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CD ScaleDesigns Albatros CI build

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Old 10-30-2012, 09:08 AM
  #2651
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Default RE: CD ScaleDesigns Albatros CI build

BTW, I should point out that on the original CI the two elevator halves were joined by the LE tube, which passed through the end of the fuselage. As such, if one or the other of the cable connections came off, the pilot still had some control on both sides. On the model there is no joining tube, so if one of the cables fails, you'd be left with only one functioning half.
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Old 10-30-2012, 09:52 AM
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Default RE: CD ScaleDesigns Albatros CI build

Try a M2 ball link for the ball in the horn. Then a slit brass cup,( tubing and flat base?), silver soldered to the horn.

It looks to me like the horn has a straight rear edge and that the apparent curve is just the top "cup" flaring a bit wider to accommodate the ball.

Martin
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Old 10-30-2012, 09:59 AM
  #2653
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Default RE: CD ScaleDesigns Albatros CI build

Don,
it's always the same construction.
We have the drawings of the BI, BII, CIII (some parts), DIII, DV.
Of course, there are small differences, but the principle is always the same.
Therefore, I will now show you a photo of a real BII, builtwith the original military plans.
I would not want to publicly display, please have a look on the pic and I will remove it.
I hope it helps you and you believe it.

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Old 10-30-2012, 02:02 PM
  #2654
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Default RE: CD ScaleDesigns Albatros CI build

I see both BIIs closer in general than the DIII shown. I can see the sweep in the polish one but it might be more of a hack job compared to the other. Both BII pictures show bolt in turnbuckle for connection where the DIII has the ball socket connection and more pronounced triangular gusset shape.
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Old 10-30-2012, 05:07 PM
  #2655
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Default RE: CD ScaleDesigns Albatros CI build

Quote:
ORIGINAL: TFF
I see both BIIs closer in general than the DIII shown. I can see the sweep in the polish one but it might be more of a hack job compared to the other. Both BII pictures show bolt in turnbuckle for connection where the DIII has the ball socket connection and more pronounced triangular gusset shape.
Exactly! Matz, thank you so much for posting that photo...even if it's only temporary. But I have to agree with TFF that the horn in your photo is NOT the same as in the DIII photo you posted earlier. In your photo of the BII it looks like there's a bolt from the side that holds the control cable/turnbuckle in place.
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Old 10-30-2012, 05:31 PM
  #2656
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Default RE: CD ScaleDesigns Albatros CI build

By the way, Matz, are the leading edge tubes of the two elevator halves connected together...or do they just "plug into" the bracket on the side of the fuselage?
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Old 10-31-2012, 07:08 AM
  #2657
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Default RE: CD ScaleDesigns Albatros CI build

Elevator horn MarkII. And the FINAL mark! Close enough is close enough.
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Old 10-31-2012, 10:30 AM
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Default RE: CD ScaleDesigns Albatros CI build



Don, the Albatros was the king class of the german aircrafts.
The Fokkers was more "rustikal", I don't know the English name. but the Albatros was a really accurate fine work.
It's not so simply as you think, all parts were put together with fine metal fittings.
To build after your reference pictures of the BII, it's not the best way, but 90% of the fighters in the polish museum was improvised.



Please have a look at the new upperpictures.

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Old 10-31-2012, 12:52 PM
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Default RE: CD ScaleDesigns Albatros CI build

The Fokkers were more 'agricultural'! Nice work, Mr. Abu!
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Old 10-31-2012, 01:36 PM
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Default RE: CD ScaleDesigns Albatros CI build

Thanks Michael,....lol....it's that the correct word?

greetings Matz
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Old 10-31-2012, 02:57 PM
  #2661
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Default RE: CD ScaleDesigns Albatros CI build


Quote:
ORIGINAL: ARUP

The Fokkers were more 'agricultural'! Nice work, Mr. Abu!

Think the correct translation would be "Rustic"....but after a few weeks in the field probably were more "agricultural"
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Old 10-31-2012, 05:42 PM
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Default RE: CD ScaleDesigns Albatros CI build

Quote:
ORIGINAL: gabriel voisin
Please have a look at the new upper pictures.
With a few tweaks with a file, I should be able to get my MarkII horns looking a bit more like that...though it's hard to hit a moving target. I based my MarkII horns on your BII photo that you posted yesterday.

