Futaba's new 2.4ghz S-BUS...Outstanding!
04-13-2010, 11:11 PM
#1
Futaba's new 2.4ghz S-BUS...Outstanding!
Toledo attendees got to see it first hand but the video below tells it all.
Futaba's engineers have outdone themselves with this new S-BUS system. Minimal wiring, programmable or non programmable servos, a PC link for programming, plug extra batteries in where needed, 10 amp servo bus in the receiver, easily drives as many servos as your installation requires and all can be done with a 7 or 8 channel transmitter and the S-BUS eight channel receiver.
S-BUS is the answer to multiple servo installations. The video is large (193mb) so it takes a litle time to load.
Enjoy.
http://www3.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin...?&I=LNZKA3&P=G
**Changed the URL to one of the S-BUS servo pages. There is a direct link to the video either by clicking on the photo or the on-line video link just below it**
Dick T.
Futaba's engineers have outdone themselves with this new S-BUS system. Minimal wiring, programmable or non programmable servos, a PC link for programming, plug extra batteries in where needed, 10 amp servo bus in the receiver, easily drives as many servos as your installation requires and all can be done with a 7 or 8 channel transmitter and the S-BUS eight channel receiver.
S-BUS is the answer to multiple servo installations. The video is large (193mb) so it takes a litle time to load.
Enjoy.
http://www3.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin...?&I=LNZKA3&P=G
**Changed the URL to one of the S-BUS servo pages. There is a direct link to the video either by clicking on the photo or the on-line video link just below it**
Dick T.
04-14-2010, 12:41 AM
#2
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RE: Futaba's new 2.4ghz S-BUS...Outstanding!
ORIGINAL: Dick T. Toledo attendees got to see it first hand but the video below tells it all. Futaba's engineers have outdone themselves with this new S-BUS system. Minimal wiring, programmable or non programmable servos, a PC link for programming, plug extra batteries in where needed, 10 amp servo bus in the receiver, easily drives as many servos as your installation requires and all can be done with a 7 or 8 channel transmitter and the S-BUS eight channel receiver. S-BUS is the answer to multiple servo installations. The video is large (193mb) so it takes a litle time to load.
Dick T.
Dick T.
and
New Futaba 8FG posts 650 onward.
Alan T.
04-14-2010, 01:22 PM
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RE: Futaba's new 2.4ghz S-BUS...Outstanding!
ORIGINAL: GalenB
The link to the video is not working. Can you check it and correct if needed?
The link to the video is not working. Can you check it and correct if needed?
Here you go: http://futabarc.com/gallery/update.html
Doug.
04-14-2010, 03:01 PM
#5
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RE: Futaba's new 2.4ghz S-BUS...Outstanding!
The concept is good, but at this time a lot more needs to be done to improve connections and build in better protection as what readers may forget when they draw parallels to full size aircraft is the simple fact that full scale craft typically haveredundant systems, i.e. several complete buses.
. Subject has been an ongoing discussion in another thread, with consecutive posts as follows:
ORIGINAL: Renatoa
"A link that worked better for me:
http://at.robbe-online.net/rims_at.s...337&catprevid=
The one from original post led to home page.
Step by step, all was in RC, i.e. interoperability, is removed and the market is invaded with proprietary technology.
Obviously, everything in name of "progress" and "newer is better"
First was the 2.4GHz RC... now they attack the heart of system, how the Rx-servos communicates.
I think that the market should say a clear NO to this trend, and favor with the wallet the companies that develops new products based on open, well established, de-facto standards, not obscure proprietary, locked "innovations"
"A link that worked better for me:
http://at.robbe-online.net/rims_at.s...337&catprevid=
The one from original post led to home page.
Step by step, all was in RC, i.e. interoperability, is removed and the market is invaded with proprietary technology.
Obviously, everything in name of "progress" and "newer is better"
First was the 2.4GHz RC... now they attack the heart of system, how the Rx-servos communicates.
I think that the market should say a clear NO to this trend, and favor with the wallet the companies that develops new products based on open, well established, de-facto standards, not obscure proprietary, locked "innovations"
ORIGINAL: VinceHaworth
"fail ... so a break on the new 'S-Bus' cable means you can loose the lot, all the servos, batteries, gyros.
The S-bus is a large step backwards, epic fail.
"fail ... so a break on the new 'S-Bus' cable means you can loose the lot, all the servos, batteries, gyros.
The S-bus is a large step backwards, epic fail.
