Specktrum radios; why did you crash? Why did you have a "brown-out?"
#102
My Feedback: (176)
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: florence, CO
Posts: 124
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Radio systems have made advances in technology, I.E., that being 2.4 Ghz systems, fantastic!! It would be easy to write about how bad Spektrum is? Haven't ever owned one. Have read a lot of bad reviews here on RCU. most, if not all based in fact and expereience. I use another brand since my first plane over 35 years ago and have been very happy with the performance. The old FM receivers were a worry after a crash and the smart pilot sent them in to get checked. With 2.4, came surface mount technology and kinda made receivers bullet proof. I understand the phrase "brown out" refers to a signal problem. I don't think I would buy into a Spektrum system, even though I am sure they have some redeeming qualities?? Loyalty is a wonderful thing, but after so many problems I would have to abandon ship, unless the manufacturer would be willing to start buying people that have had failures new planes and radios to make it right, we all know that isn't going to happen. I would think that after so much bad press, sales would be in the crapper, anyway good luck.
#103
Senior Member
Based upon what I've seen and experienced - - -
Many of the "brownout" problems are a result of poor connections, 22GA wire, servos with high peak currents, Battery packs wih high internal resistance, and so forth.
Step one can be to add a 540uf capacitor between the battery leads, close to the RX.
Step two is to use any one of several schemes that route the servo current around the RX.
Step 3 is to use a SBEC capable of the needed current. It's possible to use multiple SBECs when the number of servos makes it reasonable.
Many of the "brownout" problems are a result of poor connections, 22GA wire, servos with high peak currents, Battery packs wih high internal resistance, and so forth.
Step one can be to add a 540uf capacitor between the battery leads, close to the RX.
Step two is to use any one of several schemes that route the servo current around the RX.
Step 3 is to use a SBEC capable of the needed current. It's possible to use multiple SBECs when the number of servos makes it reasonable.
#104
Here is a picture of my old DX-7 flight pack installation in a my 40% Carden Extra 260 back in 2007, and the 9 ea. JR 8611 servos were powered with two each Fromeco 2200 ma lion packs. If you note in the picture there is a custom manufactured switch with a two battery input side and a three lead output side on the same circuit, the switch supplied power to two each Specktrum receivers and the DA ignition module all from the same switch and again same circuit, I performed this as a test bed study on RF noise while using 2.4. Anyway in over 500 + flights with this setup there was never a singe issue of a brownout power fade or signal RF noise interruption. I am happy to tell you all that this airplane is still around and flying today guys, I still have my DX-7 but I fly now with my Stealth.
Bob
Bob
#105
My Feedback: (2)
Further illustrating the fact that the sooner people stop blaming the radios, and figure out it's about power delivery to the radios/servos, the sooner they'll stop crashing.
Not sticking up for Spektrum, or endorsing their use. I don't even use one. Just trying to save the frustration of somebody else putting another plane in without knowing why. No radio can work if it's not getting enough power - ALL THE TIME - not just before the flight.
Not sticking up for Spektrum, or endorsing their use. I don't even use one. Just trying to save the frustration of somebody else putting another plane in without knowing why. No radio can work if it's not getting enough power - ALL THE TIME - not just before the flight.
#106
Then why are other brands of radios not having as many issues. if any issues at all. I run four larger aircraft each using a 5amp BEC set at 5.1v. Using all Airtronics digital servos with the servo count as 8 , 8, 7, and 6 plus electric retracts. I guess the big plus is, I don't use Spektrum transmitter and receivers. Been using all these aircraft well over 5 years and" no glitches " .
#107
Join Date: Feb 2015
Location: Ft Worth, TX
Posts: 319
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
How do you set up a separate servo bus?
Jack
#108
Junior Member
Join Date: Jun 2013
Location: South East,
FL
Posts: 20
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I must have seen a hundred planes go in at various sites with pilots using Spektrum Equipment. I have trimmed planes for people and experienced first hand your called brown outs and glitches. They always say " I Got Nothing!!" or "I got hit" There is a reason that stuff is cheap, Because it's Krap!!! Follow the leader and get a Futaba system, That's right "The Leader" I've been using Futaba gear for over 30 years without a Hiccup! A Gold Series in the early eighties, to a super 7, to a 9ZHP in '93 and now an 18 MZ. You get what you pay for. As far as the Jeti being easier to program? I cant imagine anything easier to program than my 18MZ, its all touch screen. Yea but most of the pro's use Spektrum right? Yea, Because they give that Krap to them for free. I would'nt fly a paper plate on a Spektrum System let alone an aircraft of any value.