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Old 10-31-2012, 08:13 PM
  #2663
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Default RE: CD ScaleDesigns Albatros CI build

The elevator horns are epoxied into place. It's not perfect, but really I've got to move on. The next issue that needs to be addressed is that the way the kit was designed the two stab trailing edges and the two elevator leading edges don't connect with the fuselage (and each other?) through a bracket on the tail. I was thinking of this as just a small cosmetic scale problem due to the model's stab incidence. But there's really way too much flexibility on the balsa/ply stab at this point. While the rudder-to-stab braces help with the outer portions, the inner part could be flexing in flight.

So I think I need to extend the ends of both the stab and the elevator to have some inside support.
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Old 10-31-2012, 10:13 PM
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Default RE: CD ScaleDesigns Albatros CI build

BTW, a little screwy geometry. I set the control horns at an angle so that they line up with the cable exits. That's probably wrong, but it needed to be done. But that makes the ends of the horn "wobble" a bit when the elevator moves up and down.
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Old 11-01-2012, 01:21 AM
  #2665
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Default RE: CD ScaleDesigns Albatros CI build

Don, the first "new" photo shows exactly this BII horn.
The horns at Albatros are pressed into several individual parts and then welded together.
On the "yesterday" photos you have seen exactly this horn in the finished ruder.
This is exactly the geometry of the horns at the B and C types.
Four separate pieces always give a full horn.
Now, it is enough with the horns, I already feel like a bull.
Finally, when I come to the workshop, I will look for the dimensions.

Matz
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Old 11-01-2012, 01:24 AM
  #2666
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Default RE: CD ScaleDesigns Albatros CI build


Quote:
ORIGINAL: Mein Duff


Quote:
ORIGINAL: ARUP

The Fokkers were more 'agricultural'! Nice work, Mr. Abu!

Think the correct translation would be "Rustic"....but after a few weeks in the field probably were more "agricultural"
Thanks also @mein Duff for the translation.

greetings Matz
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Old 11-01-2012, 04:20 AM
  #2667
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Default RE: CD ScaleDesigns Albatros CI build

Don, doesn't the original have some sort of bracket? I agree that it looks rather flimsy as it is. I realize that it's a bit late, but I'd be inclined to build the stab with one dowel rear spar straight across both sides and then used bolted brackets on the fuselage at the forward apex. At this point, you could pin the two sides together with a small dowel through the fuselage and into the rear spar, ideally past the hinges. I think that will be tough at this point.

Martin
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Old 11-01-2012, 05:38 AM
  #2668
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Default RE: CD ScaleDesigns Albatros CI build

Quote:
ORIGINAL: gabriel voisin
I already feel like a bull.
You've been extremely helpful! Thank you!!!

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Old 11-01-2012, 05:49 AM
  #2669
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Default RE: CD ScaleDesigns Albatros CI build

Quote:
ORIGINAL: Nieuport nut
Don, doesn't the original have some sort of bracket? I agree that it looks rather flimsy as it is. I realize that it's a bit late, but I'd be inclined to build the stab with one dowel rear spar straight across both sides and then used bolted brackets on the fuselage at the forward apex. At this point, you could pin the two sides together with a small dowel through the fuselage and into the rear spar, ideally past the hinges. I think that will be tough at this point.
A bracket? Indeed it does! And I've already got 90% of a solution. It will be a simple matter to extend the elevator LE through the fuselage with a length of the same 5mm CF tube with a 3mm CF tube inside it. I haven't worked out yet whether the 3mm tube will plug into the elevator LE or whether the 3mm tube in the LE will plug into the fuse. I'd do it whichever way makes it easier to remove a damaged stab half. I'm not sure, if I need to extend the stab TE (other than for cosmetic reasons). But I could also have a piece of 5mm CF plug into the fuselage.

At least that's one option. My tomorrow I may have thought of something better.

