mark fadely

Amazing series of shots Neil! You presented a poporri of new, old, fast and slow aircraft. On the subject of blurred props I think the amount that you are showing in your shots is very pleasing and you have a vailid point to show both blur and prop in the image. I have just gotten on this kick to show full disks and I think it comes from my helicopter shooting. I have also seen many nice full scale air-to-air shots where they show the full propeller disk blurred. I guess it's a matter of taste really.

Here is another ground shot of that Coast Guard Cessna on takeoff roll where the full prop disk is shown along with a motion blurred background which I think adds a lot to this picture.



And here is one of the helis showing a full disk

NeilHutch

Cracking shots again, Mark. That Cessna looks so bloomin' real - the guy who built is PDG[8D]

strega7

yes @Mark, the Cessna shot is really wowwwwww *thumbs ... do you have the exif for us?

strega7

... more dawn partol .... took the shots at the annual meeting of our German warbirdcommunity

Pub is getting some problems watch your six

strega7

.... and those (scratchbuilt) Fokkers



okay those ailerons ......





tacketacketacketacke

strega7

Heavy metal .... those Bolts



*argh 3-blader









4-blader yessssss







yes smoke is not scale, but its really awesome

Dwhart24

Wow! This thread has really taken off the past few days. My email is blowing up. Strega, Neil, and Mark, awesome photos! Mark, that last post with the Cessna and the heli are killer!

If any of you are ever in the central Florida area, look me up. I would love to hang out and have a drink, or 2, sometime.

Next week I will be at the Blue Max event. Hope to get some nice dawn patrol shots.

SunDevilPilot

Here are a few I have taken over the years.

Unfortunately I live in Arizona where 90% of the time the sky is nothing but blue...... Go with National Geographic's idea and "Bad weather makes for good photographs"and photography can be a little challenging to get something looking really great.

SunDevilPilot

hrrcflyer

This is an awesome thread. I just love all of the pictures of the full size and the R/C planes. Here are a couple of pictures of one of my favorite subjects. Hey Strega, you may recognize this plane?

Enjoy............

David

abufletcher

Strega, love those last two Thunderbolt photos! Regarding the eindecker though, while you've got some very nice dynamic "action" photos, the non-scale features of the model are jut too annoying for me to ignore. While it may be a case of the pot calling the kettle black, I ask myself why the very same non-scale errors are seen again and again and again and again and again and again on virtually every eindecker model we ever see. It's like the non-scale model has actually taken over and become more real than the original. Two of my eindecker pet-peeves are a larger than scale rudder and a machine gun just glued on the top deck (instead of embedded into it). Why can't people who go to the effort of doing such a good job otherwise get these simple things right?

Similarly, I really like your framing and photography of the DrI, but the model itself is little more than sport scale. So we're back to the basic dilemma of this thread: Is it about great photography of so-so models or about so-so photos of great models?

rcphotog

Hey Don,
This thread has degenerated ( from the original idea, intent and "Spirit" ) so much these past few days, who cares anymore? ....really .....who cares?[:'(]

It seems that it's more important to post quantity than quality and to keep the thread moving and to be popular than to be faithfull ( and respectfull ) to the original creator's idea.

...

BTW, you started a thread a couple years ago that was for sharing ideas for photogaphy of models. It was a good idea.

....I've been pounding my head on the desk so much at these MODEL shots, that my head hurts.
....and pics of full size planes???? what the @&#^$**((@#@(#_**@)&(^&$^

Jaybird

The other challenge for WWI aircraft besides the spinning rotary engine is a realistic pilot. The close up photos of the Camel are great but the "stuffed" pilot is pretty obvious. There is so much of the pilot exposed in these and other open cockpit planes that it can sometimes be a spoiler for on otherwise believable shot. The heavy metal guys don't get it any easier as a couple of the shots posted again are spectacular but a close look at the pilot shows he has no eyes or again has a stuffed or plastic look. It may be how you choose to photgraph that makes a difference or a larger plane to pilot size might help too.

I actually like the shot of the P-47 with the smoke...I think it's very realistic.

