newguy05

My Feedback: (2)

i am having a similar problem except mine happens the eact opposite times. On the ground it has glitched for 5-7 minutes straight all surfaces incl throttle about 3 inches on each surface and full-idle on throttle, major interference and its constant. It has only did it 2 times so far. Once this past weekend and a weekend 5 weeks ago. All the connections seem to be good, battery is 6v and im also on channel 53. Once the glitching stops everythings is fine and i cannot recreate the problem. Ive flown it and yet to get a glitch once they stopped on the ground and also did a range check from about 250 ft away without a glitch. Does it without engine running no surfaces moving. Both times i had just turned the plane on, set my radio on the flight table and was about to connect the glow driver when it started. I turn radio off wait 2 minutes turn back on and it still does it. 10 minutes later and its rock solid no glitching. Been flying this freq and only other prob ive ever had was glitch in air that was coming from a bad y harness. Im thinking its a radio broadcast of some sort that is affecting my freq. Any ideas? Also the nearest freq in use to me was 48, we have a freq scanner so as soon as it started i checked it.

Clay Walters

Since the receiver doesn't seem to be the problem (you changed it out with another) and the same transmitter works on other planes/receivers just fine I suppose the battery would be a logical check. Its the one thing unique to that plane.

Since other flyers on the same frequency aren't having the problem it should rule out hits from off-field interference.

Frankly, I'd try another radio system in the plane to see if the problem persists. If it doesn't I'd send the TX/RX in for examination accompanied with all my notes.

Regards,

Clay

gkpain

My Feedback: (1)

Newguy05,

I would love to have your problem over mine. Unfortunely for me , my glitches only have happened in the air.

In my short experience, I have seen your problem happen a couple times, I've seen the tx antenna touching the airplane cause this, or when you touch your glow starter wire from your fieldbox, or even get it close to the glow plug the servos would start glitching.

In my shop, I store my planes on top of a car (metal and lots of it), if I switch on the radio system, and stand too close with the TX I get alot off glitching, or if I leave the wall chargers plugged into the wall I get alot of glitching. The reason I said this, if by chance your working off a metal table or too close to a metal fence this may happen. Try these things and see if it happens and if this is what your glitch may be. If you have all your field equipement close to your plane you might move what you can a few feet back away from your plane and TX. If your Glitching starts try extending your antenna.

Next I would look at voltage at the receiver. A Hobbico Voltwatch may help here. It plugs into an unused channel on your RX so you can see what the voltage is doing at the RX.

Make sure you charge your batteries the night before ( of course everyone knows this) but we have lost a couple of airplanes here lately at our field because of low RX voltage (they didn't recharge the batteries). My rule here is recharge after 3 or 4 flights and always monitor your voltage. If its low, I'll recharge or pack it in and go home. Including the TX battery.

After doing all that and you dont find the problem you can join my club . And start changing or replacing components untill you find the fix. And let us know what you find.

Clay,

I agree with your suggestion, except I have two other planes that I use the same channel and TX to fly them with. I dont have this issue with the other airplanes. As of right now I have all but completely ruled out the TX. I am replacing the radio system, but one piece at a time. I want to pin point this problem so it doesn't work its way into another aiplane.

Thxs for the help guys

Flying Geezer

My Feedback: (14)

NEWGUY05, your problem could be caused by the high voltage on a freshly charged 5 cell battery pack. I have seen this happen, and it quits as the voltage goes down on the battery pack.

