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-   -   Jolly Jay fishing boat (http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/rc-scale-boating-103/8352803-jolly-jay-fishing-boat.html)

dlemo2000 01-13-2009 07:39 AM

Jolly Jay fishing boat
 
I am a newbie to this hobby and this is my first build. I am building this kit to be a "working" fishing boat. By working, I mean to install a winch type system which will reel in the fish. I have a few questions I hope someone can offer suggestions:

1. The kit came with a 4.8v motor. The boat is 24" long. Is this big enough? I don't need to go fast but do not want to be under powered.
2. Any ideas on what kind of gearing or motor system to power the winch? My current thought is an additional motor and speed control using a 4 channel remote, but I am worried about room and weight. The winch will be built with an old baitcasting spool and gears. I think I need a low speed, higher torque drive (and small)
3. Can a battery power more than one thing at a time.

Any thoughts would be a help.

Thanks

toesupwa 01-13-2009 03:10 PM

RE: Jolly Jay fishing boat
 

Quote:

ORIGINAL: dlemo2000

1. The kit came with a 4.8v motor. The boat is 24" long. Is this big enough? I don't need to go fast but do not want to be under powered.
2. Any ideas on what kind of gearing or motor system to power the winch? My current thought is an additional motor and speed control using a 4 channel remote, but I am worried about room and weight. The winch will be built with an old baitcasting spool and gears. I think I need a low speed, higher torque drive (and small)
3. Can a battery power more than one thing at a time.

1/ A semi build thread here that has info you may find useful..
http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showt...ight=Jolly+Jay
2/ You would have to see what weight the hull would be able to cope with and allow for motor, batteries (enough for a good run time) electronics etc before deciding if the hull could bear the additional weight of an extra motor, gearbox / working winch. It should be possible in a hull of that size though.
I've seen several winches using the gearbox and motor from cheap electric drills...
3/ Yes, just use a 'bus bar' and split the leads from that to your other equipment...

dlemo2000 01-14-2009 05:53 AM

RE: Jolly Jay fishing boat
 
Thanks for the info. The link was very helpful. I assume ESC stands for electronic speed control (don't know all of the terms yet). The idea on the drill is excellant. Getting ready to glass the hull. I am sure there will be more questions. Have a good day.

Doug

LtDoc 01-14-2009 02:11 PM

RE: Jolly Jay fishing boat
 
I'm probably misunderstanding you so tell me something. Do you really plan to 'fish' with this boat, or is the winch/etc. just for 'show'?
- 'Doc

dlemo2000 01-22-2009 09:22 AM

RE: Jolly Jay fishing boat
 
My plan is to actually fish with this boat. I live on a 6 acre pond and thought this would be a challenging build. My current plan is to rig a winch system combined with a portion of an old fishing rod. I think I will try and use the mast and swing arm section for the rod holder. The winch drive is the head from a cordless screwdriver (6 volt). I will use a ESC to control the retreival / "cast" speed. My current concerns are how much balast will be required and how to keep a low center of gravity. I am considering making the rod swivel for when the fish runs and utilizing some small springs to take some of the force out of the shock. On the early trials I plan to use foam pipe insulation around the open deck area to help insure I don't get too much lean. Waterproofing the main deck to minimize any seepage to the lower hull are also under consideration. Lot of questions that I have to make up answers as I go along. If this works I will build another one for my buddies and start an "old lazy man high tech fishing league"

Doug

toesupwa 01-22-2009 02:36 PM

RE: Jolly Jay fishing boat
 

Quote:

ORIGINAL: dlemo2000

My plan is to actually fish with this boat.

Oh dear...

This 'idea' has been discussed on several model boat forums in the past...

Some points to consider..
Is it considered 'legal' by F&G in your State?.. If the F&G officer thinks what you are doing is illegal, they have the right to confiscate all of your 'tackle'.
A 24" boat, no matter how much power you install is too small. The only safe way is to use your boat to drop the terminal tackle and use a pole from the bank.
Imagine even a small fish, say 1 - 2lb taking your bait / lure. Your small boat WILL be dragged all over the pond before the fish is tired.
Imagine a 10lb fish taking your bait / lure... be prepared to see your boat dragged under... even springs 'to take some of the force out of the shock' wont help in this situation...
You had better make your boat as watertight as a submarine....

To use a well known saying from a film.. "You are gonna need a bigger boat..."

dlemo2000 01-23-2009 07:43 AM

RE: Jolly Jay fishing boat
 

Quote:

ORIGINAL: toesupwa


Quote:

ORIGINAL: dlemo2000

My plan is to actually fish with this boat.

