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  1. #76

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    RE: Dealer ethics

    ORIGINAL: vallawyer


    ORIGINAL: Oberst

    ORIGINAL: Ramstein44

    One of the worst kit cutters/ designers I've personally ever delt with was with a company called innovative model products, aka IMP. I built one of their models which I purchased second hand and crashed it on maiden after two years of building. I bought another full wood kit from them paying about $800 for the kit. The quality of the wood was nice and the build was fast but the cowl was made of glass and plaster and was still wet when I got it. The design of the fuse in places had to be re-engineered to fit their plans/design. The cowl weighed as much as my labs doggy bowl and was very weak. I made several complaints to the company and I literally was cussed out, threatened to the point of me almost making a road trip out of it! I have a build on it on rcscailbuilders.. I've often heard that when it comes to kits the quality of a company product is based on the quanity of their product you see.. I've seen very few of their products.

    If you talk bad about them.. Be prepared literally for a fight! And they'll never do business with you or anyone around you ( like you'd want to) don't get on their bad side as thy have a grudge that never seems to go away. A lot of the pro builders here refuse to do business with them.


    Yes it's often like that at some RC forums. If you write that you had a problem with a company so everyone has a heads up, there will always be someone to try to take what you wrote and take it apart to try to insult or embarrass. The moderaters in here even locked my forum because they didn't like what I wrote about Glenn Torrance and my bad dealings with him.

    Glenn Torance himself came into my thread and admitted he was at fault, but still there were people who were not happy that I wrote about what happened. They acted like he was some kind of deity.

    All I want to know as a consumer of RC aircraft, is to know who screws who or what happens by whom in these threads. To me I work hard for every dollar I earn and in this tough economy I don't want my money messed with by dishonest hobby sites.

    I like ESM and KMP Warbirds, I have my eye on the Fw-190 and 109 right now. Hey tuskegee, your Stuka is craving a painted nose cone!


    Pete
    The moderation here varies like the wind blows, some people you can talk bad about all you want, others you can't say a thing, some people you can post all day about that company, others, they will remove your post.Ā* IĀ*cannot figure it out, but it is sure not straight.Ā* One moderator PMed me a hate mail about a certain company, and that same moderator removed many posts about that company.Ā* It's not right.


    I agree and I've noticed that as well. Only one moderator I personally have issues with, but the others I think are fantastic and wouldn't mind meeting them in person. If you have a problem with one, it isn't wise to have other moderators take sides of an issue because it's part of the golden rule that they all stick together. RCU and RCG would fall apart if the moderators didn't stick together. It's kind of like having a boss we don't like at work, we still know what needs to be done and still get the job done. I don't have to personally agree to what the boss does or says, and can still go on without having it affect my job preformance.

    Usually if a moderater has a problem with another moderator- it goes up the ladder and out of our earshot of the forum public and we never hear about it. I know it was like that when my wife was moderator at the Sim-outhouse many, many years ago, but again that's a different forum, different website, possibly different rules that they go by.


    The best moderators I've delt with in the past PM'ed me to warn that my post or comment was going to be removed if I didn't reword or change it. RCG does that, but again that's a different website forum. We have to give the moderators a break though, they have a hard job to do on top of living their own lives. Many of them have to travel all over the United States to do reviews then write about them so the general public gets an idea of what the new product is like. We have to make the decision if the product is worth buying in the end. RCU moderators do a lot more than just monitor our posts. All I know is I wouldn't want the job.

    I know for me if I'm interested in a product, I'm friends with a couple of moderators here who will gladly give me their personal opinion about a product in a PM or email just like they do to you. Thank God we have places like RCU to hang out, I've learned so much through the years and I'm still learning new things. This is a great place to hang out when I'm not in the middle of the flying season or in between builds.



    Pete

  2. #77
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    RE: Dealer ethics

    In that forum, there were no issues with the moderator until I was jumped. Just the company whom they favored which was also a site vender at the time.

    Venders ethics are the issue. IMP's ethics were the issue but they had a large group of personally I feel, "paid" followers!
    "IF" I'd stop staring at them, I'd get more done to them.
    Platt FW190, Holman FW190, Meister FW190, SIST FW190, TF FW190.

  3. #78
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    RE: Dealer ethics

    I just made an order from Hobbyking for 4x 6s 6000mah lipos. Ill report back as soon as they arrive...and these are coming from China..not a USA warehouse.

  4. #79

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    RE: Dealer ethics

    The last time I ordered from the US ware house it took 3 weeks for me to get 2 battery packs. When I ordered from China it gets here in a week. Go figure.
    91-Zulu

  5. #80

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    RE: Dealer ethics

    ORIGINAL: Ramstein44

    In that forum, there were no issues with the moderator until I was jumped. Just the company whom they favored which was also a site vender at the time.

