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Hangar 9 60cc Corsair

Old 03-16-2015, 01:15 PM
  #1676  
njmheli
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Originally Posted by rslstft
njmheli,
I too used the Vanessa sling. It doesn't seem to matter weather the plane is inverted or not, but I did balance with gear UP. It is a little confusing at first, but what I did after I built one, was take a airplane with a known good c.g. and put it in the Vanessa rig to see how it all worked. Like mirored said, once you use it, you will like it.
Hi Russ.

Thanks also for that...............guess I'll be building that "rig" and will have to get my head around it.............

Kind regards...................Nick(UK).
Old 03-16-2015, 01:43 PM
  #1677  
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Like I said Nick.... TONS of horsepower here!
Old 03-16-2015, 01:59 PM
  #1678  
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Hi All.......don't want to "highjack" this thread,but thought the below may be of help............?

These are the photo's of my 7-77 set up...............with regard to the "lack of thread" issue...?

After I did the CDi conversion,with some extra maching on the split collet and prop-driver and back plate,these are my own approx figures.............may help..?

Crankshaft / thread available length from face of prop-driver...................46mm
Biela hub thickness......................................... ..........................................27mm
Machined backplate......................................... .........................................8mm

Thread available for "NUT".................................................. ......................11mm ( distance from face of sensor ring to prop-driver face is 15mm,allowing a 1mm air gap )

( Solo hub that I have is 49mm thick,but no problem,as it comes with a special nut,which you custom cut to fit your set up ).............when I decide to make use of it !!!

These are only my own thoughts on the "jam-nut" issue,7-77 as stock does not have a jam-nut fitted,just a split wire ring at the end of the thread crankshaft,together with a "normal nut"
I was dealing with TT on the supply of a hub set up and after some information received,I ordered a TT-0125-A ( 10x1.25 ADP kit ),this IMHO is more than adequate for the job and when well torqued tight............no problem and has not been any issues.

Kind regards...............Nick (UK).
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Old 03-16-2015, 02:06 PM
  #1679  
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Originally Posted by Capt Midnight
Like I said Nick.... TONS of horsepower here!

Hi Bob..................I agree,I "chickened" out on one of my high end runs with the 3 BL.....................got to 5900RPM...........still had more to go !!!

let us know about those cyl temps if you can / get a chance............I will be doing another ground run-up in a day or so...be good to compare,although at the moment I am running in my back garden in a corner...........pretty noisy !!!

Cheers....................Nick.
Old 03-16-2015, 02:30 PM
  #1680  
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Originally Posted by njmheli
Hi Bob..................I agree,I "chickened" out on one of my high end runs with the 3 BL.....................got to 5900RPM...........still had more to go !!!

let us know about those cyl temps if you can / get a chance............I will be doing another ground run-up in a day or so...be good to compare,although at the moment I am running in my back garden in a corner...........pretty noisy !!!

Cheers....................Nick.
Nick,

I monitored temp with an IR Gun, but it was so windy, I was getting readings all over the map, so I gave up. Best indication might come on a moderate day, with the engine fully cowled, and take the temps off the front center of the cylinders.

Bob
Old 03-16-2015, 02:33 PM
  #1681  
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Originally Posted by njmheli
Hi All.......don't want to "highjack" this thread,but thought the below may be of help............?

These are the photo's of my 7-77 set up...............with regard to the "lack of thread" issue...?

After I did the CDi conversion,with some extra maching on the split collet and prop-driver and back plate,these are my own approx figures.............may help..?

Crankshaft / thread available length from face of prop-driver...................46mm
Biela hub thickness......................................... ..........................................27mm
Machined backplate......................................... .........................................8mm

Thread available for "NUT".................................................. ......................11mm ( distance from face of sensor ring to prop-driver face is 15mm,allowing a 1mm air gap )

( Solo hub that I have is 49mm thick,but no problem,as it comes with a special nut,which you custom cut to fit your set up ).............when I decide to make use of it !!!

These are only my own thoughts on the "jam-nut" issue,7-77 as stock does not have a jam-nut fitted,just a split wire ring at the end of the thread crankshaft,together with a "normal nut"
I was dealing with TT on the supply of a hub set up and after some information received,I ordered a TT-0125-A ( 10x1.25 ADP kit ),this IMHO is more than adequate for the job and when well torqued tight............no problem and has not been any issues.

