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  1. #2951
    Hot Rod Todd's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kwik View Post
    Toe in, Toe out. Wonder who is right?
    For most planes toe-in helps with steering stability. Because of the angle of the gear any toe in on the 190 can cause the wheels to tuck under and amplify the affects of the ground loop. From my experience so far there is no doubt in my mind, toe-out is much better than toe-in on the Top Flite FW-190.

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    Last edited by Hot Rod Todd; 05-30-2014 at 02:50 PM.

  2. #2952

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    Right

  3. #2953
    Chris Nicastro's Avatar
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    Another anology I use that helps visualize the toe out benefit is from racing 1/8 or 1/10 scale buggies. Toe out gives another added benefit besides helping calm the front end down with a little drag. When jumping with toe out if the landing angle is less than perfect then the first front wheel to touch down will pull the car outward and help level the car. If it had toe in under the same circumstance then the car trips over that wheel and rolls over. Of course if the camber angle exceeds +5 degrees it probably wont matter as the mass is now over the contact patch and the car will probably roll over.

    On any of my warbirds and planes Ive helped set up for guys Ive added toe out and they work great. Just try it for yourself and see. It will make landings easier and smoother than before.
    Like a midget in a urinal I knew I had to stay on my toes...

  4. #2954

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    Yes it works great. Toe out that is.

  5. #2955
    kwik's Avatar
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    Toe out. Got it.

  6. #2956
    Chris Nicastro's Avatar
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    Today my buddy nearly lost his FW when the right aileron plate lost the two front screws in flight. The plate flexed backward and caused the right ail to go up and the plane was doing the downward death spiral. He backed off power dropped gear and put in opposite controls to regain control. It worked and he brought it back on final to land. He touched down with a little bounce and since he was pretty much maxed out on the controls he couldn't do much else so the FW bounced and cartwheeled.

    So, just FYI, check your servo mount plate hardware often to prevent this from happening to you. He was using the stock hardware.

    Broken wing gear mount and blew out the rear fuse wing mount and bulkhead, cowl, prop, etc.

    Also, the electric Robart gear worked the first flight then the right gear wouldn't lock in the up position on the second flight. Im still not a fan of the electric set up and my air system has still performed flawless for over 35 flights.
    Like a midget in a urinal I knew I had to stay on my toes...

  7. #2957

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    Quote Originally Posted by Chris Nicastro View Post
    Today my buddy nearly lost his FW when the right aileron plate lost the two front screws in flight. The plate flexed backward and caused the right ail to go up and the plane was doing the downward death spiral. He backed off power dropped gear and put in opposite controls to regain control. It worked and he brought it back on final to land. He touched down with a little bounce and since he was pretty much maxed out on the controls he couldn't do much else so the FW bounced and cartwheeled.

    So, just FYI, check your servo mount plate hardware often to prevent this from happening to you. He was using the stock hardware.

    Broken wing gear mount and blew out the rear fuse wing mount and bulkhead, cowl, prop, etc.

    Also, the electric Robart gear worked the first flight then the right gear wouldn't lock in the up position on the second flight. Im still not a fan of the electric set up and my air system has still performed flawless for over 35 flights.
    My flying buddy has electrics in a P47 and F4U and has had about the same results.Sometimes the tail wheel won't come down and he recycles and it works.I've has good results with air also.
    Semper Fi

  8. #2958
    kwik's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chris Nicastro View Post
    Today my buddy nearly lost his FW when the right aileron plate lost the two front screws in flight. The plate flexed backward and caused the right ail to go up and the plane was doing the downward death spiral. He backed off power dropped gear and put in opposite controls to regain control. It worked and he brought it back on final to land. He touched down with a little bounce and since he was pretty much maxed out on the controls he couldn't do much else so the FW bounced and cartwheeled.

    So, just FYI, check your servo mount plate hardware often to prevent this from happening to you. He was using the stock hardware.

    Broken wing gear mount and blew out the rear fuse wing mount and bulkhead, cowl, prop, etc.

