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Is there a radio that does not lose signal?

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Old 08-11-2012, 04:09 PM
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Jagthack
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Default Is there a radio that does not lose signal?

I’m unfortunately in the market for a new radio. I have lost two airplanes to complete loss of control. My question…
Is there a radio out there that has not had or does not have problems with brown outs, frame loss, etc? Every radio I put in Google followed by the word problems get tons of pages with faults. Anything you guys know about that is close to fault proof?
Thanks!
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Old 08-11-2012, 04:38 PM
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Default RE: Is there a radio that does not lose signal?

I think you should examine your ability to assemble a reliable system. Get an experienced modeler to examine your installation.
Any of the existing radios can give you reliable operation.None of them can guarantee reliable operation without your cooperation.
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Old 08-11-2012, 04:51 PM
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Default RE: Is there a radio that does not lose signal?


ORIGINAL: Jagthack

I’m unfortunately in the market for a new radio. I have lost two airplanes to complete loss of control. My question…
Is there a radio out there that has not had or does not have problems with brown outs, frame loss, etc? Every radio I put in Google followed by the word problems get tons of pages with faults. Anything you guys know about that is close to fault proof?
Thanks!
Everyone has their favorite radio system and I know of none that are totally impervious to various forms of interference causing loss of the signal from the Tx. 2.4 systems are more resistant to RF noise but also more sensitive to fluctuations in Rx power.

I have flown RC aircraft since 1978. For many years I flew using Futaba radios. I found them to be just as reliable as any other manufacturer. I switched to JR just before the 9303 was introduced because I liked the features of the 9303 better than the Futaba 9CAP, not because there was anything wrong with the 9CAP. I picked up a Spektrum Module when they came out for the 9303 and I have been using it without issue ever since. For me and my RC club, JR/Spektrum has been very reliable and robust. A few use Futaba and Hitec without issue, as well. You will find that in many cases, members of the same club use the same equipment because they can help one another with programming and setup.

With 2.4, every radio manufacturer has had to develop their own implementation of the 2.4 Spread Spectrum Protocol so that they all work together and do not interfere with one another. If issues pop up, they are resolved and a better product is the result.
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Old 08-11-2012, 04:53 PM
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Default RE: Is there a radio that does not lose signal?


ORIGINAL: dirtybird

I think you should examine your ability to assemble a reliable system. Get an experienced modeler to examine your installation.
Any of the existing radios can give you reliable operation.None of them can guarantee reliable operation without your cooperation.
Well said!!
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Old 08-11-2012, 05:02 PM
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Default RE: Is there a radio that does not lose signal?

There are such radios.
They are called 72Mhz.
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Old 08-11-2012, 05:15 PM
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Default RE: Is there a radio that does not lose signal?


ORIGINAL: 1320Fastback

There are such radios.
They are called 72Mhz.
I have used them for many years and dealt with RF noise, Shoot Downs, Poorly tuned Tx's, and many other issues. We learned how to DeBug and get buy, but 2.4 has resolved almost all of that. 72Mhz is still viable, but not preferable by any means.
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Old 08-11-2012, 05:26 PM
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Default RE: Is there a radio that does not lose signal?

Rich,
Thank you for the reply. I am trying to narrow it down to the radio that most guys have had the least amount of problems with.

As for you other two. Let’s see....I'll examine my abilities..
I’ve been in the hobby for about 25 years. I always have the safety officer check my new planes before the first flight. I have 12 planes from a small champ up to a 111cc Pilot Edge 540 and 3 heli’s. This issue is with a plug and play Striker new in the box last Saturday with 6 total flights. It had less than 2 min on a fully charged battery with tons of power. It was under full power when the plane went into the ground. The plane didn't go into fail safe and I had time to tell the 20+ guys who were watching me fly a straight pass down the run way that I had no control. I actually held the radio up in the air and moved the sticks around so everyone could see I had nothing. The plane turned slightly right and down at full power. It just flew right into the ground. The receiver is new. I had this same problem with my radio and another plane a few months ago. I sent the radio off and it was tested as good and sent back. I just figured that I did something wrong and moved on. Now this plane does the same exact thing. I don't think so! The other plane was all new with 5 total flights. It had a 6.0v battery pack on a fresh charge on the first flight of the day. Before you ASSume I don't know what I'm doing how about clarifying what I my experience is instead of ASSuming you know everything. I posted this to gain information and help me to decide on a new system not so you can run up your post count. I would really appreciate it if you would stay off this post unless you have an answer to the question I posted.
Thank you.
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Old 08-11-2012, 05:29 PM
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Default RE: Is there a radio that does not lose signal?

Guys
I'm just looking for the radio system that has the least amount of problems that I have been facing. I really don't think it's that hard of a question.
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Old 08-11-2012, 05:33 PM
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Default RE: Is there a radio that does not lose signal?

72's been very reliable here.

