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SPEKTRUM Misrepresentation?

Old 02-27-2012, 06:41 AM
  #76  
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...
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Old 02-27-2012, 07:31 AM
  #77  
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Default RE: SPEKTRUM Misrepresentation?

I will admit I had a hard time wading through some of the postings on this thread so maybe I'm missing something here but the way I see it is:

You have a DSMX rx that is labeled DSM2.

The DMSX rx has all the capability as the DMS2 and plus a little more.

Any place you can "legally" use a DSM2 you can also use a DSMX.

So that the end of the story as far as the impact of the mislabeled rx labeling is concerned.

You are irritated that you have an rx that has more capability than you expected?

Nothing you experienced was caused by that mislabeling of the rx.

I am not saying that there are no issues dealing with incompatibilities between DSM2 and DSMX and satellites; only that they don’t have anything to do with that little sticky back thing that is placed on the outside of your rx.
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Old 02-27-2012, 08:32 AM
  #78  
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ORIGINAL: 4*60

I agree with the OP. He actually made sense.A dsmx rx labelled as a dsm2 rx is NOT a dsm2 rx. It is a dsmx rx. This is plain logic. Not saying it won't act as a dsm2 rx, but it is clearly not simply a dsm2 rx. Anyone thinking otherwise should attend a logic course or confer with Spoc.


Putting Model A labelling and pinstriping on a Ferrari and driving it on the freeway at max 45 mph does not make it a Model A.
I guess we will have to agree to disagree...

I can bind my AR8000 to my DSM2 Only DX6i and it works fine.... So I can't comprehend how anyone can tell me it is not aDSM2 receiver.

A DSM2 reciever will be a device that receives DSM2 protocol (and works) Which the AR8000 definately DOES..

I really am trying to see your point of view.. but I just can't see it..

As for the Ferrari analogy...

Your analogy is more akin to putting DSM2 labelling on a Futaba Receiver, as it cannot and NEVER will receive and use the DSM2 Protocol...

Using that Analogy, the way I see it...

Ferrari builds a 328 Model and sells it like this for years..

They are working on a 330 model (with improvements to the suspension and engine computer) (just for example)

The last few models on the 328 production run incorporate the improvements slated for the 330 release..

It is Labelled as a 328.. you bought a 328 and you GOT a 328, but LUCKYYOU.. your 328 is better than the earlier versions ... it also has some improvements that will be available on the future model...

Who would complain about Mislabelling in this scenario?? Not me..

This is what you have in the AR8000.... You have a DSM2 capable reciever that is also DSMX capable, so either labelling is technically correct.

is this a boat or a car? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wfy5o48T6Lo

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Old 02-27-2012, 08:41 AM
  #79  
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ORIGINAL: abcarr711

Correct, that all receivers that I specifically mentioned are labelled DSM2. Horizon Hobby tech support clearly said verbally and in writing that they intentionally mislabelled the AR8000s because they had not yet announced DSMX.

My crash is not at issue here, but here is a possible scenario. I know the AR8000 (labelled DSM2) was bound as the receiver in the plane that went down. I also know that the satelite receiver (labelled DSM2) was connected to the AR8000 in the same plane. According to HH tech support, neither should work as they are not compatible. This was told to me via phone and in writing by the tech on the repair ticket.

However, I tested the AR8000 when it was returned to me and it will bind with the DMSX satelite. If you remove the DSMX satelite receiver and reinstall the DSM2 receiver, the AR8000 still is bound and all of the servo functions work, but the satelite receiver light does not come on. But according to HH this should not work.

So like many, I bind the receiver and center servos before they are installed in the plane to make setup easier. The only time I ever remove a satelite is during the installation if I need to feed the wire through an opening. Is it possible I mixed up satelites, I guess. Is it likely, I don't think so, as I never have more than one on the bench at the same time. And if I did, wouldn't that mean one of my other receivers wouldn't work? But they all do. Or so it seems.

So according to HH tech support, the DSM2 and DSMX should not work if connected together, but they do.

I have learned from this and I measure twice, cut once.

I guess I trusted Spektrum after more than a year of flying their products to be up front and honest. Products labeled identically, should react the same way. Their mislabeling of the receiver, whether it came with the wrong satelite or I mixed them, appears to have contributed to or caused my problem. Obviously I did not have the security I thought I did with a satelite receiver installed.

I also made another mistake in that in the bright sunshine of the day, when I was flying, I did not check the little light on the satelite receiver. I can't say I ever have, after it was installed in the plane. I do now. I guess it is just one more thing that can go wrong.

I shouldn't have to worry about these things and with proper labeling, I believe this unfortunate accident most likely would not have happened.

