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  1. #201
    WacoNut's Avatar
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    RE: AMR 33% Waco YMF-5 Build

    I have a little tip for you guys,
    If you have used Robart hinge points you know it can be a pain to get the holes to match up on the 2 pieces you are hingeing together. The Waco has shaped hinge plates for the fin/rudder and the Stab/Elevator hinge lines. To solve any alignment isses take the hinge plates and tape them together and mark one end then mark your hinge point locations and drill through both pieces at the same time, once you have all the holes installed you can remove the tape and install the hinge plates. I use 3/16 dowel rods to temporarily hold the hinge plates together to assure I have then lined up with the flying surfaces while attaching the hinge plates. This will give you perfect alignment of your hinges for a very smooth operation. I will take some pics and post them.
    Anthony
    WACO Brother #30 Cub Brother #17
    It's not the hours you put in It's what you put into the hours.

  2. #202
    WacoNut's Avatar
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    RE: AMR 33% Waco YMF-5 Build

    I have the holes drilled in the hinge plates for the fin/rudder.
    I can now glue these to the fin and rudder then use the pre-drilled holes as a guide to drill the holes deeper for the hinge points and the holes will be in perfect alignment for the hinge points.
    Here are a few pics.
    Anthony
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    WACO Brother #30 Cub Brother #17
    It's not the hours you put in It's what you put into the hours.

  3. #203
    WacoNut's Avatar
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    RE: AMR 33% Waco YMF-5 Build

    I have completed the installation of the hinge plates on the fin/rudder.
    I attached the hinge plate to the fin 1st and once it was secured I added 2 dowel rods into the holes for the hinges and mated the rudder hinge plate to it. I then marked the location of the rudder to the hinge plate and glued the rudder in place. I am very happy with the results, the parts mate up nice and all the hinge holes are in perfect alignment.
    Here are a few pics.
    Anthony
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    WACO Brother #30 Cub Brother #17
    It's not the hours you put in It's what you put into the hours.

  4. #204
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    RE: AMR 33% Waco YMF-5 Build

    Anthony,

    Where'd you get the drill bushing? Does it have other bushing sizes?
    Also, what are you using for adhesive? You work very fast.
    Bob
    WACO Brotherhood #105
    ________________________
    \"If tho looseth airpeed beware, the earth will rise up and smite thee\"

  5. #205
    WacoNut's Avatar
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    RE: AMR 33% Waco YMF-5 Build

    Bob,
    The bushing is a Robart Hinge Point drill guide, is comes with bushing for all the sizes of hinge points. This tool is a must if you are using hinge points as it centers the hole on the center line of the part and keeps the drill bit straight.
    I am using elmers wood glue and I clamped the pieces together and tack glued in a few spots with medium CA and hit it with kicker. This keeps the parts secured while the elmers glue dries.
    If I remember right I only paid around $6 for the drill guide at the local H/S a few years back.
    Later!!
    Anthony
    WACO Brother #30 Cub Brother #17
    It's not the hours you put in It's what you put into the hours.

  6. #206
    germrb's Avatar
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    RE: AMR 33% Waco YMF-5 Build

    Anthony,

    Thanks! Gotta have one of those.

    I'm in the process of doing rib stitching on my Model 44 racer. I'm always interested in how others work. I've never been satisfied with glue marks and such. How do you do yours?

    I saw your comment to Richard about Koverall. Its certainly less expensive then Stits Lite ($6.75/yd), but the 45" wide always limited me. StitsLite comes in 60" width and continuous length. I usually buy 10 or 15 yards at a time. I'm going to buy some Koverall and do some comparisons. At $3/yd, its a bargin.

