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Eindecker EIII

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Old 12-12-2012, 06:17 PM
  #1
R/C Art
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Default Eindecker EIII

I'm back! This time i will be building a 1/3 scale Fokker Eindecker EIII. This is a fun scale plane, with the emphasis on "fun".

The kit is being offered by a new company, The Historic Aircraft Modeling Company.

I have received most of the parts and have started going through them. I will take some pictures, try to get organized and then start gluing some wood later on this week.
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Old 12-12-2012, 06:27 PM
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Default RE: Eindecker EIII

The parts are laser cut and very nicely done.
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Old 12-12-2012, 06:31 PM
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Default RE: Eindecker EIII

more pics
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Old 12-12-2012, 08:53 PM
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Default RE: Eindecker EIII

My name is Larry Folk and I would like to introduce myself and my company since Art is building the prototype of my Eindecke EIII. I have been a modeler for over 50 years and primarily fly scale.
Since 2000 I have flown competitively in scale events such as local Scale Masters qualifiers, Scale Masters Championships and Top Gun. I also have been the CD for several local scale events.

My primary business is my own architectural firm here in Ohio. For the past 30 years I have been creating all of my architectural work with a 2d cad program. About 2 years ago I decided to create some scale aircraft plans using my cad program. I soon decided that a better way was to create everything in 3d and since I had a laser machine for my architectural practice, for architectural models, I could cut my own kits.

When I attend scale events there is always the discussion about where the builders are. What I want to create are kits that have a true scale outline, easy to build and can be tackled by someone that has built and flown some ARF's but is ready for that first build. If you follow some of the build threads on the forums I think that a new builder can become very intimidated by what they see and read.

This has led to the creation of “The Historic Aircraft Modeling Company”. My process is to work from actual full scale plans or the best documentation that I can find. I work from these drawings and create all of my drawings as 3d files. From these I can export directly to the laser for cutting. Whatever we can't cut with the laser I have access to a 48”x96” CNC machine.

I decided on producing the Eindecker first as I wanted something for Dawn Patrol flying, simple to build and be an easy flier. This aircraft is 1/3 scale (135” wingspan) and is designed as a Fun Scale event type of plane. The wings slide on with a tube and to keep it simple it has ailerons and a non-flying tail. The wing has a flat bottom airfoil with a cord of 23.5”.

Here are some photos of the design done with the 3d program.

Thanks,

Larry Folk
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Old 12-12-2012, 09:31 PM
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Default RE: Eindecker EIII

Larry, it looks very well designed, and it's good to see that the outlines are based on the Nieto EIII drawings. Definitely a step up from the BUSA or SR Batteries Eindeckers..and at 1/3 scale to boot. And Art, with his experience, is the perfect builder for the prototype.
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Old 12-12-2012, 11:19 PM
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Default RE: Eindecker EIII

Hi Larry,
that's a really good lookin airplane you got there. it really looks like the parts will all drop into place for a pretty fast build. I like the way you decided to set the flying surfaces up as more conventional. here in Guam i mostly fly for myself and I'm definitly interested in your plane. I'll follow the build and see how it gets set up for flight. I currently fly a 1/12 scale e111 for fun and dawn patrol every weekend..the size you made is pretty cool..


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Old 12-13-2012, 08:44 AM
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Default RE: Eindecker EIII

Abu,

Thanks for the comments. I did use the Nieto drawings but this is still going to just be a fun scale airplane. I have several other aircraft in the design stage, WWI and classics.
All of which can be for competition events, if finished that way by the builder.
Working on a half scale Nieuport 11 for the 2014 Dayton Dawn Patrol.

Guamflyer,

Thanks for your interest. I am really working hard to make all of my designs easy to build so first time builders can be successful building.

Larry
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Old 12-13-2012, 08:57 AM
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Default RE: Eindecker EIII

Hi Larry and Art,

Great project, I look forward to following your build thread. Have you decided yet how you'll be powering it?

Congratulations on your new venture!