ORIGINAL: Iflyj3
There is nothing new about this method. It is called a multi-drop buss which has been used for years in factories etc. Automobiles are now using a distributed system called CAN which is a multi-drop system.
The only thing new is its used for RC servos.
Years ago I designed a RC transmitter using the same concept. Not new, just a new application.
There is nothing new about this method. It is called a multi-drop buss which has been used for years in factories etc. Automobiles are now using a distributed system called CAN which is a multi-drop system.
The only thing new is its used for RC servos.
Years ago I designed a RC transmitter using the same concept. Not new, just a new application.
ORIGINAL: Iflyj3
There is no doubt it is a good concept. However, I see two conditions that would bother me.
1) A break in one wire will kill the whole system.
2) What size wire must be used to handle the current required by all of those servos since they will be on the same circuit. - Iflyj3
There is no doubt it is a good concept. However, I see two conditions that would bother me.
1) A break in one wire will kill the whole system.
2) What size wire must be used to handle the current required by all of those servos since they will be on the same circuit. - Iflyj3
ORIGINAL: Wrend
Wow, look at that. People with negative opinions about something .
Thanks for the link. It was very informative...
...
Anyway, I'm not too keen on it. I'd rather have a normal high speed 10 channel Rx. The only real advantage of the S.Bus system that I can see is improved latency, and if the servos are S.Bus compatible. I'd rather not have to choose between using S.Bus hubs or proprietary S.Bus servos. I doubt Futaba will go the route of only using and supporting a proprietary S.Bus system. If they did, I think it would be a big mistake and force and lock out more customers than it would lock in.
That being said, there's nothing wrong with using a system like that for the added benefits that I mentioned, if someone specifically wants them.
For my needs/wants right now, I would much rather have a non S.Bus 10 channel Rx.
Wow, look at that. People with negative opinions about something .
Thanks for the link. It was very informative...
...
Anyway, I'm not too keen on it. I'd rather have a normal high speed 10 channel Rx. The only real advantage of the S.Bus system that I can see is improved latency, and if the servos are S.Bus compatible. I'd rather not have to choose between using S.Bus hubs or proprietary S.Bus servos. I doubt Futaba will go the route of only using and supporting a proprietary S.Bus system. If they did, I think it would be a big mistake and force and lock out more customers than it would lock in.
That being said, there's nothing wrong with using a system like that for the added benefits that I mentioned, if someone specifically wants them.
For my needs/wants right now, I would much rather have a non S.Bus 10 channel Rx.
ORIGINAL:- rcwings
"I agree. S-Bus may not be for everyone, and hopefully Futaba does not force us into it. I see some good uses for it. Good to know I may have some options as my planes get larger and more complex once the bugs get worked out. Remember Futaba did not force you into 2.4 if you wanted to stay with them, as their 72MHz stuff is still available to some extent....unlike some others that discontinued 72MHz line of products completely. Hopefully they take the same approach with S-Bus as they have done with the transition to 2.4GHz.
Speaking as one that jumped over to an 8FG from the dark side...well kinda sorta. I am thrilled with the radio, and look forward to all the new things coming!!! Makes this hobby all that more interesting.
"I agree. S-Bus may not be for everyone, and hopefully Futaba does not force us into it. I see some good uses for it. Good to know I may have some options as my planes get larger and more complex once the bugs get worked out. Remember Futaba did not force you into 2.4 if you wanted to stay with them, as their 72MHz stuff is still available to some extent....unlike some others that discontinued 72MHz line of products completely. Hopefully they take the same approach with S-Bus as they have done with the transition to 2.4GHz.
Speaking as one that jumped over to an 8FG from the dark side...well kinda sorta. I am thrilled with the radio, and look forward to all the new things coming!!! Makes this hobby all that more interesting.
04-14-2010, 06:10 PM
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RE: Futaba's new 2.4ghz S-BUS...Outstanding!
Well, I can't wait to try it.
For some reason you failed to copy the good comments from those threads as well, I wonder why?
Lots of airplanes, Helis and jets are flying for years now with no redundancy, with single batts, single switches, single receivers and receivers with single antennas (no diversity) and what happens if the single antenna breaks? I've seen plenty of those.
Like I said, I can't wait to try it with some of my models.
Doug.
For some reason you failed to copy the good comments from those threads as well, I wonder why?
Lots of airplanes, Helis and jets are flying for years now with no redundancy, with single batts, single switches, single receivers and receivers with single antennas (no diversity) and what happens if the single antenna breaks? I've seen plenty of those.
