trackmech81

So my Abrams arrived on Wednesday and worked flawlessly thanks to Erik at Imex. I already had a set of Chunwai tracks and sprockets so I decided to see how it ran with those. The sprockets were a no-go as the shaft was the wrong everything, but I still tried the tracks. I was supprised to see they fit with very little issue at all. The lack of a functional idler does cause a sagging issue due to being on the loose side. I ran the tank about 30 min with the heavier track and did not notice a bit of difference in speed or power drain. The 4:1 gears are amazing....It is too slow for a modern tank with the lower gears but some higher speed motors or maybe a 3:1 option...hint hint.....it will be better. I am going to start my experiments on an aluminum hull and functioning idler...the real system is simple and should be easy to replicate. We shall see. I work a lot and have three kids so it will take some time.

Max-U52

I might have just the motors for you. Let me play with them for a couple more days to see. If you want to see specs now I'm playing with 360SH-2885 motors in the 3v to 9v range. I've already tried them in a Tiger One and they make a HUGE difference in speed. I'll probably be ready to post the video early next week.

trackmech81

That would be nice. If I could increase the speed by 1/3 it would be close...of course twice would be perfect for an Abrams at full throttle. And the 4:1 gears would be awesome torque. Keep me posted....also, what price range?

Max-U52

$7 for two including shipping. Little water pump motors from ebay. Just take off the pumps and solder the leads and caps. I think I'm gonna order two more to try them out in other tanks.

trackmech81

Wow. That is cool. Let me know how it works and I would live to test it in the Abrams. If you could make the necessary changes to the motor I would pay a little extra. I stink at that part of the hobby.

Max-U52

OK, but it may be week or two before I'm happy with results. The last thing I want to do is steer anybody wrong so let me take the time to be thorough and I'll keep ya posted.

Max-U52

I don't have an abrams to test these motors in, so I'm wondering what might be a good comparison to the M1. At first I thought maybe the ZTZ-99A might be a good candidate, being a similarly sized modern tank, but it won't take the high/low motor configuration. So what do you guys think would give a good idea of how these motors will work in the M1? The king tiger, maybe? A full metal Tiger I? Right now they're in 4 shaft axle bearing gearboxes with 58mm shafts, but I can change to 48 if I want to try the Imex full metal T1. My other choices that use 58mm shafts besides the Imex King Tiger (Porsche turret) are the Imex Panther G, or the Imex M-26 Pershing, and they both have metal tracks, sprockets and idlers. If I change to the four shaft 48mm boxes they'll have zinc gears and axle bearings and I'll probably use the Imex full metal Tiger. That's a pretty heavy tank. It ships at 22 lbs. so it's probably around 18 or 19 pounds, and I can show a side by side comparison with an identical tank with stock motors. If nobody replies by the time I feel like doing it I'll probably use the KT.

trackmech81

I plan on running mine with the metal tracks and sprockets, as well as more metal for the hull and suspension. I live in the wooods and my tanks go over roots, hills, ditches, the kids Barbie car.....you get the idea. I want this thing solid, but that means a little weight will result.

Max-U52

I'll use the Imex Full Metal Tiger I Early. It must weigh at least 18 lbs. I already installed the motors in one and you won't believe it when I get a chance to shoot outdoor video (rainin' here). I have more than one of these tanks so I can do side by side with a completely stock version. Just in the living room of my tiny little hovel the new motors pull away by almost a complete tank-length in just about 8 feet. Low speed control; is still good and I can creep and spin on just one track from a standstill, but it takes a lot more "touch" than it used to. Fortunately this is one of the tanks that will run on the 9X TX, and it will be my first Mako/RC2TG as soon as that arrives (it's been shipped).

Augustus1967

I'll be watching as well...

Not planning to Crack On with my M1 till after the First...
I also have a few Sets of Alternate Motors to test in it.
But Heck, if your Test Motors Fit The Bill... I could always find a use for Extra Motors...
Specially at the Price you are talking about.



-gus

philipat

Another option is to get some 480 motors and higher tooth-count pinions. Use that on the 4:1s. You'll get more speed while keeping the low-end control and torque. That's what I put on my Bulldog and was able to get scale road speeds while still being able to climb some hills (metal tracks and weights in the front end). You'll have to re-drill the mounting holes because the higher tooth-count pinions also have a larger diameter. I found that the Duratrax Vendetta/Mini Quake pinions work well.

Interested in what maxu comes up with, too...