#110
Jack, I use two of these power boards from servo city; one for each receiver... there's nothing fancy about these boards, they just offer a good power buss to the servos... if you look at the board, you'll see two large holes at one end, that is where you solder in your battery harness with a good quality switch, those large holes supplies the servos with their own power source... the way these servo city power boards are designed, they isolate the servo battery source from reaching the receiver.... you then use another batter pack and switch that plugs into your receiver... the two battery packs are isolated through the power board... but, if you don't want to use a separate battery for the receiver, if you look at the other end of the power board, you'll see another set of smaller holes, that is a power takeoff point to power the receiver, so the one battery feeding the the power board will supply power to both the servos and receiver, but doing it that way you gain nothing really if you have several hV digital servos thumping away, you could still cause a voltage drop across the buss and starve the receiver.
If you want something that offers you load balancing, bad battery isolation, and true redundancy, then take a look at the power boards from SmartFly.
https://www.servocity.com/html/servo_power_boards.html
This image shows basically what the servo city power board is doing and how I have mine setup times two; one for each receiver... I have one battery pack and switch feeding both power boards for the servo power, and another separate battery pack and switch feeding both receivers.
John M,
If you want something that offers you load balancing, bad battery isolation, and true redundancy, then take a look at the power boards from SmartFly.
https://www.servocity.com/html/servo_power_boards.html
This image shows basically what the servo city power board is doing and how I have mine setup times two; one for each receiver... I have one battery pack and switch feeding both power boards for the servo power, and another separate battery pack and switch feeding both receivers.
John M,
Last edited by John_M_; 09-11-2015 at 11:41 AM.
#111
Join Date: Feb 2015
Location: Ft Worth, TX
Posts: 319
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Jack, I use two of these power boards from servo city; one for each receiver... there's nothing fancy about these boards, they just offer a good power buss to the servos... if you look at the board, you'll see two large holes at one end, that is where you solder in your battery harness with a good quality switch, those large holes supplies the servos with their own power source... the way these servo city power boards are designed, they isolate the servo battery source from reaching the receiver.... you then then, use another batter pack and switch that plugs into your receiver... the two battery packs are isolated through the power board... but, if you don't want to use a separate battery for the receiver, if you look at the other end of the power board, you'll see another set of smaller holes, that is a power takeoff point to power the receiver, so the one battery feeding the the power board will supply power to both the servos and receiver, but doing it that way you gain nothing really if you have several hV digital servos thumping away, you could still cause a voltage drop across the buss and starve the receiver.
If you want something that offers you load balancing, bad battery isolation, and true redundancy, then take a look at the power boards from SmartFly.
https://www.servocity.com/html/servo_power_boards.html
If you want something that offers you load balancing, bad battery isolation, and true redundancy, then take a look at the power boards from SmartFly.
https://www.servocity.com/html/servo_power_boards.html
#112
BTW... I updated the image in my previous post.
John M,
Last edited by John_M_; 09-11-2015 at 08:41 AM.
#114
My Feedback: (2)
Then why are other brands of radios not having as many issues. if any issues at all. I run four larger aircraft each using a 5amp BEC set at 5.1v. Using all Airtronics digital servos with the servo count as 8 , 8, 7, and 6 plus electric retracts. I guess the big plus is, I don't use Spektrum transmitter and receivers. Been using all these aircraft well over 5 years and" no glitches " .
Maybe the receivers in these radios crap out at higher voltages? So what! I'm no electronics expert, but this seems simple to me. Give them enough power (AMPS!!!!) and they work great. What USED to work is fine, but this is today. We need to get used to it.
Last edited by ahicks; 09-11-2015 at 08:29 AM.
#115
Slapnuts ; On the Jeti being easier to program.... yes and no ....When you do your first program or two it is a bit daunting But then once you get to understand the radio and the thought behind it then it becomes much easier. Of course those that say it is easier; programing comes easier to them. The Programing videos that are available at Esprit r/c are great ! AND makes the job happen quicker. What the radio can do is just unbelievable. Not particularly impressed with touch screen as I have had both and prefer the pushbutton but then that is a user thing. The easiest radio to program in my opinion; is the Airtronics SD-10G and GS bar none. Futaba is ok but prefer the Airtronics. Have also tried Spektrum and that one is on the bottom , not because of the electronic issues but strictly programing.
#116
#117
Junior Member
Join Date: Jun 2013
Location: South East,
FL
Posts: 20
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Stegl, I've heard very good things about the Jeti. I fly with the current world Champion Pylon Racer who used to work with them. Thier HQ is not to far our flying field. Was'nt knocking Jeti, just saying the 18MZ is'nt that hard to program.
