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Pilatus PC12

Old 11-20-2006, 02:34 AM
  #1  
oldtimer143
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Default Pilatus PC12

Hi everybody. I'm currently flying the Pilatus PC12 for my employment and am designing an RC model of the aircraft. Right now I have the plans about 50 percent completed, with all the major components done, but still some detailing to do. When finished, the span will be just shy of 2 metres (about 6 feet) and I'm planning on using an OS FX91 for power.

I'm looking for an experienced modeler (or more), who would like to collaborate on this project by building one from my plans and giving me any feedback on where I should change/improve them etc. This is my first serious digital design (although I've been building and flying models since the late 70's so I'm not a complete novice).

Additionally, as I'm in the process of moving all my worldly goods between two countries right now, I don't have much opportunity to build or fly, but I can get time to work on the drawings almost every day.

I'd be interested in eventually doing a fibreglass fuse and foam cores, but right now the design is entirely balsa/ply. As I have the real aircraft at my disposal to measure and photograph at will, this will be a fully scale design with no corners cut. Aerofoils and moments etc will all be as they should.

I'm even thinking about doubling the size eventually for a turboprop!

Serious offers only please. I'm happy to distribute the plans once they're finished, so that won't be a problem, but I'm really looking for experienced builder/fliers at this point to help out.

Cheers,
Greg
Old 11-27-2006, 01:25 AM
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Default RE: Pilatus PC12

Sounds like a great project The pc12 is a beautiful plane there was a brand new one up here at YBAF where i fly. What sort of winspan are you looking at?
Happy flying,
Sam
Old 11-27-2006, 01:36 AM
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oldtimer143
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Default RE: Pilatus PC12

Hi Sam,

The plans are just under 2 Metre wingspan right now, and I'm thinking of doing a smaller electric at around 600mm. Ultimately, I'd like to do a 4 Metre version with a turboprop, but that will have to wait until I can fund the engine....

Cheers,
Greg
Old 11-27-2006, 01:38 AM
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Default RE: Pilatus PC12

By the way, I've got a small blog at http://thommorfds.blogspot.com/ if you want to check out the full size PC12 that I fly. We actually have 7 that we rotate between Port Augusta and Adelaide, and they're all configured pretty much the same.

Cheers,
Greg
Old 11-27-2006, 03:32 AM
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Default RE: Pilatus PC12

HI Greg.......sounds like an interesting project...I am an aircraft engineer and have been flying models for round 30 years and have over 500 hrs flying time.Currently have a 6ft tomahawk near completion just the graphics to do and a 6ft zero ready to fiberglass and paint. A project like that would really be something to get ones teeth into.I like the idea of a fiberglass fuse,that is the way to go.I build and lay up all our full size aircraft bits at work, and in the weekends for models and home builds so glassing is no problem.Currently doing a RV 7 Home build.Would you be surplying the engine,as you mention of a size that you would use. pics of my Tomahawk and my Biplane,which I made a complete fiber front end. cheers
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Old 11-27-2006, 04:52 AM
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Default RE: Pilatus PC12

Greg,
The RFDS must be a great experience. Ive heard the stories about what types of strips you are able to land on. Its something that the jet guys could probably never do. Sounds like a good wingspan. It means that you can detail the plane slightly better and things like retracts look alot better on that size.

Mintie, How do you make the molds for the fiberglass. Do you have them CNC milled?

Sam.
Old 11-27-2006, 08:30 PM
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Default RE: Pilatus PC12

Hi guys,

Thanks for the replies. I'm looking to have some sort of cooperative effort, basically where we all work towards individual models of our own, but using my plans as the basis, and fine tuning them in the process so I can work out the bugs prior to making the plans and/or a semi-kit available to the general public. I'd not be supplying anything other than the plans initially, and we'd all have to fund our own models as we normally would anyway - by ourselves, but I'd be keen to set up a building thread and perhaps a website. I'm not looking to use anybody, or get anything for nothing - only to get a good plan to the modelling public wih the least mistakes or problems in the process.

This is only the first plan of what I envisage will eventually be a series. I'm particularly fond of civilian models as they are less common (everybody seems to have a P51 after all), and personally I'd prefer to design and build models of aircraft I've actually flown. This will limit be to a choice of 50 prototypes, more than enough to keep me busy for a few years.... Having said that, there are a bunch of aircraft I've flown that are very similar to each other and there'd be no point in building a model of everything. Nevertheless, I should be able to come up with five or ten useful and popular plans eventually.

