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Futaba 2.4 Ghz 6EX looses link midflight

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Old 02-03-2008, 04:25 AM
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gauravag
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Default Futaba 2.4 Ghz 6EX looses link midflight

Hello,
I have had a problem with my Futaba 6EX 2.4 Ghz that led to a crash of my scale GP Mustang .46 today and i suspect a radio malfunction to be the sole cause of this.
While flying the airplane, and after about 2 minutes of flight, with the plane around 300 feet up and away from me, i experienced a total loss of control on all 4 channels, with the result of which the airplane slammed full throttle into the ground, wrecking almost about everything.
I had around 5 seconds in the air after the link failure, and during which i tried to throttle down, and use the elevator to level out the plane, but to no avail. There was a total loss of control.
The first thing i noticed on the crash site was that the receiver light was set to red, even with my transmittor on and transmittor's light to green .

It is worth mentioning that i had done 3 flights for about 10 minutes before this last flight on the same day and everything was fully under control and the flights were beautiful.

After getting back to home, i turned on the receiver again, and it had the red LED on ( even with the transmitter green ) . I got the manual, and tried the ID reset which does not work at all !!! SO no matter what i do i cannot get the receiver to link with the transmitter, and somehow the link got broken in mid flight !

The battery was charged overnight, and i ruled that problem out by even trying a new battery when trying the link procedure back home.
I even have the battery connected to the Triton discharger now, and the battery is fine .

The radio system is brand new, and i have done around 10 flights in the last 5 days using this system, and all worked well till today.

i can provide photos/videos to illustrate the failed link up process thats occuring now.

We need to discuss and find the real cause of this problem. Why did the link fail in midflight ?
If it happened once, it could happen again, to me , or to someone else ?
Look forward to your reply,
Thank you,
Gaurav

PS: I tried emailing this to Futaba service email id at service@futaba-rc.com and it bounces back. any ideas what to do next in order to get some help please ?
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Old 02-03-2008, 04:41 AM
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gauravag
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Default RE: Futaba 2.4 Ghz 6EX looses link midflight

Interestingly, the serial number on my transmittor is A70331270 .. which is listed in the service advisory.
However on the day of crash, there were no other fliers anywhere around. Infact i am the only one flying in this city, and i am confident there is no reason for any Futaba 2.4 Ghz system to be around for interference...

Hopefully this helps.
-Gaurav
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Old 02-03-2008, 05:30 AM
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Default RE: Futaba 2.4 Ghz 6EX looses link midflight

Package it up and send it in to Futaba. They have said they will replace it if any problem's. send everything in, probably would not hurt to send in pieces batteries ect. So they can diagnose everything, instead of having everyone else diagnose it for you!!!! the longer you wait the longer you wont know. They may even replace the airframe!


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Old 02-03-2008, 06:34 AM
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Default RE: Futaba 2.4 Ghz 6EX looses link midflight

To me it sounds like a bad receiver, Do you have another receiver you can test?

Doug.
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Old 02-03-2008, 07:33 AM
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gauravag
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Default RE: Futaba 2.4 Ghz 6EX looses link midflight

Doug, If the reciever is bad, how come i made 10 flights with this same radio normally ? why did this occur just during one of the flights ?
Even today i had made 3 flights normally , and i flew high and far as well, and it all went fine. The radio failure accured just 300 feet away,
and there are no electrical cables, cell phone towers etc where i am flying.

I have been flying for 10 years and and everything else was perfect, the plane was kit made by me, radio antennae installation done as by the manual .. perfect day to fly, did all the pre flights, range checks , had a few good flights, and then on this flight, just lost the link while flying !
and now on the ground it wont re-link at all .

I do not have an answer on how the receiver could have unlinked itself during the flight. And if the receiver is bad, there might be others out there which are bad ? I am pretty nervous in using this radio set untill i find out something .

3DAP, Yes i intend to send the set back to Futaba, as soon as i get their response confirming they need it back on the Futaba thread where i copied this post.

