Burt-RCU

My Feedback: (23)

I heard that several meets are no longer using an impound for transmitters. The last meet I went to, no impound was used. The number of transmitters on 72mhz was about 20%. Do you feel we should go on the honor system for the 20% that are not on the 2.4 system. These figures are only my observations.

LGM Graphix

My Feedback: (22)

I personally will NOT fly at any event that does not impound ALL transmitters. I will also not fly at a field that does not require pins on the board regardless of 72 or 2.4.

Here is why:

I know of 2 instances now where a model was shot down in the past year. It happened because somebody was flying on 2.4 on ONE airplane, but still had another on 72. They have become complacent with the 2.4 and not worrying about the frequency, and the 72mhz transmitter was grabbed in error and flipped on. Sadly, the airplane in the air was flying on 72mhz.

Further to that, the pins on a board let you know how many people are flying, or getting ready to fly etc. I don't know what the number is in the US for AMA, but with MAAC in Canada I believe there is a restriction to no more than 5 airplanes in the air at once. without an impound at an event it becomes more difficult to police that.

Further to that, most events I have attended, when your transmitter is impounded, whoever is manning the impound usually requests to see that your transmitter is indeed turned off.

So, as such, like I say, I personally will not risk my aircraft at any event where an impound and frequency board are not in effect.

Your mileage my vary...

Boomerang1

What he said! - John.

causeitflies

I like the idea of impounding all 72 Tx's. If pilot has a mix of 2.4 and 72 his 72 radio should be in the impound. This should be taken care of when registering for the event and I think every pilot should be asked at that time. The last two events I attended I had to ask about the impound.
The first was a small event (13 pilots) and though there was an impound the CD said to just keep the pin as there were no conflicts. That worked in that case.
The second event was larger and there was no impound and just a board with the names of the pilots and their frequencies. At first I only put my pin on the board when I was ready to fly. Later, I wanted to check something on my plane and although I "knew" that no one was on my frequency, I trudged to the board to place my pin. It didn't take long for all the guys on 72 to just leave their pins on the board all weekend. There were no conflicts and it worked but I feel uneasy about not having an impound at all. Even an unmanned impound is better than none at all.

My main club field has an impound rack for everyday use including a spot for 2.4. My other club has a board but not an impound. I try to keep up with who is on what frequency at all times, impound or not.

At an event the air boss and the number of pilot stations determine the number of planes in the air.

DavidR

My Feedback: (1)

I could care less....everything I have has been switched over to 2.4 so the transmitter impound has become a mute point. Any of you guys still flying 72 want to buy some recievers and radios cheap???


DR

E.N.T.

My Feedback: (1)

Causeitflies is right. Even if people are flying in 2.4, it is SAFE to have the transmiter impound
with spaces reserved for 2.4¨´s. In our club even if you are in 2.4,the pilot HAS TO PLACE his ID in the impound so everybody knows which ones are in use.

Hector

DadsToysBG

My Feedback: (35)

Guys, The impound of 72 has no bearing on the pilots flying 2.4. If you only have one person on a channel and he has the pin at the meat that takes care of him. The club hosting the show has the responsibility for those radios in inpound. If one dis appearers from the impound they must replace it. Why would any club what that hanging over their head if they don't have to?
Look at the JoNall this year, they closed the impound because of only a few 72 in a tent that would hold hundreds. They had over 400.
At our show this year only two had the same channel on 72 out of 38 pilots. Most were 2.4
For those of you you that won't or can't make the move, you are getting to be a very small number at these shows, just go to a jet meet or GS show.
The time is coming very soon where a question like this will not happen. If your not on 2.4 you'll have to take care of your self.
SEEF had 100 planes in the air at once.
To LGM. Your going to all by your self and no shows to attend. You'll not want to fly at our field.

At the heli meet in Munci last fall. They only had 24 on 72 out of 700 pilots. Think about managing that many radios. Only the 72 were impounded and then only the ones that were on the same channel.
Times are changing, either keep up or get left behind. Dennis

Synthetic

My Feedback: (18)

I could not care less. Let those on 72 choose.

What I choose is to never fly without the 2.4 system.

If I had to go back to the old way and take the chance of being "shot down" I'd sell all my stuff and go back to Bass fishing!

Don

causeitflies

As soon as there is a decent 2.4 module for my radio I will be all over it. For now I'm stuck with 72. It's nice to be at an event with no one on my channel, even though I can switch channels. However, most flyers don't go to meets and only fly at their club field. More than half the members in my club haven't even moved up to a computer radio, let alone 2.4.
The spot on the board for 2.4 is not to actually impound the Tx. It is to inform everyone that this pilot is not on 72 so you don't have to worry about his radio not being there.