#118
My Feedback: (1)
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Brooker,
FL
Posts: 8
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Let me put my two cents in. I fly Spektrum DSM2 and DSMX and have for my years in the hobby. My club flies at an airport and during a period of time we were putting planes in almost every weekend. The plane would lose signal and either do aerobatics, fly straight, or simply nose in. Our safety officer blamed it on bad piloting, but when you see your plane just start looping until it lands in the trees and you show everybody you aren't inputting any controls and the sticks are neutral you have to say something else is up. Well, one of our members is an electronics whiz with the phone company. He came out with some equipment and found the neighbor to our north had a souped wi-fi that was overpowering the 2.4 spectrum. It didn't matter is you had hopping technology or not, if you flew into the path of the wi-fi which covered half our flying field, you could lose a plane. Hitec, Futaba transmitters did it, too. Another person at the airport had an overpowered wi-fi aimed at right angles to the first one, so we were hit with a double whammy. We got on the horn to the FCC and talked with them about our problems and then went to our neighbors and told them what we found. In the end things were toned down and we haven't had the problems.
I'm not saying this is the cause of your problems, just a possibility.
I'm not saying this is the cause of your problems, just a possibility.
#119
Thread Starter
My Feedback: (27)
JOHN & JACK
THIS IS THE ONLY FIX I KNOW OF UNTILL SPEKTRUM REDESIGNS THEIR RECEIVERS TO CARRY MORE AMPS...THEY ARE DEFINITELY THE WORST OF ALL THE manufacturers. I want them to fix thier problem and replace all my receivers...Unless there is a big Class Action Lawsuit we will never get the money back for our losses. They can never win if it goes to Court. Too much proof against them.
Goog Job guys...You and Spektrum knew the answer all the time..
THIS IS THE ONLY FIX I KNOW OF UNTILL SPEKTRUM REDESIGNS THEIR RECEIVERS TO CARRY MORE AMPS...THEY ARE DEFINITELY THE WORST OF ALL THE manufacturers. I want them to fix thier problem and replace all my receivers...Unless there is a big Class Action Lawsuit we will never get the money back for our losses. They can never win if it goes to Court. Too much proof against them.
Goog Job guys...You and Spektrum knew the answer all the time..
#120
Then again, most boaters wouldn't put a Spectrum in anything. I watched several boats go into and up the banks due to radio issues as well. One was a brand new scale 1980 Miss Budweiser. Everything was new, including a freshly charged 5 cell pack. Boat was started, launched and lasted one lap before it went out of control and into a steep bank. Unfortunately, the front of the boat was badly shaffered, ending it's day. Since the owner was not familiar with running boats, he asked one of the veteran drivers to test his boat so experience wasn't an issue. What was discovered was, even with full rudder input at the transmitter, the boat failed to turn. A range test was performed, no issues noted. Someone then suggested doing a longer range test, this requiring going over the water. This time, there was noticable glitching of the servos, up to and including a reversed servo output. The test was repeated, this time with the radio operator walking down the road, away from the water. The radio operated fine this time but, when the radio was taken around the far side of the pond, the glitching resumed. After that, it was several years before anyone tried a Spectrum again. What we determined was that, due to the short wavelength, the transmitter signal was being reflected and/or distorted by the surface of the water so that the receiver was unable to supply the proper servo response. The radio was sent in and deemed to be in perfect working order, regardless of what was said by the owner. For some reason, a year or so later, Spectrum came out with "Marine" receivers. These new receivers seemed to fix the problem but most, myself included, use Futaba systems
Last edited by Hydro Junkie; 09-11-2015 at 04:15 PM.
#121
Junior Member
Join Date: Jun 2013
Location: South East,
FL
Posts: 20
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
There is a song by Buddy Rich's band. It goes out to all the Spektrum users out there. Sooner or later you will identify with this song. It's called
" Pick up the pieces" Thats what you will all eventually do if you keep flying with that junk!! It's just a matter of time!!!
" Pick up the pieces" Thats what you will all eventually do if you keep flying with that junk!! It's just a matter of time!!!
#122
Member
My Feedback: (7)
Join Date: May 2002
Location: Navarre,
FL
Posts: 58
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Sir can you please tell me what receiver you are now using, I don't need a 16 channel receiver, but I have lost one jet with no reason, well it did have one problem the crew at Horizon left some of the parts inside the transmitter, there was no prof of the parts floating around inside the Tx causing the jet to slam mother earth, the good people replaced my JR transmitter with the DX 18 at no cost to me, didn't make up for a 7K jet, now that the DX 18 and 9020 receiver is being used in a new jet, I had a very exciding takeoff that made me suck up about 100 feet of asphalt, I was very lucky to get the bird down with only one gear sticking thru the top of one wing, if the 16 ch receiver you are talking about can or maybe keep the bird from doing ugly things that it wasn't asked todo I will put out $187.00+- to keep 7-8K in my pocket, for some reason my wife believes that money can be used for something other than RC, they are funny that way.. Thank you sir and I hope you will email me with the receiver number so I can get one on order.