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Tamiya KT - A beginners build

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Old 10-20-2010, 02:33 AM
  #1  
danlrc
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Default Tamiya KT - A beginners build

First, Thank You to Stern and Gary (hdbeast) for all the information you posted and the path you laid out (or maybe it was a trap you set). I couldn't resist starting a King Tiger after reading your threads. I'm new to tanks (usually build big R/C sailing ship models) and will try to collect a lot of info in one place with a beginners perspective. Mostly it will be checking the steps along the way with all the knowledgeable builders here.
I don't hope to match the quality and detail level posted already, but maybe my build will help guide other new builders through the huge amount of info available.
Please give feedback to help me get complete info included or to correct any misinformation I might put out.


I. The First Few Days.

- Reading, reading, reading all the KT threads and looking at all the great build pictures. Must do this....

- Buying the model. There is a huge range of pricing available and many, many sellers can be found on the internet. My advice - research the forums to find reliable sellers, then find one with a phone number and a person to talk to, and call your order in, confirming price, availability, shipping and actual kit ID: Tamiya Full-Option King Tiger, Kit#56018.
If ordering out of your own country, understand tax, duty, shipping, exchange rates, delivery time, etc. to avoid "surprises".
I ordered mine from Dave at Rare Plastic Models (http://www.rareplastic.com/product_i...roducts_id=269) because he was very close by, answered all my questions, had very competitive pricing and two-day delivery. Can't wait for delivery!

- Thinking about the budget now. The kit price is only the start. Must also get a decent radio, receiver, battery pack, and a good charger.
The kit is complete (from what I've read) for building and running, but upgrades are like icing on the cake - ya just gotta have 'em. They could easily add up to many hundreds of dollars.
To save some money, I'll likely scratch build some of the detail upgrades and possibly some of the mechanical upgrades (I have a small lathe and mill).

- Starting the list of upgrades. Breaking it out as "mechanical" and "appearance". I'll run the tank mostly for fun and to take vid and pictures. So I'm not thinking about battle system electronics options.
Need to make list of the various sources, costs, pros and cons of the options.

II. The Mechanical Upgrades List. (List will be edited as I learn more information. Latest update: 20 Oct 2010)

[ul][*] - Upgrades Yes/No/Maybe Source Approx. Cost Notes
Lower motor/hull brace yes scratch? Available from Daryl Turner, Schumo
400 "long" motors no
Gearbox reduction unit 3:1 w/bb's maybe Schumo Is speed high enough with this?
Drive shaft supports - plastic yes Schumo Brass ones also available
Idler tensioner yes Schumo or D Turner Which is better?
Modified axles maybe Schumo Are the stock ones that bad?
Metal tracks later (best ones?) Will see how the plastic ones hold up.
Front hull gap seal plates yes scratch
Motor dust shields yes scratch
Road wheel bushings yes ??? Is part available from hardware supplier?
Drive wheel bushings yes ??? Will try to fit ball bearings
On/off switch, onboard charging plug yes Hobby Shop DPDT switch, Tamiya plug
Metal gun elevation arm yes scratch Avail from D Turner, Schumo
Gearbox bearing upgrade maybe online hardware Will maybe add ball bearings
Longer torsion arms maybe ETO, Schumo Needed? Best ones?
Battery, 7.2VDC, 4500mAh, 6xsubC yes online, Batteryspace.com Estimated run time with 4.5Ah battery?
Smoke unit, proportional yes custom, "fog fluid" Design I use for boats
Gun fire, single shot yes custom, black powder, nichrome ignition Design used for ship models[*] [*]
[/ul]
III. The Detail Parts Upgrades List (List will be edited as I learn more information. Latest update: 20 Oct 2010)
- later - a long list.....

IV. List of Suppliers for Parts
- later

On to post#2 when the kit arrives. I'll edit the above info based on any feedback and new info I get. Thanks.
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Old 10-20-2010, 02:59 AM
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Default RE: Tamiya KT - A beginners build

run a search at eb@y using "Tamiya 1/16 King Tiger", that is one of efficient ways to find many parts

http://jbwid.com/art74c.htm
this is also one of the great sites that talk about details of building King Tiger, with aftermarket parts recommendations.

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Old 10-20-2010, 02:59 AM
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Default RE: Tamiya KT - A beginners build

etoarmour.com will have most, if not all, you need. I've built a KT or two, and a JT. Plenty of us can give advice. I always use a gear down, as I go for off road speeds. Daryl Turner gear box brace is pretty much a must, as is his spring loaded idler system if you plan on using plastic tracks.

Here's a couple photos of my King and JT, and the interior of JT/KT. Don't pay attention to the transmissions, they are special competition units from eto. Rumor has it they will be available again soon.