Synthetic

My Feedback: (18)

Mark,
What radio do you have?
Don

causeitflies

Multiplex Royal Evo 12

Synthetic

My Feedback: (18)

Thanks Mark,
Don

LGM Graphix

My Feedback: (22)

Yes, it does in fact. Imagine you're flying on your 2.4, in the meantime, take the scenario I posted above. Somebody on 72 gets shot down by somebody else on 72 not paying attention. Even though you're on 2.4, now you're flying while listening to somebody yelling "heads up" and wondering where that out of control airplane is. As in the above stated situation, the persons involved in turning on a 72 radio did so because it was sitting next to their 2.4 radio and did so without thinking. Had all radio's required pinning, or impounding this would have been avoided.


You're quite correct, if there is only one person on a channel and he holds that pin, you don't have to worry about frequency conflicts. However, does the AMA not have a rule that regulates the number of models airborne at one time? An impound/frequency board (with 2.4 slots) helps keep this in check bigtime.


I wouldn't attend an event where they allow 100 planes in the air at once regardless of impounds or frequency control. BTW, I am on 2.4, but it doesn't change the fact that others are not, and that there still needs to be SOME control of what is happening in the air at an event. If it means I no longer attend events, then I guess that's the way it will be...


Indeed, how would they ever manage that many radio's? So you're telling me that there has never been events in the past with huge numbers like that? How did they manage then?


What kills me is that now that 2.4 is here, and people feel it's so safe, all of a sudden a radio impound or a frequency board is a big issue. We've had to deal with it for years up to this point! Why is it a problem now? It's like saying that speed limits were important before cars had seat belts and air bags, but now that we have seat belts and air bags we shouldn't have to worry as much about it.

I saw the same thing happen with turbines around 2003/2004. When all turbines were air start, EVERYONE had a fire extinguisher beside them during start up, and all had start boxes attached to monitor starts. When full electric auto start came around and became so simple and user friendly, people became complacent then as well. I watched a couple fires happen at superman 2004 because airplanes were fueled, carried to the flight line with nothing but the plane and transmitter, and started up, boom, wet start, no extinguisher....
At that same event, a jet was put away in the owners trailer, receiver was left on by accident, and when another jet was started on the same channel, the jet in the trailer started as well. Fortunately all it had was start gas I believe and damage to the trailer was minimal. I'm sure some will argue that wouldn't happen on 2.4 and you're right, all I'm saying is it's human nature to become complacent, forget something etc, so why take away one of the few safety measures that we can physically control at an event???


Would you really? What kept you taking the "chance" of being shot down before 2.4 and why didn't you quit then? What if 2.4 had never come along? Would you have quit?

I personally think 2.4 is a great advance in the hobby, but I do not see it as the be all end all of radio technology and no matter how good our radio's get, the aspect of human error will always exist....

Just my 2 cents

Synthetic

My Feedback: (18)

[Would you really? What kept you taking the "chance" of being shot down before 2.4 and why didn't you quit then? What if 2.4 had never come along? Would you have quit?]

Would I have quit if 2.4 had not come alone? Nope, but it did so that is a mute point. If you re-read my post I said, "I wouldn't go back to flying on 72" not that I wouldn't have kept flying if 2.4 had not come along..

Would I quit now if I had to go back to 72? Yep, that is NOT a mute point.

If I had to worry about what other pilots flying around me are capable of I would not have been flying the last 20 years.

I have seen so much "bad piloting" I never trust the other pilots unless I know them very well and I still keep one on them if you know what I mean.

I do 90% of my flying with no other planes in the air. I know most don't have this opportunity but I do and I like it.... ehehehhe..

Don

DadsToysBG

My Feedback: (35)

To answer Point (1) that is what your spotter is for.
Point (2) No The AMA makes recommendations not hard rules. The heli meet was held at the National Flying Site.
Point (3) You would have missed a lot of fun. Your lose not mine.
Point (4) No this was the biggest event in total number of flyer's in the USA. On the jet note. The CD is the one that failed to inforce the safety rules. The AMA does in this case state you must have a fire extinguisher at hand. This has nothing to do with impound.
The fact stills stands, with 2.4 you don't need a impound plain and simple. As more pilots make the move questions like this will pass like AM radios.
To worry about human error in this hobby would most likely keep most of us on the ground. You can't fix "stupid" you just live with it.
Dennis

jason

My Feedback: (1)

Dennis

I think that's completely wrong. You can fix "stupid" if you keep his tranny until the pin is free. Having no TX control will most defiantly cause more crashes and possible damage to people and property. Until theres a meet that is exclusively 2.4Ghz then I think there must be a TX control at events.

Jason

Geoff White

100% agree with you Jason.

jason

My Feedback: (1)

Glad to hear it Geoffrey or I would have to put you over my knee[X(]

LGM Graphix

My Feedback: (22)

1. Spotter aside, would no shoot down still not be better than a shoot down?

2 & 3. Fair enough, if there is no hard number I can't argue that, but that number of airplanes in the air at once increases so many other risks I wouldn't bother flying anyway.