Cheers,
Greg
Old 11-28-2006, 12:10 AM
  #8  
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Default RE: Pilatus PC12

HI Greg.....when the plans become available I wouldnt mind one my way if you can...Have to agree there are alot of build threads and some pretty good models but where are all the civilan models. This pc12 could be a very interesting project,can already see a fiber fuse,foam wing with a carbon spar, retracks.2m a good size for most detail. As you can see I try and put as much details as I can without going over board. models do tend to get a bit of hanger rash,and lots of the little bits do tend to get broken..The pic shows a 1/6 headset I made for my Tomahawk.




Sam.....I make up all my molds from many materials, foam,steel, wood, plaster,fiberglass....On.some of my models for a one off I use the waste system of white or blue foam and melt away when finished..that is only for a one off job. The cowl on the biplane in the pic was done that way. Other jobs I make a female mold which takes time ,then lay up in that for a male product.This method lets you make any number of the same bit.But you have to remember any imperfections in the mold show in the finished job.....have put up a pic of a female mold for a tomahawk fuse to fin fairing and the finished fairing This mold was taken off the factor plastic fairing on the plane and is made of fiberglass. A bit of work to get it right but now I can just lay up as many as needed.
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Old 12-03-2006, 06:04 AM
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Default RE: Pilatus PC12

Greg,
Whats the latest on the PC12?
Old 12-03-2006, 06:14 PM
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Default RE: Pilatus PC12

Hi all,

I've been busy with a new baby boy, but am now working on the plans again. I need to do some work on the retracts and servo placement and then I'll have a preliminary plan ready for critique. Next couple of days should do it I'm hoping, although I'm still a long way from finished as there are a bunch of details to be still put on the plan such as measurements and textures etc.

For those interested in building this model, I will provide any photos that you need of the actual aircraft and I can also supply the files needed to cut the parts. I still need volunteers to build this little beastie. How about it guys (and girls)?

Cheers,

Greg
Old 12-03-2006, 07:32 PM
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Default RE: Pilatus PC12

Greg,

You wouldn't happen to fly for Roll-Rite would ya?
Old 12-03-2006, 11:55 PM
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Default RE: Pilatus PC12

No, I fly with the Royal Flying Doctor Service of Australia. I've got a small blog at http://thommorfds.blogspot.com/ if you want to check out the full size PC12 that I fly. We actually have 7 that we rotate between Port Augusta and Adelaide, and they're all configured pretty much the same.

Cheers,
Greg
Old 12-04-2006, 06:31 AM
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Default RE: Pilatus PC12

Very cool job!
Old 12-07-2006, 07:06 PM
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Default RE: Pilatus PC12

Well, I finally managed to tidy up the drawing a little so I can at least present the fuselage for your perusal and critique. This is of course only a preliminary plan, but is at full size so you can print sections if you need. I'll have the wing plan cleaned up before Christmas and may even have started building by then if things go well and I get the time. Let me know if you want me to amail the file to you as I'm not certain I will master the file attachment to this message.

Cheers all,
Greg

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Old 12-07-2006, 07:52 PM
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Default RE: Pilatus PC12

Greg,
The plans look excellent, the only thing that come to mind was the C of G it looks like it could be a bit nose heavy dependig on where the servos are placed. What program are you using to draw the plans in ? The other thing that come to mind was the extensive lightening in the stringers These would be ok for a fiberglass version but im not too sure with using them on a built up and covered model of this size.

Sam
Old 12-07-2006, 09:59 PM
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Default RE: Pilatus PC12

Hi Sam,

Thanks for your comments. I'm using CorelDraw for the basic work and hoping to eventually transfer it into Inventor for 3D views etc. I wasn't sure about the lightening holes in the top and bottom spines myself, but I'd planned it originally for balsa and I started to wonder if 3mm ply wouldn't be better (with the holes). I planned for a 3mm balsa skin with glass/resin finish. Ultimately I'd like to do a full glass fuse with panel lines and rivets molded in but I've not a lot of practice with that and feel I should start with built up components.