Fresh of the charger, the voltage can be over 7 volts on a 5 cell pack. I wonder if you are topping off your charge just before flying.

newguy05

My Feedback: (2)

the thing is though it happened after 4 perfect flights, same time of day both times it has done it and reciever pack is around 6.4v under load. Heres the sequence in which it happened. Checked batt voltage before flight, Turned tx on, turned rx on, grabbed my glow igniter (standing about 2-3 feet away from plane, and then everything started going haywire. So i ran over to the freq checker and nearest thing to me was 48. Every once in a while i would get ready to check it again and every time it would still glitch. After about 8 minutes i went back to it and it was fine and never got another glitch. So the next time that the people on 48 landed i had them turn their radio on (very unlikely it could be that far out of tune to splatter across 5 channels) and test my plane. Nothing, everything was rocksolid like it always had been. I only have 1 yharness in it and thats on the elevator servos, (its a U Can do 3d). So feeling very annoyed it took every piece of electronic equipment out and re set it up, it never glitched so i really dont know if it fixed problem or not, i guess we will find out. [&o]

newguy05

My Feedback: (2)

o yea flying geezer hows in down in bowling green? heard you all put on some good airshows down there, i fly up in louisville at RCRC (river city radio controllers). jonathan btw been flying this plane with same setup except for the motor for over a year and just now having the prob. thanks

Nathan King

Check your switch too. Do you have an Ohm meter or continuity checker? If so, hook it up and wiggle the switch a bit. Engine vibration could cause a faulty switch to go nuts in the air and work fine on the ground.

Flying Geezer

My Feedback: (14)

NEWGUY05, we have a big jet jam going on this weekend. Bunches of jets from all over. Come on down.

newguy05

My Feedback: (2)

i have graduation goin on this weekend so prolly wont be able to come down. We have a fundraiser for korsair childrens hospital coming up next week, all the big guys r there like frank noll, team futaba etc. also 4th july weekend we have kentucky jets down at springfield airport. And in september we have a warbird fly in as well. maybe see ya at one of em.

Flying Geezer

My Feedback: (14)

Graduation? Children's hospital? You have your priorities all wrong! LOL

gkpain

My Feedback: (1)

Hi folksl

Haven't got a flight in yet, but on the way home today I stopped at the LHS and bought the HAN172 Digital servo and RX current meter from Hanger 9. Its pretty cools. It will show you the current draw each of your servos is making at the RX or Battery depending on how you hook it up. I checked all 5 of my servos and got a reading of .08 amps as an average on all 5 servos. One exception was I was getting .23 draw with a down elevator input. So I inspected for binding and found that the plastic kwick connect was rubbing the plastic servo horn. I tweaked the control rod alittle and the draw is now .08 like the rest of them. The meter also shows voltage as well. At the current state of charge my battery was 5.36 volts,with any one servo input the voltage dropped to 5.34 volts. Looks to me, that I have eliminated any binding as suspect. And possibly any 1 servo.

Thxs
Just letting yall know and keeping you up to date.

Campgems

GKpain, it looks like another tool I NEED.

There can be some strange interactions that cause you greif. I have a first generation Quicke 500. When I got it, the aileron serovo was mounted on an angle and the mounts were not in very good shape. I replaced that one servo with two mini servos that gave me a lot more room and actually increased the avaiable torque. The plane also had the stock landing gear wires, but withe enough cross braces and hooks to the firewall to add a couple pounds weight. I had an aluminum gear complete with wheels and pants that was the right size so I put it on.

I was still on the buddy box at this time, so it was my "backup plane". We crashed, totaled, my trainer one day and after appoligizies from my instructor he said he was going to call it a day. HOLD on, I've got another plane. He got it up, after an interesting takeoff and got it around an back on the ground. A few weeks later, with a different instructor, I got some air time on it. WOW. Then the fun started, With instrutor 3, the plane would suddely start doing donuts. All kinds of suggestiong, not enough right thrust, Etc. Finally instructor #2 decided that if we did a pylon start, planes running fulll throttle prior to release, the donuts would go away. Didn't quite work that way. Have your ever been chased by a mad plane??? It rolled about three feet and did a 180 right back at me. The another 180 just before it hit me, then donuts. As I'm carring it back the the bench, I hear somethig click. Turns out that there was a rock in the wheel pants. It would catch on the wheel an lock into the wheel pants and cause the left wheel to lock up. I pulled the wheel pants off an that problem was resolved.

