JR 2.4 gig radios
01-15-2007, 06:24 PM
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RE: JR 2.4 gig radios
that is a bammer, is it why JR didn't stick its name on it? I just finish programing it on my SAVAX, will consider assesment on a glow?
01-15-2007, 11:35 PM
#53
RE: JR 2.4 gig radios
ORIGINAL: cactusflyer
So that's why my micro-wave interferes with my cordless phone!......But the question remains, Should we be lobbying the FCC for some bandwidth up at 5.8 NOW?
Tailwinds,
John
So that's why my micro-wave interferes with my cordless phone!......But the question remains, Should we be lobbying the FCC for some bandwidth up at 5.8 NOW?
Tailwinds,
John
01-16-2007, 03:22 AM
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RE: JR 2.4 gig radios
ORIGINAL: Dave Wilshere
Eric
Is that the Wren ECU next to the Rx unit?
Dave
Eric
Is that the Wren ECU next to the Rx unit?
Dave
Yes it is. My Futaba Rx was fixed at a similar distance from ECU without any range or interference issues.
Eric
01-16-2007, 03:42 AM
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RE: JR 2.4 gig radios
ORIGINAL: Flying Arrow
that is a bammer, is it why JR didn't stick its name on it? I just finish programing it on my SAVAX, will consider assesment on a glow?
that is a bammer, is it why JR didn't stick its name on it? I just finish programing it on my SAVAX, will consider assesment on a glow?
The separation distance that I have now between the receivers and the rest of the install must surely be OTT.
I’m beginning to feel that the main issue is the relative positions of each receiver to each other.
Don’t forget that Trevor Skedge has a successful install on his Fox Hawk
Eric
01-16-2007, 01:00 PM
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RE: JR 2.4 gig radios
Just some thoughts, my radio had over double the range on the ground than in the air (with the range check button pushed)
I got the entire length of the field (about 100meters) with full control even with someone turning the plane round in circles on the ground.
but when i pushed the button in the air at about 60-70meters it locked out immediately!
I think that was because on the ground the plane is pretty much hidden from all the "noise" from all the high power 2.4 GHz spread spectrum and OFDM transceivers that are transmitting all over the place. as soon as you go up a bit then your in amungst the sh1t. believe me, in the UK there are hundreds of thousands of them. My company fits 2.4GHz 100meg links with anything from 1k to 40k range with 30 db gain antennas. to get a 100meg bandwidth these are munching at the available "space"
although I am doing my own testing, it would be really good if the manufacturers would have done some scientific testing here in the UKs RF environment before seling them here.
My company builds equipment for OFCOM to catch illegal broadcasters, when I get a chance I will talk to them about this and there thoughts on these "mostly" guided missiles operating on this open frequency.
and those thinking that 5.8GHz will be the answer, we are currently installing loads of 5.8GHz wireless LAN links because the 2.4GHz band is to saturated and it is almost impossible to achieve high bandwidth/throughput.
I will carry on doing testing, but it is expensive (I bought 2 dx7 and 4 receivers) so I am not a pessimist but a hopeful optimist (possibly!)
Dave Stephens
I got the entire length of the field (about 100meters) with full control even with someone turning the plane round in circles on the ground.
but when i pushed the button in the air at about 60-70meters it locked out immediately!
I think that was because on the ground the plane is pretty much hidden from all the "noise" from all the high power 2.4 GHz spread spectrum and OFDM transceivers that are transmitting all over the place. as soon as you go up a bit then your in amungst the sh1t. believe me, in the UK there are hundreds of thousands of them. My company fits 2.4GHz 100meg links with anything from 1k to 40k range with 30 db gain antennas. to get a 100meg bandwidth these are munching at the available "space"
although I am doing my own testing, it would be really good if the manufacturers would have done some scientific testing here in the UKs RF environment before seling them here.
My company builds equipment for OFCOM to catch illegal broadcasters, when I get a chance I will talk to them about this and there thoughts on these "mostly" guided missiles operating on this open frequency.
and those thinking that 5.8GHz will be the answer, we are currently installing loads of 5.8GHz wireless LAN links because the 2.4GHz band is to saturated and it is almost impossible to achieve high bandwidth/throughput.
I will carry on doing testing, but it is expensive (I bought 2 dx7 and 4 receivers) so I am not a pessimist but a hopeful optimist (possibly!)