    Venders ethics are the issue. IMP's ethics were the issue but they had a large group of personally I feel, ''paid'' followers!


    I tend to agree with you. I'm glad you think the same because for a while there I thought I was going nuts suspecting the same thing. I don't feel I'm so out of line now because I suspected there are people in here who work for suppliers and dealers to help push products. Do you know how many times I had people tell me a product was great only to find it was junk? When I first joined RCG and RCU many years ago when my Avitar was Luftwaffe Oberst, I asked how the Large Scale CMP/Nitroplanes Focke Wulf 190 was as a ARF. Most everyone said it was a fantastic ARF. When I got the plane... well, all I can say I won't buy another CMP/Nitroplanes aircraft anymore. It was horrible! I should have saved my money and bought a KMP instead. When I wrote how terrible it was I was attacked and torn apart. Same thing when I complained about Glenn Torrance. I dare anyone to write something negitive about GT in either the Scale Forum, Kit or at RCG.

    My attack was so bad a guy at RCG started a forum at his own private website to bash me personally. A guy felt bad and linked me to the privite site to read what this guy was saying. I responded to the informer not to bother because the owner of the website wasn't worth me going in to start a fight. What a idiot that guy was. You can't take a oppinion personal, it shows how weak minded this guy was.

    I guess if I got free stuff from GT or IMP it's understandable why I would want to defend them. But I don't get any free stuff because I'm too honest. If a product or customer service sucks I'm going to write about my experience in hopes that the supplier will improve what's lacking. How can you improve a business if you have no idea what people are saying about your business or product?

    We live and learn and don't get sucked in to arguements because that's what the Trolls want. Then the moderators come down on the person who has had the most tickets. Unfortunately sometimes the person giving out the warnings to begin with gets the blame and the original poster gets the chop.

    Keep the wings level Brother!


    Pete

  6. #81
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    RE: Dealer ethics

    Vertical,

    I just had a very pleasant conversation with a gentleman at precision cut kits on the David Anderson TA 152 kit. I brought up again the idea of them distributing plans for this due to the complications that come up with everyone downloading their own plans and he agreed to assist. Soon, I'll order the kit and he's supplying me with a copy of the plans they used to cut the kit. He also mentioned that your not the first to have complications with David Anderson designs product since the plans come out often off due to many reasons.

    So if you're deciding on a Anderson kit and you dont have your plans professionaly made from a CAD co or there of, you run the risk of having complications with the plans being off. It's best to buy your plans from the cutter if possible.

    I believe the gents name was Larry..I'd ask for him.
    "IF" I'd stop staring at them, I'd get more done to them.
    Platt FW190, Holman FW190, Meister FW190, SIST FW190, TF FW190.

  7. #82
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    RE: Dealer ethics

    Ram, parts not matching the plan were the least of the issues I had. Almost all of the formers are going to have to be cut out the rest of the way on my bandsaw. At least half of my parts have to be glued back together from being broken. and I still have 11 items that were not in the kit that need to be sent to me. I need to call Larry to find out where they were. He did say he would get right on it. I did not get an apology though and it has been 3 weeks.
    I would not even mention plan innacuracies as that has not been an issue with most of the parts. It is just poor craftsmansip as a machinist. The feed rate of the laser or the parts moving while being cut. Essentially the thick balsa and ply have just been marked by the laser and I am going to have to finish the cutting on my bandsaw. I wonder what he would have to say about all of that stuff?
    \"let\'\'\'\'s just say, they will be satisfied with less\" Ming the Merciless

  8. #83
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    RE: Dealer ethics

    I'd definitely ask for a exchange or something! That's not a cheap kit by far! Well, hurry up and get it rectified.. Maybe we can do a duel build and some pattern flying at WOR some day. shoot down all those mustangs that were there this year..

    I wonder if you were a victim of the shipping GOD's for there to be so much damage. As for the big main parts, my other kit was fine but there are soo many little parts to the kit. Some I really couldn't figure out until I looked atthe plans.
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    "IF" I'd stop staring at them, I'd get more done to them.
    Platt FW190, Holman FW190, Meister FW190, SIST FW190, TF FW190.

  9. #84
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    RE: Dealer ethics

    I already have the tail built and I am going full speed ahead. Bad kit or not. Replacement parts or not, I am planning to have mine flying this summer. I just got my engine yesterday and should get my tailwheel this week. So the fuselage is up next. Then the wings. I will most likely build another one and there is a good chance I will just cut it out. Save some bucks.
    \"let\'\'\'\'s just say, they will be satisfied with less\" Ming the Merciless

  10. #85
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    RE: Dealer ethics

    I finally received my refund from Virginia models today through paypal! They started the process Tuesday but it was on hold until today. Kind of crapy since my payment went through on the same day from my bank. I don't understand why it's not e same for a refund. Paypal stated that it was the bank that delays the refund.

