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  1. #76

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    RE: JR 2.4 gig radios

    Hi
    I have been following the debate regarding SS for some time. I have continually asked myself the question why the big two are slow to come into the market with a SS system. Futaba I know have a SS system for cars/boats. ( sorry gents I am not using the J word my mother did teach me better)

    The only real conclussion I have come to is that 35Meg is a simple system to install. Remember most modellers are not techincally minded and I for one would not want my expensive toys being committed to avaition on the hope I have the RX installation right.

    Following a few simple rules and you will get a 35Meg system to work reliably. SS is a different kettle of fish. You need some care in locating the two RX and even then you may still need to tinker,
    So the bottom line is that IMHO the big two wont jump into SS until they have as Idiot proof a system as they currently have with 35meg.

    Something to ponder Has anyone wondered why there are so many pins to the TX module on a 14MZ( 16 of them) . Perhaps they have designed the 14MZ tx with the ability to operate a SS module when they eventually release one.

    Mike

  2. #77

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    RE: JR 2.4 gig radios

    Mike

    Spektrum have had a car plug in JR system for sometime.
    All my SS Rx set ups have worked first time inc the Raven, you just need to use common sense...bit like 35mHz
    Your worried about SS and you use a 14mz

    Best Regards

    Dave W
    Motors & Rotors. JetCat, Powerbox, Intairco, Behotec, Graupner. CARF-models Rep. JR Propo for ever!, Jet 1A, MAP, Evojet, BVM

  3. #78

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    RE: JR 2.4 gig radios

    Hi Dave
    Sorry not biting, I am one of the people who have not had a single problem with my 14 MZ and as a radio I love it. As regards SS my background is Electronics and although my Coms theory is a bit rusty I know that SS is not the holy grail people make it out to be. 2.4 Ghz is way to easily blocked. So i am happy to sit back and let others test it and wait for Futaba to come out with a module.

    Ps I know J* make a SS ground system but I didnt want to lower the tone of the thread further.

    Mike

  4. #79

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    RE: JR 2.4 gig radios

    Mike,

    Lower the tone? I thought you had already flattened it with the F word

    Trevor Skedge.

  5. #80

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    RE: JR 2.4 gig radios

    Mike

    Lover? what are you telling me [8D]

    I agree, it is early days-but it does solve some 35mhz issues...that's it.

    Dave
    Motors & Rotors. JetCat, Powerbox, Intairco, Behotec, Graupner. CARF-models Rep. JR Propo for ever!, Jet 1A, MAP, Evojet, BVM

  6. #81

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    RE: JR 2.4 gig radios

    Dave, Trevor
    Thanks for correcting my typo gents. At the risk of this thread dropping into the usual J word versus F word, which is the best radio gear manufacturer contest which all fliers love to have. I think I will shut my trap at this point.
    And I agree SS solves some problems that 35 Meg suffers from, whether it brings its own problems I will wait and see.

    Mike

    BTW I will admit that JR make decent servos but not as good as Multiplex

  7. #82

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    RE: JR 2.4 gig radios

    Mike

    OK-lets drop it...

    Servos...!

    Dave
    Motors & Rotors. JetCat, Powerbox, Intairco, Behotec, Graupner. CARF-models Rep. JR Propo for ever!, Jet 1A, MAP, Evojet, BVM

  8. #83
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    RE: JR 2.4 gig radios

    I lost a buddies heli the other day with a dx7. He did prior set up the day before, no problems. The rx pack was charged all night, we did 10 min. of setup and went flying. I hovered for about 2 min. did a little tweeking went flying again. Picked the heli up into a hover,
    wham!, it went into lock out and banked into the ground. I'm not saying that "brand new" is never bad out of the box, but the rx pack had a bad cell. The SS system did not give a single hint that the battery was losing charge, not a single servo glitch, period! The first indication was system went into lock out. Rx voltage is critical with all radios, but super critical with the DX systems, because of the fact that it gives no warning, before it locks up. On a lighter note, I hope everyone goes to the SS system so I'll have the whole freq. board to me and my 14mz.
    Dont believe everything you think....

  9. #84

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    RE: JR 2.4 gig radios

    ORIGINAL: Dave Wilshere

    Mike

    OK-lets drop it...

    Servos...!

    Dave
    Dave since you are a graupner dealer also.

    if you have a MX-12 or MX 16 look at the enclosure they are exactly the same as the DX-7

    does this mean:
    mx-12 and mx-16 come from Spektrum - tower? or DX-7 is a product from JR?

    In God we trust , the rest we Track \"digitech multirotors\"

  10. #85

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    RE: JR 2.4 gig radios

    DX7 is from Horizon hobbies so it is most likely JR or at least influenced by JR (It looks like there 7 ch radio).
    Regards, E. \" Smoking Sam\"
    The Truth is out there, Seek it!!

  11. #86

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    RE: JR 2.4 gig radios

    Dave,Trevor
    i have been told that the BMFA require failsafe on turbine models engine to idle and control surfaces to neutral

    how are you doing this with the DX7 ? Dave.

  12. #87

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    RE: JR 2.4 gig radios

    Dave,

    I will look into the "control surfaces to neutral", I thought it was engine to idle and stop if signal loss greater than 5 secs. Maybe 3secs.