You stated many times in your posts that the satellite receiver light does not come on... did you check this before flying, and if the light was NOT on,.... why did you fly...??
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Old 02-27-2012, 08:56 AM
  #80  
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ORIGINAL: BuschBarber

There was no such thing as DSMX when the OP's DX8 was received. DSMX had not been announced, yet. The DX8 was not even capable of DSMX . The AR8000 was DSMX and DSM2 capable, but since there were no DSMX transmitters at the time, everything was labeled DSM2. The transmitter and receiver worked perfectly in DSM2 mode.

This did not cause a crash.

When DSMX was finally announced, anyone that had purchased one of these DX8's could have had DSMX enabled and it would still work in DSM2 mode or in DSMX mode.

This did not cause a crash. It was not due to Labeling.
Once again, someone speaks without reading or understanding or knowing what equipment I have. I have two DX8s and both came as DSMX. Really. I have always held that my radios are DSMX from the factory and not an after thought upgrade. So let's make this clear and stop the yet another misrepresentation by certain people posting replies. Both of my radios are and always have been DSMX. They came as DSMX and have the little DSMX logo on the front, to the right of the LCD display. So, your statement is totally false because you assume I bought an early version of the DX8 that was a DSM2.

Nope. Sorry. You know not what you speak of. Although some speak of recommendations and things to consider, others obviously don't and fail to understand the intent of this thread. It is and always has been to identify that wrong labels were used and to warn people not to mix receviers and satelites in AR8000 receivers clearly marked DSM2.

Tell me again what equipment you think I have and make assumptions about them and publish them here and be wrong. Your choice. In fact, here is a picture to show it is DSMX.....

Now, I am done. This thread was to let people know they could have a problem with DSM2 labeled AR8000 receivers if they swap receivers. No more, no less. Others have made it more than that. Good night, and may God bless.



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Old 02-27-2012, 09:55 AM
  #81  
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Thanks for an interesting thread.. all the best and safe flying..
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Old 02-27-2012, 11:17 AM
  #82  
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abcarr just don't know much about the spektrums but what i have seen and heard  , but thanks for all th info  , it will be help to all!!
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Old 02-27-2012, 01:18 PM
  #83  
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ORIGINAL: Rob2160

Ferrari builds a 328 Model and sells it like this for years..

They are working on a 330 model (with improvements to the suspension and engine computer) (just for example)

The last few models on the 328 production run incorporate the improvements slated for the 330 release..

It is Labelled as a 328.. you bought a 328 and you GOT a 328, but LUCKYYOU.. your 328 is better than the earlier versions ... it also has some improvements that will be available on the future model...

Who would complain about Mislabelling in this scenario?? Not me..
But of course only Captain Rob would have to use Ferrari as an example, the rest of us would be comparing Yugos or Fords.

All in good fun Captain (what are you flying now)? I'm back to my roots in a KA90 getting in your way as you pass through 230 on your way to the top
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Old 02-27-2012, 01:50 PM
  #84  
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Default RE: SPEKTRUM Misrepresentation?


ORIGINAL: abcarr711


ORIGINAL: BuschBarber

There was no such thing as DSMX when the OP's DX8 was received. DSMX had not been announced, yet. The DX8 was not even capable of DSMX . The AR8000 was DSMX and DSM2 capable, but since there were no DSMX transmitters at the time, everything was labeled DSM2. The transmitter and receiver worked perfectly in DSM2 mode.

This did not cause a crash.

When DSMX was finally announced, anyone that had purchased one of these DX8's could have had DSMX enabled and it would still work in DSM2 mode or in DSMX mode.

This did not cause a crash. It was not due to Labeling.
Once again, someone speaks without reading or understanding or knowing what equipment I have. I have two DX8s and both came as DSMX. Really. I have always held that my radios are DSMX from the factory and not an after thought upgrade. So let's make this clear and stop the yet another misrepresentation by certain people posting replies. Both of my radios are and always have been DSMX. They came as DSMX and have the little DSMX logo on the front, to the right of the LCD display. So, your statement is totally false because you assume I bought an early version of the DX8 that was a DSM2.

Nope. Sorry. You know not what you speak of. Although some speak of recommendations and things to consider, others obviously don't and fail to understand the intent of this thread. It is and always has been to identify that wrong labels were used and to warn people not to mix receviers and satelites in AR8000 receivers clearly marked DSM2.

Tell me again what equipment you think I have and make assumptions about them and publish them here and be wrong. Your choice. In fact, here is a picture to show it is DSMX.....