As for the CofG, the PC12 has a VERY long tail moment and I was actually concerned that it may end up tail heavy. Although the engine is quite a long way forward, I didn't think I'd have enough weight there to bring it all into range of the main spar. I've planned a servo tray under the fin and rudder, although I am not certain if I'll use a bellcrank for the elevators, or a flexible rod. In any case, having the servos in the tail will make access pretty simple via the "hell hole" on the bottom of the fuse between the ventral strakes.

Every day I think I'm getting closer, but I realize there's soooo much more to be considered! Patience Grasshopper!

Retracts will be a little difficult as the PC12 gear is quite unique in its structure. I note that Robart is coming out with a new range of trailing link units http://www.robart.com/RoboStruts/500_Series.aspx[/link] that could probably have a dummy oleo fitted to the axle for a "close" copy. Alternatively, there may be a way to modify their Ercoupe trailing link units. Either way, the gear is quite distinctive and obvious to anybody who knows the aircraft, so it will need some thought.

Cheers,
Greg
Old 12-07-2006, 10:30 PM
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Default RE: Pilatus PC12

Greg,
Would you be able to get some photos of the undercarriage for me i will see what i can come up with. At school i have access to a cnc mill, normal milling machines and lathes so i could probably make some sort of custom retract, but the only problem is that im on holidays until the start of february. To sheet the model in 3mm balsa and then fiberglass it i think would be too much I feel that 1.5mm or 2mm sheeting is much more workable and with fiberglass over the top will end up stronger than it probably need to be. In High strees sections obviousely tou would use something alot stronger. I think that you should definately use 3mm ply for the top and bottom spines.
Sam
Old 12-08-2006, 05:24 AM
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Default RE: Pilatus PC12

Greg,
Check out this website for a great way to do you aileron servo linkages.

Cheers,
Sam
Old 12-11-2006, 08:02 PM
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Default RE: Pilatus PC12

Sorry its a bit on the large side, but you should be able to use these dimensions and photos. Let me know if you need any other views. We nearly always have an aircraft around to photograph.

By the way - what was that website you mentioned?

Cheers,
Greg
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Old 12-11-2006, 08:06 PM
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Default RE: Pilatus PC12

Ok, so that was too big.... Trying a lower resolution
Old 12-11-2006, 08:10 PM
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Default RE: Pilatus PC12

I'll reformat it as a .pdf and try again later.... Don't know why it isn't accepting a .jpg of only 136K
Old 12-11-2006, 09:24 PM
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Default RE: Pilatus PC12

http://www.irfmachineworks.com/rds/ This is the website i was talking about.
Hows it all going. I am looking at doing a C208B Super cargo master at the moment if i can find any cross sectional views of the fuse. Did you guess the shape of the cross sections on the PC12 or did you have an actual drawing of the cross sections. I usually taxi past this one when i go flying. Its a jetcraft cargo one done in toll ipec colours. nice looking plane. Go to this link to see the photo.

http://www.airliners.net/open.file?i...ext_id=0865096

Cheers sam.
Old 12-12-2006, 02:42 AM
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Default RE: Pilatus PC12

Hi Greg,

Your plans look incredably detailed.

I am also interested in modelling an aircraft I fly - how are you able to come up with such detailed plans?

Did you use a static model and take measurements, or did you start from a picture from a maintenance manual or such?

I am glad to hear you are using Corel Draw and not some fancy CAD program like I hear most people do - that is WAY over my capabilities and I was wondering how I would be able to come up with plans - i was even thinking of physically drawing them!

At the moment I am building my first model - a kadet senior. I am at the stage of sheeting with 1/16 balsa and I will be glassing and painting once i am done. I started the sheeting at the tail section as I have not done this sort of thing before and I am pretty happy with the results so far.
Old 12-12-2006, 03:31 AM
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Default RE: Pilatus PC12

Tasesq,
Programs like autocad are actually quite easy to draw in, and can be alot les time consuming once you know how to use it properly it would only take someone about a day playing around with it to work it out, and theres always the help menu to guide you. I personally havent used corel, but i have heard it is quite good. What aircraft are you interested in modelling. There isnt any problem with drawing plans from hand but it isnt always as accurate and involves alot more time and you cant just edit undo( but you do have an eraser ).

Cheers,
sam
Old 12-12-2006, 11:40 PM
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Default RE: Pilatus PC12

Trying again to upload images of the gear.....
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