flyncajun

This new look is going to be hard to get used too
Brett and I will try to update with photo`s and impressions when the WC starts
the US Team flies out to SA on Sunday!

Doug Cronkhite

My Feedback: (34)

None of the images are loading for me, but that's OK.. I know what the airplane looks like already.

I really like the retracts personally. I think they're going to improve the presentation of rolling maneuvers to the judges a great deal.

MTK

Brian, I think you are underestimating the retract weights, struts, servo(s) and mounts in the fuse/wing. One ounce+ for each retract mechanism plus one more ounce+ for each strut. Mounts in each wing, servo plus servo mount plus actuation pushrods, all add.

The weights for fixed gear are close, at least for most of the fixed gear I've seen; add the gear mount weight in the fuse, which is considerable for most set-ups I've seen. I've watched fixed gear weights drifting up and up over the years and especailly now with the large props everyone is turning. Said it before and it's worth repeating....current fixed gear are way overbuilt so demanding lighter will eventually make them lighter. My fixed gear weigh in the 5 ounce area RTF, including the fuse mount, so if I can do it, it's doable. BUT I don't make gear for commercial consumption, so don't ask. It's up to all you consumers to demand more for your money. Know what? Lighter means less carbon, epoxy etc., for the same or more money so it's up to the makers of this stuff to make it happen

The bottom line is making weight and I'm pretty certain Bryan's model's weight is inside the limit

flyncajun

Hey Matt
The retract setup on the Bipe is equal the the lightest fixed gear setup I`ve ever built or seen done with in a few grams
The titanium gear legs are only 6" long the new dig retract servo is 45g i think , but when deciding to do the project, I made sure the weight issue would not be a problem and carefully weighed everything for comparrison.

Doug ,the new look I was referring to was the RCU look
I got used to the retracts long ago ,and your right, the Bipe looks great rolling with the gear tucked in, much cleaner, more pure.

Now If I can convince Mayer to put retracts in his Tripe! that woud be something.
I remember being the only guy in the F3A finals with retracts,( you know Chip had to come and tell me Now his new Bipe has a YS and Retracts ,,Huuum! May be I wasn`t so Crazy after all!

BTW the new 185 Is really Nice in a Bipe, a great increase on midrange power ,Smooth,Quiet , and gobs of power. Coupled with a bipe the possibilities are endless,and I think there will be many advancements in Bipe designes because of this new power and the new Patterns. requiring more flexible designs. This is very Exciting to me, and many who compete in F3A it`s like a fresh breeze! on a cool spring day

Hope to see some of you in SA
Bryan

tuny

Beautifull Plane!!!

+1 on the 185! its a monster!!!!

see you in SA

drac1

My Feedback: (4)

Love the Alferma Bryan and the colour scheme is sensational. It looks really impressive.

What size prop are you running on the 185?

flyncajun

Thanks Drac Brett picked the colors ,I drew the Scheme a very good team effort ,he grew tiresed of the traditional red base and the same ol` colors
the airplane is big so it`s easy to see at 150.
Brett is running the 20.5- 10 apc. I`m looking forward to experiment with the three blade props But I could not get anyone to make one for us this year.

Bryan

drac1

My Feedback: (4)

I'm using the 20.5x10 on the 175cdi in my Valiants. A very good combination and suits the plane well.

The 185 should have more rpm with that prop. Might be a benefit in SA at the higher altitude.

Can you give any idea when the Alferma will be availabale?

flyncajun

Hi Drac
I`m hoping it will be in the spring 2014 in time for the season.
My Experience tells me the bipe will rule F3A for quite some time so, when I return from SA it will be my first priority to get a plug built and sent to the factory.

I also plan to update the Shark Bipe and re introduce it as well. The Shark bipe is like a little Hot Rod! capable of unbelievable stuff Like Brett says, it`s so powerfull on Knife edge,it`s like having 2 elevators. With the new motors ,,this should be a blast !

Bryan

MTK

Bryan, OK, that's great!....

Good luck to Brett, you, and our team in SA. This contest is going to be interesting.....

Bill Clark

Mainly wanted to test my new avatar but will include some pics of the Alferma I took while Brett Wickizer was preparing out at RCACF in Apopka ,Fl this week. I have to say that this plane and this pilot present the most elegant demonstration of precision flying I have ever witnessed.

serious power

Na

flyncajun

Thanks for the tip Brian

What you see is probably an illusion, the aileron and wing stays are not lined up with each other, and as a percentage of wingspan, the distance is nearly the same as most bipes.
The problem with wing folding on the proto, had to do with improper usage, the Large wings were very lightly built 500G to make weight on the first proto. (second set of wings) then using 15 deg of opposite ailerons for breaking flipped "on" during a down line.

There are so many things to consider when designing a bipe (mostly for durability and weight) but the hardest thing to figure out is exactly where to place the wings for the correct balance and incidence.
I think you should build a wood Proto, and be prepaired to move things around al little.
Bryan

serious power

Bryan,
Yes,I saw that in the photo in the post before I did the edit.
Juan Rombaut uses that break system, and seems to use a lot of aileron deflection - but then he does so when flying very slowly anyway.

500g - For each or both ??
Edit ; I meant to ask ; and or at what stage of completeness ?? ( original not well phrased)

Yes I have come up with a strut system that will allow for incidence adjustment - each wing independent of the other.
I sure it will also allow for position adjustment. I wanted adjustability and quick assembly.

