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1-3 Scale Grumman F3F-2

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Old 11-06-2013, 09:00 PM
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ProfLooney
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Default 1-3 Scale Grumman F3F-2

Hey Guys I been working on plans for a 1/3 Scale Grumman F3F-2. Dave Johnson provided me with Some factory drawings and Peter Westburg drawings and I have been working on the plans for a couple weeks now. Dave is doing an F3F-1 in 3rd scale and I am doing the F3F-2 and after the Flying Barrel I want to see if I can find some accurate drawings for an FF-1 and am waiting on some factory drawings to finish my wildcat plans with folding wings.

My Intent is to do the FF-1 the F2F the F3F and the F4F plan sets as I would love to have a fleet of the early cats

Will Post some pics soon and catch ya up on the design. I hope to order my wood parts sometime next week and begin building.
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Old 11-06-2013, 09:19 PM
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Old 11-06-2013, 09:20 PM
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There are some pics of the Initial Lofts

and I have the top wing framing turned off in the next series to see better but the next are pics of the fuse
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Old 11-06-2013, 09:21 PM
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Old 11-06-2013, 09:22 PM
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and Now where I am working at currently the Gear setup

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Old 11-07-2013, 09:08 AM
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Well I got started last night but things werent right. I was using Daves design for basis but sincehis plane is slightly different than mine as it is a dash 1 and mines a dash 2 he has his formers in differnt place than mine.

I am using the Peter Westburg profile which shows the scale former locations and thats the way my formers are set up in the scale locations and his drawings match the locations on the factory drawings. so now I have to design mine from scratch so I started with the tire and the axle so that everything is lined up with the centerline of the gear as marked on the drawings. so the arm that locks them in place and the front "A" frames ill call them are lined up so today I will see how it goes. I always hate this part cause it takes so long to design to get it right

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Old 11-07-2013, 10:44 AM
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I had 1/4 scale plans at one time, The model is large at that scale. In fact, it was designed with a two piece fuselage.

I may have actual scale drawings of the gear.

The G-22 is my favorite aircraft as is the F3F-1.

I have a few started, but not that large.

I do have parts drawn at 1/5 scale, but not in vector format for laser cutting.

Be nice to see what you come up with.

Good luck!

Charles
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Old 11-07-2013, 11:16 AM
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Old 11-07-2013, 11:21 AM
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Old 11-07-2013, 11:22 AM
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Theres some of the drawings I am using figured I would share in case anyone needs good ref material
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Old 11-07-2013, 11:24 AM
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I've puttered around in drawing up some plans in CAD using those same 3 views. All I've done is trace some of those formers, and the fuse side view. Never really went anywhere with it though. Maybe someday I'll get back into it, and figure out how to make the gear. I wanted to get a 60" span, which is large enough in itself for a bipe.
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Old 11-07-2013, 11:29 AM
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well when I am finished I will be making a couple different scales for the plans. probably 1/3 1/4 1/6th and maybe something smaller but those 3 scales for sure for all my cat series even though the early ones werent called cats they all derived into the wildcat
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Old 11-07-2013, 01:36 PM
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Todays Updates

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Old 11-07-2013, 06:40 PM
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Add me to the list for a set !! My favorite warbird bipe! built a aristocrat models f3f years ago !! Never flew very well, but it flew.
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Old 11-07-2013, 06:47 PM
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Ok I got the main strut finished gonna call it a day have honeydoes tomorrow so tomorrow night will start on the lower "A" frame

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Old 11-07-2013, 07:23 PM
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FWIW, I have a set of plans for a Grumman J3F duck, which has a diagram of the landing that is similar to the F3F's.
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Old 11-07-2013, 08:55 PM
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are they charlie smiths duck? I got those but they not the same I saw someone designing a duck on here i am waiting for those plans to be finished looks nice
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Old 11-07-2013, 08:58 PM
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lookin good my friend!
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Old 11-08-2013, 07:17 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ProfLooney View Post
are they charlie smiths duck? I got those but they not the same I saw someone designing a duck on here i am waiting for those plans to be finished looks nice
Unfortunately, I don't remember. They are buried in my stash of plans. The ones with the retracts, I think, have a span of around 60". Are the CS plans the really big duck? I have those also.
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Old 11-08-2013, 11:37 AM
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they are like 58 inch wingspan but it comes out really heavy when built.

anyways guys I am waiting to hear on some info on the gear so I am going to continue on the tail feathers and lower wing so I can get my parts to the laser to be cut then back to the gear
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Old 11-08-2013, 06:54 PM
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Looney, you are to say teh least...prolific
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Old 11-09-2013, 01:53 PM
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Ok guys Honey do day since its sunny and warm out lol I mowed the lawn twice so that all the leaves are just dust now.

I talked to Dave today to check the tail feather setups so here it is

Both Wings are at 0 degrees incidence

Vertical Fin has a 2 Degree offset

and the Horizontal stab is set at the max of 4 Degrees Incidence.

the offset on the fin matches the full scale and the 4 deg incidence on the stab is top range of full scale. full scale was between 3 and 4 degrees.

Dave built and tested a smaller scale electric and did all the adjustments so he did the hard work and I am just glad to have him share his data.
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Old 11-17-2013, 03:17 PM
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Wow, some one has the same favorite biplane I do. I to have made the jump to a very large F3F-1 in 35% giving me a wing span of 132" and a fuse length of 8' 1,3/8 " I have already got a working gear that runs on 1/4 chain drive. still need some 9" tires and rims but I do have some cool drawings. The fuse will be fiberglass. Plug with rivets and panel lines is 80% complete. The first set of wings have been cut from foam all tail feathers built up old style.
Will try to post some photos over the next few weeks. Good luck with your project. I have had a blast making this all come together.
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Old 11-17-2013, 03:55 PM
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ill be back on it this week emergency came up at sons place and i had to babysit the 2 grandkids 1 1/2 and 3 1/2 so needless to say cant get any drawing done and so tired in bed at 10 lol which is weird I usually goto bed abt 4 am
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Old 11-18-2013, 08:18 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ProfLooney View Post
Ok guys Honey do day since its sunny and warm out lol I mowed the lawn twice so that all the leaves are just dust now.

I talked to Dave today to check the tail feather setups so here it is

Both Wings are at 0 degrees incidence

Vertical Fin has a 2 Degree offset

and the Horizontal stab is set at the max of 4 Degrees Incidence.

the offset on the fin matches the full scale and the 4 deg incidence on the stab is top range of full scale. full scale was between 3 and 4 degrees.

Dave built and tested a smaller scale electric and did all the adjustments so he did the hard work and I am just glad to have him share his data.

You might want to take a look at some other scale models before committing to a fin offset. Models fly much faster for their size than full scale prototypes, and thus rarely need fin offset. If you put the 2 degrees offset in the fin, odds are that you will reach final flight trim needing a few degrees of left rudder to "offset the offset".

Ditto for extreme horizontal stab incidence, although that can depend to some extent on the wing and stab airfoils. Have you identified your airfoils yet ?

Dick
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