    Snow moving in tomorrow, looks like a great shop day.
    Bob
    WACO Brotherhood #105
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    \"If tho looseth airpeed beware, the earth will rise up and smite thee\"

  7. #207
    WacoNut's Avatar
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    RE: AMR 33% Waco YMF-5 Build

    I have never used the Stits so I can't compare,
    I used glue lines for the stitces on my 25% Waco and pieces of string for my 25% Cub, not sure how I will do this plane yet. I am not as fortunate as you retired guys and I have to go to work this morning[:@]. Work is always getting in the way of the important things like building airplanes.
    Later!!
    Anthony
    WACO Brother #30 Cub Brother #17
    It's not the hours you put in It's what you put into the hours.

  8. #208
    germrb's Avatar
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    RE: AMR 33% Waco YMF-5 Build

    Anthony,

    I remember! Work takes up entirely too much of your free time.

    While you were out trying to support your family, I put together a couple of photos of how I do stitching. To start with, "to each his own". I'm sure there are better methods, but this one works for me.

    #1 - Jig for making sheets. I used a piece of thick glass I got from a local window business. Usually, you can get odd left over pieces pretty cheaply. The nails are spaced 3/4" to simular 2 1/2" stitching @30% scale. Close enough. First, wax the glass otherwise you'll never get the sheets off. I use silkspan sheets and sandwich the thread in between them. Saturate the sheets with Balsarite or Sig Stix-it. Try to minimize the bridging around the threads. Once cure, cut the threads and peel off the sheet. Now you have sheets that will store forever.

    #2. - Cut the sheets into appropriate width strips. Paint each cap strip with adhesiive (I use Balsarite) and let dry. With an iron set at 250 degrees, attach the strips to the ribs. A pencil iron works best. Iron the strip between each thread. This attaches the thread strip and the fabric to the cap strip. On models this size, ballooning fabric can be just as bad as a full size aircraft. Now, the stitching is of a consistant width and spacing and bonded to the rib.

    #3 & #4 - Tape the strips and paint.

    This may sound like a lot of extra work, but once you have an inventory of stitching sheets, its really easy to install. For most large airplanes, two sheets will provide enough stitching. Obviously, you can vary the thread spacing and thick to match any scale.
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    Bob
    WACO Brotherhood #105
    ________________________
    \"If tho looseth airpeed beware, the earth will rise up and smite thee\"

  9. #209
    Big_Bird's Avatar
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    RE: AMR 33% Waco YMF-5 Build

    Bob, looks like a great way to do it.
    Ken
    WACO Brotherhood #70, Arlington TX home of the Dallas Cowboys, SupBowl45, Texas Rangers, World Series 2010, 2011

  10. #210
    WacoNut's Avatar
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    RE: AMR 33% Waco YMF-5 Build

    Bob,
    Thanks for the tip, I used a very similar method for my Cub. The tape I used over the stitch was too thick but other than that it worked great. I may have to revisit that method for this plane. I love adding the details, the problem is I never want to stop and call the model complete
    I did accomplish something today, I bought a drill bit index. I am getting tired of searching through several containers for the right bit. The one I bought holds #,letter and wire sizes from .040 to 1/2". It will probably take me 3 hours to sort all my bits out and get them in the index. It will be nice not searching for a drill bit, especially to find out the wife used it for mounting something and forgot where she put it[:@]
    Later!!
    Anthony
    WACO Brother #30 Cub Brother #17
    It's not the hours you put in It's what you put into the hours.

  11. #211
    kvlasblom's Avatar
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    RE: AMR 33% Waco YMF-5 Build

    That sounds really handy! (I have the samen problem with my drill bits)
    WACO Brotherhood #93
    Current project: 1/6 WACO SRE build from plans

  12. #212
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    RE: AMR 33% Waco YMF-5 Build

    Anthony, Kim and all,

    The drill index is a great time saver. I have individual indexes for the number, letter, fractional, forstner and other bits and keep them at the drill press. The ones I use at work (fractional, masonary, spade) are in their own indexes in the tool box in the truck. Having the 2 sets of bits keeps the shop bits sharper and complete. The work bits get abused, dulled and broken and I replace them often (the broken or dull bits).

