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CD ScaleDesigns Albatros CI build

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Old 10-03-2012, 01:34 AM
  #2476
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Default RE: CD ScaleDesigns Albatros CI build

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ORIGINAL: gabriel voisin
By the way,
I have some old books about individual Jasta pilots with old photos
If interested I can upload something but all is in german old style language.
I'm always interested!

Russ, It doesn't appear as if the replica makers at Vintage Aviation did this...and they're pretty obsessive about this sort of stuff.
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Old 10-03-2012, 02:25 AM
  #2477
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Default RE: CD ScaleDesigns Albatros CI build

Dear guys,
it 's so that in the period of the First World War, some different methods were used at the german aircrafts.
.
Please remember,... that for example in design the German Albatros and the Austrian Albatros in many things are very different.
Also it is with the types of the Fokker aircrafts or the LVG, etc.
But of course I can only confirm for the German types.

greetings
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Old 10-03-2012, 08:42 AM
  #2478
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Default RE: CD ScaleDesigns Albatros CI build

Don, today I've looked on your photo and I have seen that you have forgotten the under tape.

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Old 10-03-2012, 08:29 PM
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Default RE: CD ScaleDesigns Albatros CI build

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ORIGINAL: gabriel voisin
Don, today I've looked on your photo and I have seen that you have forgotten the under tape.
This is just a test for one method for doing the stitching on the model. I don't believe it is possible to do the stitching on my model exactly the same way as on the original. With this method, the thread comes up from the bottom of the wing, then across the rib cap (and also an "under tape") then back down through the wing, then straight across the bottom rib cap, then up again through the same hole. At the top, the thread then goes diagonally to the next position. With this method the top looks correct, but the bottom isn't the same as on the original.

I understand that on the original (German Albatros) a fabric tape was sewn onto the to of the rib before covering. Then after the top covering (the wing was covered in two parts) was attached, the stitching was done with a curved needle, sewing the covering onto the fabric tape. So the thread DIDN'T go up and down through the entire wing (as on some other aircraft). I tried to simulate this same effect by ironing a strip of solartex to the top of the koverall/silk covering and then run the stitch under just the solartex. This didn't work. But another possibility might be to cover the wing with Koverall. Then add the solartex "undertapes" BEFORE I put on the silk.

But no matter what I do, I won't be able to get the bottom stitching correct since this bottom covering was sewn on and stitched BEFORE doing the top covering (I believe). The bottom stitching forms a simple straight stitch.
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Old 10-03-2012, 09:05 PM
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Default RE: CD ScaleDesigns Albatros CI build

If the Silk is only being "glued" to the koverall, sew the stitching onto the silk before applying. Practice and precise measurement should get it. You might find a local with a programable sewing machine that might be able to do it for you. Art dept. at the collage?
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Old 10-04-2012, 10:30 AM
  #2481
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Default RE: CD ScaleDesigns Albatros CI build

Don, I understand your description not quite right, but I think you've understood something wrong.

Matz
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Old 10-04-2012, 05:34 PM
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Default RE: CD ScaleDesigns Albatros CI build

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ORIGINAL: gabriel voisin
Don, I understand your description not quite right, but I think you've understood something wrong.

Matz
Here's an imagine from the Vintage Aviator website that shows way the fabric strip was sewn to the top of the rib. At this point, I just need to find a compromise method for doing it on my model. Dave's suggestion for how to do the stitching looks good.


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Old 10-04-2012, 06:16 PM
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Default RE: CD ScaleDesigns Albatros CI build

There is a strip on the bottom too. The picture is showing before the bottom fabric is sewed to the strip to make it undercambered.
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Old 10-04-2012, 06:26 PM
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Default RE: CD ScaleDesigns Albatros CI build

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ORIGINAL: TFF
There is a strip on the bottom too. The picture is showing before the bottom fabric is sewed to the strip to make it undercambered.
Yeah, I just noticed that while posting it. If I were doing a larger scale model Albatros I would have definitely followed this style. It doesn't seem much harder than "faking" it with stitching after the model is covered. Anyway, today I just want to make some progress...of ANY kind! I think I'll focus on getting the top wings ready for covering and finishing up the ailerons.
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Old 10-05-2012, 06:44 AM
  #2485
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Default RE: CD ScaleDesigns Albatros CI build



Don, do the stitches on a fabric strip and then glue the striponthe ribs.
Then cover the strip with an other strip, so it was also in the German Albatros aircraft.



