Strato50

If you dig through the forum you can see where I put way more effort into explaining this, but for mercy's sake here goes.. Taigen started out marketing hopped-up HL tanks. They've come a long way, have their own products and their own brand new molds and hulls which is amazing really. They started out taking Asiatam parts (Now basically all called Taigen) and selling them installed.. metal tracks, suspension, wheels etc.

So basically Taigen has the (generally) the EXACT same internal mechanics as a HengLong. Besides unique hulls like the T-34, most of the gearbox, drive sprocket, tracks, motors, connectors wires and plugs are all meant to be cross compatible.

On another note the "New" HL 2.4ghz radio systems are complete crap. They don't have proportional steering, meaning you cannot slow down the inside turn track.. it just stops. It makes scale driving impossible and looks like hell. The old RX-18 were better in that regard. As per new Tiger and Leopard sounds, I haven't heard of that at all besides this thread.... HL for YEARS has used the same rackety ratchety clunky crappy track and engine sounds since day one.

YHR

The T90 is supposed to have the new electronics in it. As far as control goes I heard the past 2.4 ghz ones weren't good. Not sure if they have improved this with the new board or not.

Jay-Em

Are you talking about the 1st gen 2.4ghz Heng Long controllers when calling them "crap"? Or are you talking about the second-gen sets, with the new, black transmitter with integrated volume control and smoker switch? The last gen receiver is recognizable by the missing smoker-switch socket, and volume-pot connection.

The last gen controller is most certainly proportional, be it still a bit 'rough' compared to, say, a Sabertooth 2x12.

Only thing that's really unpleasant is the current small round speaker. That is, indeed "crap". I replaced it with a Taigen 3w unit.

T Skaz

Right to the point! Thanks, Tim

jarndice

[QUOTE=Jay-Em;12239105]Are you talking about the 1st gen 2.4ghz Heng Long controllers when calling them "crap"? Or are you talking about the second-gen sets, with the new, black transmitter with integrated volume control and smoker switch? The last gen receiver is recognizable by the missing smoker-switch socket, and volume-pot connection.


I absolutely agree with you JAY-EM,
It has never ceased to surprise me how much bad mouthing HENG LONG Products get on this Forum,
It is a fact that unlike any other maker of 1/16 Armour Heng Long market their products as "TOYS" there is no pretension about them But it does not alter the fact that if you want an entry point to this hobby and do not wish to spend $700 on a Panzer4 from TAMIYA when Heng Long are selling a similar product for less than $100 which to a newcomer to our hobby looks exactly the same it is a no brainer.
Too many people get mighty pretentious about this hobby,
Well I buy Heng Long and Taigen and Torro and when I have the spare cash Tamiya but I like the Heng Long because as a builder whichever of the makes I have just named is on my work bench it will be Sawn, Soldered, and Upgraded until it is what I want it to be,
I am happier doing that to a $100 Tank then a $500 Torro whose sole difference is a paint job that I am almost certainly going to remove and use my own paint and weathering on..
If you favour TAMIYA well good for you fellows, but unless you have something relevant and CURRANT to say about Heng Long then leave them alone please.
Shaun.

YHR

I don't know who you are addressing? I have 24 personal tanks, 3 are Tamiya the rest are Heng Long. I have been cutting and bashing Heng Long for years, and think they are a great entry level tank. However the electronics are not up to what most RC guys would expect. Plain and simple, that isn't bashing, that is just the truth.

Cheers


Dan

jarndice

[QUOTE=YHR;12239186]I don't know who you are addressing? I have 24 personal tanks, 3 are Tamiya the rest are Heng Long. I have been cutting and bashing Heng Long for years, and think they are a great entry level tank. However the electronics are not up to what most RC guys would expect. Plain and simple, that isn't bashing, that is just the truth.

Cheers.
Dan you may be sure I am not addressing you,
I am thinking of people whose first introduction to our world was a Heng Long 1/16 Tank of 5 + years ago which fell apart and really defined the phrase "Cheap & Nasty" they rightly moaned to all who would listen and generally ended by stating never again,
But instead of excepting the word of people who are buying more up to date Heng Long Tanks they persist with telling their friends, family, workmates and members of this Forum stories that have no relevance to the products of today.
.When I was a boy the phrase "Made in Japan" simply meant RUBBISH, AVOID. as time passed the comments stopped and moved on to "Made in Hong Kong" and then the Peoples Republic of China discovered Capitalism and so that comment was again made worldwide about Chinese products,
BUT time and the profit margin tells us that the products coming from the Peoples Republic are of much better quality and I refer to all aspects of Chinese manufacturing,
After all where does Tamiya get many of their products made today ? Or BMW ? or many other household names.
But if you thought my criticism was referring to you then I offer my unreserved apologies.
Shaun.

