Strato50

Hey guys.. I'm trying my best not to bury the forum in Panzer IV threads but I think I need some fresh eyes on this one.

So far I've installed my new Mato metal wheels on my P4, with new sprockers & idler and almost immediately noticed the track & sprocket alignment was way out! I did the usual troubleshooting but upon realizing the track & IDLER were out by the same amount, it dawned on me that it was the wheels themselves that were sitting closer to the hull than the stock plastic ones.

So my question is this; I still have the stock plastic suspension arms installed with the metal wheels... does anyone know if the metal-upgrade suspension 'push' the matching metal roadwheels out further thereby aligning the wheels, idler & sprocket?

I think it'll take someone comparing the 2 pieces together to see if they do...

...but as always RCU I'm confidant I'll have an answer soon :P

As you can see in these pictures, I've mounted the stock plastic wheel & metal wheel to the same bogie. The plastic wheel sticks out at least 3-4mm further than the metal because of the design difference.

Airbrushler

sorry Strato
it was making me dizzy looking at the pics

Strato50

I can always count on you to fix my pictures when I'm too lazy! :P

Airbrushler

could you put some kind of spacers in

Strato50

I was thinking of that but, I don't think so.. the screw that holds the wheel on doesn't tighten against the wheel itself but against the end of the axle. The head of the screw stops the wheel from falling off. Any spacer I put behind the wheel / under the screw head will give me fewer precious threads to keep the wheel on...

Same goes for putting spacers behind the bogie itself. Doesn't really work, everything gets wobble-y :P

From the few pictures I've found of the metal suspension, it actually looks like it sticks out further. I'm just not sure :\

jarndice

Strato, This is how I dealt with it, First I bought Metal Suspension from WDM I also bought Metal Rollers and Metal Return Roller Mounts, The Mounts come with Metal Axles and "C" clips. I cut off the plastic mounts which gives you the opportunity to drop the rear mounts by 4 to 4.5 mm to fix one of the Heng Long shortcomings, I threw the " C " clips in the bin and fitted "R" clip( if you do not know what I mean, there used to hold R/C car bodies together) easy to install and remove if needed. Then I installed the Metal Suspension and guess what? both the rollers and the wheels were sitting in too close!!! Fortunately being an ex-soldier I was able to recall some bad language. I bought a pack of .6mm flat washers amd a pack of 3.5 mm flat washers, I found a pair of .6 washers and 1x 3.5 washer per axle in the following style worked ( ROLLERS AXLE 2 x6 washers 1 x3.5 washers Hull then "R" clip. The Wheels you will need to experiment with how many washers but it will work. I used 16mm heavy duty servo screws with a 2.5mm thread self tappers with a Hex Head to hold the wheels to the axle which is plenty long enough, smear some thread lock on then tighten , grasp the wheel as you back off the spanner and when you have free movement it is right. Using a Hex head means you cannot fit the wheel caps although the wheels look ok as is. If you can get Counter-sunk Screws you would solve that problem. I bought all the fixings from Modelfixings.co.uk but there are plenty of suppliers in the United States can help. If you intend to fit Metal Engine Hatches come back to the Forum because it is not straight foreward. Good luck. shaun

Strato50

Hmmm that's discouraging.. so you had both the metal road wheels AND metal suspension and it was too short?

I'd LIKE to think they actually built these upgrades for the tank and made sure they fit..

I have x50 M3 button head hex screws and a bunch of M3 washers as well that fit nicely into the metal wheels... I plan to tap the metal suspension for the M3 bolts and avoid the whole issue of self tapping screws into metal. Half of the time they snapped inside the hole on my Panzer III build..

I would be eternally grateful to anyone that can compare the metal & plastic suspension pieces together and tell me the difference! :P

jarndice

I assure you it is an adventure upgradeing a Heng Long Panzer 4, As I mentioned earlier no one told me that when you cut out the plastic engine bay hatches you also cut out the rear retaining struts, It is ok if you know about the magnet and locating rod alternative to the locating screws but it caused me a few head scratching moments, and being as bald as a Badger I can ill afford that. and if you do continue I would recommend you fit the Metal Driver and Radio operator Hatches, if only so you can get the Locating Rods aligned when assembling the two halves Do have fun, after all this is a hobby!!! shaun

Green Amphibian

I do not have the metal wheels yet, but I can discern no diffrence in the plastic axles and the metal axles.

Herman

yellowshaker

My Feedback: (1)

I have just installed the asiatam metal suspension to a PIV as well as the tensioners. The wheels line up fine on this tank. I am waiting for the metal road wheels and return rollers to arrive now as well.

Strato50

This is so weird & confusing, uggh. But thank you all for your input it's been invaluable.

Strato50

First off...





Anyhoo, I haven't heard from anyone else who tried out the Mato metal wheels for the Panzer IV... just wondering if anyone else knows of ways to mount them without messing them all up!

Seems, as noted above, spacers and washers will work... and maybe some drilling. Worst money ever spent in this hobby

MAUS45

Herman, those are swing arms for the Panzer III, I think Strato was looking for a comparison of the Panzer IV suspension parts?

yellowshaker

My Feedback: (1)

Starto, here isa link to abuild of the PIV using all metal parts. It might help if you look at the photos to see any differences with your suspension problems.
http://translate.google.com/translat...l.php%3Fsid%3D

CHIEFSONN

Hope this help you with yor panzer IV, this is what I have on mine. it has the metal return rollers & return roller supports along with the metal suspension and the plastic road wheels .which also includes using the metal drive sprocket and Idler. with this set up everything is in line. I have some measurements for you to compare.
the plastic return roller and wheel is a total length 25.75 mm the metal is 22.87 with the metal suspension and the plastic wheels attached to the chassis I have a measurement of 27.21mm.

Strato50

Thanks guys :P For now my Mato metal wheels will be sitting on a shelf for awhile. I still find it hard knowing Mato still sells this wheel set... and nobody else noticed their wheels rubbing against the suspension stops and being 1/4" out of line with the sprocket and idler... yikes!!