    Trevor Skedge

  13. #88

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    RE: JR 2.4 gig radios

    Dave,

    I have looked at the JMA website and this is an extract from there. I saw no mention of control surfaces to neutral, but that doesn`t mean they aren`t there just that I haven`t seen them.

    Failsafe action is to be set so that, in the event of loss of radio signal or interference to the signal, which persists for more than three seconds, the engine will automatically stop. The automatic action may be set to operate following periods of signal loss shorter than three seconds if the operator wishes.

    Trevor Skedge.

  14. #89

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    RE: JR 2.4 gig radios

    Sandor

    It's made in the JR factory No2...by JR with JR engineers...but its a Horizon Product.

    Dave
    Trevor is right (enjoy that T it won't happen again this century!) they only say motor failsafe-other controls are your choice. On the DX-7 the choice is hold! This is fine as we could argue about pros and cons of set positions or hold.

    Dave
    Motors & Rotors. JetCat, Powerbox, Intairco, Behotec, Graupner. CARF-models Rep. JR Propo for ever!, Jet 1A, MAP, Evojet, BVM

  15. #90

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    RE: JR 2.4 gig radios

    Trevor ,Dave
    if the failsafe has to kill the turbine after a 3 second signal loss i cannot see how i can do this with the DX7
    other than use a jetcat ecu, any ideas ? Dave.

  16. #91

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    RE: JR 2.4 gig radios

    Dave,

    I don`t believe there are any radios out there that allow for failsafe to idle and then stop after prolonged loss of signal because the receiver actions the failsafe and the transmitter sets it. Yes I think it will have to be in the ECU software as it is with JetCat.

    Go on Dave, have i now been right twice this century?

    Trevor Skedge.

  17. #92
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    RE: JR 2.4 gig radios


    ORIGINAL: debaker

    Trevor ,Dave
    if the failsafe has to kill the turbine after a 3 second signal loss i cannot see how i can do this with the DX7
    other than use a jetcat ecu, any ideas ? Dave.
    My DX7 failsafes my Wren MW44 just fine.

    Dave

  18. #93

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    RE: JR 2.4 gig radios


    ORIGINAL: trevor Skedge

    Dave,
    ...
    Go on Dave, have i now been right twice this century?

    Trevor Skedge.
    Don't push your luck Trevor

    Eric

  19. #94

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    RE: JR 2.4 gig radios

    RCguy,

    I think what debaker is saying is that if he sets the failsafe to idle then that is where it stays even after 3 seconds loss of signal. The problem is that if there is a requirement for the turbine to stop after 3 seconds then there must be a secondary failsafe and at the moment that would be a function of the ECU detecting prolonged signal loss/interference.

    Eric,

    I was born lucky.

    Trevor Skedge.

  20. #95
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    RE: JR 2.4 gig radios

    ORIGINAL: trevor Skedge

    Dave,

    I don`t believe there are any radios out there that allow for failsafe to idle and then stop after prolonged loss of signal because the receiver actions the failsafe and the transmitter sets it. Yes I think it will have to be in the ECU software as it is with JetCat.

    Go on Dave, have i now been right twice this century?

    Trevor Skedge.
    thinking..

    but maybe not possible on a DX7, or even on "normal radios", a very slow servo, with a kill switch, that in failsafe kill the turbine, but so slow to move, that he takes 3 sencond to reach the kill position...

    Alessio
    MO13

  21. #96

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    RE: JR 2.4 gig radios

    3 second failsafe is not something that can be handled by existing radios. It is easily done in the ECU though, for example by applying a 3 second delay when a shutdown signal is received to actually shutting down. The delay will apply whether the radio sends the failsafe shutdown signal, or you operate shutdown from the Tx at the end of a flight. Surely it is easy for ECU makers to incorporate a user-set shutdown delay into the software so that we can adjust the ECU to suit the country, local club, future changes in rules/recommendations etc.

    Harry

  22. #97

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    RE: JR 2.4 gig radios


    ORIGINAL: mikehannah

    Hi
    I have been following the debate regarding SS for some time. I have continually asked myself the question why the big two are slow to come into the market with a SS system. Futaba I know have a SS system for cars/boats. ( sorry gents I am not using the J word my mother did teach me better)
    I think the real reason Futaba and JR have not come out first with a 2.4 air system may be Marketing. There are no TELLING how many radios "just 7 channel and up" these companies have in their warhouses and in thier dealer networks. If they were to fully release a 2.4 system, priced as they will be the value of their existing 72mhz stocks would be cut by half. Of course this is just my speculation and may not be the case at ALL.. It would answer the question though if someone could find out if they are still manufacturing 7 ch and up radios at their normal pace or cut back to an "as-need" basis.


    On the issue of a turbine failsafe you must bind at low throttle low trim which will kill the turbine, it is up to the ECU to delay this process if you so choose. Russ

  23. #98

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    RE: JR 2.4 gig radios

    swissflyer

    thanx for the idea " Hi tec digital slowed down on Y lead to throttle chanel

    operating cut out switch ". i think this is what you mean.

    Dave.

  24. #99

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    RE: JR 2.4 gig radios

    Swissflyer, debaker,

    Once your receiver goes into failsafe, so will the slow servo.

    Trevor Skedge.

  25. #100

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    RE: JR 2.4 gig radios

    Not if its programmed into a Hitec digital. But then again, that rate would always be the rate that it uses.


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