YHR

No issue, but not sure who you were addressing. I agree that Heng Long have improved on the details . They are more like kits then they used to be. The Leo, Challenger and the T90 look great. If they spent $25 more on making the electronics with PWM signals that could control servos they would be in home run territory for me. They are so very close, so lets keep our fingers crossed and see if they cross into the real RC control world I think they will and when they do upgrading electronics will be easier and cheaper.


Cheers


Dan

afv aficionado

Re Taigen/Heng Long compatibility, be aware that Taigen uses a 4mm screw to attach the sprockets to the drive shaft of their gearboxes, whereas HL use a 3mm one. Taigen chose the larger one to increase durability.

Mal

Strato50

I am, regarding the first gen. Haven't seen a second gen, but whatever it was that came with my HL Sherman and HL T-34, was absolute JUNK. HL went back a step for the sake of slapping a fancy 2.4 GHZ!!! onto the box, a cheap marketing ploy. Hated it.

[QUOTE=jarndice;12239149]Not pretentious at all I've been into r/c tanking for 5 years and now have 12 operational tanks ALL of which either started out as Heng Long or still retain most of their HL origins to some extent. HL's Sherman was a good start but it's still a HL. Tamiya doesn't interest me.

CaptainB

I like YHR's view - if Heng Long or Taigen come out with a servo based RC ready tank system - then it's a big step forward. After all, in the RC aircraft world, Almost Ready To Fly (ARTF) models have been around for years now and have everything included except a receiver and batteries which the consumer supplies thru choice. Why not this approach for the tank world? - just a thought.

Cheers

CaptB

superrod

My Feedback: (16)

I was thinking the same thing CaptianB about the tanks and the electronics. This may be something the IMEX guys could think about. I am new to tanks but not rc and prefer good radios that I can set and tune to the response I am looking for. So these would be "almost ready to roll" ARTR tanks. I think there is a market for this and I would like to have the option instead for a box full of radios in the closet.
Jimmy

Jay-Em

@jarndice

Ah, yes, the word I was looking for was "pretentious".

I understand the caveats that s.c. "serious RC-modellers" have with Heng-Long, however, Heng Long néver pretended to deliver top-of -the-line-super-detailed rc tanks. They are firmly aiming their products at the "toy-market", but they álso cater to the rc-tech heads by delivering a product that's very kit-bash friendly, modular, and pretty sturdy.

The current metal tracks and gears releases are starting to cross-over into "serious RC" territory. They're about on par with the very first 1/16 Tamiya tank, the old Sherman, which was -by our current Tamiya standards- ehh.. "Humble" wiper-msc's and all.

Problem is, that the price of reasonably well equipped HL's increased accordingly. It máy discourage beginners, that see an Hobby Engine M1 for much less, and buy that. A far less "mod-friendly"platform -though the hull and top are quite usable tbh- with sub-par performance, éven when compared to the cheapest all-plastic Heng Long. And then decide that the Tank hobby is not for them.

The inverse starting point: fancy, all elmod benedini beier scary pricey steel etc. will álso put the fear of god in someone that wants to start in the Tank hobby. Declaring Heng long toy- or rather, beginner Tanks "crap" from the get-go, while pointing at scary expensive, complex custom-builds as "the only way to get something" is counter-productive imho.

It's not only Tankers that get all high&mighty by times. The same goes for Crawling, Buggies, you name it. People like their big-buck rc-toys. No shame in that, but for newbies things get scary expensive and complex pretty quick, overwhelmed as they get by a barrage of -well meant, but often poorly aimed- "advise" by people that are immersed in the hobby.

What I mean to say, is that Heng Long, Torro, Taigen, all the cheaper Tanks fullfill a purpose with their -relative- low prices and mostly admirably working, but ultimately rather simple- electronics. They let people get a taste of the hobby, and some of those people will eventually fork-out for a tamiya or a seriously modded Heng Long with more expensive running-gear and electronics than even the most expensive Tamiya.