The cord on the picture has only one function, he holds the special tape on the ribs.
The english name is Herringbone-Tape. ( Deutsch: Fischgräten-Band). On that tape is the cover sewed on.
Other german typs have not a cord, because it's an other method.

The tape under the cord is the herringbone and the cover strip is the same material as the covering,.....Info: The cover strip was torn and not cut.

I hope I could help you,.....greetings Matz

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Old 10-10-2012, 08:35 AM
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Default RE: CD ScaleDesigns Albatros CI build

Lots of little tasks to get the top wings ready for covering. All small stuff hardly worth detailing...but it all took time. The most important task was replacing the G10 aileron levers that form one of the riblets in the aileron and extend into the slot in the wing. I had to tweak the shape and length of this a bit as the one supplied with the kit wasn't exactly right. The aileron is operated with a set of pull-pull cables from the servo arms in the lower wing. I also then glued in the 3mm dowel that runs through all the aileron riblets. The dowel helps maintain the built-in "twist" to the ailerons, which functions as washout as per the original. It looks a bit weird but was one of the identifying features of the CI.

That last thing is to fit hinges in the scale locations. There were four hinges per aileron (vs. the three shown on the kit plans). Initially the idea was to use Robart-style hinges, because that's what Chris had on the plans. But I'd like to go with something more scale. Dave Johnson has a nice way of doing this with inset bits of dowel for a strap hinge. But I can't recall the details. Dave, any chance you could post a photo?
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Old 10-10-2012, 05:33 PM
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Default RE: CD ScaleDesigns Albatros CI build

Ah, here it is!
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Old 10-11-2012, 02:48 AM
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Default RE: CD ScaleDesigns Albatros CI build

Here's an image I posted way back in 2004 (in a thread about WWI hinges) that shows the strap hinges on the original Albatros CV. I can't do mine quite like this because the construction of my ailerons isn't completely scale.
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Old 10-11-2012, 04:25 AM
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Default RE: CD ScaleDesigns Albatros CI build

Interesting that the cable pick-ups are the WWI version of a multi-hole R/C rudder horn. Ailerons too sensitive? Move the cables out.

Martin
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Old 10-11-2012, 07:14 AM
  #2490
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Default RE: CD ScaleDesigns Albatros CI build


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ORIGINAL: Nieuport nut

Interesting that the cable pick-ups are the WWI version of a multi-hole R/C rudder horn. Ailerons too sensitive? Move the cables out.

Martin
I had noticed the same thing! Very practical. I'm hoping the geometry on my model is such that there's enough travel, which can then be reduced with the EPA on the radio.
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Old 10-11-2012, 10:58 AM
  #2491
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ORIGINAL: abufletcher

Well, it's just a sport-scale quick-built interpretation of the Sopwith Pup with no frills, but it's a lot of fun to fly and I can use all the practice I can get! Good and really scale kits of German WWI aircraft are scarce at any scale and particularly at 1/6 scale. To be honest, the only 1/6 scale WWI kit that I would bother with at all at this point is the AerodromeRC DVII (designed for electric). In terms of plans, the 1/6 scale plans of the LVG VI by Frank Mizer are a work of art in themselves. The prototype took Best of Show at Toleda several years ago. You can order the plans through the Flying Scale Models website.