4. As usual, the blatant point was missed, my comment regarding a fire extinguisher had NOTHING to do with a radio impound, but was there ONLY to reinforce how some modellers become complacent when technology improves.

As for "you can't fix stuipd, you just live with it".....
Well, I agree you maybe can't FIX stupid, but you can regulate just how stupid someone is in some cases.

At any rate, it's apparent that you don't agree with impounds or frequency control regardless of any potential problems or safety concerns so I'll just leave it at that. Continue to fly where-ever you want, makes no difference to me anyway, the question posed in this thread was whether or not there should be impounds and I stated my opinion. I will suffer no loss by not attending any event that I'm not comfortable with. The simple fact is, I go to an event to fly, and if there are 700+ models and people there, the amount of time for flying will be severely limited anyway. I like to fly when I feel like flying, not when I have to wait in line and then be told it's ok for me to fly. Not at a sport event anyway.

Once everyone is on 2.4 (which I don't see happening for a VERY long time) then maybe impounds won't be necessary, but until that time I feel they are as necessary if not more necessary now than ever. Once everyone has changed to 2.4 however, I believe flightline officials at events will be more important than ever to keep the number of airplanes in the air at once to a safe number.

rcguy!

My Feedback: (69)

2.4Ghz..... NO IMPOUND NEEDED NOR DESIRED!
72Mhz.....You'll see the light someday....IMPOUND or else!

Dave

Tom Antlfinger

My Feedback: (24)

Hi Burt:

I am in charge of impound for the FDL Aeromodelers Meetings. Our June Fun-Fly had 45 check-ins, about 60:40 split between SS and 72/50. I elected to NOT impound 2.4 but do the routine impound of 72/50 as we have been doing for years. No problems. The system was explained to pilots at check-in and during pilot meeting so all understood, especially the 4 guys running both 2.4 and 72. Absolutely no 72/50 trannies or tranny cases in the pits once the flight line opens. To help our safety crew do their spot checks, I did stick a bright orange sticker on 2.4 cases. As far as the trannies in the pits, easy to identify by looking at the antennas.

Our big Midwest Warbirds Meeting is coming up Aug. 15-17. I plan to run the impound the same way. We already have 74 pre-registered pilots and expect about 100 total from several states and Canada, including both props and jets. Based on the number of guys switching to 9303, 12X, and Futaba 2.4, I would expect at least a 70/30 distribution.

If you aren't committed to another meet on that weekend, bring your jet warbird to the smoothest 1250 X 300 ft, no-obstruction grass field in the Midwest and join in on the 3 days of friendly flying.

http://www.midwestwarbirds.com
http://www.fdlaa.com

Tomcat_104

My Feedback: (42)

I'm with LGM on this one. I have both 72mhz ans 2.4ghz radios and while impound is not necessary with the 2.4 systems it's a lot safer. As a pilot I feel more comfortable when I don't see 50 or 100 radios in the pits. I'm never sure if there's one other radio there on my 72mhz channel and I put way too much time in my models too have them shot down accidentally by someone who owns both frequencies and doesn't want to impound his radio.

I'm not so selfish that I can't care for someone else's airplane, even if it's just an ARF! I may be old fashioned but I still have respect for all of the other fliers at a meet. And if I have to miss out on a fly-in because of a lack of an impound then so be it. I choose not to go a throw away good money.

I hope I haven't offended anyone here; that was not my intention.

David

Synthetic

My Feedback: (18)

David,
You certainly did not offend me at all.

I agree with the 72's an impound should be in place.

All I am saying is I think the guys or gals on 72 should be the ones voting on this thread. They are really the ones effected by this.

I also agree with Dennis when he said, "To worry about human error in this hobby would most likely keep most of us on the ground. You can't fix "stupid" you just live with it.
Dennis]

There are many other things that should concern us besides the impounding of the 72's... However, if you worry about all those things ... flying won't be much fun......if you'd fly at all...

Don

bcovish

My Feedback: (8)

I've been to a lot of jet events. While I was on 72, I just impounded the module only but have witnessed two things happen to other pilots TX.
1 the impound person dropped a TX and broke one of the switches on top and didn't even say anything to the pilot.
2 the impound people lost a TX and the event didn't replace it.

I fly 2.4 now and there's no way I'm going to hand over a $1500 radio to someone who doesn't want to be there in the first place.

Tomcat_104

My Feedback: (42)

Don,

I'm glad I didn't offend you I just had an opinion and had to voice it. And no you can't cure stupid and it's rampant in our society today, and you're right when it stops being fun I have a bass boat in my garage and a couple of reels and that will become my #1 hobby! Until that time comes I'll keep flying!

David