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Sport Jets - small vs big

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Old 09-21-2019, 07:23 PM
  #26  
PowerDrum
 
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I agree with Gunradd on this I have the T1 Mini as my first jet and it is a great jet but the wing loading is a bit tricky I'm still practicing my landings with it that being said Ive seen the T1 and it is awesome flyer and smooth as butter to fly I'm actually thinking about contacting Dirk from Pacific Jets and getting one!!
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Old 09-22-2019, 12:36 AM
  #27  
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Originally Posted by FenderBean View Post
Type any rc jet name and crash into YouTube and see the same thing. Hey what do I know I only see viper jets at every event I have attended since getting into jet. Just F-16s and Bae Hawks, you see a lot of them because lots of people like them for a reason. All jets crash if you get too slow
harlock viper jets are constantly out of stock for a reason, the quality is great and they fly great.
It’s a common flaw that every Viper jet has but there’s no need to be ignorant.

I lover viper jets and I agree they fly great but as you say what do i know...
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Old 09-22-2019, 03:39 AM
  #28  
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I love the viperjets. I have 3 sizes now:

90", 105" and 130". It's a scale jet but really becomes a sports jet once you remove the tip/sfgs.

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Old 09-22-2019, 06:10 AM
  #29  
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Yes The viper Jet is an awesome jet too, Ive been looking for one that being said can anyone tell me what company has a well built Viper 2.0?? BVM , Pilot RC or any other company??
Thx!!
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Old 09-22-2019, 07:29 AM
  #30  
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Originally Posted by PowerDrum View Post
Yes The viper Jet is an awesome jet too, Ive been looking for one that being said can anyone tell me what company has a well built Viper 2.0?? BVM , Pilot RC or any other company??
Thx!!
Skymaster/ xtreme jets does a nice 2M viper jet. It was very popular when it first came out
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Old 09-22-2019, 10:57 AM
  #31  
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Originally Posted by PowerDrum View Post
Yes The viper Jet is an awesome jet too, Ive been looking for one that being said can anyone tell me what company has a well built Viper 2.0?? BVM , Pilot RC or any other company??
Thx!!
Tomahawk in Germany makes a very high quality 2m Viper
https://tomahawk-aviation.com/eu/jet...iper-jet-2-0m/

as well as 2.5m and 3m
https://tomahawk-aviation.com/eu/jet...port-jets/?p=1
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Old 09-22-2019, 01:05 PM
  #32  
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I agree with Henke.

Smaller and cheaper is simply more fun.

Smaller and cheaper jets fly lower.

My stinger 64 EDF can knife edge down the runway at 1 inch of the grass.

No way am doing that with a $10,000 turbine.

I just built a free wing Avanti with the X45

Many people say the FW Avanti is the best flying EDF jet on market.

I have over 300 flights on my EDF all of grass and it really does not have any bad habits.

It really is very idiot proof especially turning from base onto final.

Total cost of airframe, $350 US

And if you prang it, being foam it is easy to fix and, FW as all the spare parts readily available at realistic prices i.e. $12 for the whole main strut assembly.
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Old 09-22-2019, 03:28 PM
  #33  
ltc
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Originally Posted by Mikey5547 View Post

It’s a common flaw that every Viper jet has but there’s no need to be ignorant.

I lover viper jets and I agree they fly great but as you say what do i know...
This article on RC Vipers mentions the stall tendency
Model Aviation - July 2018 Popular Viper jets

‘Most Vipers tend to drop a wing on stall, so make sure you don’t stall while turning into the final approach. This is why I don’t recommend the Viper as a transition airframe when stepping up to high-performance aircraft.“
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Old 09-22-2019, 04:57 PM
  #34  
kevin
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I cant imagine having any more fun with a 45 than with a mini avanti. It flies great! I have had offers to buy it for quite a bit more than I paid for it .... nope
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Old 09-22-2019, 10:48 PM
  #35  
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Originally Posted by ltc View Post

This article on RC Vipers mentions the stall tendency
Model Aviation - July 2018 Popular Viper jets

ĎMost Vipers tend to drop a wing on stall, so make sure you donít stall while turning into the final approach. This is why I donít recommend the Viper as a transition airframe when stepping up to high-performance aircraft.ď
Thanks for your reply, Iíve seen it when they stall wether itís final approach and even during a loop that they can sometimes snap on you and go into a unrecoverable spin. I wasnt saying to anyone not to buy one, it was more a warning to the person who started thread if he buys one it can happen if people arenít careful just like other types of jets have unique issues! They fly great and look great
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Old 09-23-2019, 12:32 AM
  #36  
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Originally Posted by PowerDrum View Post
Yes The viper Jet is an awesome jet too, Ive been looking for one that being said can anyone tell me what company has a well built Viper 2.0?? BVM , Pilot RC or any other company??
Thx!!
I have 2 of these 2.2M Viperjets - just sold one:


Flymodel Viperjet 2.2M (build thread is on RCG). Comes with nice electric gears tube, tanks.etc.
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Old 09-23-2019, 04:01 AM
  #37  
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Originally Posted by ltc View Post

This article on RC Vipers mentions the stall tendency
Model Aviation - July 2018 Popular Viper jets

‘Most Vipers tend to drop a wing on stall, so make sure you don’t stall while turning into the final approach. This is why I don’t recommend the Viper as a transition airframe when stepping up to high-performance aircraft.“
I couple of thoughts. We are talking 45n size, Jim was talking about larger models, the Harlock wasn't available when that was written and probably not the Pilot-RC's

Also, its hard to stereotype a model Viper like that and apply it to all models of that jet. For example, Corsairs and Mustangs can be a handful to fly because they have higher wing loading and while you can scale a model you can't scale an air molecule.
Then along comes Hangar-9 and they thicken up the airfoil, enlarge the control surfaces a touch and make the tail moment a bit longer and all the sudden you have a scale looking warbird that flys like any other sport plane.

So please don't stereotype the Harlock Viper and lump it in with others because it's a different airframe.
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Old 09-23-2019, 06:01 AM
  #38  
ltc
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Originally Posted by BarracudaHockey View Post
I couple of thoughts. We are talking 45n size, Jim was talking about larger models, the Harlock wasn't available when that was written and probably not the Pilot-RC's

Also, its hard to stereotype a model Viper like that and apply it to all models of that jet. For example, Corsairs and Mustangs can be a handful to fly because they have higher wing loading and while you can scale a model you can't scale an air molecule.
Then along comes Hangar-9 and they thicken up the airfoil, enlarge the control surfaces a touch and make the tail moment a bit longer and all the sudden you have a scale looking warbird that flys like any other sport plane.

So please don't stereotype the Harlock Viper and lump it in with others because it's a different airframe.
I wasn't trying to stereotype
I merely posted a link to an article that mentioned Viper and (tip) stalling, since it was mentioned and discussed in earlier posts in this thread. Nothing more than that.
I have no affiliations or issues with any particular Viper
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Old 09-23-2019, 06:52 AM
  #39  
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While that was a reply to you, it wasn't an attack and hope it didn't come across that way.

My point was only that different models of the same full scale example can be quite different.
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Old 09-23-2019, 08:05 AM
  #40  
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All I'm going by is people are always recommending them and I have seen so many people tip stall them into the ground its not funny. I could care less what people buy its their money. I for one think Vipers are ugly.. When I see a full scale one on the ground I have 0 ambition to go look at it. Now put an F18-F15 or 22 and yep I'm going to go out drool over it.

I want to see new guys that get into jets and have success and stay on this side of the hobby. All to often they get bad advice and soon go back to props due to the cost and crashing a plane that they should not be flying in the first place.
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Old 09-23-2019, 09:20 AM
  #41  
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Originally Posted by gunradd View Post
All I'm going by is people are always recommending them and I have seen so many people tip stall them into the ground its not funny. I could care less what people buy its their money. I for one think Vipers are ugly.. When I see a full scale one on the ground I have 0 ambition to go look at it. Now put an F18-F15 or 22 and yep I'm going to go out drool over it.

I want to see new guys that get into jets and have success and stay on this side of the hobby. All to often they get bad advice and soon go back to props due to the cost and crashing a plane that they should not be flying in the first place.
I haven't seen every model of a viper jet fly but I've seen a few and I've seen all of them suffer both high speed and low speed stalls. Some survived as altitude was their friends. Other ones weren't as lucky. I dont like the looks of them either but looks are just personal taste. They seem to stall without warning as well.
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Old 09-23-2019, 10:11 AM
  #42  
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I think this viper jet thing has blown out of proportion a bit. It was just a caution as he was interested in a viper jet. Just like if he was looking for a T33 for example I would warn about the narrow landing gear on landings.
Last time I give any advice to anyone on rcu
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Old 09-23-2019, 10:12 AM
  #43  
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Okay I donít know what folks are doing then, because I have slowed both of mine down to the point of a crawl without issues and in the past seven years I havenít seen anyone tip stall one. I have seen some dumb thumb crashes on vipers but not the above mentioned issue.

on thread topic, I think you would be happy with a Harlock and the X45. Just be aware of the above issue if the Harlock has this tendency. I will test this out at GA Jets this week since Iím curious now.

