MAVROS

Hi all,

Does anyone know the difference between the 185 Cdi Red and the non Red.

The red appears to have a different injector on top of the engine.

Is this a new design ?

rgds

apereira

Yes, it is a little bit different.

It has a different injector, the diaphragm has been removed, new injector with a hose attached to it (specific hose, not anything to be used) has the same effect but seems to be a simpler longer lasting injector.
It has a "break in" needle, it is used for it's name and for very hot days.
Has pretty much the same power and runs reaaally good.

Regard

topiwala

I just got the cdi red. Different injector I see. But shouldn't fuel flow to it when priming the engine. I've just tried to prime by hand as i do with my other cdi's, and I just get fuel pouring out of the carb throttle body. fuel doesn't seem to go through to the injector. However if I disconnect the line from the injector and then prime the engine, then fuel does flow through that line. So it seems the injector is closed or something. Is it some kind of spring loaded unit that only opens with pressure in the cylinder? Or is there something wrong if fuel can't flow to it? Should the hose be pushed all the way over the barb on the injector? A little confused....

apereira

The hose should be pushed all the way into the barb, what happens is the fuel will go thru the injector once the fuel has sufficient pressure, this is so the injector pulverizes and do not drip, the fuel coming from the carb is from the "break-in needle", which drops fuel on the real bearing and connecting rod.

You probably still have air in the pump as it is new, disconnect the injector hose and flip the prop by hand back and forth in the position where you hear a click coming from the engine, let the fuel come out a bit, not just a couple of drops, reconnect and start, it should work.

Regards

topiwala

Thanks for sharing that info. Installed and ran a tank through. This engine is a dream to run. No mucking around. Primed and ran from the first attempt. Up to full throttle and down to a 1200 rpm idle. On its first ever tank of fuel. Beautiful and smooth.
Running a 20x10.5 on it to run in.

apereira

Excellent,

I really like that prop too.

Regards

MAVROS

Hi all,

Fired up my 185 cdi red today...

Started up first go run it very rich for one tank full ....leaned it out a bit and run to full power no hesitation and very smooth idle.
Also running the20x10.5 APC Carbon prop
Awsome engine

kenh3497

IMO.... CDI on any glow engine takes out most if not all the issues of running glow on a large displacement (over 1.2) engine. An increase in fuel economy and the ignition point is always the same every firing stroke unlike glow which can vary considerably.

Ken

bjr_93tz

As long as it's doing what it should.

IMHO the vast majority of the issues I've had with my engine have been ignition related. In fact, I'm heading towards a stalemate with YS right now over who's going to pay the freight to replace a faulty-out-of-the-box CDI sensor.

As much as I love my engine when it's running right I've reached the point where, under the current circumstances, I'll walk away from YS if they want to stiff me over postage.

drac1

My Feedback: (4)

I had a lot of ignition problems with the 170 cdi's and not so many with the 175 after I worked out what to do to stop the back plate sensor from playing up.

I've been running my 2 185's for 2 years now, and only changed one ignition module. No back plate sensors.

I have never had any problems with YS replacing faulty parts, they couldn't be more helpful. They even send the replacements without me sending the faulty parts back.

bjr_93tz

Yeah, but you must be a YS shareholder by now :-)

I don't really mind replacing bits that wear out or fail every now and then, but this is the last straw. When a customer gets shirty over a couple of dollars of postage you know it's become a matter of principle...

MAVROS

I think its time for you to go electric mate...

Beware they have their issues too

As a matter if interest who are you dealing with ...factory or ausie shop ?

rgds

bjr_93tz

I'm working with the retailer, who are communicating with YS.

I was wondering myself the difference between the 185cdi and the 185cdi red?
Just some anodising or is there a performance difference?

I don't remember noticing any differences in the major part numbers, unlike the Zero which runs a different (higher compression?) piston.

drac1

My Feedback: (4)

The injector set up is different. The Red doesn't use the check valve.

And also the bling

From what I hear, performance is the same as the standard 185.

drac1

My Feedback: (4)

Hi MAVROS,

What's the top rpm you are getting with the 20 x 10.5?

drac1

My Feedback: (4)

The head, crankcase and carb housing have different part numbers. The carb would be because of the break in needle, the Red crankcase is "polished", for extra strength and for the head, I presume the injector nipple would be different.