Like I said, I can't wait to try it with some of my models.
Doug.
04-14-2010, 06:24 PM
#7
RE: Futaba's new 2.4ghz S-BUS...Outstanding!
ORIGINAL: DougV
Well, I can't wait to try it.
For some reason you failed to copy the good comments from those threads as well, I wonder why?
Lots of airplanes, Helis and jets are flying for years now with no redundancy, with single batts, single switches, single receivers and receivers with single antennas (no diversity) and what happens if the single antenna breaks? I've seen plenty of those.
Like I said, I can't wait to try it with some of my models.
Doug.
Well, I can't wait to try it.
For some reason you failed to copy the good comments from those threads as well, I wonder why?
Lots of airplanes, Helis and jets are flying for years now with no redundancy, with single batts, single switches, single receivers and receivers with single antennas (no diversity) and what happens if the single antenna breaks? I've seen plenty of those.
Like I said, I can't wait to try it with some of my models.
Doug.
Any new technology in our hobby is always met by doubters and some points are good for thought. However the proof will be in the reliability and Futaba has far more successes than failures.
The comment about 'one broken wire can kill the system' is really a moot argument as that occurs now with any system. I run dual airborne systems now in my 33%'ers and can still do the same with S-BUS. A lot fewer wires for sure and the redundancy I want.
04-14-2010, 06:59 PM
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RE: Futaba's new 2.4ghz S-BUS...Outstanding!
I also like the idea that if you have a 14 channel radio (like the 12FG, 12Z and 14MZ), that you don't need to get a 14 channel rx to get 14 channels.
Serial Bus technology has been around for a good while now, Its about time that we get to use it with our models.
JMO,
Doug.
Serial Bus technology has been around for a good while now, Its about time that we get to use it with our models.
JMO,
Doug.
04-14-2010, 07:09 PM
#9
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RE: Futaba's new 2.4ghz S-BUS...Outstanding!
ORIGINAL: DougV <snip> For some reason you failed to copy the good comments from those threads as well, I wonder why? <snip> Doug.
<snip> Doug.
If readerssimplysearch "Futaba S-Bus" there are more than one thread on the topic where every post shows a high level of concern,similar to those quoted, for which an answer is awaited.
Not bagging as the concept is good,simply highlighting the need for much more information regarding S_Bus redundancy and better connectorsto those shown before system is released.
Alan
04-14-2010, 07:53 PM
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RE: Futaba's new 2.4ghz S-BUS...Outstanding!
I was at Toledo and was in the first presentation. Funny, they billed the seminar as "Futaba Programming" and once the seminar started, they announced the "real" topic was the S.BUS. Several people got up and left, but I'd say most stayed.
The only concern mentioned was the relatively thin wire for power that served the entire system. The presenter (forgot his name, but he's in most of the videos) said that it would handle 8 amps, and that the stall current for FUT's largest servo was only 2 amps. Still, he acknowlegded the concern that most modelers would have, and strongly hinted (in my opinion) that FUT would be coming out with larger gauge wiring.
The programmable servos were nice. String a few together with the same channel number for large control surfaces and eliminate multiple Y connectors or "match boxes". The prog servos could even set set for different speeds, etc.
Personally, I think they have a winner. No doubt they will come out with different hubs and/or specialized wiring harnesses (or the user will make his own) which can REALLY cut down on wiring. The presenters also hinted at this would be part of an expanding "system" that (again, in my opinion) would encompass more than just servos and RXs.
Now, the only downside I can see to this ..... is that I hope Futaba will be ready for the onslaught of "that S.BUS caused my plane to crash" if the pilot accidently programs a servo wrong, or simply crashes his plane and decides to blame the last equipment he installed.
I think the S.BUS is a great idea... I will certainly be using it when it comes out, but - like the 2.4 stuff that came out - it will require a new set of skills to use properly.
Best... Roger Parrett
The only concern mentioned was the relatively thin wire for power that served the entire system. The presenter (forgot his name, but he's in most of the videos) said that it would handle 8 amps, and that the stall current for FUT's largest servo was only 2 amps. Still, he acknowlegded the concern that most modelers would have, and strongly hinted (in my opinion) that FUT would be coming out with larger gauge wiring.
The programmable servos were nice. String a few together with the same channel number for large control surfaces and eliminate multiple Y connectors or "match boxes". The prog servos could even set set for different speeds, etc.
Personally, I think they have a winner. No doubt they will come out with different hubs and/or specialized wiring harnesses (or the user will make his own) which can REALLY cut down on wiring. The presenters also hinted at this would be part of an expanding "system" that (again, in my opinion) would encompass more than just servos and RXs.
