RC Jets Discuss RC jets in this forum plus rc turbines and ducted fan power systems

Bavarian Demon Cortex PRO is here!!

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Old 08-22-2017, 12:30 PM
  #326
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I think I'll just run the CP on the "umbilical cord" with both Rx's direct to CB200 until this is fully resolved and proven out. I feel on a sport jet that my risk of running this way is much lower than taking full advantage of the CP capability at this time.

Please correct me if I'm wrong ... there is no reason to believe the CP is any better/worse than the regular Demon Cortex when run with the umbilical cord ... right?? I know I lose the individual output over-amp protection which I feel is lower risk at this time on my "simple" sport jet.

JS
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Old 08-22-2017, 12:32 PM
  #327
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JSF-TC View Post
Wayne,

Are you suggesting that the CP merges the RX1 & RX2 data and re-broadcasts the 'best' signal along with gyro inputs onto both RX1 & RX2 outputs to the CB. If that were to happen, the CB would never see a single RX drop-out as the CP would 'fill-in' on its output.
Paul
Paul, yes and no !
CP proceses signal from RX1 by default. If no signal is received from RX1, it switches to RX2.
Regardless of which signal is received, it is then "gyro processed" and fed to the CB in parallel thru both output cables. (There are not two independent gyro processors in the CP).
In other words, ports Rx 1 and Rx 2 on the CB are receiving exactly the same signal from the CP. It is a "Y".
So, yes ... CB would never see a single RX dropout.

Jack

Last edited by Jack Diaz; 08-22-2017 at 12:34 PM.
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Old 08-22-2017, 01:16 PM
  #328
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To further clarify, and regardless of the use of CP, the CB never triggers any indication of signal loss (as far as I have tested it).
This can be verified by disconnecting the signal cable (orange) from the RXs to the CB.
CB will switch to the other RX or go to failsafe if both are disconnected .. "silently".
The "signal loss" is triggered by the RXs not receiving power or data.

Jack

Last edited by Jack Diaz; 08-22-2017 at 02:48 PM.
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Old 08-22-2017, 01:40 PM
  #329
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Jack,

Thanks - I guess the question, for which we will probably never know the answer, is which has the more redundancy, CP or CB, in terms of Rx switching on signal loss.

At a simple, subjective level, I feel that keeping the Rx's separate going into the CB (one via the CP, one direct to CB) is a more redundant and robust solution, than having both run through a separate, single point of failure device.

Of course, the first time I see a CB failure that logic will fall apart........

Paul
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Old 08-22-2017, 02:45 PM
  #330
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JSF-TC View Post
Jack,

At a simple, subjective level, I feel that keeping the Rx's separate going into the CB (one via the CP, one direct to CB) is a more redundant and robust solution, than having both run through a separate, single point of failure device

Paul
Paul,
That is how I have them connected.
Also, the CP should be powered from the CB from one of the servo ports, in addition to the RX connection.
Receiver ports at the CB are very limited in their power handling capability; so, since you are powering the CP from one port only, it's better to be sure not to overload it. Jeti approves that jump.

Jack
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Old 08-22-2017, 07:25 PM
  #331
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I Agree W Jack,
For now, that is the way I have mine connected as well.. Secondary RX to RX2 port. Primary RX to port B, and 6 to RX1 on CP, with a jumper.
That takes care of the situation we have been describing with the CP for now.. until we get to the bottom of this

If you are set up this way, turn the gyro off, trim the model and turn it back on.. this way it will be very close on RX1 and 2.
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Old 08-22-2017, 07:36 PM
  #332
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jack Diaz View Post
Goose, how does the CP recognizes a low Q ??
As it has been explained several times, Q is a value computed at the Transmitter. Receivers don't know or care about Q.


Jack
Jack, the Q value is computed in the TX like you through.. but what the CP and CB can determine is the amount of valid packets in a given timeframe. Thats how it determines control stream.. When the number of valid packets drops off to a very low value, the latency goes up and some value will trigger a switch over by both the CP and CB..

The issue we are chasing is when we get a double switch, or when the CP switches, and the CB does too... In serial dual mode, the CP switches and the CB in theory never sees the switch because the CP sends dual signals that are derived from primary. When it switches, the CB sees the signal from R2 down both signal wires..

The problem is when the CP switches to RX2, it doesn't send back data. And when there is a bad signal environment, it can create a situation where it switches and not enough packets are available. So for now, we are circumventing the double negative situation by recommending to put secondary receiver directly into RX2 port. This allows the CB to do the switching.. When the CP switches from B to A, nothing will be there, and the CB will switch to RX2, and all is well.