Kind regards...............Nick (UK).
Nick,

Your setup and dimensioning is very similar to mine, in spite of the different manufacturers. I agree with your conclusions.

Bob
Old 03-16-2015, 03:19 PM
  #1682  
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Originally Posted by njmheli
Hi All.......don't want to "highjack" this thread,but thought the below may be of help............? These are the photo's of my 7-77 set up...............with regard to the "lack of thread" issue...? After I did the CDi conversion,with some extra maching on the split collet and prop-driver and back plate,these are my own approx figures.............may help..? Crankshaft / thread available length from face of prop-driver...................46mm Biela hub thickness......................................... ..........................................27mm Machined backplate......................................... .........................................8mm Thread available for "NUT".................................................. ......................11mm ( distance from face of sensor ring to prop-driver face is 15mm,allowing a 1mm air gap ) ( Solo hub that I have is 49mm thick,but no problem,as it comes with a special nut,which you custom cut to fit your set up ).............when I decide to make use of it !!! These are only my own thoughts on the "jam-nut" issue,7-77 as stock does not have a jam-nut fitted,just a split wire ring at the end of the thread crankshaft,together with a "normal nut" I was dealing with TT on the supply of a hub set up and after some information received,I ordered a TT-0125-A ( 10x1.25 ADP kit ),this IMHO is more than adequate for the job and when well torqued tight............no problem and has not been any issues. Kind regards...............Nick (UK).
Nick, Your setup and dimensioning is very similar to mine, in spite of the different manufacturers. I agree with your conclusions. Bob
Old 03-16-2015, 06:28 PM
  #1683  
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Hi Again everyone - I have begun working on the build before I receive the landing gear - something I had said I wasn't going to do - but, curiosity got the best of me so, here we go. First question to the many experienced builders out there of this beautiful plane - gaps between the flap sections are a bit wide and uneven - especially at the aileron - did anyone have to reposition the holes in the flaps or the wings? Thanks in advance as always...
Old 03-17-2015, 04:30 AM
  #1684  
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Originally Posted by Ted62
Hi Again everyone - I have begun working on the build before I receive the landing gear - something I had said I wasn't going to do - but, curiosity got the best of me so, here we go. First question to the many experienced builders out there of this beautiful plane - gaps between the flap sections are a bit wide and uneven - especially at the aileron - did anyone have to reposition the holes in the flaps or the wings? Thanks in advance as always...
Hi Ted.

I did a little bit of extra work on the "middle" flap...........details + photo are on page 24,post # 586................may be of help.

Kind regards...................Nick (UK).
Old 03-17-2015, 05:03 AM
  #1685  
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Thanks for the reply, Nick. My problem (if it really is a problem) is the gap when the flaps are in their "up" position - the gap at the flap/aileron is not parallel and a bit wide. By the time I get it where I want it, it'll be time to tear everything apart for glue - then, getting it back to the same way could be an issue. I'm in no hurry, so, that gives me time to contemplate the solution. I doubt if it's a unique situation. I believe the flaps and the gear doors are the only difficult areas of the "build". Here in Pennsylvania, there are at least 2 more months of winter-like temps to go, so, I have plenty of time.

Originally Posted by njmheli
Hi Ted.

I did a little bit of extra work on the "middle" flap...........details + photo are on page 24,post # 586................may be of help.

Kind regards...................Nick (UK).
Old 03-17-2015, 05:58 AM
  #1686  
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Capt, what brand is that engine test stand/mount? It looks like a nice little setup.
Old 03-17-2015, 06:26 AM
  #1687  
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Originally Posted by njmheli
Hi All.......don't want to "highjack" this thread,but thought the below may be of help............?

These are the photo's of my 7-77 set up...............with regard to the "lack of thread" issue...?

After I did the CDi conversion,with some extra maching on the split collet and prop-driver and back plate,these are my own approx figures.............may help..?