The rocker cover and regulator body have different part numbers as well. But that's only because of the anodising.

Should be able to convert a standard 185 to the Red, but unless the new injector set up is noticeably better, then probably not worth it.

MAVROS

Hi drac,

The engine is not broken in yet so will post RPM later for you.
What are you getting and what fuel are you using with your 185.

Also do you mind telling how you prevent the back plate from playing up.

regards

drac1

My Feedback: (4)

What's your break in procedure?

Rapicon 30/10.

Around 6900 with the 21 x 10 PNC.

I've just fitted the 21 x 10.5 PNC to try. 6700 rpm, but haven't flown with this prop yet.

From what I hear, the Red should produce around 150 more rpm. I'm interested to know what you are getting.

I fit a bracket to support the sensor lead where it comes out of the back plate.

bjr_93tz

I wish my sensor issues were as simple as a broken wire. I replaced the hall sensor in one that was unreliable and consigned that to the spare parts bin. I swapped that back in recently when it's replacement became unreliable but my repaired one will only run reliably for about 5-6 minutes.

So I've got two that'll run the engine for a while before playing up. The brand new unit would't even start the plane at all despite triggering the module when turning the engine by hand. Spin the engine with the starter and it was like the ignition was turned off. Interestingly the new sensor was triggering about 3 degree earlier than the original two.

I've just sent the new one back to YS and they've posted me a replacement.

The magnets in all three (including the new one) have a peak surface field strengths around 200mT (2000 Gauss) so the magnets haven't weakened with the heat cycles. I've a few avenues of investigation to head down. It'd be nice to know what is happening rather than just change the assembly and have it work again.

drac1

My Feedback: (4)

Symptoms sound more like ignition module.

drac1

My Feedback: (4)

When it starts playing up after around 5 minutes, what exactly does it do? Is the miss fire in the midrange, top end or everywhere?

bjr_93tz

I've got three ignition modules, two older ones and a new 8.4v one when I bought with the new sensor to isolate if it were a module problem. I've powered up the modules in all the ways you can to rule out supply voltage issues.

With an old sensor and new module, it runs fine but about 5 minutes in it'll cough a few times then act like it's loaded up with fuel or running rich and won't clear itself. You can get it on the ground before it stops running but it won't throttle up if you need to do a go-around. I've chased this with new parts all over, the brand new sensor and module was the last hope before sending it to the crusher so when the new sensor wouldn't even start the engine I was more than a bit miffed.

This engine has done this to me before and when I got it sorted it ran well for years, but again I think there's been one or two things playing up at the same time.

drac1

My Feedback: (4)

The version 2 HV modules are heaps better than the original ones, lighter as well. It's a pity there is no way of testing them, the test is to use them. Even on the test stand, I've found they will run fine, but put them in the plane and fly, they start to play up.

"With an old sensor and new module, it runs fine but about 5 minutes in it'll cough a few times then act like it's loaded up with fuel or running rich and won't clear itself. You can get it on the ground before it stops running but it won't throttle up if you need to do a go-around." - It's either the module, or the engine is getting too hot. If it's a brand new module, I'd say engine overheating?

If it's the back plate sensor, it will misfire, (similar to a bad plug), or just stop working completely. Run the engine on the ground and wriggle the sensor lead where it goes into the back plate.

bjr_93tz

Yeah Scott, it's frustrating that they'll run all day on the ground fine but play up in the air, makes it hard to isolate things.

I had a small win today, even though it was 40 deg here, I went out anyway as I'd installed a new hall sensor and wiring into the old assembly and was keen to try it. Much better but still not 100% and whatever it is seems temperature related.

I'll wait until the new unit turns up and try that out. When it was working right you could be a bit out with the regulator and needle settings and it would be fine, but right now it seems hard to find a sweet working range. Seem to need to have it super lean at the moment.

We probably shouldn't be hijacking Mavros's thread with this. I might start a new thread when the new sensor arrives if the problems continue.

Cheers.

drac1

My Feedback: (4)

No worries Brett.

I'm leaning towards engine over heating.

Good info for cdi users though.