    Anyway, now I can contact Hobby people..
    "IF" I'd stop staring at them, I'd get more done to them.
    Platt FW190, Holman FW190, Meister FW190, SIST FW190, TF FW190.

  11. #86
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    RE: Dealer ethics


    ORIGINAL: 91zulu

    The last time I ordered from the US ware house it took 3 weeks for me to get 2 battery packs. When I ordered from China it gets here in a week. Go figure.
    Same here, ordered one battery from them to see what it was like. It was supposed to be coming from the "US Warehouse" but it took over two weeks. That is insane.
    Blake

  12. #87
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    RE: Dealer ethics

    That is right......what you may say....One At WOTR the P-51's were good but the one that I ordered(and hope to have in the air by then is the P-51B) will shoooot all of you out of the air. We will let my JU-87's live for another day. When I did order from HK the items that were in stock took two months. Now I am going crazy about my muffler. I got a Jtec from Troybuilt, it has two seal leaks. e-mailed Troybuilt and they told me to call Jtec. We sell there items but after(we got your money)that isyour issue. I e-mailed Jtec and no reply as of yet. Now that is messed up.
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    Tuskegee
    U.S.Army(ret.)

  13. #88
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    RE: Dealer ethics

    I dont know how some are reporting severe shipping times from HK(hobbyking). 2 months? Did you choose bargain basement snail mail? Not trying to be offensive at all, but I just dont get it. Ive never had shipping times anywhere close to that long and i live only 50 miles from the previous poster Tuskegee.

    I told you all a few posts back that I would report when I got the shipment I ordered.
    Please NOTE....the order was made 10/17/11.
    I received the box yesterday 10/27/11

    Thats just ten days and it wasnt some light box of assorted little stuff either. A nice heavy package of four 6s 6000mah lipos

  14. #89

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    RE: Dealer ethics

    Same here, ordered stuff on the 13th, received it on the 23rd.

  15. #90
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    RE: Dealer ethics

    I doubt distance has anything to do with it, some are just more fortunate than others when it comes to shipping, customer service and so on. Some will receive their items lightning fast when other will get snail mail..[&o] some will get great customer service when others want to choke the person on the line! Been there!! What's needed is to know what companies seem to care less about the consumer and those who care the most! Who causes the most grief in their transactions and those who are supportive.

    I personally want to know who's worth my hard earned money and avoid those that aren't! Unfortunately some will suffer like a lot of us have already but due to those few, we'll figure out the pain in the ***** venders and those deserving.
    "IF" I'd stop staring at them, I'd get more done to them.
    Platt FW190, Holman FW190, Meister FW190, SIST FW190, TF FW190.

  16. #91
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    RE: Dealer ethics

    That is right...where you order has very little to do with it.I know a modeler who ordered the same items and the shipping time was VERY differant, and we live only blocks apart. At the end of the month I am willing to spend $100.00 on an order with someonr doing the same. we order the same items on the same day. post the tracking No. and see how long it takes.....Hello...Other than that I did get an e-mail from Jtec. They told me to send them the muffler and they will test it to see if it is a factory issue, and if so(which it is) it will be replaced. I will send it out Monday.
    Tuskegee
    U.S.Army(ret.)

  17. #92
    kahloq's Avatar
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    RE: Dealer ethics


    ORIGINAL: tuskegee

    That is right...where you order has very little to do with it.I know a modeler who ordered the same items and the shipping time was VERY differant, and we live only blocks apart. At the end of the month I am willing to spend $100.00 on an order with someonr doing the same. we order the same items on the same day. post the tracking No. and see how long it takes.....Hello...Other than that I did get an e-mail from Jtec. They told me to send them the muffler and they will test it to see if it is a factory issue, and if so(which it is) it will be replaced. I will send it out Monday.
    I have ordered things from troybuilt myself. I honestly cant say I was really impressed. Your issue with the Jtec muffler doesnt surprise me with them. Ive heard a bunch of bad stories and there are some good as well.
    One example I can give relative to Troybuilt....... I had ordered an ESM ME-109E because they showed the version they carried was the mediteranean color scheme. I already had(still have) the Battle of Britian version, so merely wanted the other one and this 2nd one was going to be made electric as opposed to glow.
    Anyway.....on the website...they had all the pictures showing the Med color scheme, but when it arrived, it was a BoB scheme. So now Ive got two identical planes. Sure...I could paint it(which i did enough to separate them), but that was the whole reason I purchased it from them...two distinctive schemes.
    I bought other stuff from them, but if i can get what I want elsewhere, I generally dont order from troybuilt now.

