splais

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I am beginning work on a FW190 with a DLE30 engine. I'm thinking a 16x10x3 would be perfect. Can anyone confirm this. Also I'm having trouble finding anything with even sorta scale outline. I've found the master airscrew and the Biele, but would to find something more in the lines of the Xoar WWII props, but can't find them in the 16x10x3 size. Anyone help?

Ok,, I think I may find what I need at Valley View.

kahloq

Troybuilt carries beila 3 blade props...take a look at those. Graupner also has a 3 blade 16x10. I have one on the front of my ESM me109

All Day Dan

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You can get the information from here. Dan.
http://www.zingerpropeller.com/

irocbsa

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I use a 16 X 10 MAS three blade on my DLE 30s. It's a good combo for the price.

RBean

Splais, I'm running a DLE 30 in a BH FW 190 70" wingspan. I wanted to run a three blade prop, but I thought the 16" prop looked too short on the FW190. I tried the Biela 17-10 three blade recommended by Troy Built but it only turned 6,000 rpm. The plane took of and flew level ok but had very poor verticle. I next tried the Xoar 18-8. This looked great on the plane, turned 6,600 rpm. The plane flew ok. I broke this prop when I had a landing gear failure. Next I tried an Xoar 17-8 prop. This turns 7,100 rpm and plane has plenty of power and verticle. However the Xoar props are painted wood, fragile and expensive. I've never run a 16-10, though it should work ok.

splais

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Are you talking about a 2 or 3 blade prop on that 17-8?

RBean

Sorry, 3 blade 17-8. For a two blade the Xoar 18-10 works great.

kahloq

Splais......I had a 16x8x3 graupner prop on the esm fw-190A until I got the sdshobbies spinner(2 blade only). I had that skyshark 3 blade 190 spinner on it as well. Remember, mine is running a saito 180. The graupner 16x8x3 has much wider blade paddles then an MAS. They really look nice painted black.

http://www.v-eastonline.com/products...x20-cm%29.html

They also have a g-sonic version at 16x10x3
http://www.v-eastonline.com/producti...roduct_id=2004

And then of course the Biela 16x10

http://www.troybuiltmodels.com/items/BP1610-3BY.html

Attached is a pic of a Biela 20x14 3 blade on the front of my ESm DO-335. Its a really nice looking prop and looks good with flat black paint. The 2nd and 3rd pic is a graupner 16x8x3 on my BH stuka at 75" wingspan

splais

My Feedback: (25)

I have the Biele 16x10x3 on my ESM T-6, it flies it ok, but nothing spectacular. Now the T-6 is substantially larger than the FW and the motor is farely new. But a 2-blade Menz 18-8 flies it great. I really like the shape of that Graupner prop. You think the DLE30 would pull that prop in 17x8x3?

Well forget that, they don't have a 17x8x3.

splais

My Feedback: (25)

ok, ValleyView has the Xoar WWII 17x8x3 that looks really good, but expensive. Anybody have any idea if the DLE30 would pull better with a 17x8x3 then it does with the 16x10x3?

kahloq

Use a higher octane gas then the cheap stuff. But, the higher you go you may end up running hotter....so good airflow is essential. You might be able to run an 18x8x3 if running 93 octane. You can also buy octane boost bottles at some gas stations to mix in with the fuel. Better ask the people you got the motor from if its ok to do that.

irocbsa

My Feedback: (12)

Check in the gas engines forum for more detail on this issue, but the 17" three blades seems to be just over the edge of what the DLE30 can handle. It's borderline for the 35. The 17 and 18" three blades really need a 40 or 45 to turn them with authority.

splais

My Feedback: (25)

well, now everything i was working on is messed up. that prop that i thought was a 16x10x3 actually was a 17x10x3. it flew the T-6, did loops, etc ok, but lacked zip if you know what i mean. So know i'm thinking that maybe a 17x8x3 might be ok. do some more reading today.

CK1

My Feedback: (60)

splais ,
I have been flying the Biela 17x10 3 blade on my Cessna 182 and it was marginal (very scale). It has improved some with engine breakin (now 4 gals)and retuning . I would think based on the 6700 rpms I'm getting on the 17x10 3blade that the 16x10 3 blade would be nearly perfect for the DLE 30 . I am planning on using the 16x10 3 blades on DLE 30's on an up coming C47 project .
BTW : I had tried the Graupner 16x10 3blade and it was not efficient enough (lots of rpm not much pull , blade flex was terrible ) I have seen and heard of the graupners failing on gas engines and I will not use them on a gas engine again.

kahloq

Which version of the graupner prop? I have used many of them and so have a good number of people at our field without ever seeing any type of failure at all on all kinds of motors....including gas. I also have to disgree with the lack of pull comment. The blade paddles are wider then an MAS thus producing MORE thrust and the prop blades do NOT flex at all. They are thicker blades then the MAS as well. The disadvantage is they are heavier then an MAS due to the thickness of the prop all the way around.
Are you thinking APC or something like that because there's no way the prop blades are going to flex as you say with how thick and robust the prop blades are.....unless your thinking the g-sonic as they are a thinner prop design.