This can be alarmed as well by setting the "alarm at loss of RX1" but you will get nuisance alarms when it switches.. I still have my alarm set to "loss of both". But I have my antenna alarm set at 3, and q at 25%, for "signal weak" just as a precaution..

So for now my personal recommendation is either connect Primary thru the CP, and sec RX to RX2 port for now, OR go back to the umbilical and not run the dual serial setup thru the CP for now.. either of these options is working fine, and you also won't have data dropouts.
We will get to the bottom of this.

PS.. if you run the umbilical and want more servo power put into the cortex pro, just pick one of the servo outputs and Y off it, and bring a 2 wire power over from the Central box channel.. any servo output.. Kinda like you did with the CP.. I have tested this setup too.. it works fine. This is the way the spektrum guys run it now off their Powersafe setup.

Last edited by gooseF22; 08-22-2017 at 07:44 PM.
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Old 08-22-2017, 10:48 PM
  #333
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AEROSHELDON View Post
Do you mean 4.23?
sorry 4.24
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Old 08-23-2017, 05:07 AM
  #334
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gooseF22 View Post
I Agree W Jack,
For now, that is the way I have mine connected as well.. Secondary RX to RX2 port. Primary RX to port B, and 6 to RX1 on CP, with a jumper.
That takes care of the situation we have been describing with the CP for now.. until we get to the bottom of this

If you are set up this way, turn the gyro off, trim the model and turn it back on.. this way it will be very close on RX1 and 2.
Goose, if I have a plane set up and flying with a CP can I simply unplug RX2 and wire it the way you describe, or do I need to change any TX settings or reprogram the CP?

Thanks!
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Old 08-23-2017, 07:20 AM
  #335
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AEROSHELDON View Post
Goose, if I have a plane set up and flying with a CP can I simply unplug RX2 and wire it the way you describe, or do I need to change any TX settings or reprogram the CP?

Thanks!
Short Answer: no changes in TX or CP required.

Make sure you power off everything, double check the plugs and polarity, then power up.

To test it: go into transmitter and kill TX1, and see.

one caveat: IF the cortex pro hasn't been setup originally in dual serial path, that will need to be done first, but if you have the serial setup working, simply unplug from CP port A, and replug into CB rX2 port.

Make sure to have a second power lead as discussed above. double check polarities and make sure pins are correct..

As I mentioned above, when flying the model, shut off the gain on CP sometime and quickly trim model, and turn back on.. this way if on RX2, minimal changes occur. I have my gain off/on on a switch.. the values are programmed in, but I use the trim function in gain menu or mix gain/gain with -100% free mix..either method works

Last edited by gooseF22; 08-23-2017 at 07:26 AM.
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Old 08-23-2017, 07:27 AM
  #336
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jack Diaz View Post
Paul,
That is how I have them connected.
Also, the CP should be powered from the CB from one of the servo ports, in addition to the RX connection.
Receiver ports at the CB are very limited in their power handling capability; so, since you are powering the CP from one port only, it's better to be sure not to overload it. Jeti approves that jump.

Jack
100% correct Jack..exactly
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Old 08-23-2017, 11:50 PM
  #337
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Hi, my Name is Thomas and i come from Germany. Sorry for my bad English. I have the same problem with the Cortex Pro.
Transmitter: DC24 (V4.20), CD 200. 2XRsat and CP (V1.3)
4 minutes flown then hold (longer than 10 seconds) until crash.
Bavarian Demon says:
The problem of Paul (JSF-TC - Post # 273) would be static charging from the turbine, not the Cortex Pro

Bavarian Demon (Captron) says: the firmware from the transmitter is the reason, NOT the V1.3 from CP.
Jeti says: The Cortex Pro is the reason.
With us the combination CB200 and CP has start prohibited with us on the airfield. Until that is clarified.