    You can spend a lot of money on bit and indexes or you can go cheap. Harbor Frieght (has a combo set with #, letter and fractional in one box) is one place, Wood Workers Supply, McMaster-Carr are others. Wal-Mart and the big box store have sets and replacement bits. Check you local area (phone book) or online search. Micro Mark has the very tiny #60-80 bits in sets, but I haven't used those bits in years.
    John F Howard (aka skylarkmk1)
    AMA 10955, WACO Brotherhood #26, AWC, NWC

  13. #213
    WacoNut's Avatar
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    RE: AMR 33% Waco YMF-5 Build

    Well I have my drill index all squared away and I will get back to work on the Waco tonight,
    Working these 10 hour shifts doesn't leave much time during the week and working 6 days a week juts doesn't leave anything but at least I still have work so not complaining too much!!!
    I hope to finish up the tail feathers this weekend, I still have not received the tail gear from Robart. I will be in big trouble If I do not get the tail strut before the Holidays as I need it to continue on with the fuse.
    Later!!
    Anthony
    WACO Brother #30 Cub Brother #17
    It's not the hours you put in It's what you put into the hours.

  14. #214
    WacoNut's Avatar
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    RE: AMR 33% Waco YMF-5 Build

    Finally back to work on the Waco,
    I mounted the Fin to the fuse, I have the edges of the fin and rudder sanded to shape. I built the Stabs and Elevators this morning and I have them dry fitted to the fuse on the aluminum and glass joiner tubes. The Stabs are removeable and each one is held in place by 2 set screws as well as the flying wires. This will make it much easier to get the monster out of my basement.
    Here are a couple pics of the progress.
    Anthony
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    WACO Brother #30 Cub Brother #17
    It's not the hours you put in It's what you put into the hours.

  15. #215
    WacoNut's Avatar
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    RE: AMR 33% Waco YMF-5 Build

    I now have the tail feathers finished up,
    I like the setup with the removeable Stabs, everything slips together easily but snug. Once I receive my Robart tail wheel strut I can get it installed and continue on with the fuse. It should start looking like a Waco soon.
    Anthony
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    WACO Brother #30 Cub Brother #17
    It's not the hours you put in It's what you put into the hours.

  16. #216
    WacoNut's Avatar
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    RE: AMR 33% Waco YMF-5 Build

    A little bit of a relief, I received the Robart strut today and it looks like it will suite my needs well.
    It is alot lighter than I expected but strong. I don't thing it weights much more than the stock gear. Now I have to just figure out where and how to mount it.
    Anthony
    WACO Brother #30 Cub Brother #17
    It's not the hours you put in It's what you put into the hours.

  17. #217
    WacoNut's Avatar
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    RE: AMR 33% Waco YMF-5 Build

    I am working on installing the tail gear strut,
    I will have to make a trip to the local H/S to pick up a few items to complete the pull/pull hookup on the strut. I will take some pics of the installation later.
    Anthony
    WACO Brother #30 Cub Brother #17
    It's not the hours you put in It's what you put into the hours.

  18. #218
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    RE: AMR 33% Waco YMF-5 Build

    I'll bet that Robart will sure look good. A modified Robart is what I have on my Waco. It sure is strong.
    Ken
    WACO Brotherhood #70, Arlington TX home of the Dallas Cowboys, SupBowl45, Texas Rangers, World Series 2010, 2011

  19. #219
    WacoNut's Avatar
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    RE: AMR 33% Waco YMF-5 Build

    I finally got the mokey off my back and harvested a nice mature doe this morning.
    I will be going out again tomorrow morning and then processing the deer. I thought I was going to be off work until Jan 5th but I received a call last night and was told I need to work this monday and tuesday and the next monday and tuesday[:@]

    I did get everything I need to install the flight controls for the tail surfaces and a 2-3/4" tail wheel. As soon as I get the deer taken care of I will be back to working on the Waco.
    Later!!
    Anthony
    WACO Brother #30 Cub Brother #17
    It's not the hours you put in It's what you put into the hours.