Thanks all for your suggestions. I have been stumped by this and do not have any possible solutions for this strange occurance.
Regds,
Gaurav
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Old 02-03-2008, 08:03 AM
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Default RE: Futaba 2.4 Ghz 6EX looses link midflight

It still could be either the Rx or Tx , I've had computor memory act up but on very rare ocassions. I replaced the memory and no more troubles. Could be a flawed chip in one of you components.

Andy
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Old 02-03-2008, 10:01 AM
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Default RE: Futaba 2.4 Ghz 6EX looses link midflight

Gaurav:

I had about 10 flights on my new DX7 radio and the Radio (TX) died, Horizon send me a new one and all good again.

I had a Futaba 148 receiver died on me after 9 month of use.

It can happen!

Best thing to do is to send both the RX and TX to Futaba.

Best regards,

Doug.
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Old 02-03-2008, 06:50 PM
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Default RE: Futaba 2.4 Ghz 6EX looses link midflight

As the engine did not idle down due to failsafe, and the reciever cannot be linked anymore, I say it is a defective reciever and not a link loss.
No chance for us to provide any help but to suggest to send it in.
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Old 02-03-2008, 09:50 PM
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Default RE: Futaba 2.4 Ghz 6EX looses link midflight

Thanks Julez, Doug,

Yes as soon as i hear from Futaba support, il lsend this back to them. But the thing is, there may be other 'bad' receivers out there ?
And there is no ways of finding out a bad receiver till the plane crashes, as the range test was fine and several flights went well also ?

The situation is very serious, this accident could have potentially killed a person. The plane went the ground from 300ft full throttle down, and the impact was so much that everything - engine,retracts, servos were totalled.

How can i trust to use this technology for other airplanes i have , its a lot of time/$$ invested per plane...

Plus Futaba's support/service email is getting bounced back . Any other way to contact them , apart from posting in the RCU Futaba Direct support forum ?

Thanks all,
Gaurav
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Old 02-03-2008, 10:28 PM
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Default RE: Futaba 2.4 Ghz 6EX looses link midflight

Take pics of all pieces or video and send it in. You do not need to wait for them to get back to you (I dont think) they are going to tell you to send it in. Any way sorry about your loss, crashing sucks. What was your preflight voltage? I like to check Rx voltage under load before every flight. Obviously there has been some problem's with the fasst, just curious about voltage????

If you post on Futaba's direct forum, it will not take that long before Krysta or Bax gets back to you. I would have sent everything in as soon as you got home including battery in same condition as it was when you picked it up off the ground. When they get the gear in these conditions they can properlya asess the situation. I had a Hitec Hs 225 mighty mini in an elevator servo on a 90 size edge go bad
and Sent ALL radio gear in and took pics. They replaced the servo and my plane. Not saying what Futaba will do, just saying that with all this Futaba Havoc going on it would be a lot easier for them (futaba) and rc community to deal with if they know exactly what's up!


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Old 02-03-2008, 11:32 PM
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Default RE: Futaba 2.4 Ghz 6EX looses link midflight

I am sorry for your loss and have no idea of the cause.

You assumed immediatly that the receiver became unlinked in the air and caused your crash. I suppose anything is possible. But, testing the receiver to find that it won't link does not mean it became unbound in the air. Once the plane hits the ground, you will probably never know whether it unlinked in the air, or won't link now because of crash damage.
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Old 02-03-2008, 11:45 PM
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Default RE: Futaba 2.4 Ghz 6EX looses link midflight

Flying Geezer,
Thats right, but why did the fail safe not work ? and since Futaba's email is not working, where do i ship the equipment (closest to India) , and what all do i send them ?
engine and remaining airframe as well ?
I hope they can give me a replacement for this, but ill be scared to fly this till we find the root cause..