I do have 2.4 also but always reach for the 72 when I want to go out a few miles FPV.
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Old 08-11-2012, 05:34 PM
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Default RE: Is there a radio that does not lose signal?

Anyone else at field having problems?
Has anyone done a spectrum analysis of the location with a monitor?
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Old 08-11-2012, 07:40 PM
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Default RE: Is there a radio that does not lose signal?

at first when the 2.4s come out dey has both git issues. den deys get better one get better first then the other cathsup now even more onna market. some good some bad all pretty much deh same channel hopping varietie choose a good brand foller the instruciones. And dont talk down to people who are trying to help you, sorry noones interested in starting a tx flame thread.
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Old 08-11-2012, 08:57 PM
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Default RE: Is there a radio that does not lose signal?

Problem is, it's hard to tell if the radio was at fault or it was operator error in failing to charge or replace flight batteries properly or keep servos from stalling and draining current swiftly.  Easier to blame the radio gear in those cases.
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Old 08-11-2012, 08:58 PM
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Default RE: Is there a radio that does not lose signal?

The problem is they are all good so you really need to look at yourself if you have problems.
I would not recommend any one over the other. They are all made in China with the same basic parts.
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Old 08-11-2012, 10:25 PM
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Default RE: Is there a radio that does not lose signal?

Futaba and Spectrum are the most common brands. You can start a long debate, either one seems to be reliable.
Spectrum's brown outs were mostly caused by weak batteries or too much load causing a voltage drop, Spectrum reacted with shortening the reboot time for the rx and recommended a 6 Volts rx battery.
Some die hard users swear by 72 Mhz, I had bad experiences with that and no problems at all with my Futaba 8FG.
I would not go back to 72 Mhz. For FPVs, range can be an issue and the old radios seem to reach further, under normal use you will not get your plane out of range with 2.4 Ghz.

If you fly electrics, Spectrum's telemetry functions come in handy, Futaba has those only on their high end systems.
What I'd do is set a budget, then compare what the manufacturers offer for the money.
Also the price of the receivers should be considered.
I use mostly Futaba 617s, they are around $70 if you look around in the internet.
For the cheaper planes I use Frsky, Orange and Corona, they are $25 - 30 and I have had no problems with those.


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Old 08-12-2012, 04:10 AM
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Default RE: Is there a radio that does not lose signal?

ORIGINAL: Jagthack

It had a 6.0v battery pack on a fresh charge on the first flight of the day. Before you ASSume I don't know what I'm doing how about clarifying what I my experience is instead of ASSuming you know everything.
This is part of the reason you're having trouble with the responses; it'd be hard to count the number of guys who post this type of response to questions about a crashed model wherein the radio system is blamed only to find out later, there is a power system problem not faulty radio gear.

Faulty radio gear is RARELY the case and if you tried browsing around or using the search engine here you'd know that rather than ASSuming you're the only one who's ever had this kind of issue and your attitude is not encouraging thoughtful responses.
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Old 08-12-2012, 04:25 AM
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Default RE: Is there a radio that does not lose signal?

Nope! Allot depends on where you are. Different areas of the country have issues with radio frequencies. Just like the old 27 mhz was hit with CB traffic. I still fly with AM, FM and PCM. I do not own any 2.4 stuff. To expensive to switch over. To each his own.
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Old 08-12-2012, 04:53 AM
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Default RE: Is there a radio that does not lose signal?

Spectrum DX7, no problems in 3 yrs, the receivers are a little pricey though I just bought an 8 channel for $120
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Old 08-12-2012, 05:21 AM
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Default RE: Is there a radio that does not lose signal?

We have had a few say 5 crashes at our field in the past 2 years where guys say they lost control of the plane. I can't speak for them but I know what happened to me. I know 99.98% or crashes are caused by human error. That's not to say a radio can't be the fault. So that leads me to look for a new radio.
What else would you do? You have a new plane, a new receiver with a satellite and a fully charged battery that is the exact size the manufacturer recommends. You have range checked the plane and all looks good. You fly about two mins and then while you are flying a pass from right to left down the runway about 50ft high the plane rolls right and dives into the ground at full throttle. As the plane is rolling out you yell I don't have it and hold up the radio while moving the sticks around and the plane continues to dive into the ground. What error could you have made that would cause that plane to crash? Now look back about three months you had another plane do almost the exact same thing but it was going the other direction and rolled out left. You sent the radio back to the manufacturer and they gave it a clean bill of health. What would you do?

How do you have a field analysis done? How much would that cost?
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Old 08-12-2012, 07:07 AM
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Default RE: Is there a radio that does not lose signal?


ORIGINAL: 1320Fastback

72's been very reliable here.

I do have 2.4 also but always reach for the 72 when I want to go out a few miles FPV.
Not to hijack the thread but as a field safety officer I feel I must speak up. Going "out a few miles FPV" would be strictly against the AMA safety rules on FPV flying as the plane must be kept in visual range. Please review the rules here http://www.modelaircraft.org/files/550.pdf

Dave
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Old 08-12-2012, 07:22 AM
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Default RE: Is there a radio that does not lose signal?