Dave Stephens
01-16-2007, 01:38 PM
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RE: JR 2.4 gig radios
ORIGINAL: The boys Back
Just some thoughts, my radio had over double the range on the ground than in the air (with the range check button pushed)
I got the entire length of the field (about 100meters) with full control even with someone turning the plane round in circles on the ground.
but when i pushed the button in the air at about 60-70meters it locked out immediately!
I think that was because on the ground the plane is pretty much hidden from all the "noise" from all the high power 2.4 GHz spread spectrum and OFDM transceivers that are transmitting all over the place. as soon as you go up a bit then your in amungst the sh1t. believe me, in the UK there are hundreds of thousands of them. My company fits 2.4GHz 100meg links with anything from 1k to 40k range with 30 db gain antennas. to get a 100meg bandwidth these are munching at the available "space"
although I am doing my own testing, it would be really good if the manufacturers would have done some scientific testing here in the UKs RF environment before seling them here.
My company builds equipment for OFCOM to catch illegal broadcasters, when I get a chance I will talk to them about this and there thoughts on these "mostly" guided missiles operating on this open frequency.
and those thinking that 5.8GHz will be the answer, we are currently installing loads of 5.8GHz wireless LAN links because the 2.4GHz band is to saturated and it is almost impossible to achieve high bandwidth/throughput.
I will carry on doing testing, but it is expensive (I bought 2 dx7 and 4 receivers) so I am not a pessimist but a hopeful optimist (possibly!)
Dave Stephens
Just some thoughts, my radio had over double the range on the ground than in the air (with the range check button pushed)
I got the entire length of the field (about 100meters) with full control even with someone turning the plane round in circles on the ground.
but when i pushed the button in the air at about 60-70meters it locked out immediately!
I think that was because on the ground the plane is pretty much hidden from all the "noise" from all the high power 2.4 GHz spread spectrum and OFDM transceivers that are transmitting all over the place. as soon as you go up a bit then your in amungst the sh1t. believe me, in the UK there are hundreds of thousands of them. My company fits 2.4GHz 100meg links with anything from 1k to 40k range with 30 db gain antennas. to get a 100meg bandwidth these are munching at the available "space"
although I am doing my own testing, it would be really good if the manufacturers would have done some scientific testing here in the UKs RF environment before seling them here.
My company builds equipment for OFCOM to catch illegal broadcasters, when I get a chance I will talk to them about this and there thoughts on these "mostly" guided missiles operating on this open frequency.
and those thinking that 5.8GHz will be the answer, we are currently installing loads of 5.8GHz wireless LAN links because the 2.4GHz band is to saturated and it is almost impossible to achieve high bandwidth/throughput.
I will carry on doing testing, but it is expensive (I bought 2 dx7 and 4 receivers) so I am not a pessimist but a hopeful optimist (possibly!)
Dave Stephens
This band will be good when it become obsolete for the other users
01-16-2007, 02:36 PM
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RE: JR 2.4 gig radios
I have just discovered this new R/C technology and as I am thinking about purchasing a DX7 set I would like first to pass a question regarding "legality" to my european mates:
Although R/C model airplanes allowed frequencies are different from one EU country to other, I understand there is an official european norm that describes them all and 2.4 is not recorded as direct allowed in any country within the EU, so if an accident happen should be the modeller flying with 2.4 band covered by his flying insurance?.
Moreover and as far as I know, 2.4 band home devices are allowed to emit up tp 100 mW power only for wireless networks but only up to 10 mW for any other home or private use......., then only using the DX6 and DX7 here in Europe we are already violating a radiofrequency norm.
I would much like to read your comments before investing in this new technology as perhaps, with their inherent troubles and all perhaps it shpuld be better to continue using the tested 35 Mhz and wait till it is clear we are legally and safe flying in the 2.4 band, mainly regarding model jets.
Best Regards,
Jesus Cardin
Although R/C model airplanes allowed frequencies are different from one EU country to other, I understand there is an official european norm that describes them all and 2.4 is not recorded as direct allowed in any country within the EU, so if an accident happen should be the modeller flying with 2.4 band covered by his flying insurance?.
Moreover and as far as I know, 2.4 band home devices are allowed to emit up tp 100 mW power only for wireless networks but only up to 10 mW for any other home or private use......., then only using the DX6 and DX7 here in Europe we are already violating a radiofrequency norm.
I would much like to read your comments before investing in this new technology as perhaps, with their inherent troubles and all perhaps it shpuld be better to continue using the tested 35 Mhz and wait till it is clear we are legally and safe flying in the 2.4 band, mainly regarding model jets.