Here ist the German Thread:
Sorry, I have not here yet the right to write complete links with http...***

jetiforum.de/index.php/23-fremdprodukte/8288-absturz-durch-verwendung-cb200-und-cortex-pro-fliegt-jemand-diese-kombination?limitstart=0

Better I wait for the assist

I am really pissed off



Greetings from Germany
Thomas
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Last edited by NE555; 08-24-2017 at 12:02 AM.
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Old 08-24-2017, 12:06 AM
  #338
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NE555 View Post
Hi, my Name is Thomas and i come from Germany. Sorry for my bad English. I have the same problem with the Cortex Pro.
Transmitter: DC24 (V4.20), CD 200. 2XRsat and CP (V1.3)
4 minutes flown then hold (longer than 10 seconds) until crash.
Bavarian Demon says:
The problem of Paul (JSF-TC - Post # 273) would be static charging from the turbine, not the Cortex Pro

Bavarian Demon (Captron) says: the firmware from the transmitter is the reason, NOT the V1.3 from CP.
Jeti says: The Cortex Pro is the reason.
With us the combination CB200 and CP has start prohibited. Until that is clarified.

Here ist the German Thread:
Sorry, I have not here yet the right to write complete links with http...***

jetiforum.de/index.php/23-fremdprodukte/8288-absturz-durch-verwendung-cb200-und-cortex-pro-fliegt-jemand-diese-kombination?limitstart=0

Better I wait for the assist

I am really pissed off



Greetings from Germany
Thomas
Hallo Thomas

das problem ist auch bei DS-16 bekannt.
bei mir nach 90 fluge ist die anlage am boden hangen geblieben.
grade fuhr das aufsteigen , also gluck gehabt
habe jetzt die CP nuhr mit RX1 verbunden und der secondary sat direct am CB gebunden.
und ich werde das so erstmal lassen bis alles geklart ist mit Jeti und CP.
damit ist erstmal der lockout geklart .
mitlerweile gibt es die 1.4 von CP die habe ich jetzt drauf aber noch immer Primary zu CP und secondary zu CB direkt.
das gesagt ich habe noch einen CP im einsatz der ist direct mit servos betrieben und einen jeti empfanger REX12.
damit shon 150 fluge gemacht nie einen problem.
es siet aus es hatt sehr sicher mit double path zu tun.

Log file von den lockout.

# Pc-21
000000000;4291420428;0;Tx;
000000000;4261327266;0;Rx;
000000000;4261327266;1;U Rx;V
000000000;4261327266;2;A1;
000000000;4261327266;3;A2;
000000000;4261327266;4;Q;%
000000000;4261305858;0;Rx 2;
000000000;4261305858;1;U Rx;V
000000000;4261305858;2;A1;
000000000;4261305858;3;A2;
000000000;4261305858;4;Q;%
000000000;4220500256;0;Digitech-TTU;
000000000;4220500256;1;Fuel;%
000000000;4220500256;2;RPM;rpm
000000000;4220500256;3;EGT;Deg
000000000;4220500256;4;Speed;kmh
000000000;4220500256;5;Batt;V
000000000;4220500256;6;Pump;Pw
000000000;4220500256;7;Throttle;%
000000000;4220500256;8;RPM2;rpm
000000000;4220500256;9;Status;
000000000;4200108024;0;PBS GPS;
000000000;4200108024;1;SPEED;km/h
000000000;4200108024;2;ALTITUDE;m
000000000;4200108024;3;DISTANCE;m
000000000;4200108024;4;TRIP;km
000000000;4200108024;5;LONGITUDE;
000000000;4200108024;6;LATITUDE;
000000000;4323321757;0;MFlow;
000000000;4323321757;1;R.volume;ml
000000000;4323321757;2;Flow;mlM
000000000;4323321757;3;R.volume;%
000000000;4355324115;0;CBOX200;
000000000;4355324115;1;U Accu 1;V
000000000;4355324115;2;U Accu 2;V
000000000;4355324115;3;I Accu 1;A
000000000;4355324115;4;I Accu 2;A
000000000;4355324115;5;Capacity 1;mAh
000000000;4355324115;6;Capacity 2;mAh
000000000;4355324115;7;Temp.;C
000000000;4355324115;8;Over-I;
000000000;4261327266;0;Rx1;
000186391;4220500256;1;4;0;91;2;4;0;58400;3;4;0;66 7;4;1;0;27;5;1;1;99
000186391;4220500256;6;1;0;102;7;1;1;60;8;4;0;0;9; 1;0;1545
000186391;4200108024;1;1;0;0;2;1;0;4294967292;3;1; 0;30;4;1;1;0;5;9;1;378813
000186391;4200108024;6;9;0;3332235
000186391;4323321757;1;4;0;1428;2;1;0;62;3;1;0;95
000186391;4355324115;1;1;1;77;2;1;1;77;3;1;2;75;4; 1;2;61;5;4;0;1104
000186391;4355324115;6;4;0;962;7;1;0;39;8;1;0;0

Lockout :