Last edited by FenderBean; 09-23-2019 at 10:27 AM.
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Old 09-23-2019, 12:57 PM
  #44  
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Thanks for all the inputs guys, really appreciated.
In fact, I was not looking for a fight on which brand do which Viper but I was more concern about how you can compare a big plane to a smaller one.
There are nice feedbacks, like someone said, with a smaller plane, it's harder to see. It sound stupid but that's totally true and it can quickly become a big issue.
I think the dilemn is more regarding the wing load, smaller plane tend to be heavier than big ones, thus, more instable on some flying phases. Not taking into account the wing and airframe design which obviously impact the flying characteristics.
The Harlock is really tempting price wise and it looks really light for a small airplane. One of my friend is looking for a small jet due to car restriction, I will let him pick a model and ask to try it out once he got it in the air

Joke apart, I've seen a Tomahawk Viper in 2m this week end and the flight was amazing ! The price is equally amazing ...
If I had the money now, I think my choice will go for a Pilot RC Viper jet in 87", looks like it's a good balance. But the Rebel Hot is damn interesting, I will wait to see flight reports with a 40ich turbine in it.
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Old 09-24-2019, 03:33 AM
  #45  
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Originally Posted by jimibar View Post
tempting price wise and it looks really light for a small airplane.
I find the cheaper kits being heavy. Usually 1-2lb heavier then the premium ones. This is even more important if coming from big to small when you are used to fairly low wing loading.

I'm not saying anything is bad, not my call to make. Just saying that I don't think the china planes are good enough in the small segment. lot of gelcoat, lots of paint compared to European kits, specially the ones painted in mold.

I also make a great difference between flying well and staying in the air. No problem getting anything off the ground with a jet engine pushing with loads of power, but then flying well landing in a resonable speed, no tip stalling etc. Those who only tried one plane one have one point of reference. good or bad you don't know until you try the second one. I see WAY to may on the forums with only one point of reference telling their plane is the best.

This is why I suggest the foamies as they in this range provide really good performance on pretty much all levels. Shaving of money, time and skills needed.
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Old 09-24-2019, 06:39 AM
  #46  
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I agree Henke.
I have been flying turbines for 20 plus years and have flown many, many different jets as well as test flying for others.
Your comments are absolutely true and newbies should take his advice.
While I still have and will fly my big toys ( Carf Tutor, Skygate/Carf Hawk ) I find the simplicity, size and value of smaller
" nanoturbine " models so much more relaxing and enjoyable. So what if I dent a bit of foam or bend a strut on landing, geeez
I could buy a complete airframe for the cost of just my landing gear on my Hawk!

How about this...I can fully outfit 7 Avios Mig 17s complete with X45 turbines for the price of my single ready to fly big Hawk.
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Old 09-24-2019, 09:57 AM
  #47  
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Originally Posted by FenderBean View Post
Okay I donít know what folks are doing then, because I have slowed both of mine down to the point of a crawl without issues and in the past seven years I havenít seen anyone tip stall one. I have seen some dumb thumb crashes on vipers but not the above mentioned issue.

on thread topic, I think you would be happy with a Harlock and the X45. Just be aware of the above issue if the Harlock has this tendency. I will test this out at GA Jets this week since Iím curious now.
I flew my Harlock Viper on EDF at 11+ lbs, if the model is nose heavy it tends to drop a wing when it gets slow. I flew mine with the cg at 115 and it would land great there! Factory cg is 90.
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Old 09-24-2019, 10:44 AM
  #48  
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Originally Posted by Bob_B View Post
I flew my Harlock Viper on EDF at 11+ lbs, if the model is nose heavy it tends to drop a wing when it gets slow. I flew mine with the cg at 115 and it would land great there! Factory cg is 90.
True, by the time I flew my turbine version I had the benefit of you figuring the CG out!
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Old 09-24-2019, 12:24 PM
  #49  
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I don't agree with the comment that smaller jets are harder to see.

You simply fly the smaller jets closer, and the large jets further away.

Once in the air, it is very hard to figure out how big a model is.

I have a stinger 64mm EDF which is an awesome warmup plane as well as a awesome plane to fly when it gets so windy that everybody else packs up and goes home.

It has no landing gear, and takes off by sliding across the runway on its belly.

It owes me around $100 brand-new.

That is only a tiny plane and you simply fly closer.

I have so much fun with this plane and it's taught me that small and cheap is soooo much more fun.

A good way of measuring how much fun you are having is, is your mouth smiling, or is your butt crack so firmly clinched together that you cannot slide a credit card between your butt crack.
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Old 09-24-2019, 12:58 PM
  #50  
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i think this thread has gone off topic now
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