Now, I am done. This thread was to let people know they could have a problem with DSM2 labeled AR8000 receivers if they swap receivers. No more, no less. Others have made it more than that. Good night, and may God bless.



I wish you had posted the picture of your DX8 before now, however, it makes no difference. It does not matter whether the AR8000 was labeled DSM2 or DSMX. The DX8 is compatible with both. It does not matter what the Remote was labeled. When you went through the Bind process, the lights on the AR8000 and Remote would Blink, go out, and then come back on Solid. If the lights on the Remote did not come back on Solid, it just means that the Remote did not Bind. If you were sent a true DSM2 Remote then you deserve a replacement.

Since your DX8 Linked to your AR8000, all is well and your controls worked.

As Andy said, the AR8000 will work properly Without a Remote.

None of this would have caused a crash.

End of story.
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Old 02-27-2012, 02:15 PM
  #85  
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ORIGINAL: catflyer


ORIGINAL: Rob2160

Ferrari builds a 328 Model and sells it like this for years..

They are working on a 330 model (with improvements to the suspension and engine computer) (just for example)

The last few models on the 328 production run incorporate the improvements slated for the 330 release..

It is Labelled as a 328.. you bought a 328 and you GOT a 328, but LUCKYYOU.. your 328 is better than the earlier versions ... it also has some improvements that will be available on the future model...

Who would complain about Mislabelling in this scenario?? Not me..
But of course only Captain Rob would have to use Ferrari as an example, the rest of us would be comparing Yugos or Fords.

All in good fun Captain (what are you flying now)? I'm back to my roots in a KA90 getting in your way as you pass through 230 on your way to the top
Hey Catflyer...long time... how's things?

Transitioned to a Global Express XRS recently, same company, and currently in Tucson while it is in maintenance.. 6 of the last 7 weeks have been in the USA...

I can only dream of a Ford... I drive a KIA...

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Old 02-27-2012, 03:01 PM
  #86  
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Default RE: SPEKTRUM Misrepresentation?

Lets break this down to the important point which almost NO ONE is reading...

ORIGINAL: abcarr711
...the receiver and the satelite receiver were both clearly marked as DSM2 receivers, but according to product support at Horizon Hobby, only the Satelite receiver is DSM2. The AR8000 receiver is actually DSMX although it is clearly marked as DSM2.

They continued to tell me that they are not compatible with each other although they were both clearly marked as DSM2...
I agree with the OP that this is clearly wrong on Horizon's part. If I have two products labeled DSM2 they should work together. I shouldn't have to figure out that they labeled a DSMX as a DSM2 and that these two items are not going to work together with the default settings in my TX. There is no logical reason the user should have to manually select DSM2 in their TX to make this setup work properly.

Also you all assume that the OP is blaming Horizon for his crash. He is not and has stated that several times. He is simply stating something that he discovered in his investigation into the crash.
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Old 02-27-2012, 04:48 PM
  #87  
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Default RE: SPEKTRUM Misrepresentation?

This video shows you how to select DSM2 or DSMX in the DX8 and how to bind to different type of Receivers..

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U3RjotmUPts[/youtube]

Some DSMX Transmitters have no indication which mode they are in - here is an easy way to confirm your Receivers are in DSMX or DSM2 mode.

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4_Tbes9f1_c[/youtube]
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Old 02-27-2012, 04:57 PM
  #88  
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Default RE: SPEKTRUM Misrepresentation?


ORIGINAL: grimbeaver

Lets break this down to the important point which almost NO ONE is reading...

ORIGINAL: abcarr711
...the receiver and the satelite receiver were both clearly marked as DSM2 receivers, but according to product support at Horizon Hobby, only the Satelite receiver is DSM2. The AR8000 receiver is actually DSMX although it is clearly marked as DSM2.

They continued to tell me that they are not compatible with each other although they were both clearly marked as DSM2...
I agree with the OP that this is clearly wrong on Horizon's part. If I have two products labeled DSM2 they should work together. I shouldn't have to figure out that they labeled a DSMX as a DSM2 and that these two items are not going to work together with the default settings in my TX. There is no logical reason the user should have to manually select DSM2 in their TX to make this setup work properly.

Also you all assume that the OP is blaming Horizon for his crash. He is not and has stated that several times. He is simply stating something that he discovered in his investigation into the crash.
I just reread the OP's original post. While he says he is not holding anyone to blame for his crash, he contradicts himself by implying that disastrous things could happen because of the mislabeled receivers, however, that would not be the case. Here are some of the statements in question.