Lots of little things you can do, like the brass stock cross hull braces I make for my KT's, sealing the hull front and back from dust, etc etc. Also some tweaks of the elevation and rotation system, both posted in threads on this forum, and the Schumo ZUH30 turret rollers. They get your turret up off the paint, being slightly larger than stock.

I use the black long cans, again available from eto (I'm the owner, by the way, but also an avid tanker), and run quite well. Lots of us here have done KT's, so any questions, just ask!
Sev
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Old 10-20-2010, 08:50 AM
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Default RE: Tamiya KT - A beginners build

Whoa - a lot more info already available out there. I should have known....
I'll defer to those sources - this thread not really needed.
Thanks for the fast responses.
Sev - thanks for the offer to help. Likely an order will be coming your way soon...
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Old 10-20-2010, 09:52 AM
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Default RE: Tamiya KT - A beginners build

You can ask for advice or make an order, or both. All will be handled with alacrity.
Sev
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Old 10-20-2010, 12:31 PM
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Default RE: Tamiya KT - A beginners build

Sev is correct he owns ETO Armor and has been in the Tank Biz a long time that's were I buy my Tamiya upgrade parts from very good service and help also just ask him if he don't already know hill find out .

Thanks
Jimmy
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Old 10-20-2010, 01:12 PM
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Default RE: Tamiya KT - A beginners build

Alacrity. Whoa big word! I know big words too. How about "davenport"
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Old 10-20-2010, 02:02 PM
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Default RE: Tamiya KT - A beginners build

An older word for 'sofa' if memory serves. Grin. Or was it the guy who invented the porch swing? Dang, now you've confused me.
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Old 10-20-2010, 05:41 PM
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Default RE: Tamiya KT - A beginners build



AH drat! Now I want  KT again!!! SEV!! HELP!!!!!!!!!

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Old 10-20-2010, 07:07 PM
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Default RE: Tamiya KT - A beginners build

Hey Dan! Glad to see you ventured over to model tanks.[sm=thumbs_up.gif]

With your impressive work with the [link=http://www.modelsailingships.com/]SC&H[/link] kit, I'm certain we'll soon see one of the best King Tiger builds here.

Bob can take care of you in the spare parts department - he's a straight shooter, carries a well stocked line & will sell you only what you'll need for that KT.
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Old 10-20-2010, 11:13 PM
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Default RE: Tamiya KT - A beginners build

One serving of 'help' coming right up.
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Old 10-21-2010, 12:35 AM
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Default RE: Tamiya KT - A beginners build

Herrmill - Hello again - it's a small world!
Sev - e-mailed you "the list".

OK. The Tamiya KT build, from basic to advanced, parts, upgrades, suppliers, etc etc have been well covered already, so I won't duplicate posting that kind of info. as I first thought would be useful. I'll post my build progress with pics even tho it will likely be very repetitious. The "big box" is being delivered tomorrow by Fedex. Only two days from ordering at Rare Plastic Hobby - pretty quick. I'll be tearing into that right away.

Here's a vid clip of a Tiger I gun blast produced with a simple nichrome firing mechanism and a very small black powder charge. This is the same approach I use on the 18 firing guns on my 1/24 scale R/C ship model Syren.
The barrel is brass tubing, the muzzle brake is the stock HL plastic part. The barrel is wedged in the tiger's metal tracks for this demo setup. The blast produces little heat - the plastic muzzle brake is safe. No projectile is, or can be, used with this setup.
A very small BP charge wrapped into flash paper cartridge is used. The cartridges are pre-made and easily slipped into the tip of the barrel - into a chamber only about 1" deep. There is only slight kick/recoil.
A nichrome heater wire at the back of the chamber ignites the charge. Instead of flashing the blast LED, the wires will be used to ignite the charge and the recoil mechanism timing should be about right with the ignition. This will likely be the system I install in the KT barrel.
[link=http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showatt.php?attachmentid=3164385&d=1270438954]Tiger muzzle blast[/link]
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Old 10-21-2010, 12:40 AM
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Default RE: Tamiya KT - A beginners build

Niiiice!!!!!!!!!
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Old 10-21-2010, 12:45 AM
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Default RE: Tamiya KT - A beginners build

I love watching builds. Keep the pics coming. Good job so far.[sm=thumbs_up.gif][sm=thumbs_up.gif][sm=thumbs_up.gif]
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Old 10-21-2010, 01:35 AM
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Default RE: Tamiya KT - A beginners build

Interesting. How about reloads for the blast?

Answered your email of this AM with detail. That should get us started on this deal. I'll be here off and on all day.
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Old 10-21-2010, 02:54 AM
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Default RE: Tamiya KT - A beginners build

Looking forward to your build!