000186544;4261327266;1;1;2;707;2;1;0;9;3;1;0;9;4;1 ;0;100
000186544;4261305858;1;1;2;707;2;1;0;9;3;1;0;9;4;1 ;0;100
000187063;4261327266;1;1;2;707;2;1;0;9;3;1;0;9;4;1 ;0;100
000187063;4261305858;1;1;2;707;2;1;0;9;3;1;0;9;4;1 ;0;100
000187576;4261327266;1;1;2;707;2;1;0;9;3;1;0;9;4;1 ;0;100
000187576;4261305858;1;1;2;707;2;1;0;9;3;1;0;9;4;1 ;0;100
000188099;4261327266;1;1;2;707;2;1;0;9;3;1;0;9;4;1 ;0;100
000188099;4261305858;1;1;2;707;2;1;0;9;3;1;0;9;4;1 ;0;100
000188622;4261327266;1;1;2;707;2;1;0;9;3;1;0;9;4;1 ;0;100
000188622;4261305858;1;1;2;707;2;1;0;9;3;1;0;9;4;1 ;0;100
000189152;4261327266;1;1;2;707;2;1;0;9;3;1;0;9;4;1 ;0;100
000189152;4261305858;1;1;2;707;2;1;0;9;3;1;0;9;4;1 ;0;100
000189666;4261327266;1;1;2;707;2;1;0;9;3;1;0;9;4;1 ;0;100
000189666;4261305858;1;1;2;707;2;1;0;9;3;1;0;9;4;1 ;0;100
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000190186;4261305858;1;1;2;707;2;1;0;9;3;1;0;9;4;1 ;0;100
000190707;4261327266;1;1;2;707;2;1;0;9;3;1;0;9;4;1 ;0;100
000190707;4261305858;1;1;2;707;2;1;0;9;3;1;0;9;4;1 ;0;100
000191227;4261327266;1;1;2;707;2;1;0;9;3;1;0;9;4;1 ;0;100
000191227;4261305858;1;1;2;707;2;1;0;9;3;1;0;9;4;1 ;0;100
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000191749;4261305858;1;1;2;707;2;1;0;9;3;1;0;9;4;1 ;0;100
000192255;4261327266;1;1;2;707;2;1;0;9;3;1;0;9;4;1 ;0;100
000192255;4261305858;1;1;2;707;2;1;0;9;3;1;0;9;4;1 ;0;100
000192776;4261327266;1;1;2;707;2;1;0;9;3;1;0;9;4;1 ;0;100
000192776;4261305858;1;1;2;707;2;1;0;9;3;1;0;9;4;1 ;0;100
000193296;4261327266;1;1;2;707;2;1;0;9;3;1;0;9;4;1 ;0;100
000193296;4261305858;1;1;2;707;2;1;0;9;3;1;0;9;4;1 ;0;100
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000196419;4261305858;1;1;2;707;2;1;0;9;3;1;0;9;4;1 ;0;100
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000197458;4261305858;1;1;2;707;2;1;0;9;3;1;0;9;4;1 ;0;100
000197978;4261327266;1;1;2;708;2;1;0;9;3;1;0;9;4;1 ;0;100
000197978;4261305858;1;1;2;707;2;1;0;9;3;1;0;9;4;1 ;0;100
000198504;4261327266;1;1;2;707;2;1;0;9;3;1;0;9;4;1 ;0;100
000198504;4261305858;1;1;2;707;2;1;0;9;3;1;0;9;4;1 ;0;100
000199024;4261327266;1;1;2;708;2;1;0;9;3;1;0;9;4;1 ;0;100
000199024;4261305858;1;1;2;707;2;1;0;9;3;1;0;9;4;1 ;0;100
000199545;4261327266;1;1;2;708;2;1;0;9;3;1;0;9;4;1 ;0;100
000199545;4261305858;1;1;2;707;2;1;0;9;3;1;0;9;4;1 ;0;100
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000200068;4261305858;1;1;2;707;2;1;0;9;3;1;0;9;4;1 ;0;100
000200585;4261327266;1;1;2;708;2;1;0;9;3;1;0;9;4;1 ;0;100
000200585;4261305858;1;1;2;707;2;1;0;9;3;1;0;9;4;1 ;0;100
000201091;4261327266;1;1;2;707;2;1;0;9;3;1;0;9;4;1 ;0;100
000201091;4261305858;1;1;2;707;2;1;0;9;3;1;0;9;4;1 ;0;100
000201622;4261327266;1;1;2;707;2;1;0;9;3;1;0;9;4;1 ;0;100
000201622;4261305858;1;1;2;707;2;1;0;9;3;1;0;9;4;1 ;0;100
000202142;4261327266;1;1;2;708;2;1;0;9;3;1;0;9;4;1 ;0;100
000202142;4261305858;1;1;2;707;2;1;0;9;3;1;0;9;4;1 ;0;100
000202653;4261327266;1;1;2;708;2;1;0;9;3;1;0;9;4;1 ;0;100
000202653;4261305858;1;1;2;707;2;1;0;9;3;1;0;9;4;1 ;0;100
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Old 08-24-2017, 02:28 AM
  #339
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I also think that the problem at the Mode "2-way HF".
What annoys me: nobody says there is a software error.
If there is no error, then none is fixed?
The next flight can be the last one?
I do not fly any more with the CP. When my model 2 weeks ago no longer reacted, humans are escaped (!) That I will never forget.