After soloing, I flew that plane a few times. A really fun plane. One day, I had a dead stick. Lots of altitude and no problem I got it into a good glide and on the down wind leg. When I went to start the turn to final, nothing happened. I couldn't do a left turn. I glided it to a semi soft landing but hit a rock and cracked the LE of the wing. I got it back to the bench and checked everythign out and couldn't find the problem. The next day, I repeated it. My throttle servo when at idle was hitting the linkage to the left aileron and locking it out mechanically. When I went dead stick, I cut the throttle back to idle an lost all left aileron on the left wing. Starnge things.

You binding falls into this catorgory. I sure hope that turns out to fix it. If not, I would suggest that you take the painfull path of pulling the complete radio/batteries/servos/switch from a working plane and put them in this one. Every thing at once. Check it out again. This will eliminate everything but Transmitter, Airfframe, and linkages. Swat out the Transmitter next. Borrow someone's who has one compatable with your receiver, buy a new Xtal for the receiver if necessary. It will be slow, but it should isloate your problem.. Lets hope it was the binding linkage causing the problem.

Don

gkpain

My Feedback: (1)

Campgems.

I guess its possible but, it was only binding at full down elevator , it wasnt sticking or anything just rubbing the servo horn right at the end on its travel. I could see the kwick connect moving just a bit so I tweaked the control rod so it wouldn't rub.

I don't think this is the problem. As we will see in the mornigs .

Yes I think the meter is a valuable tool for setting up an airplane or anything else that uses servos. Just might save you a servo or 2.

I've change the left aileron servo last night, so that will be the first test.

If that doesnt do it I am gonna change the y-harness and try again.

If that doesn't do it I will change the other 2 servos (elevator and throttle) one at at time and try again.

And finally I will ground it for the day and fly the other 2 planes and pay close attention to them.
If they don't have glitches I really can't say that the TX or RX is the problem. If they do have glitches than the problem has to be the TX or they are getting hit by another source. I will take all my planes to another field on Sunday and varify that it isn't something around the field.

Anyways wish my luck

P.S. Dp you sill have them wheel pants they'd look good on my 4 * .

Campgems

Not when I finished with them[:@]

A good set can be had from tower though, and at a very reasonable price. Check the "parts" for the U-can-do's Nice white gellcote fiberglass pants for way less thant Fiberglass specialitites. I've got to get a set for my Super Aeromaster, just in case I get nerve to fly it.

Don

gkpain

My Feedback: (1)

OK I think I have the answer folks,

To start off I did not fly the 4 * today. I flew my other 2 planes , a PT-40 trainer and a Eagle 2, both on channel 53 and both use the same TX as my 4 *.

First I let my son fly the PT-40 as I watched the airplane for any glitches or unusual incidents. Nothing I couldn't see was out of the ordinary.

Then I flew the Eagle 2 and almost imediately I notice the rudder glitching in the same direction the 4 * does. Although, because it a trainer, the effect is no where near as bad. I flew it around awhile , nice and hi, and confirmed it had the same glitching.

I landed and got out my backup TX, same channel (53), refueled and took off, same thing, rudder glitch. Flew it around awhile to confirm and yep still glitching.

I landed, refueled and recharged. The club president offered his Futuba 9C with a syn. thingy (lol). So I could confirm my TXs.

Yep still glitches ( nice radio I might add but heavy). Now what .

The club president then offered another TX and a RX on channel 52 that he uses on the club trainer. He said he has not noticed any glitches on it. Not a big swing I know but it was availible to try.

So there I was again changing a RX at the field, After a radio and range check I took off again. At the same time the wind went from
5- 10, to 15-20mph, so it made it difficult to tell on the trainer.

So, I'll get out there earlier in the morning while the wind is still calm and see what happens.

Some of you were concerned about me fling my 4 * with the glitching. I have decide to ground the 4 * until the problem is found. Do to the fact that the effects of the glitch is more drastic on the 4 *. And not so on my Eagle, but noticable.

I believe now that I am getting an outside interference, Being that I have 2 planes and 3 TXs doing the same thing. I just can't see all this, having the same problem. It has to be outside interference with channel (53).