Oh dear...

This 'idea' has been discussed on several model boat forums in the past...

Some points to consider..
Is it considered 'legal' by F&G in your State?.. If the F&G officer thinks what you are doing is illegal, they have the right to confiscate all of your 'tackle'.
A 24" boat, no matter how much power you install is too small. The only safe way is to use your boat to drop the terminal tackle and use a pole from the bank.
Imagine even a small fish, say 1 - 2lb taking your bait / lure. Your small boat WILL be dragged all over the pond before the fish is tired.
Imagine a 10lb fish taking your bait / lure... be prepared to see your boat dragged under... even springs 'to take some of the force out of the shock' wont help in this situation...
You had better make your boat as watertight as a submarine....

To use a well known saying from a film.. "You are gonna need a bigger boat..."

Oh yee of little faith. Think of this as an engineering challenge. The DNR point is a good one but it is my pond so I should be OK but I will look it up. My guess is it would fall into the "drop line" or "jug fishing" rules. I got this idea from a you tube clip where the kid landed a 4 lb bass with a little 16 or 17 inch plastic boat. The fish did stand the boat up one time, but he got it in. My target species will obviously be panfish (bluegill,crappie) but I will have to account for the occasional rogue bass. Think of the boat as a 24" by 8" bobber. No fish in this pond is going to pull it under, but even a .75 lb bluegill could cause it to "roll" if allowed to get to a 90 degree angle. This is where the power train comes into play. You will need to keep the boat well in front of the fish. The rod and springs package will help transfer or spread some of the energy over a broader cross section of the hull. Kinda like a race car and the carbon fiber bodies that "explode" when they hit the wall, "disipate the force". Your last point about a larger fish is a concern. I haven't done the math yet (not sure I can) but a 5 lb fish could be a problem. To account for this I have a couple of ideas. First, I will use 2lb test line. Hopefully the line will break before we pull an "edmund fitzgearld". The second idea I got from the model kit of the Andrea Gail (Billings Boats). The AG had outriggers extended to each side. Attach a 1 or 2" styrofoam ball to each arm and your roll problems are over. You have to admit utilizing technology from the AG is appropriate here, we all know where she ended up. At the end of the day I may have to use the Roy Schieder quote. Thanks for the comments, any suggestions are greatly appreciated. Gottta go finish glassing the hull.

Doug



toesupwa 01-23-2009 09:49 AM

RE: Jolly Jay fishing boat
 
1 Attachment(s)

Quote:

ORIGINAL: dlemo2000

Oh yee of little faith.


Hmmmmmm..


pompebled 01-23-2009 02:37 PM

RE: Jolly Jay fishing boat
 
Hi Doug,

I don't think faith has anything to do with it, Toes is right, a sizable fish will pull your boat under or capsize it, outriggers or no outriggers, as nor the fish or the water is at the scale of your trawler.
"You'll need a bigger boat..."

Please make sure to have plenty of video footage to convince us otherwise...

Regards, Jan.

Kaymac 01-23-2009 04:57 PM

RE: Jolly Jay fishing boat
 
Your idea of using 2 lb. test line is probably wise but trying to predict how a fish will make the first move is difficult. I suggest you test your idea by connecting the two pound line to the boat and attach a three pound rock about 4 ' downline and drop the rock while the boat is sitting in the water. If the line breaks before the boat, you win.
Regardless. it sounds like fun!
Keith
www.kaymac.ca

dlemo2000 01-25-2009 07:33 AM

RE: Jolly Jay fishing boat
 
Video footage will be provided, good or bad. Probably not until April or May. The rock test is a good one to measure line strength and roll characteristics. If you want to see how much force is required to pull this boat under, try submerging a 1 gallon empty milk jug. The milk jub is about 1/3 to 1/4 the size of the boat by air volume. Toes fish could not pull it under. The boat will be most vulnerable to roll in a static position. I believe forward momentum is key. Is heat build up in the motor compartment a typical concern? The kit has a fake stack I was wondering if I should make it functional? Kay, your last line sums it up, It's all about the fun. Next up, a container ship fitted to be a portable cooler. Have fun.

Doug

pompebled 01-25-2009 08:07 AM

RE: Jolly Jay fishing boat
 
1 Attachment(s)
Quote:

ORIGINAL: dlemo2000
Is heat build up in the motor compartment a typical concern?
Doug
Hi Doug,

Under normal circomstances the motor in a scale ship doesn't get hot, if properly dimensioned.
If it has to work very hard, as may be expected when tangling with a caught fish, adding a cooling coil and brushtabcooling may be a good idea.
I would make a water pickup behind the prop and an outlet also under water facing towards the stern (creating suction), this way you'll have a pressureless cooling system that will always function, even when running slow.