  20. #220
    WacoNut's Avatar
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    RE: AMR 33% Waco YMF-5 Build

    28 deg here with 15-20mph winds and the temp will be dropping all day[&:] The deer are safe I am staying in where it is warm
    I finished up the tail strut installation, I had to remove a little of the tri-stock barcing at the bottom corners of the fuse to make room for the strut mounting bracket. I cut 2 1/2"x3/4" walnut blocks and dripped and tapped them for 6-32 and secured them to the mounting bracket leaving a 1/2" gap getween them to slip over the fin base which goes all the way to the bottom of the fuse. I then used Gorilla glue to glue the block to the fin base. After that cured I drilled thru the block and fin base with a 5/16 hole and installed a 5/16 dowel rod to pin everything together. The installation is very strong.
    The strut came with a control arm with just one connection, it consisted of a fully threaded 4-40 rod that doubled for the clamp at the top of the strut. I replced this with a longer piece of rod and added a second connector on the opposite side so I can use a pull/pull setup.
    The tail wheel is 2.75" which is just over scale size, to me it still looks small on that huge tail.
    Anthony
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    WACO Brother #30 Cub Brother #17
    It's not the hours you put in It's what you put into the hours.

  21. #221
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    RE: AMR 33% Waco YMF-5 Build

    Anthony I have been following the thread. I am a novice builder and threads like this one does more to teach us novice builders than I can even say. I see so many things that I have thought about but didn't really know how to do. Then there are things like making fiberglass parts which Big Bird mentioned in his build thread that are way beyond what I can imagine at this point. Thanks to all you guys for your contributions.
    Ron Mallonee Waco Brother #130
    \"A man of good character is known for what he does when no one is looking.\"

  22. #222
    WacoNut's Avatar
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    RE: AMR 33% Waco YMF-5 Build

    Ron I am glad you enjoy the thread,
    I have found doing a build thread helps to keep the motivation up and also it is a great way to get advice when you get yourself worked into a croner, I seem to do that alot
    Ken is a great builder and he really helped me with my last project probably more than he will ever know. He is one of the nicest and most helpful guys you will find on RCU.
    Anthony
    WACO Brother #30 Cub Brother #17
    It's not the hours you put in It's what you put into the hours.

  23. #223
    skylarkmk1's Avatar
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    RE: AMR 33% Waco YMF-5 Build

    Anthony,

    The tail wheel is looking good, both on the installation and in size. I just looked at some of the photos of NC 14081 and compared them to your photo and the position in front of the rudder post is just about spot on. The tire size is good as well.
    John F Howard (aka skylarkmk1)
    AMA 10955, WACO Brotherhood #26, AWC, NWC

  24. #224
    WacoNut's Avatar
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    RE: AMR 33% Waco YMF-5 Build

    Thanks John,
    I referenced the photo's a dozen times before locking it into position, I always keep second guessing myself.
    Anthony
    WACO Brother #30 Cub Brother #17
    It's not the hours you put in It's what you put into the hours.

  25. #225
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    RE: AMR 33% Waco YMF-5 Build

    Anthony,

    Let me also complement you on the tail wheel installation. Very well done and it should last through many landings. Congratulations on bagging the deer.

    Ron, I've not done much fiberglass work but believe me it is pretty easy. The 4' x 8' foam board is about $10 and you can make a lot of forms out of a piece that size. Sometime just jump in and try it. You will be surprised at how easy it is. Once I built a big boxy cowl for an Orline Fokker D-VII with foam board and fiberglass. When I finished I poured gasoline on the foam and dissolved it.

    Merry Christmas and Happy New Year to all of you.
    Ken
    WACO Brotherhood #70, Arlington TX home of the Dallas Cowboys, SupBowl45, Texas Rangers, World Series 2010, 2011


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