Thanks all !
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Old 02-04-2008, 12:28 AM
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Default RE: Futaba 2.4 Ghz 6EX looses link midflight

I don't know about the fail-safe? We don't know about it coming unbound either. Check your manual for information on warranty service, this should get you started on where to send your equipment.

good luck,
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Old 02-04-2008, 08:35 AM
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Default RE: Futaba 2.4 Ghz 6EX looses link midflight

I think you may have a bad cell on your battery....even though you charged it overnight. Charging it overnight is no guarantee that you are going to get a flawless flight the next day. And if everything was totaled, how do you know the receiver failed to link after the crash? Just curious.
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Old 02-04-2008, 09:52 AM
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Default RE: Futaba 2.4 Ghz 6EX looses link midflight

Just a thought here, but you just may have lost battery power to the receiver due to a switch or harness failure, resulting in no failsafe. Since everything was totaled, there's no way to really know[&o]
Pete
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Old 02-04-2008, 10:10 AM
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Default RE: Futaba 2.4 Ghz 6EX looses link midflight


ORIGINAL: gauravag

Thanks Julez, Doug,

Yes as soon as i hear from Futaba support, il lsend this back to them. But the thing is, there may be other 'bad' receivers out there ?
And there is no ways of finding out a bad receiver till the plane crashes, as the range test was fine and several flights went well also ?

The situation is very serious, this accident could have potentially killed a person. The plane went the ground from 300ft full throttle down, and the impact was so much that everything - engine,retracts, servos were totalled.

How can i trust to use this technology for other airplanes i have , its a lot of time/$$ invested per plane...

Plus Futaba's support/service email is getting bounced back . Any other way to contact them , apart from posting in the RCU Futaba Direct support forum ?

Thanks all,
Gaurav
Hello Gaurav,

I am not trying to make light of your crash, but there are several things you need to consider. I have been flying R/C since 1965 and have come to realize many years back that crashing is an unpleasant fact that we all have to learn to live with. There are numerous reasons that a model can crash, too many to list here.

In the early days, it was most often radio related. The airplanes we were flying were converted free flight models that would fly fine without any control, but we managed to crash them quite often with our primitive control systems. Radio failure is so rare these days that when it does happen, people are quite often shocked, but it still happens. Components in the receivers are subjected to horrible vibration. For this and many other reasons we still have receiver/battery/switch/servo failure. It usually happens at the worst of times. A couple of years back I watched as a 33% IMAC airplane crashed straight down at full throttle. The pilot had completed a maneuver that ended in a down line and had given full throttle just before attempting to pull out to level flight. That was when something in the airplane decided to quit working. We will never know exactly what it was because there were not enough usable pieces left to try the radio.

I have seen and experienced so many crashes over the years that it does not bother me that much any more. I guess what I am trying to say is the yours was not the first in-flight failure and will not be the last.

I have no idea why it did not go into failsafe and would only be guessing if I commented on it at all. Send everything in for service. Send them everything, transmitter/receiver/battery pack/switch harness. Give Futaba time to get their email working again. If you need something to help regain faith in the technology, just look around you. Both where you fly and on line here. I am sure you will see quite a few others using the same radio system with no problems.

Later;

D.W.
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Old 02-04-2008, 10:59 AM
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Default RE: Futaba 2.4 Ghz 6EX looses link midflight

And I don't think the 6ex has a battery fail safe....this is not the same as a interference/loss-link fail safe.
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Old 02-04-2008, 11:36 AM
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Default RE: Futaba 2.4 Ghz 6EX looses link midflight

I agree with pilotepete2, the problem may not be with the reciever or transmitter at all. Sounds more like a bad switch, bad battery or bad wiring that finally succumbed to vibration or other flight conditions.
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Old 02-22-2008, 08:59 PM
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Default RE: Futaba 2.4 Ghz 6EX looses link midflight

Hi something like that has happened to me, this is the email ive send to futaba, but it came back to me:

--
"Hi, my name is Ivan Schroeder, im from Argentina, Ive bought a new FUTABA 7C 2.4GHZ with the R617FS and one R607FS a few weeks ago. Ive linked it and installed the R607FS in my glow plane, i notice a little interferece in the rudder(ch 4) when i use the ailerons(ch 1) and the elevator(ch 2) at the same time. Ive relinked and still the same. I realize it on the field, after i relinked ive started the engine an justo before take off all the channels started moving by them self, the throttle went iddle, the ailerons, elevator and rudder moved slowly, step to step, one way until the reach the maxim position. Ive checked everything, the batteries and change it but they were full charged, all the conexions and cables OK, the antena was 90ΒΊ, everything. I stoped the engine, relinked the R607FS and stil the same, all the channels went weird.
The Rx is brand new, ive sawn in the Rx the lights went from green to red just when the channels went weird, like it has a Epprom problem like sais in the manual. I have the guarranty and the original case. Ive friends with the same Futaba and they dont have this problem. What could be the problem??