  18. #93
    tuskegee's Avatar
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    RE: Dealer ethics

    That is a big your right.....So many companies now are selling the same items. I try to go to the one who is willing to give me a break in something. But I do get most of my things from VQ Warbirds. Same price in some things but he is a small company and we need to help them out. And I do get good service on top of the sale.
    Tuskegee
    U.S.Army(ret.)

  19. #94
    kahloq's Avatar
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    RE: Dealer ethics

    I love VQwarbirds. Tomas is top notch and Ive ordered a LOT of stuff from him.

  20. #95

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    RE: Dealer ethics

    ORIGINAL: Ramstein44

    One of the worst kit cutters/ designers I've personally ever delt with was with a company called innovative model products, aka IMP. I built one of their models which I purchased second hand and crashed it on maiden after two years of building. I bought another full wood kit from them paying about $800 for the kit. The quality of the wood was nice and the build was fast but the cowl was made of glass and plaster and was still wet when I got it. The design of the fuse in places had to be re-engineered to fit their plans/design. The cowl weighed as much as my labs doggy bowl and was very weak. I made several complaints to the company and I literally was cussed out, threatened to the point of me almost making a road trip out of it! I have a build on it on rcscailbuilders.. I've often heard that when it comes to kits the quality of a company product is based on the quanity of their product you see.. I've seen very few of their products.

    If you talk bad about them.. Be prepared literally for a fight! And they'll never do business with you or anyone around you ( like you'd want to) don't get on their bad side as thy have a grudge that never seems to go away. A lot of the pro builders here refuse to do business with them.
    I can confirm everything Ram has said here and in Spades!

  21. #96

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    RE: Dealer ethics

    Hi,
    With regard to retracts why don't people try shindin machine retracts? I got a set for my Meister 102" me109 and they are really nice. Lenny was very quick to respond to my emails and he only charged me half the postage costs to the UK. As for HobbyKing i think you get what you pay for, most of the stuff i've ordered from them has been ok apart from an Orange 2.4 RX which worked once when it was bound to the TX and then nothing. It would cost more to send it back than the RX is worth, so its a bin job.

  22. #97
    Ramstein44's Avatar
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    RE: Dealer ethics

    I've purchased several sets of retracts from Lenny at shindinmachine.com. He does great work which is reliable. He's also done some custom work for me for other projects that others wanted you to mortgage you home to afford!

    I've since ordered two engines from hobby king, one I've received which only took two weeks and the other is in route. Not bad considering the distance but not the best. I've ordered other items from china and received them in seven days.
    I'm learning that you purchase from hobby king not when you need the items now but when your collecting items for a future build, like the LA-7 I'll be ordering from VQ here after the holidays.

    I've also purchased several planes from VQ.. Outstanding service puts it mildly! Emails me at midnight, great communications and keeps me informed of products shipments with the fastest deliveries to date. He'll continue to get my business.
    "IF" I'd stop staring at them, I'd get more done to them.
    Platt FW190, Holman FW190, Meister FW190, SIST FW190, TF FW190.

  23. #98
    Moderator da Rock's Avatar
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    RE: Dealer ethics


    ORIGINAL: yak54
    As for HobbyKing i think you get what you pay for, most of the stuff i've ordered from them has been ok apart from an Orange 2.4 RX which worked once when it was bound to the TX and then nothing. It would cost more to send it back than the RX is worth, so its a bin job.
    And that's the story with the small electric motors and ESC I bought from HobbyKing. One motor was bad out of the box. The other one wouldn't work with the ESC. The ESC worked up until a couple of weeks ago and went out in flight.

    Cost more to send them back if there was confidence that would get a refund.

    Done with HobbyKing.
    Good flying wit ya today

  24. #99
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    RE: Dealer ethics

    Based on what's been said on hobby kings electronics and knowing how vital they are to our project, I'll never buy them from hobby king..
    "IF" I'd stop staring at them, I'd get more done to them.
    Platt FW190, Holman FW190, Meister FW190, SIST FW190, TF FW190.

  25. #100
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    RE: Dealer ethics


    ORIGINAL: Ramstein44

    Based on what's been said on hobby kings electronics and knowing how vital they are to our project, I'll never buy them from hobby king..

    Their products have not only cost me time and money, but the 1st order from them was over $100 worth of stuff and they declared it was something like $5 worth of toy parts. Ethics? Bad ones, if you consider they have any.
    Good flying wit ya today


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