I'd keep the hull closed intill you're shure it won't capsize under load, sinking her through the smoke stack isn't my idea of having fun...

Regards, Jan.

toesupwa 01-25-2009 11:56 AM

RE: Jolly Jay fishing boat
 

Quote:

ORIGINAL: dlemo2000

If you want to see how much force is required to pull this boat under, try submerging a 1 gallon empty milk jug. The milk jub is about 1/3 to 1/4 the size of the boat by air volume. Toes fish could not pull it under.
But that is ignoring the self weight of the boat and its equipment. If the boat only has about 1" freeboard, then it wont take much to pull it under... and yes, the fish in the pic could quite easily do that to your boat.

dlemo2000 01-26-2009 06:57 AM

RE: Jolly Jay fishing boat
 
That cooling coil is neat. Whats the drive mechanism? Pump? While I'm asking do they make a little bilge pump? I have an extra channel on the controller, it may come in handy.

Thanks

Doug

dlemo2000 01-28-2009 12:19 PM

RE: Jolly Jay fishing boat
 
I continued my research this morning and reached a conclusion that you all had already reached. Any fair size fish is gonna kick my boats butt. I viewed 4 or 5 videos on the web and unless the fish was about the size of a minnow, the boat struggled mightly and in all cases got wet. While this evidence doesn't kill the project, it does require some re=thinking on certian engineering aspects. My wife says I'm stuborn but I really just don't like to lose.

Thanks for the heads up.

Doug

toesupwa 01-28-2009 01:33 PM

RE: Jolly Jay fishing boat
 

Quote:

ORIGINAL: dlemo2000

I continued my research this morning and reached a conclusion that you all had already reached. Any fair size fish is gonna kick my boats butt.

Is this a case of "I told you so"?...

If you can be stone blind certain, without a shadow of a doubt that there is nothing bigger in your pool of 1lb, then go for it...

If you cant be sure of the above then...

1/ Go for a boat hull of at least 40"... with LOTS of self boyancy.
2/ The electronics (Motor / prop / ESC / Battery) combination needs to have a sustained bollard pull of at least equal to (and more) the weight of the fish.
3/ The above needs to be able to 'pull' for long periods without overheating or blowing a fuse.
4/ Your boat needs to be very 'directional' and responds to the rudder with authority. Keeping the fish over the stern is important!.. if it gets to the side of your boat it WILL roll the boat over.
5/ Seal the boat like the water bottle you mentioned in a previous post. If it gets rolled over or worse, sunk (Dragged under by the fish), then it will pop up to the surface again.
6/ Find some way of a quick release... a 'panic' button!.
7/ Remember a fish of only 5lb can have a sustained pull enough to break 10lb line.

Oh yeah... and still be prepared to lose all your hard work...

Taking all the above in to consideration, i still dont think there is a model boat capable of safely 'going fishing' with..

dlemo2000 01-29-2009 07:10 AM

RE: Jolly Jay fishing boat
 
Thanks for the ideas. I did find a guy in Texas who built these things and guess what, they were all a lot longer and wider (18-22"). He patented the design and was going to kit it but must have had no takers. One of the features was a line cut system. Here is the link

[link]http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_qa3918/is_200004/ai_n8893653[/link]

"I'm gonna need a bigger boat"

Doug

skunz85 09-03-2009 02:43 AM

RE: Jolly Jay fishing boat
 
 I belive you had stated something about making the rod swivel you may also want to rethink that idea. I am a 4th generation shrimper on the gulf coast galveston to be exact. One thing you want to watch out for is the height of the actual "pole" and not allowing it to swivel. If the fish decides to run to the side and that is the direction the pole swivels to instead of off the stern it will surely roll the boat!! Also I would watch the height of the actual poole itself when we let our nets out we do not pull from the top of our rigging, once out we lower the block from the top of the rig to approx 6' from the deck this helps if we need to make a fast turn if we were to make a fast turn with the block at the top of the rig the chances to roll the boat increase significantly! The foam blocks on the riggers will help some but not as much as you think we use what they call "birds" basically a big weight with wings all they are for is to slow the roll of the boat down especially when in the trough they will not fully prevent a rollover. I would def keep the pole as low as possible wile still allowing for some give and would not allow it to swivel remember easyier to roll then to filp lol! Just my opinion!


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