piotrekpepe

Which better for pattern flying (F3A): Hacker A60-22S, Hacker A60-24S or Plattenberg XTRA 30-10 EVO?

can773

My Feedback: (1)

I have never ran the A60 series of motors so I cannot make any comments on them.

I have probably the most experience running a Pletty 30-10 Evo of probably anyone. Its not the cheapest option by far, but they are one of the lightest options and are very reliable. I have around 500 flights on one of my Evo's with zero maintenance of any kind. The motor was specifically designed by Plettenberg with input from Bernd B. and myself for F3A competition, so it works in that environment very well.

Performance wise, depending on your local conditions and batteries an APC 20x15 will spin about 6200-6500 rpm and the motor will draw around 80A static. In flight you can expect about a 5A drop as everything unloads. I have not measured in flight RPM.

I am not sure if Dave Snow reads this list, but he has done some comparisons with the 30-10 Evo and some other motors like Axi/Dualsky....although I cannot recall if he compared to an A60.

Chris Moon

My Feedback: (8)

I don't think Dave frequents RCU so I will tell you what Dave has done. Dave does not have a Hacker 20S to try. I do, and it is a nice motor but it's biggest issue is getting it mounted securely. The only option is to nose mount it and then make a rear support for the back of the motor. Yes, you can use one of the aluminum firewall mounts, but that adds another several ounces. The others can mount right to a firewall and save the weight of the aluminum mount. Dave flew the Pletty, Axi and Dualsky in his Prestige and he said he is going to run the Dualsky next year. I think his decision was based not only on performance but cost. The Dualsky we got for $105, the Axi F3A is about $209 and the Pletty is close to $500. I saw them all fly and they are all VERY good motors, but is the Axi twice as good as the Dualsky, or the Pletty 5 times better based on pricing? I am running the Axi simply because that is what I set up my planes for. If I did it again, I would pick the Axi or the Dualsky for their performance / price.

Oh, yeah - I saw Chad's Pletty Evo at the NATS and it has amazing power - at least equal to or a little more than all of the others mentioned

woodie

I have no direct experience with the Plettenberg motors (other than looking at the price!) ;-)

However, I have experience running both the AXI F3A and the Dualsky 6360s as well as a flying partner that used the A60-22S but has switched to Dualsky. In my opinion, the A60 does not have the power of the AXI F3A, Dualsky 6360s.

I am now running Dualskys exclusively for 3 reasons. First, they are every bit as reliable as the AXIs, second they cost half as much as an AXI F3A and third, they are about 2 oz lighter than the AXI F3A. Having said that, I will add that I think the bearings in the AXIs are better but replacement bearings for the Dualsky are very inexpensive, they are in fact skateboard bearings and very easy to remove and replace. You can spend as much on the bearings as you would like (ceramics, etc) but standard steel or stainless bearings are about $3 apiece. The AXI and the Dualsky both use the same 3 bearings one larger 19x8x6 mm and two 16x8x5 mm). We have just switched a friends motor to some ceramics as an experiment, too early to tell yet.

The Dualsky 6360-11T (235kv) motor is almost a duplicate of the AXI F3A in performance (amps, rpm, etc) while the Dualsky 6360-12T is a 210kv motor and only draws about 65 amps on a 20x15 motor but still has more than enough speed and vertical pull to handle some pretty stiff wind. I typically use about 3200-3500 mah for a P07 flight if I fly normal size and about 150 meters. If you want to go faster, just move the throttle up a little. In calm air, it is pretty easy to fly a P07 flight at around 3000 mah if you don't get too large on the maneuvers. I have had zero problems with my first Dualsky 12T, still running it with original bearings tho some of my friends have replaced bearings in their Dualskys when they get a little noisy.

Both the Dualsky and AXI motors can be mounted from a firewall mount or from a nose ring mount. I prefer the nose ring mounts due to simplicity and I think it also helps distribute the prop loads thru the motor better. I know some have had problems blowing the noses off their planes using nose ring mounts but with the approach we have taken building the nose rings and support structure, we have had no problems with strength or rigidity, etc.

Sorry for rambling. I know you were asking about A60 vs Plettenberg but I thought I would throw in a little reference material here.

Woodie (Don Atwood)

Malcolm H

I have around 150 flights on my first 30-10 Evo and other than charging the batteries there has been zero maintenance on the motor and the complete model. My numbers agree with Chad's and this setup produces outrageous power if you want it.

A lot of years in this hobby have taught me that you gets what you pays for and in the words of John Ruskin " the common law of business prevents paying a little and getting a lot"

You choose!

Malcolm

OhD

Last year I decided I wanted to replace my Hacker inrunner with an outrunner that would yield the same performance with a minimum weight increase. I looked at the A60 S series but decided to buy an A60 18M as it could handle higher power. How much is difficult to determine from the Hacker specs. It proved to work fine on the bench but it was 26.5 ounces rather than the advertised 24 ounces. I ended up buying the Dualsky 6360 12T and have over 110 flights with no problems.

Chad's data is very impressive and might be the best combination one can put together right now. I measured 6040 rpm on the 20x15 with a Dualsy 11T with the voltage pulled down to 33.7 V at 80.2 Amps. With new generation batteries, voltage, rpm and probably current would be higher.

Bottom line, I don't think you can match the Pletty with an A60 S and the A60 M is too heavy in my estimation, but you can get close with a Dualsky .

Jim O

can773

My Feedback: (1)

Hi Jim

From the correspondence I had with Dave S. it seemed like the Dualsky was very similar to the Pletty in terms of performance. Pretty amazing considering the price. He sent me all his logged flights and it seemed like it is really good bang for the buck.

I have asked on a number of occasions if Plettenberg would consider dropping the price of the Evo, and I hope to broach the subject again at the WC's next month. Hopefully they will listen as right now its pricing is a bit out of line imo.....although I don't think it will ever be in the $100 level!! That being said if dropping the price means hurting quality etc. thats not a good thing either.

Chris Moon

My Feedback: (8)

Dave asked me to add the Dualsky 12 turn likes a larger prop than the Axi F3A motor. Dave liked the 21-14 on the Dualsky vs. the 20-13 on the Axi drawing similar amps.

ColinW

Hi has anyone tried a Hyperion Z50xx series? It looks good from the specs. They do a mount and ESC as well.

shannah

My Feedback: (5)

Hi Guys,

Will the Dualsky 6360-12T bolt into the same hole pattern as an AXI FAI? (nose ring mount).

woodie

If you are referring to the outer holes on the AXI, then the answer is yes. The Dualsky mounting holes match the outer ring but do not have an inner ring of 4mm holes like the AXI.

Woodie

shannah

My Feedback: (5)

Thanks,

I'll give a dualsky 12 a try.

Steve