Sebbe335

Hello!

I also have a ESM 335 and its almost finished. A Eflite pwr 160 in front and pwr 110 in rear. Also ESM V4 electric gear.

My question is what servo should I use for the nose wheel steering? how much torque is needed for steering this heavy plane? What servo do you use?


Regards from Sebastian in Sweden

bcrc

My Feedback: (19)

Not a lot. I just have an average full size servo in mine. It doesn't take much power to steer it.

visioneer_one

My Feedback: (506)

I went with an HV power system for the receiver, as I do on most of my big planes. No brownout worries when the receiver never sees less than 6V!

I used a Corona DS538 on my steering. Overkill.

Crashed mine on its unintended maiden flight ~2 years ago.

I had it all assembled and was doing motor runup and taxi tests... got gong a little too fast and she popped into the air. I went with it! Pulled the gear up and flew a couple of circuits. The plane tracked really nicely - the "arrow" nickname suits perfectly. Only issue was that I had the top hatch open so I never got it up to full speed... remember, I wasn't planning to fly it!

I slowed it down a bit too much on final and dropped heavily onto the right main. Tore the gear out on that side, damaged both wings and broke the nosewheel steering collar. The fuse and tail were OK... didn't even break the prop(s).



Inside the wing



After seeing just how lightly the gear mount plates were secured, I went ahead and ordered a new set of wings. I cut and fitted in in solid balsa blocks so that the plates are now secured to the top and bottom of the wing as well as to the sides of each rib.

Progress has slowed, as I have had no luck in sourcing a replacement steering arm. The original ESM part (i have the V2 electric retracts) was made of cast aluminum and not very strong to begin with, but it appears that ESM doesn't sell parts for these anyway so moot point. Really don't want to drop another $700+ for another full set of landing gear.

skubacb

Using an HS-965MG - 10 kg./cm. Not worried about the power to turn the wheel but the shock to a servo if the nose gear touches down slightly sideways or hits a rock, etc. The metal gears can take that shock. I had this servo sitting in a box and decided to use it since I normally use digital servos on everything else. An HS-5485 is the lowest end servo I put anywhere. Mostly throttles. I am sure it at 6.4 kg./cm it has enough torque to steer the nose wheel but I would never use it because of the potential shock loads.

skubacb

visioneer_one
I hope you know that there have been extensive failures of the V2 gear. I had them and took them out. Some people have had them last longer by putting a rubber bumper at the end of travel but have still eventually had the gear fail. They will either fail full up or full down (best case there). I finally fitted Sierra retracts for the DO-335. Expensive and they have a longer mount plate so you have to modify the mount rails. A few people have been having very good luck with Electron.com electric gear sets. I do not trust the Down & locked who make the electrics for Robart. I have just seen too many failures of their gear here at our club. The good thing about the Electrons is that you can order them with a wide set of retract angles and can also order them with the correct size hole for your struts. Finally, (and I wish they were available before I got the Sierras), you can get elecronic brakes that work from the same controller as the gear. Would love to have that.

nemesis4u

My Feedback: (77)

Visioneer_one,

please email me... I believe I may be able to assist you ;-)

[email protected]

mustang11

"The good thing about the Electrons is that you can order them with a wide set of retract angles and can also order them with the correct size hole for your struts."
would there be a link for these? sounds intriguing......... Thanks!!

skubacb

Sure. Should have posted it: https://www.electron-retracts.com/

mustang11

Thank you sir.........

snauwaertj

Hello Guys,
I am considering to buy the ESM do-335 to convert it in a do-435.
This means gas engine in the front and a jet engine in the back.
The plan would be to put a wren mw44 gold with 45N thrust behind the wing in the fuselage, and guide the thrust to the tail trough a thrust tube like on my other jets. On the front would be a 40cc engine.
I think the plane would be quite light because there would not be a lot of weight in the back.
The only doubt I have is if the airframe is strong enough for this kind of setup?
Are the planes from the start of the tread 6 years ago still alive? Has anyone tryd a full throttle dive out off the clouds?

Ram-bro

My Feedback: (101)

that sounds pretty interesting. Didn't know there was a 435. The wren 44 puts out about 12lbs of thrust if I remember. I think your biggest issue will be weight and room for the fuel. [ATTACH]2170523[/IMG][ATTACH]2170524[/IMG][ATTACH]2170525[/IMG]

snauwaertj

Why weight?
A wren mw44 weighs 600grams, this is the same weight of one eflite 160. And it would be positioned way more to the front. The 1,5 liter kerosine that would be needed is burned when it is time to land.
The only problem indeed could be positioning this 1,5 liter exactly on the CG.

Ram-bro

My Feedback: (101)

that was my thought. It can handle the weight as long as it is on the CG. Looking at the drawing from my post, the air inlet shouldn't be a problem and it leaves you room near the cg for fuel. So are you looking at cutting and modifying the fuse ? Removing the vert.lower stabilizer and air inlet being moved to the top of the fuse should be interesting . Why not start with a wood kit and modify as necessary? Believe me I am not trying to discourage, always trying to learn

snauwaertj

No sweat Bro, I am very happy at least one DO owner still replies to this tread.
I would not make this model superscale, I even think about doing the opposite.
The idea is to make him like he would be if someone would compeet with one in the Reno airraces today.
I would cover him completely with flitemetal sheets, and polish him like a mirror with Belgam alu polish.
About the air intake on top, the 435 never got out of prototype status. A few air intake and tail configurations where tried.
I think I should buy a book about the Do 335- 435... to git it a bit right.
Anyway I would not change the rudder downside, or it would not be an arrow "pfeil" anymore.

look @ this one:
[ATTACH]2170644[/IMG]
With some googeling I discovered that this would probably be the first air intake attempt to feed the jet in the back.

snauwaertj

Don't know if you can see the image
http://www.ww2shots.com/gallery/v/We...force.jpg.html

snauwaertj

Can anyone tell me the inside diameter of the front cowl?
I am looking what engine could fitt inside it?