"I am here to let people learn from my misfortune and advise them that SPEKTRUM has knowingly and admitted to mislabeling AR8000 receivers as DSM2 receivers and if you have the misfortune to mix up a clearly marked DSM2 satelite receiver with another clearly marked DSM2 satelite receiver with an AR8000 that is clearly marked as a DSM2 receiver, you could have disasterous results."

"Could my mishap been avoided if the receivers had been labeled correctly? Very possible. Have others lost planes in this same fashion? That is what I would like to know."

I have the early version of the DX8, labeled on the face of the Tx as DSM2. I bought it used from someone who only used it a few times and then decided he wanted a 9503, with more channels and enhanced programming. He had no problems with the AR8000 and Remote that was shipped to him, before or after he sent it in for the DSMX upgrade. I have had no problems with it, as well.

There were legitimate reasons why Horizon labeled the receivers as they did, but again, nothing that was done in any way affected the performance of the equipment.

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Old 02-27-2012, 08:13 PM
  #89  
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Default RE: SPEKTRUM Misrepresentation?

About time people realized that buying Spektrum is opting in to be a guinea pig - at YOUR expense.

Off to get more popcorn as this is surely not over.

Bliksem
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Old 02-27-2012, 08:25 PM
  #90  
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Default RE: SPEKTRUM Misrepresentation?

It seems that the people bashing Spektrum are jealous? If they are so bad, why has no one at my field had any problems? Most of the heli pilots fly Spektrum here. No problems with Futabas or Airtronics either. All crashes I know of have been pilot error, followed by transmitter set to wrong airplane, followed by battery issues. Not to say that every radio of every brand is perfect, but to imply any one brand is junk is not credible.
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Old 02-28-2012, 08:05 AM
  #91  
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I have been back in this hobby for about a year now, back in the "old Days" with 72.XXX transmitters we were shot down all the time.  I flew Expert equipment, which was good at the time and all were expensive.  Today my LHS told me Spektrum was the way to start.  I have a DX6i and DX8 currently.  I have about 100 flights on them.  Last Year, I had a brownout, and thought the radio caused it; it was the Battery as someone stated.  I have learned more and more over the last few months.  Whether engines, speed controllers, RX, etc.  The products from the main suppliers seem to be very good.  Along with new technology and feature, come more set up issues. 

This thread will make me check out the equipment better in all my planes and even more in the Large big $$ equipment.  The point is that every time it goes up there are so many variables there is a risk.  I do think HH should have spent the time explaining the issue they found and what it could have caused, with that being said, I have seen linkages, servos and other things bring down planes.  It is part of the hobby; none of them will pay for a crash.

I too am sorry for your loss and thank you for sharing with everyone.

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Old 02-28-2012, 09:49 AM
  #92  
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ORIGINAL: BuschBarber


ORIGINAL: grimbeaver

Lets break this down to the important point which almost NO ONE is reading...

ORIGINAL: abcarr711
...the receiver and the satelite receiver were both clearly marked as DSM2 receivers, but according to product support at Horizon Hobby, only the Satelite receiver is DSM2. The AR8000 receiver is actually DSMX although it is clearly marked as DSM2.

They continued to tell me that they are not compatible with each other although they were both clearly marked as DSM2...
I agree with the OP that this is clearly wrong on Horizon's part. If I have two products labeled DSM2 they should work together. I shouldn't have to figure out that they labeled a DSMX as a DSM2 and that these two items are not going to work together with the default settings in my TX. There is no logical reason the user should have to manually select DSM2 in their TX to make this setup work properly.

Also you all assume that the OP is blaming Horizon for his crash. He is not and has stated that several times. He is simply stating something that he discovered in his investigation into the crash.
I just reread the OP's original post. While he says he is not holding anyone to blame for his crash, he contradicts himself by implying that disastrous things could happen because of the mislabeled receivers, however, that would not be the case. Here are some of the statements in question.

"I am here to let people learn from my misfortune and advise them that SPEKTRUM has knowingly and admitted to mislabeling AR8000 receivers as DSM2 receivers and if you have the misfortune to mix up a clearly marked DSM2 satelite receiver with another clearly marked DSM2 satelite receiver with an AR8000 that is clearly marked as a DSM2 receiver, you could have disasterous results."

"Could my mishap been avoided if the receivers had been labeled correctly? Very possible. Have others lost planes in this same fashion? That is what I would like to know."

I have the early version of the DX8, labeled on the face of the Tx as DSM2. I bought it used from someone who only used it a few times and then decided he wanted a 9503, with more channels and enhanced programming. He had no problems with the AR8000 and Remote that was shipped to him, before or after he sent it in for the DSMX upgrade. I have had no problems with it, as well.