    Also, the electric Robart gear worked the first flight then the right gear wouldn't lock in the up position on the second flight. Im still not a fan of the electric set up and my air system has still performed flawless for over 35 flights.
    That doesnt sound good. Somethimes it helps to glue thick chunk of balsa under each corner so the screws get something to bite in.

    Regarding both Air and Electrics, and the Williams Brothers 12200 wheels;

    The Williams 12200 wheels are thicker than the stock ones.
    So on mine, the wheels started to press against the bottom oft he wheel well.

    This means that the oleo can get stuck in the up-lock position. Somethimes, a bit randomly , one wheel didnt come out.

    Belly landing.

    So, to avoid this, I made a 2 mm plate of aluminium with the 3 screw holes in it, and used it as a shims for the gear mount.

    The wheels should really be moveable when in up position.
    Last edited by kwik; 06-01-2014 at 01:43 AM.

  9. #2959
    SteveD-RCU's Avatar
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    I just picked up a set pf Williams Bros 14600 wheels for my FW,I see on the package that the covers snap on and off and that one can drill a 1/16" hole on the other side to help push it off on the other.Has anyone else tried this?I cant seem to get the cover off...I also got my electric retracts back from Down and Locked and they work fine,One of the motors was done and they did some upgrades
    Last edited by SteveD-RCU; 06-01-2014 at 10:29 AM.
    Steve Daly
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  10. #2960
    sparky4lawndart's Avatar
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    in a recent post someone wrote to check the wing servo hatches. I haven't ever and went flyin today w/o looking. Had three flight today and loved every minute of it. When I went to pack my FW in the truck I saw the left wing aileron servo hatch had only 1 screw in it and was flopping around on there... scared the ***** out of me. I'm gonna go through the entire bird and check 'em all tonight...

    New rule: Pre-flight the entire bird the night before and before each flight. No more gas, air, and fly for me without checking over the plane!
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  11. #2961
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    I screw my servos in, then take each screw out one at a time and apply a tiny drop of CA into the screw hole, then put the screw in again.

    Seems to hold 'em in nice n tight

    "Loctite" for Balsa

    BJ
    Ahhhh...I love the smell Kero in the mornings....

  12. #2962
    kwik's Avatar
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    I dont know...CA as Loctite...???

    Wood glue seems to work for me as Locktite for wood screws.

  13. #2963
    I got toe out,too.

  14. #2964
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    Quote Originally Posted by BJ64 View Post
    I screw my servos in, then take each screw out one at a time and apply a tiny drop of CA into the screw hole, then put the screw in again.

    Seems to hold 'em in nice n tight

    "Loctite" for Balsa

    BJ
    I do the same thing. Have don this for as long as I've been building.. I remember one of the first kits I built mentioning this method.. I also run a screw or toothpick with CA through the door/hatch cover into the mounting block for the servos bottom which makes the unit one piece. This way that block has a lower chance of separating from the torque or stress.
    "IF" I'd stop staring at them, I'd get more done to them.
    Platt FW190, Holman FW190, Meister FW190, SIST FW190, TF FW190.

  15. #2965
    BJ64's Avatar
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    I think you may have actually suggested it to me somewhere sometime.

    Works like a charm

    BJ
    Ahhhh...I love the smell Kero in the mornings....

  16. #2966
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    Quote Originally Posted by BJ64 View Post
    I screw my servos in, then take each screw out one at a time and apply a tiny drop of CA into the screw hole, then put the screw in again.


    Seems to hold 'em in nice n tight


    "Loctite" for Balsa


    BJ
    I hope you aren't screwing anything into balsa & expecting it to hold. The sub surface is usually light ply, spruce or hardwood.



    Quote Originally Posted by Ramstein44 View Post
    I do the same thing. Have don this for as long as I've been building.. I remember one of the first kits I built mentioning this method.
    That is exactly what the instructions that come W/ the TF GS FW190 say to do except W/ the additional step if backing the screw out before a semi-permanent bond occurs & them re-tightening the screw.


    SOP for me on any airframe.