Max-U52

OK, Men, here's the end result. How we got here is a kinda long story. These motors will definitely produce higher top speed in the new abrams. These two tanks weigh about 18 pounds each, and the power difference is extremely noticeable. On a tank as light as the abrams I'm guessin' at least a 20% increase in top end. I'm thinkin' about doin' a Squad video on the whole motor swap thing, with takin' the pinions off spare stock motors with a torch and puttin' the EMI caps on and all that happy horsehockey. Anybody need to see that, or would it just be boring? Both these tanks have the Imex/Taigen four shaft gearboxes with bearings at the axle shafts and bushings at the gear shafts.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gzW9U5pkMiA

philipat

Interesting results...the how-to video and info on the motors would be interesting. Always good to have options.

The faster tank look like it is still a little too slow for an Abrams, Leopard or ZTZ-99. Better speed test would be mark off about 25 m on that road and time how long it takes to cover the distance. Give the tanks a running start so that they are are full speed when you start the 25-m stretch. That will give you a top end road speed, which can be scaled and compared to the real thing.

Max-U52

I'm thinking about trying them in the ZTZ-99A. That has 3 shaft black steel gears. I did this a couple weeks ago, pick it up at 1:10. Do you think that's fast enough? Is the 99A a decent comparison platform for the Abrams? I thought they were putting 3 shaft boxes in the M1 but I now know it's the 4 shaft. I'm waiting for those to be available. Of course, I'm still waiting on slip rings, too. One can only dream.

If the weather agrees I might put them in the 99A and give it a try.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sZo0KFmOOvQ

trackmech81

The speed is better, but I am after a touch more. The Abrams is a fast machine and the ramp up speed from stop to full is the fastest due to the turbine....not the best pack choice but whoever listened to the mechanics when designing anything military....I think scale 70mph would come out to around 4.5-5 MPH. From a scale point of view it is probably right on the money but the eye thinks it needs to be faster lol.

philipat

Stock HL motors and gearboxes (3:1) don't hit modern scale speeds. Closer to 30 mph, if I recall correctly, but no low-end control or torque. I use a set of 4-shaft steel gearboxes with 480s in the Bulldog and get scale road speeds of 45 mph with good torque. Faster would mean a 16 or 18-tooth pinion and that might not fit on the gearboxes. You'd have to try it.

The gearboxes were what RCCommand used to sell before it went out of business. They were actually made by a former RCU member (haven't seen him in awhile) by taking multiple gearboxes, stripping gear and shaft from one and installing it into another. I think he got 3 4:1 gearboxes from 4 3:1 gearboxes. I'm guessing that the new Taigen 4-shaft boxes will be better built, especially if they are all ball-bearings. I wouldn't move from a 4:1 to a 3:1 if you want torque and off-road and hill performance. Just go with the bigger motors and pinions. Not sure that 70 mph is realistic in an Abrams anyways. It might be capable of that on paper or even the track at the factory with an infinite supply of parts, but I think that the military maintains controls to keep the speeds slower (around 45 mph) and thus less stressful on the system.

trackmech81

Philipat, I am stating the 70 from experience. The Bradleys in my troop were consistently hitting 60mph after each semiannual service....I know because I read tested them. We did have one Bradley command BFIST that we put a new motor in because the one we deployed with dropped a valve and wrecked the head. After the new motor we hit 67 on a dirt road behind FOB Falcon's trash pile. While in sector though, the guys always complained about the Abrams pulling away from them while running route Irish.

I like the all metal bearing boxes I got with this tank. Well worth the money, and will try swapping in different motors. I am tempted to see what my Tamiya Leo 540s will do lol.

hiramekisama

I'm trying to find a good gearbox and motors combination for my Leopard 2A6 as well. In my opinion, the my ideal gearbox has to satisfy three things: High torque, high speed, and low noise.

From trials and errors, I found the following to be true:

1. High gear reduction is great for torque and for running at low speed, so the noise is also low. However, as soon as you put in high speed motors to a high gear reduction gearbox and running at high speed, the gearbox shrieks like a dying cat. This is a turn off for me. My 2A6, even with 3:1 steel gearbox and stock motors, the gearbox noise is still undesirable.

2. From trials and errors, I found that low reduction reduces gearbox noise significantly. Which kinda makes sense now, since you're taking off one gear spur, one less gear that's making noise. 2:1 gear reduction has high speed and low noise, but also low torque. To compensate for the low torque, I put in 540 banebot motors and running at 12V on a 50A dual motor controller. The torque is good, very high speed, and I'm content with noise (but still not ideal).

Here is the result:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TeN-8Ff285Q&feature=youtu.be Gearbox noise matters a lot to me because I want to hear my sound system. And this is where metal tracks also fell out of favor for me. Metal tracks at high speed creates a lot of noise that's undesirable.

trackmech81

Haha. That is fast. The whine would blend with the Abrams turbine sound from the Benedini I plan on running, but still need torque. I am also looking at brushless with 7.4 lipo battery as another viable option.