Best Regards,
Jesus Cardin
01-16-2007, 04:15 PM
#61
RE: JR 2.4 gig radios
ORIGINAL: Gary Jefferson
Why does everyone keep pushing the bind button in the air??? Is this just curiosity to see what will happen? Gary
Why does everyone keep pushing the bind button in the air??? Is this just curiosity to see what will happen? Gary
Why does a dog lick his..."same reason I guess!"
DX7 installed in my Reaction44. Pictures posted in my build thread.
Dave
01-16-2007, 05:23 PM
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RE: JR 2.4 gig radios
Eric,
Your install looks clean now with the small exception of the primary RX ariel pointing at the ECU. As Dave says, take a little Velcro to the field just in case you need to move it.
I am surprised that anyone is having trouble but when you read Dave Stephens (by the way what is wrong with his back?) post it seems probable to me that you and your clubmate were subject to outside interference on the day and if this is true, it won`t make any difference if you tow the RX`s behind on 40ft extension leads.
FYI, I had one flight at Abingdon and a further 5 flights at Chalgrove with 100% success on the Hawk/DX7 combo. I would guess that Abingdon would be the only "Dirty" field as it is still active.
Has anyone else had problems with DX7?
Regards Trevor Skedge
Your install looks clean now with the small exception of the primary RX ariel pointing at the ECU. As Dave says, take a little Velcro to the field just in case you need to move it.
I am surprised that anyone is having trouble but when you read Dave Stephens (by the way what is wrong with his back?) post it seems probable to me that you and your clubmate were subject to outside interference on the day and if this is true, it won`t make any difference if you tow the RX`s behind on 40ft extension leads.
FYI, I had one flight at Abingdon and a further 5 flights at Chalgrove with 100% success on the Hawk/DX7 combo. I would guess that Abingdon would be the only "Dirty" field as it is still active.
Has anyone else had problems with DX7?
Regards Trevor Skedge
01-16-2007, 05:50 PM
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RE: JR 2.4 gig radios
Bind button is for ground ops only. Bind the RX/TX, then no need to touch the button on back of TX again. Spectrum-7 remember when you bind, it is between the TX and RX for a particular A/C and will not work if TX is on another airplane program! WHMC
01-16-2007, 05:57 PM
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RE: JR 2.4 gig radios
ORIGINAL: jescardin
Although R/C model airplanes allowed frequencies are different from one EU country to other, I understand there is an official european norm that describes them all and 2.4 is not recorded as direct allowed in any country within the EU, so if an accident happen should be the modeller flying with 2.4 band covered by his flying insurance?.
Moreover and as far as I know, 2.4 band home devices are allowed to emit up tp 100 mW power only for wireless networks but only up to 10 mW for any other home or private use......., then only using the DX6 and DX7 here in Europe we are already violating a radiofrequency norm.
Although R/C model airplanes allowed frequencies are different from one EU country to other, I understand there is an official european norm that describes them all and 2.4 is not recorded as direct allowed in any country within the EU, so if an accident happen should be the modeller flying with 2.4 band covered by his flying insurance?.
Moreover and as far as I know, 2.4 band home devices are allowed to emit up tp 100 mW power only for wireless networks but only up to 10 mW for any other home or private use......., then only using the DX6 and DX7 here in Europe we are already violating a radiofrequency norm.
Regards,
=Adrian=
01-17-2007, 03:57 AM
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RE: JR 2.4 gig radios
ORIGINAL: WHMC
Bind button is for ground ops only. Bind the RX/TX, then no need to touch the button on back of TX again Spectrum-7 remember when you bind, it is between the TX and RX for a particular A/C and will not work if TX is on another airplane program! WHMC
Bind button is for ground ops only. Bind the RX/TX, then no need to touch the button on back of TX again Spectrum-7 remember when you bind, it is between the TX and RX for a particular A/C and will not work if TX is on another airplane program! WHMC
as for pushing in the air, i was experimenting (range checking in the air to see how the RX would react to reduced TX power)
i have these RXs is some big heavy models and i want to be fully confident in the system before flying them as they could cause serious injury or even death. this is where my main criticism of this radio lies in the fail safe (or lack of it) when i did push the range check button in the air i was moving the ailerons from side to side to see if i still had control. it locked out almost immediately and became a high speed rolling missile (engine went to idle but the plane was at 45 deg. to the ground and accelerating!) it took a few seconds to recover but felt like forever!) i am a firm believer that a failsafe should be set up to slow the model to allow it to crash with minimum speed and WITHIN the safe area you are flying in. a jet doing 250mph in level flight will go a long way in hold with the engine on idle
Skedgy, something went wrong and i could not get on RCU with my old name so i had to start again I.E. im back
01-17-2007, 04:02 AM
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RE: JR 2.4 gig radios
Dave, my understanding of the Bind button is it puts the Rx into "scan" so surely it will freeze for a second while it looks for a frequency,or two.