    Quote Originally Posted by Ramstein44 View Post
    I also run a screw or toothpick with CA through the door/hatch cover into the mounting block for the servos bottom which makes the unit one piece. This way that block has a lower chance of separating from the torque or stress.
    I use epoxy to glue the blocks to the hatch in addition to the screws. Again, per the instructions & SOP on any airframe.
    Club Saito #785 - FA91S, FA150, FA180, FA180HC/BBC, FA200TI, FA300TTDP: All with CH Ignitions CDI/Glow fuel
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  17. #2967
    Ramstein44's Avatar
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    Maybe you misunderstood me or I failed to get my point across. No instructions I've ever seen mention the extra method I posted. Placing a screw through the bottom of the block or toothpicks??? Show me.

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    Last edited by Ramstein44; 06-04-2014 at 10:31 AM.
    "IF" I'd stop staring at them, I'd get more done to them.
    Platt FW190, Holman FW190, Meister FW190, SIST FW190, TF FW190.

  18. #2968
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    no you didn't I understood everything you said , sr telemaster seems to have a bit of a chip on his shoulder he is the same in all the other threads.

  19. #2969
    SrTelemaster150's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ramstein44 View Post
    Maybe you misunderstood me or I failed to get my point across. No instructions I've ever seen mention the extra method I posted. Placing a screw through the bottom of the block or toothpicks??? Show me.

    Click image for larger version. 

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    The hatches on my TF GS FW190 all have 1 screw going through the hatch cover into each if the blocks.

    Yes I guess the toothpick & CA might be an extra step, but it just doesn't seem like it would add to the integrity if a full epoxy joint exists over the entire surface between the block & hatch.
    Last edited by SrTelemaster150; 06-04-2014 at 11:55 AM.
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  20. #2970
    SrTelemaster150's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by steph69 View Post
    no you didn't I understood everything you said , sr telemaster seems to have a bit of a chip on his shoulder he is the same in all the other threads.

    Seems to me that you are the one that has copped an attitude. Just because you might not understand something doesn't make it invalid.
    Club Saito #785 - FA91S, FA150, FA180, FA180HC/BBC, FA200TI, FA300TTDP: All with CH Ignitions CDI/Glow fuel
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  21. #2971

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    you all have attitudes, that is why there is only 12 people on RC universe.

  22. #2972
    Ramstein44's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SrTelemaster150 View Post
    The hatches on my TF GS FW190 all have 1 screw going through the hatch cover into each if the blocks.

    Yes I guess the toothpick & CA might be an extra step, but it just doesn't seem like it would add to the integrity if a full epoxy joint exists over the entire surface between the block & hatch.
    Well SrTelemaster, I guess until you try it you won't know. It's more of a CYA factor and it's definitely better to have that extra security. Having built and flown so many giant scaled aircraft, I know from that experience; it does add the extra peace of mind factor. Like any glued joint, adding screws or in this case, toothpicks or dowels will add strength (ask any carpenter). I also Hysol my joints which IMO is better then epoxy but that's another off topic area I care less to go into.
    Last edited by Ramstein44; 06-04-2014 at 04:39 PM.
    "IF" I'd stop staring at them, I'd get more done to them.
    Platt FW190, Holman FW190, Meister FW190, SIST FW190, TF FW190.

  23. #2973
    kwik's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ramstein44 View Post
    I also Hysol my joints which IMO is better then epoxy but that's another off topic area I care less to go into.
    Ramstein, Hysol IS epoxy......

  24. #2974
    Ramstein44's Avatar
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    Thx.
    Last edited by Ramstein44; 06-04-2014 at 02:56 PM.
    "IF" I'd stop staring at them, I'd get more done to them.
    Platt FW190, Holman FW190, Meister FW190, SIST FW190, TF FW190.

  25. #2975
    Chris Nicastro's Avatar
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    Hysol is an aerospace grade of epoxy so in fact its better than traditional hobby epoxy, so, anyway, fyi...
    Like a midget in a urinal I knew I had to stay on my toes...


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