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Composite-ARF Integral, kinda build thread

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Old 11-17-2006, 07:13 PM
  #26
JAS
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Default RE: Composite-ARF Integral, kinda build thread

Hi Chuck, not sure about dropping any weight from the motor itself, but the control unit is 1.2ozs though. I guess it all depends on what is swapped out (injector) or added (needle valve) on the motor.

Since the stab servo's dropped in like the wing servos... I did that. Looks like it might be time to start doing some actual work to rig the rest. That's probably gonna happen tomorrow.
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Old 11-17-2006, 09:12 PM
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Default RE: Composite-ARF Integral, kinda build thread

Jason,
I'm curious how the final weights came in. If I read correctly from your earlier post the basics are:
Fuselage 27
Belly Pant 2.2
Canopy 4.5
Hatch 2.4
Right Stab 4.1
Left Stab 4.2
Rudder 2.1
Right Wing 14
Left Wing 14
TOTAL: 74.5 oz for empty airframe
plus Engine OS200 EFI* 41

Neither the airframe or the engine are remarkably light. The engine itself is 11 oz heavier than an OS140RX. My fascination was your prediction of a 9.34 lb final product, which is remarkably light. Actually I don' t this this was so much a prediction as an accounting of the weights you knew at the time. However, if the final plane is close to this and the plane is stiff enough and durable, then there are some building skills in play that you have that would be of great interest. Many people starting at this weight would have a hard time making 11# much less 10#, so I hope to learn more. Thanks.
--Lance
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Old 11-17-2006, 09:47 PM
  #28
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Default RE: Composite-ARF Integral, kinda build thread

Lance,

Those are weights as I pulled parts out of the box. Don't forget, the fuselage has a bunch of stuff already installed, and is only missing a rudder/tank/batt/rx tray. The OS weight is including all the parts with a * next to it. Hyde mount, header and pipe. It looks like we probably will change the canopy to a solid composite one to save about 3ozs or so. My list also includes a heavy back plate spinner, a 24oz tank (using a 20) and other than a 2-cell Lipo, I'm not doing anything to make it lighter. I want basic, everyday numbers. Anyone that spends some time with it I'm sure will make it lighter. 9.75lbs... maybe with work, my prediction is 10-10.25lbs. I'm not really a builder , I think I can hold my own, but I could easily be way off on my predictions.

Jason
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Old 11-17-2006, 10:01 PM
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Default RE: Composite-ARF Integral, kinda build thread

That's a great pic Jason..
Get a sawzall out and then I'll really be impressed.. LOL




Chris
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Old 11-17-2006, 10:14 PM
  #30
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Default RE: Composite-ARF Integral, kinda build thread

Thanks Jason, I spit Coca Cola out laughing when I noticed the claw hammer.....

-Mike

PS hey can I use that for the next K Factor cover?
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Old 11-17-2006, 11:11 PM
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Default RE: Composite-ARF Integral, kinda build thread

They look like the same tools my dentist used on the last visit .
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Old 11-17-2006, 11:29 PM
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Default RE: Composite-ARF Integral, kinda build thread

I would defenitely quit that dentist!!

OUCH

LOL

C
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Old 11-18-2006, 06:54 AM
  #33
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Default RE: Composite-ARF Integral, kinda build thread

Great airplane Jason!

Two questions:

- if I understand correctly, the OS 200 can be run without the control unit, just like a standard 4-Stroke???
- what kind of servo did you mount on the stabs?
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Old 11-18-2006, 09:57 AM
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Default RE: Composite-ARF Integral, kinda build thread

Good Morning: We're following this thread as well. Since we're newbies, could JAS, or someone explain the RFI, vs the standard 200.. and has anyone run these engines yet.. also a consideration.. thks for sharing.
Don
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Old 11-18-2006, 10:20 AM
  #35
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Default RE: Composite-ARF Integral, kinda build thread

I believe that Jason is running 9602 on the elevator. He also mentioned earlier that he has not run th motor yet. So we will just have to wait till next week when he runs the motor and flies the plane to get some numbers on the engine.
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Old 11-18-2006, 11:25 AM
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Default RE: Composite-ARF Integral, kinda build thread

Thks rgreen24, JAS, or someone; please elaborate on the actual control horn placement/type on the surfaces. Looks like the surfaces will have to be cut, or drilled to implant the horns. What type are you going to use?Do you folks use something lie the rocket city hardware, or some other device
Thks

Don
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Old 11-19-2006, 06:10 AM
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Default RE: Composite-ARF Integral, kinda build thread

Now I see--that beard would be risky with an electric prop....
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Old 11-19-2006, 06:57 AM
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Default RE: Composite-ARF Integral

Quote:
ORIGINAL: JAS

That is the OS-200 in the CR MKII mount.
How many % oil and % nitro does OS recommend for OS-200 EFI? Nitro and oil is much more expensive than methanol. YS engines need 20 to 30 % nitro and at least 20 % oil. That make YS engine much more expensive to run compare to OS 140 RX.

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Old 11-19-2006, 01:40 PM
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Default RE: Composite-ARF Integral

Is this OS200 already sold ?
In which Shop ? Please put a link, if you have !

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Old 11-19-2006, 04:42 PM
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Default RE: Composite-ARF Integral, kinda build thread

Thanks guys.

Jason, can I know why a 9602 instead of a 9650, which is digital with the same weight?

Thanks!
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Old 11-20-2006, 12:59 AM
  #41
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Default RE: Composite-ARF Integral, kinda build thread

I have not been told when the 200 will be available. There will be a Sport version coming that is just like the rest of the OS line of 4-strokes. I was told to run 20/20 fuel in the EFI and a 17x13 prop, so that is the prop for my first few flights. After that I will be doing some prop testing. Guess I'll go exchange that 30% I just bought.