On the other hand, the R617FS has the same interference in the throttle(ch 3) when i use the elevator(channel 2). What could it be?

This is the FCC ID from my TX in case you need it: AZPTMSS2-24G

I have all my planes equipped with futaba since i began this hobby and these is the first time it happens something like this. Please i need some answer about it because ive bought the 7C 2.4ghz and i cant use it neither fly my planes"
--


Then i send it to futaba brasil and they answered this:

--
Dear Sr.

It seens tobe the main unit processor.
unfortunately we don't have this processort in stock.
we recomend that you send your transmiter to Futaba - USA.
They have this processor.


Atenciosamente,

Aeromodelli Ltda.

--

All is new, batteries Futaba, new servos s3004, all futaba, all full charged...

What should i do, ship it to Futaba USA? How can i contact them, should i send a fax?

Thanks
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Old 02-22-2008, 10:08 PM
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Default RE: Futaba 2.4 Ghz 6EX looses link midflight

Read this:

http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/m_1131517/tm.htm
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Old 02-24-2008, 02:57 PM
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Default RE: Futaba 2.4 Ghz 6EX looses link midflight

Yikes, that's scary. Guess I won't be upgrading to 2.4 which sucks, because my 8U tx has seen better days and needs to be replaced. It seems the technology just needs a few more years for the bugs to be ironed out all the way.
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Old 02-25-2008, 02:51 PM
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Default RE: Futaba 2.4 Ghz 6EX looses link midflight

You would need to contact the seller of the system so that they can tell you where you would need to send it for service. From the description you gave, it is only apparent that your airborne system failed to respond to the transmitter for some reason. It could not be due to a loss of "link" because the system did not go into the failsafe mode. Something else happened. Because the receiver cannot be linked after the crash, it may be impossible to determine what caused your model to crash because of crash damage to the receiver. If your transmitter will not operate other FASST receivers that are linked to different transmitters, or with unlinked receivers, you don't have problems with the ID code in your unit.

Any number of reasons could have caused your model to crash. Some can be: bad servo leads, bad battery pack, improper vibration isolation of the receiver, bad receiver antenna installation, bad servos, bad wiring and connectors, a bad switch, and the list goes on. It's almost impossible to determine the cause from the information provided. Again, we can only recommend that you send your system to the service center recommended by the seller of your system to you. If your system was purchased from a North American seller, then we can perform the service. In such a case, you would need to provide documentation to prove that the system was U.S. purchased and was being returned to the U.S. for repair services. This would be on the customs declaration with a copy of the purchase receipt attached to a letter requesting repair services that would be inside the package. Without such declarations, the unit would likely incur customs duties upon arrival in the U.S. You would also want to register your system with your country's customs service so that you would not be charged with import duties when it was returned to you.

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Old 02-26-2008, 12:16 AM
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Default RE: Futaba 2.4 Ghz 6EX looses link midflight

Thanks Bax,
With my 10 year+ experience with RC, i understand several things could have failed. However i take full precautions wit hthe vibration, batteries, switches and everything. I know the only thing i need todo now is to send everything over to your US facility. I purchased this set from Tower Hobbies, so i will include their receipt.

It was an extremely un-nerving experience, and i hope i will hear back from Futaba soon, after sending in the set.

After this loss, i am continuing to fly with my 72 Mhz Futaba radio and its so reliable. I havent crashed a model in 10 years like the way this one did.

I am a Futaba fan, and will continue to be one. Would just appreciate the company to look at my equipment to try and see if there is anything to be learnt.
Thanks to all,
Gaurav
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