mec

and after (first flight)

a scratch built R1 of a friend of mine

mec

a photo taken at a visit of the fiberclassics factory in nov 1999

the fully composite GeeBee in the showroom:

Ed

MEC:

Yikes ! ..... Besides the engine and firewall coming straight out thru the front of the cowl, can you tell us what else happened ?

Like what caused that ? ? ?

mec

we do not exactly know what happened by now.
in the meantime it was the third "first flight", always with the same result.
the take off was ok, but when the plane gained speed it was not possible to control it with the elevators. it was a steady up and down, suddenly the geebee started with a roll and it seemed the geebee liked most of all a knife edge flight.
a controlled landing was impossible.
the second flight took place with a modified CG, the third with a s-shaped airfoil (i think the 1:1 geebee had also s-shape, hope its the correct term).

maybe the desaster is caused by the position of the stabs lying in the shade of the wings and getting turbulences?
we do not believe in an uncorrect CG.
unfortunately i do not know the exact technical dates, cause as i mentioned above its the plane of a friend of mine.

mec

Ed

mec: That is truly a sad story. "the third with a s-shaped airfoil (i think the 1:1 geebee had also s-shape, hope its the correct term)."

I don't know what this means, the 1:1 had a modified M6 airfoil, and thats all that I know about it.

Your friend lost a really beautiful bird.

Jim

mec

hi,
second try:

the airfoil of the upper wing has in its upper contour a slight depression(?) in the last half, third, so that it imitates slightly up-elevons. in german we call this "S-Schlag Profil". what is the exact term in english?

my friend has now built the fiberclassics (for another friend )GeeBee with a 4 cylinder 150ccm engine (photo above) and its waiting for first flight.
his destroyed one, its a little bit smaler, is waiting for repair.

mec

Ed

"in the last half, third, so that it imitates slightly up-elevons. in german we call this "S-Schlag Profil". what is the exact term in english? " - mec quote

We would probably call that a reflexed airfoil here, sometimes used on Delta aircraft.

Jim

RC_Eflyer-RCU

I believe that the full size Gee Bee has an M-6 airfoil that is 65% thickness, so its a little bit thinner than the regular M-6

-Paul

Kregg

My Feedback: (45)

Jim,
Adrian did not give me exact details about what he has changed on his gear. He did indicate that it has made a dramatic improvement to its ground handling! I think he wanted about $40 just for the gear... but I believe it also included a new set of wheel pants and legs. He indicated that the original pants would not work with the new gear??? I have been reluctant to spend the bucks, but maybe I will take the plunge. I wanted to order the glass cowl as well.

TLH101

My Feedback: (90)

Here's an update on my NWHT R-2

Ed

Tell me, how long did it take you to progress this far ? And what kind of paint are you using ?

Jim

TLH101

My Feedback: (90)

Jim,
I think I have about 30 - 40 hrs actual working time, and about a 100 hrs, "just thinking about it" . I spent more time on wheel pants than the rest of the plane. All that is left to do is cover wing and paint trim on wing, add panel lines and details, then clearcoat. I am covering in 21st Century Prepainted fabric, and painting w/ Krylon.

Ed

TLH: What was the problem with the wheel pants ? And did open them up to allow wheel access ?

TLH101

My Feedback: (90)

Jim,
You have to join,& fill & sand & fill & sand............... , then you have to cut them in half again, to make acces to install, or remove wheels. I used #2 phillips flathead screws and counterbored the holes so they dont look too bad.

TLH101

My Feedback: (90)

Here'sa closer shot

Ed

Beautiful graphics, great photography, and when ya goin to fly it ?

Jim

rdcracer

My Feedback: (2)

Hey Guys
I ordered the Z model from Adrian Page last week I can't wait to get started. I have a few pictures of the full size plane in the Fantasy of Flight museum in Polk City Florida. Anyone wants them e-mail me. If you are heading to Lakeland for Top Gun in April the museum is just down the road.

Whzzzer

Hi Racer: Got a favor to ask yer. I'm gonna be interested in knowing from you if your new Page Gee Bee Z, contains his re-designed landing gear ? He has supposed to have modified it so that it now flexes forward like the Kyosho. One of the magazines that reviewed the Page, said that it landed mostly upside down ? It is said that his landing gear was a problem, and needed work ?

You'd be doing the Gee Bee fans a big favor if you could shoot a copy of his landing gear layout, and post it.

Let us all know - the Whzzz

Ed

" One of the magazines that reviewed the Page, said that it landed mostly upside down ? "

Hi Whizzer: In what month, and in what magazine was that Page Gee Bee Z reviewed ? I must have missed that one. Maybe you or one of our viewers, can advise me on what was said, or even send me a copy of just the review ?

I also didn't know that Mr. Page was re-designing the landing gear for this model. Maybe if he reads this, he would be kind enough to comment on how it was improved ?