My focus is on weight and wing stiffness but with a view to producing a model that is extra stable in yaw - as I'm using the contra and it would now appear that the contra has exposed a pre-existing yaw stability issue in some designs.
I'm also focused on getting a model with a bias for the P schedules. I have little need for an 'F' model.
However if this works out I have a V2 thought trough which will be good for the high K stuff.

Brian

MTK

Hmmmm 500 grams for both wings, finished and RTF will be a stretch for an RC model.

It's no big deal tho to make a 700 square incher to come in at 7 ounces or so (around 200 grams) for CL, so this wing size can be very light and strong enough, but CL models only weigh 4 lbs

For a bipe, A top wing with 750 squares (75" span, and 10" avg chord) can be built at around 9-10 ounces RTF (or 300 grams with smaller servos and all paint of course) and a bottom wing at around 14-16 ounces (400-450 grams with retracts).

BUT I have no real interest in tackling a project like that. I want to work on 100" Pattern planes next for smaller piped gassie twins.

flyncajun

Hey Brian , Matt
The lightest I `ve been able to build my Alferma Bipe wing is 400G top 520g bottom with retract plates, I think( have to go back and check Finished weights this is not covered with any film or glass except for the center ) and this is no easy task. I even weighed the glue, C/A is 12-15G heavier per skin than poly glue to attach. Center glass cost aprox 50g each wing so raw wood weight about 350.
It`s not as easy at it may seem, the wing stay mounts are included in this with internal wing structureas well to about 40 grams each wing.
My wings are very large however. My Oxai Shark wings painted were 500G each But very small compared to the Alferma.

Bryan

MTK

Bryan, it sounds like around 2 lbs to 2.2 lbs (1000 grams) for both wings. Still a fine weight for the bipe in my opinion....Are the wings around 750 squares a piece? I guessed at that size but seemed logical, reasonable....

serious power

Hi,
Matt ; yes 72" x 11" would be typical for an F3A bipe right now - some quite a bit smaller and one or two are a bit bigger.
Bryan are yours foam cores or built up - I have decided to go with foam cores.
I have a test core at 35g (need 4 of those) for a 1.8M span - after coring out !
This would be fine to use for both IC and E power as the original foam is over 15Kg/M\2 - quite dense and structurally sound.
Will post here on RCU when I move forward on this.

Brian

MTK

Brian, I think foam can be built lighter and stronger or just as strong as built up. It also easier to get accuracy in the long run. And should be easier to finish light with some the techniques we've discussed for paint

serious power

Matt,
I agree.
I will be going with that method.
I now have all the sheeting req'd - at 11.3g per 4" sheet - not bad.
Have to work our a good method for glueing.

Brian

flyncajun

Matt the wings on the Alferma are 780 square each much bigger than any other bipe out right now and the reason it was difficult to get the Alferma under weight.
The first set of wings were much smaller and foam core, the foam is much heavier but stronger May be, if they are honey combed you might be able to save a little ,But I doubt it, I tried , Built up is way lighter, but much more work.

My stabs are also built up at 50g each before covering. The first set of foam stabs were 80 grams each before covering.
Bryan

flyncajun

"I'm also focused on getting a model with a bias for the P schedules. I have little need for an 'F' model.
However if this works out I have a V2 thought trough which will be good for the high K stuff."

Brian

Brian,
Don`t get caught up in thinking that a bipe will fly P easier than F is setup a particular way. A bipe set up well, will not be able to tell the difference between the two patterns when flying.
The P pattern is more deciving than it looks in complexity, A lot of down wind 45 pulls and other decivingly complex intricacies that will require a large wing mono or, bipe to perform correctly.
The setup is no different from P-F or unknowns on a bipe.
So, if your going to put the effort in building a Bipe make it a Thoroughbred!

I hear this alot and it`s just not the case , If an airplane is really designed for F3A, it has to be designed for the Unknowns ,if you can do this, it will easily fly the P pattern in the right hands. it would be like designing a formula 1 car for oval racing.

Bryan

serious power

Hi Bryan,
Yes I agree.
It's just that ,for now anyway, I'm going to use a pre-existing fuz,, with a few simple enhancements.
To get a complete model out at the weight and strength (both are important to me) that I require simply demands a moulded fuz,, . (I need enough overhead to install the contra and reasonably big batteries, so as not to be 'hurting' the packs)
Right now that is just not justifiable for a one off - for me anyway.
If it works well and meets my weight target I do have a 'V2' planned.
I'm confident I will get a result ,but not sure.
That will mean a return to plugs and moulds for me - next winters project .
The effort put into V1 should readily transfer to V2.
I'm also in a tighter than before budget situation.
So for now it's one step at a time.
Bipes do have the advantage in the P versus F debate. They make it a lot less relevant as they fly both well.
They snap and spin etc very well with no compromise to their other 'flying' characteristics.
For me they 'fly' well and also allow me a tad more time which is making a difference to my flying.

Brian

flyncajun

interesting,

Brandon Landrey is turning a Shinden into a Bipe as we speak, I love this.
The new patterns and powerplants have enticed new thinking and tinkering, This advances the Sport.
I`m glad to see some still love the "home brew" method, just like the old days !
Good luck with your mod.

Bryan

tuny

from my experience build up is lighter than foam, foam is just easier to work with (takes more time also believe it or not) and is a lot easier to make everything straight. about the weight, around 550-600 g RTF each wing is about normal. ALL the bipe wings that I have seen or have myself lighter than that just dont hold up. the wings on a biplane MUST be strong. so be very careful with this. if you need to save weight save all you can on your fuselage, NEVER compromise the structures on the wings.

TUNY