CK1

My Feedback: (60)

The prop failure I had was with an Graupner 16-8 3blade . It had been balanced and fitted to a DLE 30 with a single bolt prop adapter. I ran it up and found very little pull and noticed that while reving up and down there was way more flex than any other prop I had used . The prop failed on the first and only flight .One of the blades cleanly separated itself about an inch put from the hub . I tried a second prop(the same) that I had and got the same flex so I did not leave it on . I had also talked with a fellow modeler about props he had been running on his C47 and he had also had failures of his own and new of others he flew with also. I also don't use MA props on gas engines for the same problems of flex . I have never had a problem with them on glow engines up to Saito 1.80.
I prefer wood and/or carbon fiber props because they are in my opinion more efficient and I have not had any fail on flight.

airraptor

My Feedback: (66)

Why do you say run higher OCTANE fuel???

Most Octane boosters are fake lol read the fine print lol most only boost the Octane by .110 or .109 lol

a higher octane fuel will burn slower and might make your engine run hotter. If going to run higher octane adjust your timing..

kahloq

If you read what I said....a higher octane at the pump...say 93 vs the cheap 85 or 87 WILL produce more power. Higher octane creates a more efficient burn per firing of the spark plug. Yep...you do have to adjust the timing a bit and I specifically stated it would raise the temp on the motor. As far as octane boosters, your thinking the garbage stuff. Im talking about the boosts that raise the standard pump gas octane to 101 to 104.

RBean

I'll just throw this in. I have a Graupner 15-8 three blade on a DLE 20. Turns about 8,450 rpm, great thrust and have been running it for several years. No problems.

With regard to the DLE 30 and a three blade. Already tested the Biela 17-10 three blade. My DLE 30 would only turn it 6,000 rpm. Too much prop for the engine. However, the Xoar 17-8 three blade works very good. Actually tested and flown.

Tried to load pictures but the server wouldn't take them. ???

RBean

Here are some pictures of the FW 190 with the 3 blade Xoar 17-8 prop. I flew it yesterday. Tached 7,500 on the ground. Flew fine.

91zulu

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Question.. Why it is you gained 1500 rpm just by droping one pitch on the Xoar prop? I know the Biela props are a bit on the heavy side but 1500 is quite a bit of a jump. The reason I ask is I am also looking to use a 3 Blade on a MLD35 and I am looking to get in the 6800 - 6900 rpm range and was looking at the Biela 18x12 or 20x10. How big a difference is it between the 2 brands ?

BubbasanJohn

looks nice rbean. Never seen a fw190 with yellow prop tips.

RBean

91Zulu,

The blades of the Biela prop are much wider and thicker than the Xoar so I suppose there is a lot more drag on the engine. The DLE 30 just can't get up to its power range with the 17-10 three blade Biela prop. 6,000 rpm was it. I also tested an RCGF 18-8 prop but it is wide like the Biela and would only turn 6,000 rpm. I tested the Biela 17-10 on a G-38 I had on the engine stand and it turned the prop 6,450 rpm. It depends on how you are planning to use the 35. If it is going to be in a plane with a large radial cowl, a longer prop will look better. The DLE turned the Xoar 18-8 three blade about 6,600 rpm. Your 35 should turn it between 7,000-7,500 rpm which would be right in there.

BubbasanJohn, I thought about painting the prop dark brown and no yellow tips to look more scale but decided to leave the yellow tips for now for safety reasons.

Here is a picture of the plane with the Biela prop and the Xoar. You can see the difference

kahloq

The biela definitely looks better due to the wider props. If I were building another one with a gas 30cc motor, Id probably go with the 16x10 3 blade biela. To ME and my opinion only, the xoar prop just doesn't look right having the blades so narrow. Sure, Id love to put a big fat bladed prop on the 190. To that end, if I were to build another, id stuff a bigger motor in the cowl since it needs nose weight and be able to swing a bigger biela prop which would also aid in the nose weight department.

Ive heard of a new 40cc twin. That might be the ticket right there......but some people have stuffed a 50cc single in the front of the ESM 190.

kahloq

There's a guy in the BH fw-190 thread that put a dle30 on the BH Macchi 200 and did a video of the motor running a Biela 16x10 3 blade. First run on the motor gave him 7950 rpms. To me, that sounds pretty darn good. After running the motor for awhile(flying for a season), it sounds like a 17x10 would run just fine.