The Eindecker is a tough subject. I've only seen one model that seemed accurate all around and that was at Cole Palen's Old Rhinebeck Aerodrome. It's in the upper museum hanger and even has a complete radial engine. The pictures aren't for this thread, but at least give an example of what's involved. Most kits, especially the BUSA are a compromise of different degrees. Wing warping is a challenge as well instead of ailerons.

Here's a shot from the Jamboree in 2009 and 2010.

Jaybird

abufletcher

Argh!!!!!!!!!!! Except for that ridiculous INACCURATE "English turning" seen again and again and again and again and again and again on EIII models but which was NEVER used on any actual eindecker. All the modeler has to do is look at ANY actual photo of an EIII. I think modelers just WANT to try their hand at this so badly (and they know that it will elicit whistles at the field) that they just don't care that it's not right.

Oh, and that pilot must have put off a career in the NBA to fight for the Fatherland.

sweetpea01

My Feedback: (10)

Some of mine. I need to do some B+W to match the real ones!

mark fadely

Sorry, but I have to disagree with you here. Rather than degenerating I belive this thread is getting a bump of new life with new and existing enthusiastic posters. Ideas about how to make better scale images are being discussed. There is nothing wriong with positive critique but your sour attitude will do nothing but drive people away from this thread. If someone posts a model that you think doesn't fit then some constructive criticism would be much better than a rant like You've posted here.

Jaybird

Yes, sorry, I was going to mention the inaccurate machine turning on the cowl and sheet metal in my original post but thought that would be too much. I should have known better. And as I stated earlier, the pilot just doesn't cut it...but the engine sure does.

Jaybird

abufletcher

I agree with Mark. Lots of really great photos posted lately...most of which present a very believable impression of a full-scale aircraft. The thread isn't necessarily about creating a "model diorama" or "scale photos" (for example, those made to appear as period photos). It isn't even really about "good" photographs. You can have a horrible photo of a model (poorly composed, poorly exposed, badly focused, etc.) in which the model nevertheless looks like (a bad photo of) a real aircraft. Most of the photos on the last few pages have been outstanding or at least quite competent attempts to make a model look real. Some of the models (including my EIII) do leave something to be desired, but that's OK. The really great photographs motivate me to take better photos. And the really great models (and the critiques of the not so good ones) motivate me to build better models.

abufletcher

Actually, thanks for posting it. I do enjoy seeing a good model, and that's a generally excellent model, even if it has features I find "unfortunate." But you know, that's such a amazing engine (working model isn't it?) that you'd think the builder would be doubly eager to frame it with the right cowl.

G T

Hi Strega 7

Thanks for sharing the great T/bolt images,, i am a Jug man !!

Reverend

My Feedback: (3)

ok, definitely not the best shot among these partially really brilliant pictures (wahnsinn, deine Pics stregali ) heres a Picture of my Stuka I quite fancy.

abufletcher

Very nice...but what's the jumbo-monster ultra-secret weapon in the background? BTW, the black and white photo posted by sweetpea above demonstrates that even real aircraft were photographed from above looking down. That's tough to pull off with a model though.

Looking back and Stega's EIII photos, I have to say I really like the "story" of this one. It's so difficult to get two appropriate models together in the air, let alone lined up nicely. It's even more amazing that this aerial photo looks like it was taken from another aircraft! By the way, the photo was looking a little dark on my screen so I brightened it up a bit with the highlight/shadow function in PS. Now if only the builder hadn't just stuck the gun on the top!

Reverend

My Feedback: (3)

That is the Ãœbermesserschmitt BF-1900



No, seriously, the picture was taken in front of a hangar where they were restoring an ME-109 and while I was taking the pictures they opened the hangar door to wheel the 109 out. I had to scram and the only picture worth showing was the one with the half opened door.