There were legitimate reasons why Horizon labeled the receivers as they did, but again, nothing that was done in any way affected the performance of the equipment.

In response to the part above highlighted in red.. he forgot to finish the sentence with.... disasterous results IFand ONLYIF you don't conduct your BINDcheck correctly and CONFIRM that both the Main and Satellite receivers are correctly bound to the radio as per the Manufacturers instructions.. IE both the Main receiver and the Satellite have steady illuminated lights indicating a correct bind..

Sure, it is entirely possible to mix up Satellites, but if you follow the correct procedure you will catch it during the binding phase... and fix it before flying..

I am only sorry that I am in the USAright now with no access to my equipment in Sydney, or I would produce several videos showing what happens if you try to bind mismatched Recievers and Satellites in the incorrect mode....

If you understand your equipment and use it correctly, you won't have problems 99.9% of the time because no system is perfect. ..

I used to be an air crash investigator in real life, attending over 40 fatal aircraft crashes over 4 years.. exactly the same thing happens in the full size world, crashes are caused by people NOTunderstanding the equipment they are using. Overstressing aircraft in flight manouvers, miscalculating weight and balance, engine mismanagement, or not understanding modern navigation systems and flying directly into a mountainat night.. It happens..

PS.. Bliksem.. 10 / 10 for the popcorn comment.. it is so true!.

as for the Guinea Pig comment.. 7 different Spek / JR transmitters, 20 odd aircraft and helicopters.. over 5000 flights in 2 years.. Nil issues EVER.. I guess I am a happy Guinea Pig..


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Old 02-29-2012, 04:41 AM
  #93  
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ORIGINAL: Rob2160


ORIGINAL: BuschBarber


ORIGINAL: grimbeaver

Lets break this down to the important point which almost NO ONE is reading...

ORIGINAL: abcarr711
...the receiver and the satelite receiver were both clearly marked as DSM2 receivers, but according to product support at Horizon Hobby, only the Satelite receiver is DSM2. The AR8000 receiver is actually DSMX although it is clearly marked as DSM2.

They continued to tell me that they are not compatible with each other although they were both clearly marked as DSM2...
I agree with the OP that this is clearly wrong on Horizon's part. If I have two products labeled DSM2 they should work together. I shouldn't have to figure out that they labeled a DSMX as a DSM2 and that these two items are not going to work together with the default settings in my TX. There is no logical reason the user should have to manually select DSM2 in their TX to make this setup work properly.

Also you all assume that the OP is blaming Horizon for his crash. He is not and has stated that several times. He is simply stating something that he discovered in his investigation into the crash.
I just reread the OP's original post. While he says he is not holding anyone to blame for his crash, he contradicts himself by implying that disastrous things could happen because of the mislabeled receivers, however, that would not be the case. Here are some of the statements in question.

''I am here to let people learn from my misfortune and advise them that SPEKTRUM has knowingly and admitted to mislabeling AR8000 receivers as DSM2 receivers and if you have the misfortune to mix up a clearly marked DSM2 satelite receiver with another clearly marked DSM2 satelite receiver with an AR8000 that is clearly marked as a DSM2 receiver, you could have disasterous results.''

''Could my mishap been avoided if the receivers had been labeled correctly? Very possible. Have others lost planes in this same fashion? That is what I would like to know.''

I have the early version of the DX8, labeled on the face of the Tx as DSM2. I bought it used from someone who only used it a few times and then decided he wanted a 9503, with more channels and enhanced programming. He had no problems with the AR8000 and Remote that was shipped to him, before or after he sent it in for the DSMX upgrade. I have had no problems with it, as well.

There were legitimate reasons why Horizon labeled the receivers as they did, but again, nothing that was done in any way affected the performance of the equipment.

If you understand your equipment and use it correctly, you won't have problems 99.9% of the time because no system is perfect. ..
The OP understood that he had two products labeled DSM2 which all Spektrum product literature says will work together. Sounds to me like he understood what Spektrum told him just fine. The issue is Spektrum was lying to him.

Say for a second that gas fuel line and glow fuel line looked identical. Now say the manufacturer mislabels glow fuel line as gas fuel line and when you use it for gas it breaks down. By the logic of most of the people here the manufacturer has done no wrong. It's 100% your fault if you try and use the fuel line with gas.

Spektrum says if you have a DSM2 receiver you must have a DSM2 remote. The OP had what according to Spektrum packaging said was compatible hardware. I agree with the OP. Why is there not a service notice telling people to check their rx and remote by serial number instead of what it's labeled? Why did they mislabel if there was going to be issues with mixing?
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Old 02-29-2012, 05:42 AM
  #94  
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ORIGINAL: grimbeaver


ORIGINAL: Rob2160


ORIGINAL: BuschBarber


ORIGINAL: grimbeaver

Lets break this down to the important point which almost NO ONE is reading...