Ram-bro

My Feedback: (101)

I only have the AL MASTERS 335, different kit, wish I could help, Its probably buried somewhere in this thread

snauwaertj

Just ordered the kit.
Are there guys out there who are flying this bird for many years?

skubacb

About three years. Running a DLE-35R and a DLE-20R. From experience I can tell you it will keep flying with just the 35. Hoping to never know what happens on just the 20. Solid flying but certainly not a speedster with those motors. I could not fit any bigger gasser in the rear. If I wanted more power I would put in two OS 1.60s. For take-off I use 17 degrees of flap. I have landed with full, half, and no flaps depending on the wind. Everyone really loves the very different sound of those two mismatched gas engines.

It would be much easier to just put a 50 up front. Because of the weight in the rear I had to weld up a steel plate platform that mounts to the front motor mounts and put about 5 lbs of lead up there. The rear exhaust tubes just come out on each side of the lower vertical fin. And I mean JUST clear the fin while rubbing against it. Had to weld a custom aluminum motor mount. Also, the rear firewall was way off 0 - 0. Had to glue a wood plate to the firewall and use a router to bring it parallel with the rear of the fuse. I had checked and luckily the rear of the fuse was 0 - 0.

Way too many other things to get the rear engine in properly. But I do love flying this thing.

snauwaertj

Very interesting to read. In your opinion, can the airplane handle much more power? I mean: are the wings strong enough?
What retracts are in your bird?
Do you have any movie from a flight?
Gas powered Do 335's seem to be very rare, they are all electric.

Johan

skubacb

In this thread there are more gas ones out there. The truth is it is much easier to make this plane electric rather than two gas engines. The installation of both engines is complcated by the fact that ESM sunk the firewalls into the fuse. So your access while putting the engines in is limited.

I think one in this thread had 60-65cc up front. The plane is made well enough to handle more power than I am using. I am sure that 65cc gives it some punch. No videos. I guess I never tend to video the planes. Stopped taking pictures on vacation etc. Just memories. I know that is weird these days. I would have no worries using more power since the plane is well built.

For me I am getting some vibration in the rear engine (again the electric is easier). I rebalanced everything but I think the DLE-20R just vibrates a little more than I want. The muffler came loose and that was why I landed with only the 35cc up front. With just the 35cc I am sure I could have gone around if it had been necessary. BTW have not weighed the plane but I picked up the Xicoy balancer and will weigh the plane next time out. To get the 20cc in I put the muffler in place then with the motor in the mount bolt the mount to the firewall. Red HiTemp RTG is already Then using a about a 8" tee handle hex wrench I bolt the muffler to the engine through the bottom access plate. I always make sure the mating surfaces on the motor and the muffler are flat so that only a thin smear of high temp RTG is used to mate them (no gasket). Do this with wet & dry sandpaper on top of plate glass.

I put in the Sierra gear. Kind of a pain since Sierra uses a longer mount plate than any other gear. So you have to modify the mounting rails in the aircraft. However, the gear are really first class and look great. I did that because the ESM electric retracts are known for their unreliability. VQ warbirds worked with me and took back the V2 ESM gear. Today I would probably use Electron gear. www.electron-retracts.com Had a friend that had them in 20 planes. Wide range of angles so you could get the nose gear right. Also, you can specify the size of your struts. The retracts I got recently for my 100cc FW-190 (ER-40eVo) are for up to a 38 lb aircraft. Next step up goes to 66 lbs.

A hard part for this plane I have seen no one talk about is putting on the wings at the field. 4 bolts. I changed over to hex head bolts and use a 90 degree power tool from Harbor Freight to put on the center bolts. Too small an area for my hands and they put the hole very close to a bulkhead. Then I put the aircraft on its nose, lower the gear and put in the front bolts. These are easy to put in. Plenty of room for your hands.

Bottom line for me was that this was a gas twin and I was going to build it that way. I am happy I did.

snauwaertj

I know electron, they make high quality products indeed. Using their ER40 evo retracts with the heavy duty swept legs they also make would make a durable landing gear that would dampen the shocks.
My plan is to put a 40Cc four stroke in the nose and put a 45N jet engine behind the cockpit with a thrust tube to the tail.
Did you reinforce the landing gear mounts in the wing?

Johan

skubacb

Don't think I reinforced the mounts. If you take a good look you will see that they used a thick plate that is well locked in. Have fun with that combo. I understand that version never flew but at least there is some documentation out there about it. Sounds like a really interesting thing to do!

Joespeeder

Opps, late to the party and posted redundant info.... Deleted.

skubacb

If you want to go bigger look at this video. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8PhoKUXhGr0 Just not all the way to the end as it does not end happily.
Engle Dornier 335 Kit 3W65 with a G-45 in the rear. It says it is 1/5 scale that puts the wingspan at 108' i.e. 45/5 However, it does not look that big to me but he sure should have had lots of power. Just kind of heavy to do the high speed stall. I could not find the Engle Kit anywhere.

BTW the biggest kit I know of out there is the Don Smith plans that they call 1/5 it is actually 1/5.5 or 98.8". Our ESM is 1/6.5.