Crankshaft / thread available length from face of prop-driver...................46mm
Biela hub thickness......................................... ..........................................27mm
Machined backplate......................................... .........................................8mm

Thread available for "NUT".................................................. ......................11mm ( distance from face of sensor ring to prop-driver face is 15mm,allowing a 1mm air gap )

( Solo hub that I have is 49mm thick,but no problem,as it comes with a special nut,which you custom cut to fit your set up ).............when I decide to make use of it !!!

These are only my own thoughts on the "jam-nut" issue,7-77 as stock does not have a jam-nut fitted,just a split wire ring at the end of the thread crankshaft,together with a "normal nut"
I was dealing with TT on the supply of a hub set up and after some information received,I ordered a TT-0125-A ( 10x1.25 ADP kit ),this IMHO is more than adequate for the job and when well torqued tight............no problem and has not been any issues.

Kind regards...............Nick (UK).
Nick, wow I can't keep up with you! haha

I have not measured yet, but even with the standard thick backplate Tru Turn supplies with the parts mentioned in the Hangar 9 manual, I have about the same if not a handful more threads than you seem to. So I guess I am ok. I have the same adaptor kit as you and everything else, except my hub is twice the thickness of yours. The Mejzlik props I have, are a bit thinner than the 3 blade Biela so I get even a little more threading. Seems I am OK then and will put a dab of thread locker.

On top of that, Adrian mentioned that he fitted a better locking system with his new prop hub that should keep it in place noticeably better than the stock split collet. From what I can tell it's just a much beefier and larger lock nut which would translate to more surface area and a tighter clamp on the crankshaft.
Old 03-17-2015, 10:27 AM
  #1688  
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Originally Posted by affas
@njmheli

Did you some temp measurements before and after gas cnversion? I do have the same engine in my Corsair with Adrian ignition but still on glow. Thinking of gas conversion but always running hoter and a little weaker..
Hi Alf.

I did another run with the 7-77,so here are some figures for you................I guessing you already have some for your 7-77 running on glow...?

I am running a fuel mix at 16:1 ( but will change to 20:1,as the plugs are getting a little "oiled" at the higher mix ).........prop used was the Biela 22" x 10 x 3BL....The ambient temp was 11 degrees C...........@ 1022mbar pressure. The Max RPM's today were 5950.......I didn't want to go any higher at the moment,the UN-COWLED readings were :

1400 RPM ( very stable ).........................22 to 30 degrees C

4500 RPM ( held there for 3 minutes ).....46 to 52 degrees C

5000 RPM ( held there for 3 minutes ),,..49 to 58 degrees C

Readings were taken at the front centre of the cylinder head area................the #2 cylinder for some reason was giving the lower readings mostly..?

I have decided to go back to using the stock cowling on the Corsair,but I have moved it FWD by 12mm,using "slit blocks" of ply".... Stablitt Expressed to the mountings on the cowl.
By doing this,you can take advantage of the "open-cowl flaps" and increase the area for the air to exit the cowl,always good to get as much cooling air out !!!!

I also think that for 7-77 users to change to gas,If using the 84 Carb set-up....? will be very easy and still will use the 25mm Ply mounting "bock" ( if using that method )...........

Using 45mm ( 6mm bore ) engine stand-offs to make room for the 84 carb,between radial body and mounting flange + 55mm long countersunk M6 bolts..........on my set-up,the distance from the face of the prop-driver to the mounting flange face is 160mm ( FG 84 is 172mm )...........so roughly calculate,that with moving the cowl 10mm or so FWD and still using the 25mm mounting ply block,you will end up pretty good..in relation to the rear of the prop / front of cowl...?

The velocity stack protrudes 20mm from the face of the 7-77 mounting flange...............so no problem there...?

Carburetor complete G84R3..............pt # SAIG84R3821


see photos below..........

Kind regards...................Nick (UK).
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Last edited by njmheli; 03-17-2015 at 10:41 AM.
Old 03-17-2015, 10:34 AM
  #1689  
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Hi Chorner.

Sounds like it's all sorted then !!!!...............will be good to see what Arian has come up with,but I'm pretty happy with what I am using at the moment.

Have you sorted out your " possible leaks" yet...? and how about going to gas now...?

This was a short reply for once !!!!............