So you see, even a picture with a story

abufletcher

Ach, ja, das super-duper extra-geheim Riesenjagdflugzeug! I should have guessed!

strega7

Huuuuuuuuh .... lets talk about scale and photography. At first "scale" ... you wont find a scale model which ist scale. If you want really scale, forget about all those heavy metal warbirds. At no plane I´ve seen, and these are a few, you will find correct panellines, correct rivet diameter, fuelcap-diameter, brakesystem and wheels ..... and-so-on-and-so-on-and-so-on. Talking about the Corsair. You will never find a RC-model with the original shape of, for ex., the cowling. Every series has another shape, diameter and angle. We are talking about the biggest propeller used on a single engine fighter, Diameter 4 meters. Most of the bentwings are scale 1/5, scale would be a diameter of 80centimeters (31 inches). Which engine offered on the modelers market would turn a 31inch-4-blade-propeller ??? The Moki 250 is one of the strongest radials, it wont turn a 31´´ 4-blade-propeller with enough power. The engine .... a poor 5-cylinder-radial ??? Lets talk about a doubleradial with 18 cylinders. There is not one to buy ? What a shame, so no photos with front view, someone could count the cylinders. I know two (!) nearly-scale models with the exhausts at the right place, will say at the original position. Yes you can see smoke coming out of the exhausts at the real plane. So, we should never try to take a shot from a model with model exhaust-position, cause its not scale ? Okay, no warbirds anymore, cause there are no scale warbirds, cause it is not possible to build one.

Lets talk about jets ... the same thing. Not scale. Look at the panellines, hatches, fasteners, brakesystem & gearsystem, hydraulicsystem, aerodynamic things as flaps and slats, airbrakes (at that case of course detailled airbrake interior), hardpointdetails, stencilwork, two engined birds with only one engine inside. Of course pilots with no eyes. **** hapens, we will only see some Hawks and F-16´s whilest flybye. Maybe a Scooter, there is a good basis from Composite ARF. All those other ships are not scale. And think about, to get all those scale gimmicks, we talk about good and deep scalework, forget all those scales smaller than 1/5. Smaller are toys and they are too small to place all those details. That means, the mighty F-15 or the good ol Smoker will measure a minimum (!!!) length of 3,5meters (about 140 inches). Okay, we have learned, jets are also dead, you will never get a beautiful scale-shot as you want.

The great war... here we are, here we go. Those Fokkers are having almost rotary engines ... good idea, there are only a handful available. The only Fokker with the possibility for a good scale-shot will be the D.VII. Propdiameter 2,8 meters (about 110 inches), will say in quartescale 27inches. Yiehaaa, which engine will you choose for a quarterscale D.VII ? A quarterscale D.VII needs a Zenoah 38 for scale flying. For that recommended scale-propsize you need a geardrive. What about the weight ? With a Zenoah 38 you will reach a weight about 26pds .... scale.. okay
There are some good replicas as the Sopwith Pub and so on. A friend of mine flies a Pub with a Moki radial engine ..... hewwwwww ... the Moki is only a 5-cylinder-radial and its not a "Umlaufmotor" ... not scale, burn the Pup for a scaleshot.
Result ? No scale aircraft of the great war, to small engines, no scale rotary engine, to small propdiameter. No scale shots ...

General aviation .... that works ... shots like that really awesome shot of the Cessna taxiing, that is scale. You can fit engines which will turn scale sized propellers. Undercarriage of most sportsplanes are simple, no hydraulics (2 or 3 hoses should not be the problem) . Okay Ive understand the message, in future we can only post some shots of Cessnas and friends, every other plane would not be scale enough.

Poor thread I think , but you are right. All, and I really mean all, of my shots are not (!) scale. The reasons are to be read above. Sorry but can me explain than somebody the reason for this "degenerated" thread ?

Just my 2 cents ....

as a closer the nonscaleshot of an awesome Fw190, scale 1/5 ... wrong propshape (the blades are too thin), the geardriven radiatorwheel (Luefterrad) in front of the engine is missing, swastika is missing (German law), tailwheel extracted, fuselage antenna is missing, ETC is missing, no blur out of the exhauststacks, at highspeed (this should be highspeed) the socalled "panzerring" cowlring should be opened for about 5cm (1,9inches)



but folks, the display was awesome, powerful, scale, fast and with that dark scale-rain-clouds nearly best of show.

abufletcher

100% scale is unobtainable. But a good 95% is probably doable on some aircraft types. It's all theater... The problem is that we modelers often know too much. It's like magicians watching magicians. I can pick apart most WWI aircraft, but won't notice even large errors on the WWII birds.