ORIGINAL: mike31

Nope! Allot depends on where you are. Different areas of the country have issues with radio frequencies. Just like the old 27 mhz was hit with CB traffic. I still fly with AM, FM and PCM. I do not own any 2.4 stuff. To expensive to switch over. To each his own.
Total out just one plane and you will have met your budget cost to switch over to 2.4 GHz.

"A radio that will not lose signal"? They all lose signal but with the 2.4 GHz systems you are flying with a "failsafe" mode and multiple receivers for redundancy. The best failsafe for the 2.4 GHz systems is to have a battery(s) of 6V and adequate capacity and discharge rate so they do not drop below 3.4V under a load.

My 72 MHz stuff has slowly fadded away but I still have 2 systems on the shelf collecting dust.

SPEEDY
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Old 08-12-2012, 07:23 AM
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Default RE: Is there a radio that does not lose signal?

Hey, Ihave been flying Hitec Aurora 9 for 2.5 years with never glitch! Electrics to .70 size 4-stroke glow. Before that Hitec Eclipse 7 on 72MHZ for 10 years with no radio problems.

I believe most lost of control things are poor aircraft prep, batteries too small and or old/improperly charged batteries. Also,many people don't seem to realize there is a limit to how many servos a basic ESC/BEC circuit can handle. Also Irecommend 6volt batteries for all glow model RX systems. For electrics with more than 4 servos, use a seperate CCBEC set for 6vdc to power your RX and servos. Also the A9 will beep and let you know if your battery is dropping low during hard high current draw manuvers.

Good luck!
Jim D.
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Old 08-12-2012, 08:10 AM
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Default RE: Is there a radio that does not lose signal?

About your two crashes....Did you re-use any of the electronics from the first crashed plane in the second? I lost several planes due to a faulty servo. It only caused interference when there was a load against the flight surface, so that if you did a ground check all was fine but in the air eventually that control surface would be used or a maneuver would load it, and bam, no control. That being said, I've flown Futaba since about 1990, both 72 and 2.4, and never had a radio related crash. I am now using the 8FGS with A123 battery packs on the rx, with a diode in the line so it's running just over 6 volts. I have found some glitch issues on ground testing but it's always been either gas ignition too close, a faulty extension, or antenna/rx placement.
Good luck, I know how frustrating this stuff can be.
Sam
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Old 08-12-2012, 08:14 AM
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Default RE: Is there a radio that does not lose signal?

Switch to Futaba.......just my 2 cents worth.
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Old 08-12-2012, 08:35 AM
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Default RE: Is there a radio that does not lose signal?

Jagthack,
It sounds you do a good job of setting up your plane and radio.
You said that the RX battery had a full charge. However, how old is the battery? if the battry is older, it could have a dead cell.
In that case if you check it with out a load, it will show OK, but when you put a load on it, it could go below the threshold voltage.
Just a thought....
It is my opinion that the Major brands of radios are all good, and you could get a bad system from any one of the brands.
Evan though they do a good job of quatlity control, a radio can be good when tested, and thenthen go bad shortly after. This can happen with anything in electronics.
I personally use Futaba, but most of the people in my club use Spektrum or JR. I have only been into RC for 2 years, but have not seen a plane crash due to radio failure with these systems.

Good luck on which ever system you choose.
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Old 08-12-2012, 08:53 AM
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Default RE: Is there a radio that does not lose signal?

We had a 9C, Futaba synthesized module on channel 49, PPM

Plane 1. Big Stik 60, OS91FS, Hitec Supreme RX, Hitec 425 servos, 4.8v 1000mah nicad, all new when installed. 10-15 flights on everything.

Plane 2. SIG Hog Bipe, OS91FS, Hitec Supreme RX, Hitec 425 servos, 4.8v 1000mah nicad, all new when installed. At least 200 flights, over a couple of years, on everything.

Saturday 1. Fresh charge, load tested before flight. Stik in a spin. Release sticks, spin stops still diving. Try to pull up, no response. Plane destroyed. Everything is working after the crash. Load tested battery, no issue. Chalked it up to dumb thumbs.

Saturday 2. Fresh charge, load tested before flight. Bipe in a spin. Release sticks at vey high altitude due to nervousness from last Saturday, spin stops still diving. Try to pull up, no response. Try all controls, no response. Plane destroyed. Everything is working after the crash. Load tested battery, no issue.

Items common to both crashes
Transmitter
RF Module in transmitter
Channel 49
Pilot
Location of flying site

We are not changing pilots or locations so we went to the LHS and bought a new 9C which came with a fixed frequency module on channel 13. We also bought all of his channel 13 Hitec RX crystals. We have a couple of years on the new transmitter now with no issues.

We do not know for sure the old TX or module is bad but we no longer trusted it. We gave it away, with full disclosure of our experience. We do not know if the new owner ever used it; health issues have kept him away for a long time.
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