M
M
01-17-2007, 04:09 AM
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RE: JR 2.4 gig radios
Mick, the button has 2 uses
1 is to "bind" and to put the TX in bind mode you have to hold the bind/range check button whist turning the TX on.
if you push the button whilst the TX is on it just reduces power so you can perform a range check (as you cannot remove the arial)
Dave
1 is to "bind" and to put the TX in bind mode you have to hold the bind/range check button whist turning the TX on.
if you push the button whilst the TX is on it just reduces power so you can perform a range check (as you cannot remove the arial)
Dave
01-17-2007, 04:49 AM
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RE: JR 2.4 gig radios
Hi Trevor,
The scenario that Dave S paints, taken together with flying at an active military base don’t fill me with joy! The planes behaviour during the second and third flight did smack of outside “glitch” type interference. My first flight was however totally without mishap.
Next flight will be at West Raynham airfield, an abandoned military base.
Understand your concern on placement of primary aerial. Dave W did recommend placement of primary receiver on the side wall with the aerial uppermost and pointing for and aft. The DX7 manual recommends that the aerials are placed perpendicular but also shows one aerial further rotated through 90 deg. As you advise, I’ll take a strip of Velcro to the field!
Regards,
Eric
The scenario that Dave S paints, taken together with flying at an active military base don’t fill me with joy! The planes behaviour during the second and third flight did smack of outside “glitch” type interference. My first flight was however totally without mishap.
Next flight will be at West Raynham airfield, an abandoned military base.
Understand your concern on placement of primary aerial. Dave W did recommend placement of primary receiver on the side wall with the aerial uppermost and pointing for and aft. The DX7 manual recommends that the aerials are placed perpendicular but also shows one aerial further rotated through 90 deg. As you advise, I’ll take a strip of Velcro to the field!
Regards,
Eric
01-17-2007, 11:03 AM
#71
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RE: JR 2.4 gig radios
Below is an article on the DX-7 for anyone that wants to read it from an interview with Paul Beard (the inventor and designer of Spectrum) concerning the DX-7. One of the things I found interesting is the information concerning how much the range is reduced when you push the bind button. After reading this I don't think that pushing the button in the air can possibly provide any sort of useful information (unless I am missing something), and especially don't turn off the transmitter in the air because the recovery time is 5-7 seconds while it is scanning for channels after you turn it back on...I have already read where one person has done this but I don't remember where...Gary
http://www.runryder.com/helicopter/t298150p1/
http://www.runryder.com/helicopter/t298150p1/
01-17-2007, 11:12 AM
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RE: JR 2.4 gig radios
i am a firm believer that a failsafe should be set up to slow the model to allow it to crash with minimum speed and WITHIN the safe area you are flying in. a jet doing 250mph in level flight will go a long way in hold with the engine on idle
01-17-2007, 11:49 AM
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RE: JR 2.4 gig radios
Gary,
Thanks for the link to the article on runryder. I cut and pasted the critical statement for all to see. I didn't realize how much the power was reduced with the bind button, I may have read it but it didn't register. I'm going to have a look at it tonight with my spectrum analyzer.
"Since there is no antenna to collapse the system uses a button in the back of the transmitter that will cut the power of the transmitted signal down 40 dB while it’s being pressed. For those not familiar with dB numbers that mean that the signal’s power will be ten thousand times lower than normal."
Regards, Bill
Thanks for the link to the article on runryder. I cut and pasted the critical statement for all to see. I didn't realize how much the power was reduced with the bind button, I may have read it but it didn't register. I'm going to have a look at it tonight with my spectrum analyzer.
"Since there is no antenna to collapse the system uses a button in the back of the transmitter that will cut the power of the transmitted signal down 40 dB while it’s being pressed. For those not familiar with dB numbers that mean that the signal’s power will be ten thousand times lower than normal."
Regards, Bill
01-22-2007, 06:54 PM
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RE: JR 2.4 gig radios
I have my DX6 about one year on my park flyers with no problems. I decided to get the DX7 for my jets and large warbirds. I was wondering if anyone has had any prolblems with there DX7? The one think that I notice with my fut. 9z is every once in a while it would lock out for a breif second, I thought it must be the wind or something. With my spectrum I never get that feeling. I am gaining much confidence now. Where is spell check?