If I see this glitching on channel 52 the I dont know.

I do have an TX and RX for channel 27 and 34, guess I'll take them with me tommorrow. That should put the nail in the coffin.

Thxs again

flensr

Do you use that transmitter with any other planes? If yes, do any of them show any glitching? If no, maybe it's an intermittant problem with the transmitter. I had a friend who didn't know that he had to screw in his removable antenna after removing it and putting it back in... He just put it in until the little textured end sort of seated and he felt the post click onto the antenna bottom. It worked well enough except when he tilted the TX while flying, with the predictable results.

So... Try wiggling, shaking, or bumping the TX while flying and see if it happens. Try pushing straight in on your TX sticks to see if the pots are bad. Try running the trim on the TX over to one side and then re-centering the control surface with the control horn, in case there is a spiking point on the input pot near center.

I guess my point is make sure you troubleshoot the TX as well as the installation in the airplane.

gkpain

My Feedback: (1)

Thxs flenst,

Excellent point and one that has slipped by me.

I could see this as a possible problem, But altough I didnt check the antennas on all three of the TXs I tried today I will. Unlikely all three antennas are loose but you never know.

Good tip
Thxs again

Campgems

GKPain. We had problems at our field a few years back and it turned out to be a Highway Patrol relay transmitter that was hitting us. Some of the fields have a ban on some channels due to police or other transmitters on the near frequencys that are putting out a dirty signal.

You club might have a frequency monitor. Ours gathers dust and the battries are sure to be down when you need one, but I would check to see if they do.

Good luck with this, I sure sounds like you are on to someting you can get your hands around now.

Don

Foamaholic

My Feedback: (1)

Also check the tx battery to see if the it plugs in tightly. I have a radio that if I wiggle the tx battery wire the radio goes off. If I leave it alone it stays on. Kind of scary.

Campgems

Sorry, I'm stuttering[]

gkpain

My Feedback: (1)

What's a frequency monitor and where do I get one>??

I have a Hobbico Frequency Checker that doesn't pick up any hits on any channels. Is this the same thing>??

I'm sure our club doesn't have one but sounds like we should.

I now have heard a many stories of glitches at our field but no one has recorded any imformation on these glitching incidents.

Might explain alot to people at our field wth is happening to their planes, when they lose them and don't know why.

Thxs agin

Campgems

Ours is quite a bit different. It has a LCD screen and shows signal strength in a bar graph format off both sides of the frequency being checked. You have to set the channel you want to watch, your case CH53, and then you can see if there is any activity on it and also get a reading from your transmitter as to how close the band is. I'll not get out to the field until tomorrow. I'll grab some photos and post them. I'm not sure who makes it. I suspect it is an artifact of the days when the narrow channel was introduced. Maybe.

Don

tomlee

My Feedback: (1)

Two other things come to mind;

I have seen loose engine mounting bolts.or any metal to metal that is vibrating at all.

And, eliminate the switch from the circuit. Try plugging the battery directly into the receiver. We have some folks here getting the switch out of the equation in their large gassers.

Dood Luck!!!

gkpain

My Feedback: (1)

Ok folks got the answer for sure,

I flew my Eagle with a ch 52 TX and RX first thing this morning, I flew it twice to confirm and I did not see any glitching.

I then flew another one of my planes on channel 27 and did not see any glitching. So I took the ch 27 RX out of that plane and put it in the Eagle and flew it 3 or 4 times without any glitching.

I am convinced that ch 53 is getting an outside interferrence from some where at our field.

Heres the kicker, I found out today the large tower we can see in the distance is a radio tower for the county police department. Also on the other side of the trees surrounding the field is a county jail, a firing range for the county police, a juvenile detention center , a news paper and on and on.

If I had know all this info before hand I would absolutely bought spectrum or FAST radio equipment.

Well I was going to that anywyas on the next plane so mise well go ahead and convert now.
But who will take the ch53 stuff off my hands . I already got that handle .

Flying Geezer

My Feedback: (14)

But have you flown your 4 star on another frequency, yet?