Now, the only downside I can see to this ..... is that I hope Futaba will be ready for the onslaught of "that S.BUS caused my plane to crash" if the pilot accidently programs a servo wrong, or simply crashes his plane and decides to blame the last equipment he installed.
I think the S.BUS is a great idea... I will certainly be using it when it comes out, but - like the 2.4 stuff that came out - it will require a new set of skills to use properly.
Best... Roger Parrett
04-14-2010, 08:43 PM
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RE: Futaba's new 2.4ghz S-BUS...Outstanding!
It looks interesting, I don't know how much of a demand there will be for a simple 4 channel plane, but I also think Futaba is getting away from the entry level stuff and going more towards higher end equipment. I would be interested in the price points.
04-14-2010, 08:52 PM
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RE: Futaba's new 2.4ghz S-BUS...Outstanding!
The receiver is the same price as the regular R6008HS, http://www3.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin...24&C=CADCEG&B=
Doug.
Doug.
04-14-2010, 09:25 PM
#15
RE: Futaba's new 2.4ghz S-BUS...Outstanding!
Currently announced S-BUS items with pricing and availabilty are on this page of Tower's "Just Announced" web page.
http://www3.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin...24&C=CADCEG&B=
http://www3.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin...24&C=CADCEG&B=
04-14-2010, 09:53 PM
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RE: Futaba's new 2.4ghz S-BUS...Outstanding!
Here's another unit coming from Futaba.
Page 100 here: http://www.rcmarket.org/ProductManua...010English.pdf
"This Twin battery power supply (battery backer)
is primarily configured for S-BUS receivers and
servos, standard servos and electronic devices
may also be connected using the PWM-Adapter.
The major advantage of the S-BUS system is that
only a 3 core cable is needed to connect the twin
batteries to the receiver and also carry the signals
for upto 18 channels from the receiver to
the servos."
Doug.
Page 100 here: http://www.rcmarket.org/ProductManua...010English.pdf
"This Twin battery power supply (battery backer)
is primarily configured for S-BUS receivers and
servos, standard servos and electronic devices
may also be connected using the PWM-Adapter.
The major advantage of the S-BUS system is that
only a 3 core cable is needed to connect the twin
batteries to the receiver and also carry the signals
for upto 18 channels from the receiver to
the servos."
Doug.
04-14-2010, 10:27 PM
#17
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RE: Futaba's new 2.4ghz S-BUS...Outstanding!
ORIGINAL: DougV
The receiver is the same price as the regular R6008HS, http://www3.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin...24&C=CADCEG&B=
Doug.
The receiver is the same price as the regular R6008HS, http://www3.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin...24&C=CADCEG&B=
Doug.
As I said it looks interesting, there will no doubt be some significant changes in radio gear in the next few years.
Jon
04-15-2010, 05:48 AM
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RE: Futaba's new 2.4ghz S-BUS...Outstanding!
ORIGINAL: Minnreefer
I could be mistaken, I know that Futabe rx are expensive but is $139 the going price for a Futaba 8 channel rx? I don't have Futaba and jsut bought a Hitec Aurora, but I have a very tight budget so Futabe was out of my price range.
As I said it looks interesting, there will no doubt be some significant changes in radio gear in the next few years.
Jon
ORIGINAL: DougV
The receiver is the same price as the regular R6008HS, http://www3.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin...24&C=CADCEG&B=
Doug.
The receiver is the same price as the regular R6008HS, http://www3.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin...24&C=CADCEG&B=
Doug.
As I said it looks interesting, there will no doubt be some significant changes in radio gear in the next few years.
Jon
There is also no doubt that if the S-Bus concept is a "winner", then it will be emulated (and improved upon) by other manufacturers as well, just like all the good stuff that comes out that people like is emulated by other manufacturers.
04-15-2010, 06:18 AM
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RE: Futaba's new 2.4ghz S-BUS...Outstanding!
I happen to catch the S. Bus video that was either streamed or linked by the folks sending Toledo pics to us stay at home crowd. When you combine the concept, soon to be available, nobody knew about it or leaked it and reasonable pricing I sure think Futaba deserves a 'nicely done'. Futaba needs my input like they need a hole in the head but, why should I let that to stop me, please Futaba, spend some time and the money to have the manuals written by someone with English as a first language. I love my 14MZ but, I sent the manual to Tim Geitner and told him it was a primer on how to use Turbo Tax to mazimize his next year return - he has not sent it back. 