Slagging the cheaper brands off because they are simple, or even "below" some people? Nope. Wrong way to go about it. Yelling "crap" is easy, gently coaxing people in the hobby by first suggesting the cheaper options, without getting all hot&bothered about the "missing" features, is a bit harder, but ultimately more rewarding when one sees thet kid with the Heng-Long tiger starting to ask advise and carefully upgrade it.

My 2c.

*steps off his box*

T Skaz

Hey Dan, Will the the Benedini TBS correct that violent tank recoil? Where the tank jumps like grasshopper! Or will I still need the ATRC to correct it? Tim

Imex-Erik

Hehe, something is being worked on for sure. The TBS should have no issue with the next board from Taigen. You will be able to use your own transmitter and for sounds.... well lets just say you will have options and wont need to purchase something new to change them There is also of course another one we are working with someone now, if you were at Danville earlier this year you would of got to see it function there. That board also accepts the TBS with no issue at all either and can do MUCH more.

YHR

Good to hear Erik. That is what we need, and confirms my suspicion and decision to quit making the BARC. People will be able to buy the $120 TBS and add it to their stock electronics and get some of the best sounds available if they choose. I am guessing you guys are probably working on better stock sounds so that perhaps most won't even care for an upgrade.

All of this is why I never invested heavily into the 3rd party electronics. Just about the time a guy has spent the time and money to developed the "perfect system" Taigen or Heng Long will come out with something stock that will get people 90% there.

Thanks again for the info.

YHR

No the BARC eliminated the recoil, the TBS does not . However the TBS is a non starter if you aren't upgrading to a PWM radio system. So this means to use the TBS you need at least a Clark board, and with that you don't have the stupid recoil Jerk.

Erik's latest comments are very good news indeed. This means that the future Taigen electronics are crossing in to that Homerun hit that I mentioned earlier. A RTR run tank with a a Standard RC radio that will allow everything from servo speed reducers to Benedini sound to be hooked right up without having to gut the electronics completely.

Cheers

Dan

T Skaz

Thanks Dan! Sure happy that you are out there to help. Now did you or some one else say that there is a cheap Clark board for 20 bucks? I Purchased the new upgraded Heng Long with the 2.4 transmitter (in Black). I'm going to do what you suggested and upgrade the recoil and turret elevation with that Clark servo unit. And definitely installing a TBS sound board. By the way, what does PWM stand for? Tim

TheBennyB

On this argument again fella's...this vs that? I've come down to it essentially coming to a price point to what you want to do no matter the brand. For the most part this all relates to making the machine mechanically reliable and/or the addition of a battle system. Just my experiences of running most tanks over the years and battling long weekends at the Danville battlefield. I'm sure some have different results but after reading threads and witnessing multiple stock and modded machines over 15+ years of r/c tanking this is what I've experienced. I enjoy the vast options now in this hobby, wasn't long ago when you either bought a tamiya or gutted a HL to fit tamiya electonics in it along with a complete lower hull rebuild. Lots of options now to get any experience or hobby level involved in r/c tanking.

Backyard/dining room runner 4X a year = $150
Backyard/driveway/park trails 6X a year= $350
Backyard/driveway/park trails multiple times a year = $450
IR battle 2X a year running a couple battles per session = $450
IR battle multiple times a year running a couple battles per session = $600
IR battle multiple times a year running throughout the day for an entire weekend = $800

YHR

I think a Clark board is in the $100 range now for a new one. Now you might find an old one for less, but you need to be very careful when buying used electronics..

Cheers

Merganser

Are you planning on quantity discounts for my 5 Taigens and will these drop into HL?

CaptainB

That is good news Erik - look forward to seeing an ARTR tank in the near future........

Cheers

CaptB

Jay-Em

Oh, my!

That sounds really promising. For now, my 6-channel sets are occupying a Kyosho Blizzard with "the works", a modded Dickie Kassbohrer Pistenbully PB600, and the Bruiser. But being able to just bind a standard 6-channel to Heng Long/Taigen/Torro boards would be the best development of recent times, afa affordable tanking is involved, I'd say.

ausf

That's the best summary I've read. Not only is it spot on for the hobby as it exists today, but by leaving out brands and only using dollars, it's even more accurate because they are many ways to get to each plateau, but there's no escaping what it takes.

dgsselkirk

I totally agree Ausf. If you are a new person looking at this hobby this should be a great guideline for the $$$ you will spend to do what you want the tank to do...