Rusty
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Old 12-13-2012, 09:22 AM
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Default RE: Eindecker EIII

Quote:
ORIGINAL: CubCrafter
Thanks for the comments. I did use the Nieto drawings but this is still going to just be a fun scale airplane.
I'm impressed that the fuselage is the correct length and width, that the wing has a scale outline and is in the right place, that the tail feathers appear to be the correct size (even if they're non-flying), and that the nose/cowl is a scale length and width. Those features alone make your design vastly more scale than 99% of the eindeckers seen. More experienced builders probably wouldn't have any problem converting the tail feathers to full-flying versions. I can understand your decision to use an orthodox airfoil with ailerons, since only serious builders are going to be up to the task of incorporating a wing-warping system and all the functional cables and rigging that entails.
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Old 12-13-2012, 11:08 AM
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Default RE: Eindecker EIII

Hi Larry

Do you have a website? ( where can i buy the kit ?)

Regards
Viggo
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Old 12-13-2012, 11:18 AM
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Default RE: Eindecker EIII

Hi Viggkri,

No web site just yet but it is in the works.

Will be selling thru the web site as soon as we have everything ready.

Thanks,

Larry
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Old 12-13-2012, 11:20 AM
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Default RE: Eindecker EIII

Rusty,

Power could be a G62, GT80, DA85 or DLE60.
The cowl is 14" in dia.

Larry
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Old 12-13-2012, 11:34 AM
  #13
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Default RE: Eindecker EIII

Does the kit include a cowl?
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Old 12-13-2012, 12:00 PM
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Default RE: Eindecker EIII

My thinking on the kits is that everything should be included to frame up the plane and would include building hardware.
A fiberglass cowl and wire landing gear would be part of the package.

The standard gear will be 1/4" and 3/16" wire similar to the 90" BUSA kit.
An alternate gear could be offered using the GTM aluminum struts.

I think that someone building a kit the first time needs to have everything included to make for a better building experience.

My final kit costs have yet to be set but the cost will need to be reasonable and with enough profit to make it all worth while.

The only extras would be covering and finish, radio and engine.

Larry
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Old 12-13-2012, 01:24 PM
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Default RE: Eindecker EIII

Larry,

Even better would be a Robart or other gear manufacturer gear option. Many builders these days shy away from kits that require soldering, and even a fun scale Eindecker gear is complex, a 1/3 scale version must have shock absorption, plus at that size, welds or joins take a good bit of pounding. I would also see if any commercially available metal cowl might work. 

Looking forward to this build.

Whit
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Old 12-13-2012, 02:27 PM
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Default RE: Eindecker EIII

i am subscribing to this thread.
i would be very interested in this kit if you plan on making full flying tail and wing warping version
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Old 12-13-2012, 07:50 PM
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Default RE: Eindecker EIII

Hi Larry,
I really feel that you're on point about making your planes easy builds for anyone. that hard builds or planes designed for the experienced builders really scare the first time guys..It's large enough so that ,as one of the guys mentioned we could modify if so inclined. I see that you've got a n17 in the works..truely interested guy here..mostly scale is cool with me.. I just want to see the plane I built fly past me... Keep goin Bro... When you're ready I'll order.. by the way , will these planes convert to electric fairly easy?
Thanks...Love your stuff man....


SLOPE FAST - SOAR DEEP

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Old 12-13-2012, 08:13 PM
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Default RE: Eindecker EIII

It's pretty amazing that we've gotten to a point in RC scale where "first time builders" might consider doing a 1/3 scale model! [&:] But from what I hear, the bigger these WWI models are easier they are to fly. [8D]

Anyway, I'm looking forward to watching Art get on with his build.
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Old 12-15-2012, 01:24 AM
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Default RE: Eindecker EIII

Nice project [8D]

Looks like a good fun scale concept with scale outlines. I think this design has potentional for the scale flyer that not always want to take his full scale model out to the field but still want to fly scale.