Thanks guys - Jim

rdcracer

My Feedback: (2)

He just e-mailed me today it will be shipped tomorrow. I'll let you know about the gear. I have the article in question, it was in the December RCM Mag. If you subscribe to thier mag you can view online.

Ed

Thanks Racer: I just read the RCM review that you referred me to. It was landed 21 times by an "experienced" pilot. It stayed upright 3 out of the 21 ? I just don't understand this ? Maybe it was the runway surface ?

Don't let it scare you, my same size Kyosho has never been upside down. If Page copied the Kyosho LG scheme in his design change as rumored, you won't have any problems.

JUST IN > RCM Editor's Note: The kit manufacturer has informed us that the kit construction has now been simplified for easier assembly. Additionally, the landing gear has been moved forward and the R/C gear positioned lower in the fuselage to improve landing characteristics. It's always nice to see continued kit improvements!


Jim

Derrick-RCU

My Feedback: (1)

Seeing as how this thread is here and started I figured I could add to it with my Gee Bee Z build.
I originally bought plans for Adrian Page's GeeBee Z and then ordered the plastic from Adrian to scratch his Z, then I came accross a Hobby Hanger Kit of Adrian's Z (Prior to Adrian kitting them himself), and bought that. I am currently puitting that kit together. Check out: My Building board for pictures of my Z build this far....

As for magazine reviews, I don't always agree with them....A few friends have Z's built from the Hobby Hanger kit and they land right side up most of, if not all of the time.....

I was so happy with the way the Z is turning out that I went and ordered Adrian's R2 kit and just got it a few days ago....I can't wait to start that one!

Ed

Good comments Derrick. Just the kind that we like to hear. I'm sure that they are going to be benificial to the Gee Bee builders who have been posting.

Thanks - Jim Lynch

Adrian Page

I must take exception to the notion that I copied anything from the Kyosho version of the Gee Bee Z.
The design of my landing gear (good or bad) is 100 % my own, and came about some 4 years before Kyosho had the idea to kit a Z.
I get many emails asking about the changes I made to the gear on my Z so I will list them here and also the reasons behind the changes.
I designed the Z back in 97 and a construction article was published in 98. Shortly after, Hobby Hanger produced a kit of the plane. The kit was made by scanning my hand drawn plan and "vectorizing"it. This is not the ideal approch with reguards to parts fit. When I began to produce the kit on my own, I redrew the plan in CAD to improve the parts fit. I did not have time to do a major kit redesign at the time because I needed to get the kit on the market so I could eat. After my new business stabilized I redesigned the Z as I had wanted to for some time. I had found new, better pictures of the original and had listened to customers suggestions about changes they would like to see in the kit. The redesign was done to increase the scale accuracy and make assembly easier. No changes were made to the aerodynamics of the plane.
The biggest changes were the laser cut fuselage frame and the gear design. The new fuselage frame replaced 36 odd sticks you had to cut yourself with 4 laser cut parts. It's also a bit lighter. The landing gear was modified to allow the removal of the cross braceing structure which people found to be a pain to build. I added a torque link to the rear leg to do this. The gear was not moved ahead as reported in the RCM review of the old kit. The firewall was moved back 1/2" for scale reasons. This in effect moves the gear ahead, but it is in the same location on the wing. I also figured out an easier way to install the wheel pants useing the same parts as the old design.
The gear was also moved further apart to scale width. This was simply done for scale reasons...I've never had any trouble with the Z's ground handling new or old gear.
Do Z's flip on landing? They can...but I do considerably better than 3 out of 21 tries. The problem with the Z is that the plane is 34" long and the prop shaft is 12 1/4" from the ground. The plane should be landed with the throttle in a three point attitude.
One change that does help in preventing nose overs is to mount all the parts inside the fuse (radio, battery, servos) as low as you can get them. This lowers the CG so the weight of the parts can't help throw the plane over the top of the gear. Mounting the engine inverted would lower the CG even more. If anyone is really timid I have gear leg covers and shorter main gears that allow lowering the gear by 1" without changing the look of the plane noticeably.

Adrian

Derrick-RCU

My Feedback: (1)

Great response Adrian. Glad you could get online here to clarify a few things about your design.

To: Whzzzer One of the reasons I wouldn't hesitate to buy a kit from Page Aviation is because of the above posting. I have always found Adrian to be open and quick to respond to a customer question or complaint. Even when I first looked at his Z design and bought the plans to scratch it, I emailed him and asked a few questions, he was very prompt in answering them. I am personally not a big fan of Arf's but if thats your thing then you have the Kyosho but if you like to build then definately get yourself a Page kit.
Your original question about building or getting a GeeBee type aircraft to fly, but with limited building space, hopefully has been answered....
I don't think there are any other manufacturers or designers who make GeeBee's in the .40 to .60 size range.......

If you want to go 1/4 scale then I do have a set of Hostetler R2 plans for sale down in the for sale forums!