Cheers....................Nick (UK).
Old 03-17-2015, 02:40 PM
  #1690  
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Originally Posted by chorner
Capt, what brand is that engine test stand/mount? It looks like a nice little setup.
It's from PSP Mfg. Google them; they are in Indiana.

Bob
Old 03-17-2015, 02:57 PM
  #1691  
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Build continuing here - flaps are a bit of a headache - maybe just for me - one side almos done, the other side needs some drilling. I also cancelled the electric retracts and ordered the pneumatics which ARE in stock. To be continued -
Old 03-18-2015, 01:18 PM
  #1692  
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Also finally getting around to starting my build. Thinking of putting a linear actuator in to operate the sliding canopy but it would need to go where the air tank is supposed to go in the fuse. Anyone put the air tank in the open section of the wing center section, like under the flap servos to get it out of the way?
Old 03-18-2015, 03:05 PM
  #1693  
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Let me know your progress on that location, Todd - sounds like a neat idea. Of course, trying to keep the weight of the plane below 100# is getting more difficult as I add this and that. I just received my warbird pilot with articulated head - that should be really fun to watch. Update on the build - left wing flaps are installed and look good; right wing flaps need a bit more tweaking - I did have to slightly move the location of the holes for the innermost flap section. Oh yes, I trial fitted the wing dowels and I believe the holes are undersized considerably. I will sand the dowels a bit, but, I'm sure the holes will need reamed. There was a comment to drill an access hole above each dowel to be certain enough epoxy got to the best location - but, looks to me as though there's enough access from the flap servo area to do the same thing - that's the current plan. To be continued - hopefully, anyone can chime-in with their comments here. Loving the build so far - snow forecast Friday - lotsa time left this winter, ugh!

Originally Posted by Todd D
Also finally getting around to starting my build. Thinking of putting a linear actuator in to operate the sliding canopy but it would need to go where the air tank is supposed to go in the fuse. Anyone put the air tank in the open section of the wing center section, like under the flap servos to get it out of the way?
Old 03-18-2015, 03:05 PM
  #1694  
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double

Last edited by Ted62; 03-18-2015 at 03:06 PM. Reason: double
Old 03-19-2015, 09:07 AM
  #1695  
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Originally Posted by Todd D
Also finally getting around to starting my build. Thinking of putting a linear actuator in to operate the sliding canopy but it would need to go where the air tank is supposed to go in the fuse. Anyone put the air tank in the open section of the wing center section, like under the flap servos to get it out of the way?
Just curious why you think you'd need to locate one there? Wouldn't it make more sense to try and put an actuator to the rear of the canopy and control it from there, making a track on the very top of the fuselage? Heck, you could even mount a push/pull system inside the cockpit to move the canopy back/forward on the rails.

Ted: just find a drill bit that matches the diameter of the dowels (or slightly smaller) and gently ream out the holes. Be careful to ream out the very back of the holes cleanly, as the little plywood plates they mount to the back of the wooden cross section in there can pop off and fall inside the centre section. How do I know? I did it on one of them "Thankfully" I was planning to cut an access hole on the top of the centre section to mount the Robart electric retract control box and a Gyro in there by creating a floor between the formers, so I had enough room to put it back with a whole lot of extra epoxy on both dowels (using a pair of long nose needle nose pliers that is).

Last edited by chorner; 03-19-2015 at 09:11 AM.
Old 03-19-2015, 12:48 PM
  #1696  
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Thanks @mjhheli !

Looks like good temp readings, but it seems like they are very low? Do You make the measurements on the top or on the cylinder area where combustions is taking place. They are normally warmest there.

I`ve started mine today after the winter and even if it was run empty and got oil inside it was a bit sticky and some small particles in the carb I had to do a full cleanup and also valve adjustments. New start and test tomorrow.
If I´m going for Saito FG 84 carb do I need more than carb? Any inlet suitable?
Old 03-19-2015, 03:52 PM
  #1697  
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Originally Posted by affas
Thanks @mjhheli !

Looks like good temp readings, but it seems like they are very low? Do You make the measurements on the top or on the cylinder area where combustions is taking place. They are normally warmest there.