ORIGINAL: abcarr711
...the receiver and the satelite receiver were both clearly marked as DSM2 receivers, but according to product support at Horizon Hobby, only the Satelite receiver is DSM2. The AR8000 receiver is actually DSMX although it is clearly marked as DSM2.

They continued to tell me that they are not compatible with each other although they were both clearly marked as DSM2...
I agree with the OP that this is clearly wrong on Horizon's part. If I have two products labeled DSM2 they should work together. I shouldn't have to figure out that they labeled a DSMX as a DSM2 and that these two items are not going to work together with the default settings in my TX. There is no logical reason the user should have to manually select DSM2 in their TX to make this setup work properly.

Also you all assume that the OP is blaming Horizon for his crash. He is not and has stated that several times. He is simply stating something that he discovered in his investigation into the crash.
I just reread the OP's original post. While he says he is not holding anyone to blame for his crash, he contradicts himself by implying that disastrous things could happen because of the mislabeled receivers, however, that would not be the case. Here are some of the statements in question.

''I am here to let people learn from my misfortune and advise them that SPEKTRUM has knowingly and admitted to mislabeling AR8000 receivers as DSM2 receivers and if you have the misfortune to mix up a clearly marked DSM2 satelite receiver with another clearly marked DSM2 satelite receiver with an AR8000 that is clearly marked as a DSM2 receiver, you could have disasterous results.''

''Could my mishap been avoided if the receivers had been labeled correctly? Very possible. Have others lost planes in this same fashion? That is what I would like to know.''

I have the early version of the DX8, labeled on the face of the Tx as DSM2. I bought it used from someone who only used it a few times and then decided he wanted a 9503, with more channels and enhanced programming. He had no problems with the AR8000 and Remote that was shipped to him, before or after he sent it in for the DSMX upgrade. I have had no problems with it, as well.

There were legitimate reasons why Horizon labeled the receivers as they did, but again, nothing that was done in any way affected the performance of the equipment.

If you understand your equipment and use it correctly, you won't have problems 99.9% of the time because no system is perfect. ..
The OP understood that he had two products labeled DSM2 which all Spektrum product literature says will work together. Sounds to me like he understood what Spektrum told him just fine. The issue is Spektrum was lying to him.

Say for a second that gas fuel line and glow fuel line looked identical. Now say the manufacturer mislabels glow fuel line as gas fuel line and when you use it for gas it breaks down. By the logic of most of the people here the manufacturer has done no wrong. It's 100% your fault if you try and use the fuel line with gas.

Spektrum says if you have a DSM2 receiver you must have a DSM2 remote. The OP had what according to Spektrum packaging said was compatible hardware. I agree with the OP. Why is there not a service notice telling people to check their rx and remote by serial number instead of what it's labeled? Why did they mislabel if there was going to be issues with mixing?
There were no issues with mixing. As was repeated many times, the AR8000 receiver will operate with a DSMX or a DSM2 transmitter. His DX8 was only capable of DSM2 operation, at the time, but subsequently upgradable to DSMX, when it was announced. His AR8000 was labeled DSM2 which was fully compatible with his DX8.

The Remote that came with his DX8 was also marked DSM2. He states that his Remote would not Bind to his DX8. Since his AR8000 will Bind and work properly whether or not the Remote even works or is attached, there was no problem with the operation of his radio.

The OP claims he used the Remote that came with his AR8000. The OP said that Horizon told him the Remote was not compatible with his AR8000. If Horizon inadvertently sent him an incompatible Remote, they owe him a compatible Remote.

None of this affected the operation of the radio. The labeling was done for a legitimate reason and caused no harm, just confusion, in this case. This could be just an isolated case.

When I was new to 2.4, the first thing I had to learn was how to Bind the Tx to the Rx and how to tell if the Bind was successful. In the case of Spektrum, I also had to Bind to the Remote, at the same time. If the Remote did not Bind, the light on the Remote would not come on Solid. If the Remote had no Solid light, I would have called Horizon and if the Remote was deemed to be defective, I would have had it replaced under Warranty.

In most cases, if the Remote is bad, you cannot Bind so you cannot Fly. If the Remote goes bad in the air, the main Rx will still operate normally. The next time you power up the Rx, if the Remote is bad, the Tx will not Link to the Rx and you will know you have a problem.

The AR8000 was designed to work With or Without the Remote. Each time I prepare for a flying day, I check the lights on the main Rx and Remotes to be sure the lights come on solid.