One point for consideration: You should maybe call this a E.I instead of a E.III. You use the scale outlines and the big difference between a E.I and E.II/III is that by a E.I the cowl diameter is the same as the square fuselage frame. A E.II/III has a slightly larger diameter cowl (and engine) and have a little extension in fuselage width in front of the cockpit area. Difficult to explain for me but I hope you understand what difference I mean.

Looking forward to your build Art.
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Old 12-15-2012, 05:11 AM
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Default RE: Eindecker EIII

Quote:
ORIGINAL: Teus

Nice project [8D]

Looks like a good fun scale concept with scale outlines. I think this design has potentional for the scale flyer that not always want to take his full scale model out to the field but still want to fly scale.

Tues - that is exactly why I am interested in this plane! When I go to a dawn patrol event, it is usually a 2 to 4 day event, sometimes 5 days. With this much time involved, the weather sometimes rears it's ugly head - and who wants to subject his scale project in rough wind or risk getting caught in a down pour.......scale planes usually (for me) take a while to assemble and dissassemble. This model has two wing panels on a wing tube - release a couple of bolts and pull the wings off, slip it in the van or trailor and in 5 minutes you are buttoned up and have protected your model from any quick moving inclimate weather.

And yes the EI is a little smaller in several dimensions, with several suttle differences (I flew an EI in competition for several years), but this kit is of the EIII.

I'll work on getting some wood glued this weekend and post a few pictures.


Rusty, I have a Mick Reeves prop reduction drive that I might use with a G-62 for power.


Abu - I can't be wandering off into the giggle weeds on this project like I do on most of my builds. This is a proto-type kit builld and I have to stick to the plans. Thinking about it, that might be a really good idea!


wphilb - my old 1/3 scale EI that I flew in scale competition weighted 42+ pounds and used a rigid music wire landing gear. I never had any real problems with it. As with any big model, functional gear always enhances how the model handles rough landings, but as Balsa USA has proven over the years with their big pup it certainly isn't a mandatory requirement.
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Old 12-15-2012, 05:18 AM
  #21
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Default RE: Eindecker EIII

Quote:
ORIGINAL: R/C Art
...but this kit is of the EIII.
I agree. The kit's outlines are base on the Nieto drawings (as seen in the rendering above) and the Nieto drawings depict the EIII (thought I can't vouch for how accurate the Nieto drawings were).
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Old 12-15-2012, 09:42 AM
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Default RE: Eindecker EIII

Art , have fun with your latest project ! Progress is only achieved by gluing sticks together ! Over Thinking results in headaches ! [] and gluing yourself to your leg means a unplanned trip to the Emergency room ! [X(]
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Old 12-15-2012, 02:25 PM
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Default RE: Eindecker EIII

It's great to see another potential source for kits, especially WW1 kits.

I'd love to see a 1/3 scale Nieuport 11. It would be at the top of my build list.
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Old 12-15-2012, 03:00 PM
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Default RE: Eindecker EIII


Quote:
ORIGINAL: bokuda

It's great to see another potential source for kits, especially WW1 kits.

I'd love to see a 1/3 scale Nieuport 11. It would be at the top of my build list.

bokuda
I have been flying my own design 1/3 N-11 for the past two seasons. I am not a professional draftsman by any strectch of the imagination, but I have drawn up some workable plans for it. The outline is pretty good as it has won its class (expert, div II) at the Mint Julep in both 2011 & 2012. I placed 8th at the 2012 Scale Masters Championships. It is a pretty good flyer. There is a build thread here on RCU - it's a few pages back, but still viewable. If you are interested in a set of plans, pm or email me.
Cheers,
Art
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Old 12-15-2012, 03:16 PM
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Default RE: Eindecker EIII

Progress report: Fin and rudder

A brief discussion on the materials that Larry has chosen. The core is 1/8" (3mm) Baltic birch ply, laminated on either side with 1/8" balsa. Ribs are two laminatins of Baltic birch ply as is the control horn bed. Rudder post and rudder leading edge is 3/8" square aspen.

The stab and elevators are also of the same construction.

Here are some pictures.
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