I`ve started mine today after the winter and even if it was run empty and got oil inside it was a bit sticky and some small particles in the carb I had to do a full cleanup and also valve adjustments. New start and test tomorrow.
If I´m going for Saito FG 84 carb do I need more than carb? Any inlet suitable?
Hi Alf.

The Saito Carb,comes complete,with the velocity stack ( inlet )............all you require are,4 x 45mm stand off's ( 6mm bore ) + 4 x 55mm M6 countersunk bolts + Carb Adaptor from " morrisminimotors"...........not to sure how many "Morris" has had made of these,best be quick and get in touch with him..?

Pretty sure that the "retro-fit" for the 7-77 will be very easy,I'm certain that you can still use the 25mm "ply" stand off ( if that mounting method was used )..........just move the cowl FWD 10 to 12mm.........???

I think that you will be very pleased with the results,I know I was and "Bob" ( in the US ) also..................

I took the UN-COWLED readings on the cylinder head,front,centre area as stated in my previous post.............I have one more "run" to do with the fuel mix at 20:1,so will take some more temp readings at the top...............certainly is a very good blast of air coming off the 3 Blade prop !!!!.....lots of cooling !!!

The 7-77,appears to be very well lubricated,as it feels almost "silky" after it has cooled............so all good inside,I hope !!!

PM me for info on the Carb if you are going to go that route.............?

Kind regards.....................Nick (UK).

Last edited by njmheli; 03-19-2015 at 03:56 PM.
Old 03-19-2015, 05:21 PM
  #1698  
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[QUOTE=chorner;12005958]Just curious why you think you'd need to locate one there? Wouldn't it make more sense to try and put an actuator to the rear of the canopy and control it from there, making a track on the very top of the fuselage? Heck, you could even mount a push/pull system inside the cockpit to move the canopy back/forward on the rails.

I saw a video and some instructions on how another modeler did it over on FG. He was using the area in front of the canopy to mount the linear actuator since the space was there as he also had the elcetric retracts so ne need for the air bottle. Your comment gives me another idea about a possible mounting area for the air bottle though, might just go behind the cockpit area, gotta take a look at that possibility when I get home from this business trip.
If you haven't seen them yet check out the linear actators at Fergelli, pretty cool.
Todd
Old 03-19-2015, 07:40 PM
  #1699  
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I saw a video and some instructions on how another modeler did it over on FG. He was using the area in front of the canopy to mount the linear actuator since the space was there as he also had the elcetric retracts so ne need for the air bottle. Your comment gives me another idea about a possible mounting area for the air bottle though, might just go behind the cockpit area, gotta take a look at that possibility when I get home from this business trip.
If you haven't seen them yet check out the linear actators at Fergelli, pretty cool.
Todd[/QUOTE]

hi Todd D,


i am the one one who put the actuator in my corsair and made the drawings for my fellow corsair builders. when i chose the spot i did i didn't need to use the air as i was using the robart electric gear and that was the only spot i could get both hands to be able to work on the setup. the area behind the wing is very hard to access unless you have very small and flexible hands- arms. i have an electric motor so no need for a fuel tank. since i made the drawings i have changed to the sierra air gear as i was having problems with the robart setup i used two of the small air tanks where the fuel tank would go. i know one of the small tanks is not enough volume for the gear but you might be able to put two small ones in. one under the bar that the canopy is attached too and the other on one side of the fuel tank or the two towards the wing but below the pushrod tubes.
Old 03-20-2015, 02:19 AM
  #1700  
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Originally Posted by kalzone
hi Todd D,


i am the one one who put the actuator in my corsair and made the drawings for my fellow corsair builders. when i chose the spot i did i didn't need to use the air as i was using the robart electric gear and that was the only spot i could get both hands to be able to work on the setup. the area behind the wing is very hard to access unless you have very small and flexible hands- arms. i have an electric motor so no need for a fuel tank. since i made the drawings i have changed to the sierra air gear as i was having problems with the robart setup i used two of the small air tanks where the fuel tank would go. i know one of the small tanks is not enough volume for the gear but you might be able to put two small ones in. one under the bar that the canopy is attached too and the other on one side of the fuel tank or the two towards the wing but below the pushrod tubes.
Can you share the drawings here or point to the posts that you already made?

Last edited by mirored; 03-20-2015 at 02:21 AM.

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