I bought a number of AR9000 Rx's from my LHS. One had a bad servo port 5. I took it back to the LHS and he gave me a new one.
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Old 02-29-2012, 09:00 AM
  #95  
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Default RE: SPEKTRUM Misrepresentation?

ORIGINAL: BuschBarber
There were no issues with mixing. As was repeated many times, the AR8000 receiver will operate with a DSMX or a DSM2 transmitter. His DX8 was only capable of DSM2 operation, at the time, but subsequently upgradable to DSMX, when it was announced. His AR8000 was labeled DSM2 which was fully compatible with his DX8.

The Remote that came with his DX8 was also marked DSM2. He states that his Remote would not Bind to his DX8. Since his AR8000 will Bind and work properly whether or not the Remote even works or is attached, there was no problem with the operation of his radio.

The OP claims he used the Remote that came with his AR8000. The OP said that Horizon told him the Remote was not compatible with his AR8000. If Horizon inadvertently sent him an incompatible Remote, they owe him a compatible Remote.

None of this affected the operation of the radio. The labeling was done for a legitimate reason and caused no harm, just confusion, in this case. This could be just an isolated case.

When I was new to 2.4, the first thing I had to learn was how to Bind the Tx to the Rx and how to tell if the Bind was successful. In the case of Spektrum, I also had to Bind to the Remote, at the same time. If the Remote did not Bind, the light on the Remote would not come on Solid. If the Remote had no Solid light, I would have called Horizon and if the Remote was deemed to be defective, I would have had it replaced under Warranty.

In most cases, if the Remote is bad, you cannot Bind so you cannot Fly. If the Remote goes bad in the air, the main Rx will still operate normally. The next time you power up the Rx, if the Remote is bad, the Tx will not Link to the Rx and you will know you have a problem.

The AR8000 was designed to work With or Without the Remote. Each time I prepare for a flying day, I check the lights on the main Rx and Remotes to be sure the lights come on solid.

I bought a number of AR9000 Rx's from my LHS. One had a bad servo port 5. I took it back to the LHS and he gave me a new one.
First I said nothing about the transmitter. The transmitter is irrelevant in this discussion so lets just drop that aspect, plus you didn't read the thread, his DX8 was DSMX from the box, it was not upgraded. The issue of what happens or does not happen when you attempt to bind is also largely irrelevant to the discussion.

The issue here is mixing DSM2 and DSMX receivers and remote receivers. Horizon Hobby says don't mix them, all of you seem to like to point out they won't bind as well. So the question is why did they ship DSMX hardware labeled as DSM2 when this will inevitably end up with someone mixing them? Please answer that question.
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Old 02-29-2012, 09:40 AM
  #96  
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Default RE: SPEKTRUM Misrepresentation?


ORIGINAL: grimbeaver

ORIGINAL: BuschBarber
There were no issues with mixing. As was repeated many times, the AR8000 receiver will operate with a DSMX or a DSM2 transmitter. His DX8 was only capable of DSM2 operation, at the time, but subsequently upgradable to DSMX, when it was announced. His AR8000 was labeled DSM2 which was fully compatible with his DX8.

The Remote that came with his DX8 was also marked DSM2. He states that his Remote would not Bind to his DX8. Since his AR8000 will Bind and work properly whether or not the Remote even works or is attached, there was no problem with the operation of his radio.

The OP claims he used the Remote that came with his AR8000. The OP said that Horizon told him the Remote was not compatible with his AR8000. If Horizon inadvertently sent him an incompatible Remote, they owe him a compatible Remote.

None of this affected the operation of the radio. The labeling was done for a legitimate reason and caused no harm, just confusion, in this case. This could be just an isolated case.

When I was new to 2.4, the first thing I had to learn was how to Bind the Tx to the Rx and how to tell if the Bind was successful. In the case of Spektrum, I also had to Bind to the Remote, at the same time. If the Remote did not Bind, the light on the Remote would not come on Solid. If the Remote had no Solid light, I would have called Horizon and if the Remote was deemed to be defective, I would have had it replaced under Warranty.

In most cases, if the Remote is bad, you cannot Bind so you cannot Fly. If the Remote goes bad in the air, the main Rx will still operate normally. The next time you power up the Rx, if the Remote is bad, the Tx will not Link to the Rx and you will know you have a problem.

The AR8000 was designed to work With or Without the Remote. Each time I prepare for a flying day, I check the lights on the main Rx and Remotes to be sure the lights come on solid.