Here is a list of the dealers I have bought from:

[link=http://www.axels-modellbau-shop.de]Axel - click on englisch version and then on King Tiger 1/16[/link]

[link=http://www.professionalkits.de/shop/index.php/cat/c24_K-nigstiger-1-16.html/XTCsid/152pj52sro85dd7n323lchfe83]Professional[/link]

[link=http://www.aber.net.pl]ABER[/link]

[link=http://www.wecohe.de]Wecohe[/link]

To your question of the modified axes - yes that is necessary - but if you do not get to much weight on your Tiger (mine has 5 kg) Axels solution is good enough - if you want to have near to 10 kg you should use the wecohe system - but it is to expensive for that what you get - and - not original like Axels (shumo) system.
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Old 10-21-2010, 10:11 AM
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Default RE: Tamiya KT - A beginners build

Sevoblast - the gun will be reloaded by simply inserting a small cartridge made by rolling flash paper wth a bit of black powder or black powder substitute inside.
Here's a conceptual drawing of a separae brass tip approach, but I may just use the stock barrel and add a plug to create the firing chamber. Need to examine the kit when it arrives.
This may be the first thing I work on when I get the kit.
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Old 10-21-2010, 10:25 AM
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Default RE: Tamiya KT - A beginners build

WOW ! That it an interesting idea! I am really looking forward to your first experiences!
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Old 10-21-2010, 10:32 AM
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Default RE: Tamiya KT - A beginners build

That should work, and with your obvious skills, I'm sure it's doable. In 1/10 scale, a blank fire pistol is used, attached to the main tube, semi auto generally. Gives rather a blast as you can see from the photo from Odessa last year. Really a crowd wowser.
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Old 10-24-2010, 01:40 PM
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Default RE: Tamiya KT - A beginners build

Started construction on this beautiful kit and ordered the first round of mechanical upgrades. Focusing on improving the bearings in the idlers and on an idler tensioning system. I have a small lathe, etc, so I'm making the suspension mod's myself - more on those later.
Attached is the info on progress so far on the firing gun system. Plenty of smoke and a good bang. Drawback is that it's a single shot system, but it is very easy to reload. The clip shows a test setup. To fire the gun is simple - work yet to do on how to integrate the recoil effect, etc.
DO NOT try this. This design is very dangerous until you know the precautions and exact material and loading details. Only a VERY small amt of BP is used. DO NOT use a firecracker - it WILL blow the barrel apart.

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TpacqpoeqsM[/youtube]
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Old 10-24-2010, 09:59 PM
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Default RE: Tamiya KT - A beginners build

The road wheels have some nice bushings, but the idlers that take a lot of load don't have bushings or bearings, just the steel axle riding on the cast metal surfaces. So I added brass bushings and sealed ball bearings. Also made up a new axle profiled for the added bearings.
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Old 10-24-2010, 10:28 PM
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Default RE: Tamiya KT - A beginners build

Interesting and new stuff you are showing here. Like the black powder effect.

You can buy flare shells called "Bear Scare" we use the in the Bush all the time to keep bears away. It too is a one time shot. Highly dangerous and no doubt illegal when used on an RC tank The Bear scare is set off by a mechanical pin, it fires and goes out about 30 ft, and then explodes and sounds like a rifle shot with a cloud of smoke

I was going to thread one on the end of an airsoft tank. and then load up a metal bb to act as the firing pin. When I do this I will take a video. The cool thing about these bear scares is there is a helluva bang and smoke at the intended target 30 ft out!!!!!!!!
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Old 10-24-2010, 11:51 PM
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Default RE: Tamiya KT - A beginners build

Splendid work, Dan. That's the way to do it, bearings where possible. I REALLY need to get an operating lathe here! Miss having that tool for sure.
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Old 10-25-2010, 12:00 AM
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Default RE: Tamiya KT - A beginners build

Idler Tensioner, Battery

Decided not to use the stock tensioner. Used the existing kit parts (as shown by sevoblast and others) to rig up a tensioner spring. Have no idea yet how strong or long the spring should be, but it's pretty stiff and I have even stiffer springs if needed. Also made up a new, longer cross axle.

Also added strips of aluminum U-channel to stiffen the bottom of the hull and to make a motor/gearbox stiffener frame.
I know I can buy all this stuff, but I have the tools to make it all, and I'd rather save the $'s for more external details.

Found a 6 x sub-C NiMH battery pack rated at 5000mAh. Is there a similar size higher capacity NiMH pack out there?

Thanks.

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Old 10-25-2010, 01:23 AM
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Default RE: Tamiya KT - A beginners build

Proof will be in the pudding when you put metal tracks on. Spring has to be pretty stiff for them, and the idler support drum has to move freely in it's axis of movement to work well. I use straight 10W-40 oil to lube the one Tiger I have spring loaded idlers in. Works, but of course with the talc fine powdered dust we have here in summer, needs cleaning after long runs.
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