Now about that bracket. That's a bit of a problem. Because the incidence of the model's stab is not the same as on the original, the stab TE/elevator LE are positions at least 1/4 inch lower than would be correct. So I could make a bracket that would have a sort of scale appearance but would actually be way to big.
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Old 11-01-2012, 07:05 AM
  #2670
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Default RE: CD ScaleDesigns Albatros CI build

Please have a look.
The inside of a Albatros and the BIIdetail,...allwasmade by CraftLab.
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Old 11-01-2012, 07:06 AM
  #2671
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Default RE: CD ScaleDesigns Albatros CI build

[:@][:@][:@] Frickin' CA! [:@][:@][:@] Dripped down into one of my scale brass elevator hinges and so when I moved the elevator it broke part of the stab and I may have to tear apart the elevator to replace the hinge. In short start all over again. Carp. [:@]
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Old 11-01-2012, 07:49 AM
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Default RE: CD ScaleDesigns Albatros CI build

I love it when a plan comes together[:@] Any disbonder in the shop?
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Old 11-01-2012, 03:42 PM
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Default RE: CD ScaleDesigns Albatros CI build

I could try soaking the hinge in nail polish remover...or applying the tip of a soldering iron. In all likelihood, I'm just going to have to cut it off (there by destroying the current LE) and make a new brass hinge. I'll try to look at this in a positive light...as an opportunity to rebuild the TE/LE in a stronger, more scale manner. The 6x6 balsa stab TE was also weak, so maybe I can replace that with CF tube as well. Also if I have to rebuild the elevator(s?) I might as well replace the single 4mm aluminum edge I used with a "reinforced" aluminum tube (2mm tube inside 3mm tube with a strand of CF in the center for good measure).
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Old 11-02-2012, 10:32 AM
  #2674
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Default RE: CD ScaleDesigns Albatros CI build

Well, I'm back to where I was...

...and can get on with what I was trying to do before, that is, fashioning extensions of the elevator LE through the fuselage. But I'm also going to take this opportunity to reinforce the stab frame with strips of flat CF. Replacing the stab TE with CF tube wasn't practical since the current hinges wouldn't work (the "straps" aren't long enough to reach past the tube).

*****

BTW, the solution to unsticking the hinge was to hold a 100w soldering irons against the brass until it started to smolder and that "released" the CA. Then it was just a matter of cleaning up the area with a file and then re-epoxying the broken bits back in place.
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Old 11-04-2012, 04:10 AM
  #2675
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Default RE: CD ScaleDesigns Albatros CI build

It's embarrassing to admit it, but here's a photo showing the problem with doing the tail bracket that I took TWO YEARS AGO (and almost certainly posted somewhere in this thread). The printed photo shows the proper bracket, while my sketch shows how I would have to "fudge" the bracket to fit the locations of the TE/LE on the stab/elevator.

I also threw together a quick test of how it might work to prime the entire stab and elevator structures prior to covering...and how this primer might affect the adhesion of the coverings. I build a small triangle out of balsa, aluminum, and CF and then primed it all with the grey automotive primer I've used with great success. Then on one side I brushed on Stix-it. You do have to be careful because the Stix-it does eat into the primer if applied to heavily. When the Stix-it was dried I ironed on a small piece of Polyspan, which is a heat-shrinkable synthetic with random fibers similar to silkspan. For smaller models and/or flight surfaces it's a great materials. But it has to be completely filled to be function (as with the Koverall). On the other side of the triangle I ironed on good old Solartex Natural.

Finally, over the Polyspan side, I applied a square of my "bamboo" silk using PolyC. In terms of the final results, well, I'm not impressed. The grey primer does the job of making all the different materials used on the model look more like metal tubing, so that's good. And it's good that the covering seem to adhere just fine over the primer (ultimately the covering is really adhering to itself when the top overlaps the bottom).

But the color and transparency of the covering+silk when soaked through with PolyC is disappointing. Furthermore, I still haven't worked out a method for getting a really smooth surface. I don't know what the problem is but I'm ending up with a really "sandy" surface with little "bubbles" here and there. Not good. I may have to rethink the whole "silk-instead-of-paint" idea.
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