Howard
Howard
04-15-2010, 08:01 AM
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RE: Futaba's new 2.4ghz S-BUS...Outstanding!
ORIGINAL: Minnreefer
I could be mistaken, I know that Futabe rx are expensive but is $139 the going price for a Futaba 8 channel rx?
I could be mistaken, I know that Futabe rx are expensive but is $139 the going price for a Futaba 8 channel rx?
11-27-2010, 11:43 AM
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RE: Futaba's new 2.4ghz S-BUS...Outstanding!
Dad upholstered the seats for the Stinson. I installed the Futaba S-bus system for the wing servos. We now have just one servo wire to each wing and control the flap, headlight and aileron servos.
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BCgFjOdBVGg[/youtube]
If you’d like to follow our build, see the Stinson Reliant Build thread on the CCRCC website:
[link=http://www.ccrcclub.org/Forum/tabid/58/forumid/4/threadid/69/scope/posts/Default.aspx]Stinson Reliant Build[/link]
Damon
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BCgFjOdBVGg[/youtube]
If you’d like to follow our build, see the Stinson Reliant Build thread on the CCRCC website:
[link=http://www.ccrcclub.org/Forum/tabid/58/forumid/4/threadid/69/scope/posts/Default.aspx]Stinson Reliant Build[/link]
Damon
11-28-2010, 04:15 AM
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RE: Futaba's new 2.4ghz S-BUS...Outstanding!
i have no doubt S-bus will b brilliant. Couple the hubs to telemetry sensors and you have the most intelligent system monitoring system bound to the most robust rf link.To the naysayers, i will borrow a line Audi used in US in 90 when their 4WD race cars cleaned up; "Limitation is the sincerest form of flattery"I find it odd that detractors of the s-bus can form negative opinions on a technology that futaba uses in its industrial machinary reliably. The track record of Futaba says do it safely and reliably or not at all.The opportunites the system bus opens is enormous. Pity some can't open their minds.
11-28-2010, 08:39 PM
#23
RE: Futaba's new 2.4ghz S-BUS...Outstanding!
TimBle,
I am a long-time 14MZ user, converted to their 2.4 as soon as it came out, and it works flawlessly for me. I was intrigued by the S-Bus when it came out, but I honestly can't think of a real problem that it solves. Ok sure, nice to have one connector vs. 2 (or 3) to each wing, and one wire to the tail, but is that it? Seems like it is. Plus the guys most likely to see this benefit, big 3D planes and jets, won't have any interest in the skinny little wires they offer now.
Please .. help me understand what potential benefits I am missing! How does it benefit telemetry? Seems like that is its own value proposition. Honest .. I really want to think this is a good thing, I must just have my imagination stuck...
I was tempted to set up my next jet (a small Panther) with the S-Bus system but once I add up all the hubs and servo converters just to gain the wiring simplicity benefit (one for each wing, one for the tail), it costs an awful lot more than a 6014, and gains darned little. Maybe a little more attractive when all the servos are S-bus compatible, but that will take a while, and I depend on the diversity of the size + power they offer today.
Dave McQ
I am a long-time 14MZ user, converted to their 2.4 as soon as it came out, and it works flawlessly for me. I was intrigued by the S-Bus when it came out, but I honestly can't think of a real problem that it solves. Ok sure, nice to have one connector vs. 2 (or 3) to each wing, and one wire to the tail, but is that it? Seems like it is. Plus the guys most likely to see this benefit, big 3D planes and jets, won't have any interest in the skinny little wires they offer now.
Please .. help me understand what potential benefits I am missing! How does it benefit telemetry? Seems like that is its own value proposition. Honest .. I really want to think this is a good thing, I must just have my imagination stuck...
I was tempted to set up my next jet (a small Panther) with the S-Bus system but once I add up all the hubs and servo converters just to gain the wiring simplicity benefit (one for each wing, one for the tail), it costs an awful lot more than a 6014, and gains darned little. Maybe a little more attractive when all the servos are S-bus compatible, but that will take a while, and I depend on the diversity of the size + power they offer today.
Dave McQ
04-14-2011, 07:04 AM
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RE: Futaba's new 2.4ghz S-BUS...Outstanding!
Hey SBus is a waste of money. I was looking forward to the rumors 12 months ago thinking Telemetry would be in the 8FG, and now they have super programing but no Telemetry. I guess sbus is where it is at for some people. I will not buy buy it. It is not cost affective for me.