Thomas
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Old 08-24-2017, 05:45 AM
  #340
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Hello! Quick question: Is it possible to stabilize let say 3 ailerons and 3 elevators (instead of 2 ele, 2 ail and 2 rudders) with ether the Cortex or the Cortex Pro ? Thanks
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Old 08-24-2017, 06:33 AM
  #341
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RobinLeblond View Post
Hello! Quick question: Is it possible to stabilize let say 3 ailerons and 3 elevators (instead of 2 ele, 2 ail and 2 rudders) with ether the Cortex or the Cortex Pro ? Thanks
Up to 16 channels can be stabilzed so yes why not
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Old 08-24-2017, 10:28 AM
  #342
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RobinLeblond View Post
Hello! Quick question: Is it possible to stabilize let say 3 ailerons and 3 elevators (instead of 2 ele, 2 ail and 2 rudders) with ether the Cortex or the Cortex Pro ? Thanks
As has been said, it can stabilize up to 16 channels but only if you're using some form of serial output such as EX Bus to a Jeti Central box as opposed to the wiring loom.
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Old 08-24-2017, 10:41 AM
  #343
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Thanks, I known about the serial output, but wasn't sure about the more than 6 stabilized channels!
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Old 08-25-2017, 09:46 AM
  #344
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Originally Posted by gooseF22 View Post

To test it: go into transmitter and kill TX1, and see.
I have mine hooked up atm bypassing the CP on rx2 and tested it and upon killing rx1 all is good,but when i go back and restore signal from rx1 i get a noticable jump from the control surfaces? They don't change centers or anything just a quick jerk, is that normal?
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Old 09-02-2017, 01:54 AM
  #345
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Hi Cortex Pro guys,
I have some roll oscillations when I release the aileron stick quickly when doing for example a 4-point roll.
Can you help me with the setup to avoid this. I have a Jeti DS16, so it should be possible to finalize my setup via the transmitter.
Thank you.
Arnaud
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Old 09-02-2017, 06:38 AM
  #346
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Looping31 View Post
Hi Cortex Pro guys,
I have some roll oscillations when I release the aileron stick quickly when doing for example a 4-point roll.
Can you help me with the setup to avoid this. I have a Jeti DS16, so it should be possible to finalize my setup via the transmitter.
Thank you.
Arnaud
Lower the " lock in characteristics " settling for aileron. This can be done either in software or through the Jeti transmitter.
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Old 09-18-2017, 10:18 PM
  #347
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I am using a JR 28X with my Cortex and use gain on a separate channel. Do I put 80/85% travel or 20/15% travel to set the correct gain?
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Old 09-27-2017, 09:45 AM
  #348
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Guys,

I'm converting a plane form Igyro 3e without gps to cortex pro.I believe some of you did that and then can help me and save me some setup flights.

On 3e I have 30% aileron, 30% elevator and 50% rudder. Servo ATV (Endpoint) is 50%.

What is a good starting point on Cortex pro?
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Old 09-27-2017, 09:58 AM
  #349
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Start with 30% overall gain. Leave all the individual gains and other settings in the SW at default. This will get you very close.
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Old 09-27-2017, 10:23 AM
  #350
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Originally Posted by F1 Rocket View Post
Start with 30% overall gain. Leave all the individual gains and other settings in the SW at default. This will get you very close.
I see. Is there a locking percentage? What is that?

Cortex pro manual says is dangerous to land in holding mode. Is it a problem or just a waiver on their side? I see people landing jets on igyro hold and no problem at all.
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