It's supposed to be really windy here the next few days, so I've since slowed down the build. I've made parts for most everything to get mounted to and they totaled 1.5ozs. This includes a tank tray, rudder tray and throttle servo/EFI/Rx Battery tray. I have the nose ring "former" to go. Tomorrow is a gluing day and hopefully I can get the canopy and chin mounted as well.

I was going to use 9602’s, but I’ve since found a couple of 3002’s that I’m going to use instead. Being that the 200 is a prototype, I haven’t seen how much is doesn’t shake yet, so I’ll keep the metal-geared servos in for now. After I know more, I’ll order up some 9650’s and put them in my Integrals.

Oh yea, some more weights:

Hatori short pipe- 3.5ozs with included mount
EFI unit- 1.2ozs ready to install
Hyde CR MKII mount- 3.4ozs with all screws/washers/blind nuts
Du-Bro 20 oz tank- 2.9ozs ready to fuel

*** Does anyone have weights of their fuselages, with all wood/composite parts glued in/ hatches/canopies mounted, they are willing to share? No motor, mounts, servos, switches…etc installed and no canopy and chin on. Even weights of their bare airframes before all the formers, trays, firewall...etc. Thanks.
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Old 11-20-2006, 08:16 AM
  #42
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Default RE: Composite-ARF Integral, kinda build thread

Hello JAS
Weights of differents pieces as in the kit on picture are :
fuse 750 g (26,455 oz), underbelly 130 g (4,586 oz) , rudder 20 g (0,705 oz) , wing 257 g (9,065 oz), other wing 260 g (9,171 oz) , stab 2x 55 g (2x 1,94 oz).
Claude
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Old 11-20-2006, 09:02 AM
  #43
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Default RE: Composite-ARF Integral, kinda build thread

Jason,
Be careful with the really small metal geared servos. I ran some JR DS 3421s on ailerons last year with metal gears, thinking that I'd change them to nylon when they got a little sloppy. The difference between a little sloppy and totally stripped was a very fine one, and a servo lost 3 teeth in one flight, landing with one ailreon working. The very fine gears in these small metal geared servos wear very quickly once there is a little slop, and the teeth are so fine that they don't have much material to wear before they strip. Ailerons are particularly vulnerable. This was with an OS 1.60 which doesn't shake as much as the big 4 strokes.

I changed the gears to nylon, and never had another problem.

Just a thought...

Jon

Quote:
ORIGINAL: JAS


I was going to use 9602’s, but I’ve since found a couple of 3002’s that I’m going to use instead. Being that the 200 is a prototype, I haven’t seen how much is doesn’t shake yet, so I’ll keep the metal-geared servos in for now. After I know more, I’ll order up some 9650’s and put them in my Integrals.

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Old 11-20-2006, 05:46 PM
  #44
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Default RE: Composite-ARF Integral, kinda build thread

I have

Fuse 823 g
All wood in bag 393 g
Leading edges + other 197 g
Right stab 57 g
Left stab 60 g
Right wing 226 g
Left wing 234 g
Rudder 22 g
Canopy ( Nut cut yet ) 227 g

Total 2239 g

" All wood in bag" includes the undercarriage along with wheel pants and tail tube of aluminum. Fuse is huge (!) on this one, so it will be difficult to build a really light aeroplane. In comparison the fuselage of the Cocaine was 765 g with a large plate for undercarriage allready installed.
Your models empty weight seems to be 78.8 oz, 2234 g, so this is now all alarm lights starts to turn on for keeping the weight down going electric, but for glow it is going to end up in the 4700's. That is also the weight i'm shooting for....Back to the building table ...
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Old 11-21-2006, 11:12 PM
  #45
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Default RE: Composite-ARF Integral, kinda build thread

Here are a couple of pics of the horns. I taped off the area I didn't want the glue to get to and removed it after I made the fillet around the horn. Leaves a nice clean glue joint.

Also, here's a pic of the rudder pin that holds the rudder in.
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Old 11-21-2006, 11:33 PM
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Default RE: Composite-ARF Integral, kinda build thread

Lookin good Jay.
Obviously there is no Turkey at YOUR HOUSE!!!!!!!!!!!!

We're all waitin to hear an honest flight report!!

Thanks for this thread!!

C
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Old 11-22-2006, 12:54 AM
  #47
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Default RE: Composite-ARF Integral, kinda build thread

There's always at least 1 "turkey" here...

I'll give my report and I'll try to get others to report if they get to fly it...lol.
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Old 11-22-2006, 01:41 AM
  #48
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Default RE: Composite-ARF Integral, kinda build thread

Hi Jason,

Looking forward to your report

A couple of quick questions

1) Are wings constructed from the same material and lay up of fuse?
2) Are they using adjusters or fixed pins?
3) Is undercarriage same as Impact undercarriage?
4) Does the tailplane have a thick airfoil section or similar to IMPACT
5) What thickness are the trailing edges?
6) Is there any chance you could take a couple of pictures inside the fuse through the canopy access?

Thanks

Peter
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Old 11-22-2006, 10:26 AM
  #49
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Default RE: Composite-ARF Integral, kinda build thread

Hi Peter,

Here's some answers:

1- Same
2- Fixed
3- Same
4- ZN
5- ZN
6- Will get some soon

Jason
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Old 11-22-2006, 04:13 PM
  #50
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Default RE: Composite-ARF Integral, kinda build thread

Here's some pics of the way I mounted the chin cowl. 4- 2/56 bolts with blind-nuts. I added wood to the front for the front 2 screws and used the landing gear plate for the rear 2.
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