There aren't more than a dozen truly scale WWI kits anywhere in the world. Many of the AerodromeRC kits are reasonably scale, but they're mostly small electric models. If you're interested in one of the Albatros fighters, the FunAero kits are good value for the money (though perhaps not when you include shipping to Germany).

http://www.funaero.com/id6.html
Hello Don,
today it's arrived the 1/6 plan of the LVG VI by Frank Mizer.
uh uh,....a lot of work waiting for me, but it's an excellent plan, drawn by the Shuttleworth machine.
Frank Mizer has used a lot of good details from the original,........thanks for the tip.

greetings Matz
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Old 10-11-2012, 03:41 PM
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Default RE: CD ScaleDesigns Albatros CI build

Those LVG VI plans are absolutely stunning and it'll be a great project! I enlarged the side-view to 1/4 scale just to get an idea for what that would be like.
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Old 10-12-2012, 03:07 AM
  #2493
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Default RE: CD ScaleDesigns Albatros CI build

Even though I have the photo of Dave's way of doing the strap hinges I'm still not quite understanding how it would work on my model. I'm assuming that there must be slots cut in the wing TE (ahead of the aileron) so that the lower tab on the trap hinges slip in there.
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Old 10-12-2012, 03:50 AM
  #2494
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Default RE: CD ScaleDesigns Albatros CI build



Hello Don,



thanks for the answer.



Some things I will do construct after the original drawings. I don't know



how perfect I will do it, it's a lot of work.



Today I have time and I'll scan a photo of the Albatros model that Fred Muehlberger has built for the World Cup, .....you will like it.

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Old 10-12-2012, 05:10 AM
  #2495
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Default RE: CD ScaleDesigns Albatros CI build

Don, I've made up the "hinge spar" as a lamination. The basswood top cap is as thick as the hinge. Then there is a web of balsa notched to accommodate the lower hinge tab. Then there is a lower basswood cap to complete the spar. The hinge slips into the notch and over the top cap and is bolted through with a small bolt. It's really handy to be able to finish the control surface before attaching to the airframe.

Martin
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Old 10-12-2012, 05:25 AM
  #2496
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Default RE: CD ScaleDesigns Albatros CI build

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ORIGINAL: gabriel voisin
Today I have time and I'll scan a photo of the Albatros model that Fred Muehlberger has built for the World Cup, .....you will like it.
Matz, I'm excited to see it!

Martin, thanks for the description. I'll try to implement something similar. And, yes, I agree that it's best to be able to attach a finished aileron. I spent the evening making up 8 little brass hinges. Still have some work to do on them though. They aren't perfect, but they'll play the part.


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Old 10-12-2012, 06:02 AM
  #2497
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Default RE: CD ScaleDesigns Albatros CI build

Yes I will do it.
Because of your "Flugsport" drawing.
I've the original Flugsport document with the drawing and the description, do you need something of the description?
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Old 10-12-2012, 06:14 AM
  #2498
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Default RE: CD ScaleDesigns Albatros CI build

The ailerons on my model aren't 100% scale accurate because the original's ailerons were made of steel tubing. I thought about rebuilding the ailerons (since I had already replaced the kit's ply/balsa laminated TE with a wire TE) but I just wanted to get moving forward.
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Old 10-12-2012, 11:52 AM
  #2499
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Default RE: CD ScaleDesigns Albatros CI build

Today I got a lot of photos and documents from the Restoration of the LVG C.VI in Brussels.
Over a hundred detail photos and many documents.
I've found that the plan has a lot of mistakes and I want to build not so.
Don, are also a lot of detail photos of the Benz engine and the rib stiching.

Matz

By the way, I need the Lozenge covering in 1/6 , has anybody an idea?
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Old 10-12-2012, 12:53 PM
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Default RE: CD ScaleDesigns Albatros CI build

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ORIGINAL: gabriel voisin

By the way, I need the Lozenge covering in 1/6 , has anybody an idea?

Yeb, try [link=http://www.mdf-modelltechnik.de/index.php/lozenge]THESE[/link] guys Matz, you can order it in the scale you want.
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