I bought a number of AR9000 Rx's from my LHS. One had a bad servo port 5. I took it back to the LHS and he gave me a new one.
First I said nothing about the transmitter. The transmitter is irrelevant in this discussion so lets just drop that aspect, plus you didn't read the thread, his DX8 was DSMX from the box, it was not upgraded. The issue of what happens or does not happen when you attempt to bind is also largely irrelevant to the discussion.

The issue here is mixing DSM2 and DSMX receivers and remote receivers. Horizon Hobby says don't mix them, all of you seem to like to point out they won't bind as well. So the question is why did they ship DSMX hardware labeled as DSM2 when this will inevitably end up with someone mixing them? Please answer that question.
Only Horizon could explain how a true DSM2 Remote was sent with the AR8000. It could be just a fluke accident. It could be the only one, as well.

Since xI first moved to 2.4, if the Remote did not Bind, the receiver would not Link to the Tx. Since DSMX was announced, we know there are now DSM2 and DSMX receivers and remotes. The receivers and remotes should both be the same or they will not Bind.

We were just recently informed that the AR8000 will still Bind even if the Remote is missing, incompatible, or broken.

Bottom line is that in the case of the AR8000, the intentional labeling did no harm.
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Old 02-29-2012, 10:00 AM
  #97  
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Default RE: SPEKTRUM Misrepresentation?

ORIGINAL: BuschBarber
Bottom line is that in the case of the AR8000, the intentional labeling did no harm.
But it did do harm. It left the user with a DSMX AR8000 (labeled as DSM2) that will not work with the DSM2 remote receiver he has. Now he must buy a DSMX remote receiver if he wants to use that AR8000 with a remote. When he sent them in the responsible thing for Horizon to do would have been to replace one of the pieces he sent in. Rather then just saying we labeled this wrong and if you want to use it you have to give us more money.
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Old 02-29-2012, 10:14 AM
  #98  
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Default RE: SPEKTRUM Misrepresentation?


ORIGINAL: grimbeaver

ORIGINAL: BuschBarber
Bottom line is that in the case of the AR8000, the intentional labeling did no harm.
But it did do harm. It left the user with a DSMX AR8000 (labeled as DSM2) that will not work with the DSM2 remote receiver he has. Now he must buy a DSMX remote receiver if he wants to use that AR8000 with a remote. When he sent them in the responsible thing for Horizon to do would have been to replace one of the pieces he sent in. Rather then just saying we labeled this wrong and if you want to use it you have to give us more money.
They DID give him a free DSMX Satellite.

Quoted from one of his earlier posts...

Trying to shorten my story, Horizon shipped me a free DSMX satelite receiver to go with my clearly marked DSM2 AR8000



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Old 02-29-2012, 10:43 AM
  #99  
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Default RE: SPEKTRUM Misrepresentation?

ORIGINAL: Rob2160
They DID give him a free DSMX Satellite.

Quoted from one of his earlier posts...

Trying to shorten my story, Horizon shipped me a free DSMX satelite receiver to go with my clearly marked DSM2 AR8000
Can't find it, perhaps it was part of the other thread?

Either way the short of it is there should be a note on the Spektrum site saying that some DSM2 rx's are DSMX and how to identify them. They could have even spun it as a bonus when they announced DSMX. Think about it, tell people hey check your RX's they might be DSMX, give people an incentive to upgrade their TX.
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Old 02-29-2012, 11:55 AM
  #100  
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Default RE: SPEKTRUM Misrepresentation?


ORIGINAL: grimbeaver

ORIGINAL: Rob2160
They DID give him a free DSMX Satellite.

Quoted from one of his earlier posts...

Trying to shorten my story, Horizon shipped me a free DSMX satelite receiver to go with my clearly marked DSM2 AR8000
Can't find it, perhaps it was part of the other thread?

Either way the short of it is there should be a note on the Spektrum site saying that some DSM2 rx's are DSMX and how to identify them. They could have even spun it as a bonus when they announced DSMX. Think about it, tell people hey check your RX's they might be DSMX, give people an incentive to upgrade their TX.
yes it was part of the other thread..

I agree it can confuse people.. but I remember clearly knowing DSMx was on the way and that the AR8000 was DSMX ready even though the first DX8s were still DSM2..

I honestly don't remember how I came to know this, but I did, for many months before DSMX was released, so I waited until the Firmware was available for the DX8 and bought a DSM2 version and updated it the first day the firmware was released..

Now I can't remember where I read about DSMX but I am sure I saw it first on the Spektrum website.. long before it was released...

Andy? any ideas when DSMX first appeared on the Spektrum Website vs the day the firmware was released for the DX8?

I know it was several months because I was getting impatient waiting for it..

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