P-38 Lightning Brotherhood
10-20-2014, 10:32 AM
#752
Guys,
If you would like to see the maiden of my P38 that took a long time to get ready go to you tube and type in Warbirds over Hecksher and look for the 0ne by Rich Leonard,
I repaired it and flew it 2 or 3 more times after some mods to the outboard flaps, unfortunately it went into the water 2 weeks ago, managed to salvage the engines and retracts but all else lost...
If you would like to see the maiden of my P38 that took a long time to get ready go to you tube and type in Warbirds over Hecksher and look for the 0ne by Rich Leonard,
I repaired it and flew it 2 or 3 more times after some mods to the outboard flaps, unfortunately it went into the water 2 weeks ago, managed to salvage the engines and retracts but all else lost...
10-20-2014, 11:37 AM
#753
Guys,
If you would like to see the maiden of my P38 that took a long time to get ready go to you tube and type in Warbirds over Hecksher and look for the 0ne by Rich Leonard,
I repaired it and flew it 2 or 3 more times after some mods to the outboard flaps, unfortunately it went into the water 2 weeks ago, managed to salvage the engines and retracts but all else lost...
If you would like to see the maiden of my P38 that took a long time to get ready go to you tube and type in Warbirds over Hecksher and look for the 0ne by Rich Leonard,
I repaired it and flew it 2 or 3 more times after some mods to the outboard flaps, unfortunately it went into the water 2 weeks ago, managed to salvage the engines and retracts but all else lost...
I had a small profile P38 by Great Planes with 25 size engines that I had to come in to land hotter than some of my other planes will fly flat out wide open. As soon I would cut the throttle it would drop like a rock. I couldn't tell in the video if there was a crosswind that day but it looked like she tip stalled on you. The other question....I see the water in the background of the video, is that the water it ended up in?
10-20-2014, 03:20 PM
#754
Hey Tony,
We thought it tipped stalled also, though my friend who did the 1st flight to trim it out didn't bring it in too slow. We did add a touch of flaps and not sure if that contributed to the crash.
The damage wasn't as bad as it looked in the video, I added a hardwood spar to both outer wing panels as well as a separate flap servo for each outer flap, the instructions had a spade and tongue arrangement that I was never really happy with.
As for the water, we fly in a state park that just happens to be on the Great South Bay which is on the south shore of Long Island, I wasn't the 1st and certainly not be the last but thankfully the Suffolk Marine Bureau was kind enough to retrieve it for me. I was able to salvage the engines and retracts, all electronics are gone.
I am moving to AZ next year and figure I will only have to fight the scorpions for whatever pieces are left....
Larry
We thought it tipped stalled also, though my friend who did the 1st flight to trim it out didn't bring it in too slow. We did add a touch of flaps and not sure if that contributed to the crash.
The damage wasn't as bad as it looked in the video, I added a hardwood spar to both outer wing panels as well as a separate flap servo for each outer flap, the instructions had a spade and tongue arrangement that I was never really happy with.
As for the water, we fly in a state park that just happens to be on the Great South Bay which is on the south shore of Long Island, I wasn't the 1st and certainly not be the last but thankfully the Suffolk Marine Bureau was kind enough to retrieve it for me. I was able to salvage the engines and retracts, all electronics are gone.
I am moving to AZ next year and figure I will only have to fight the scorpions for whatever pieces are left....
Larry
10-20-2014, 04:10 PM
#755
As far as scorpions...the black ones are the nastiest.
10-20-2014, 06:09 PM
#756
Guys,
If you would like to see the maiden of my P38 that took a long time to get ready go to you tube and type in Warbirds over Hecksher and look for the 0ne by Rich Leonard,
I repaired it and flew it 2 or 3 more times after some mods to the outboard flaps, unfortunately it went into the water 2 weeks ago, managed to salvage the engines and retracts but all else lost...
If you would like to see the maiden of my P38 that took a long time to get ready go to you tube and type in Warbirds over Hecksher and look for the 0ne by Rich Leonard,
I repaired it and flew it 2 or 3 more times after some mods to the outboard flaps, unfortunately it went into the water 2 weeks ago, managed to salvage the engines and retracts but all else lost...
Video linked in
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g3APwrzzvLc
10-20-2014, 06:25 PM
#757
Just watched video, nice looking plane, that sucks! No audio, so can't hear the engines, but if you were carrying power on the final, looks like you might have lost the right engine. I only say that the way it yaws around like the left engine is pushing, but not the right. Can't really tell, and it really doesn't matter at this point
Nothing worse that loosing everything. Happened to me once when the club flew in the Stratford marsh (Balsa Bugs). Wasn't really a crash, just landed in the water. Got it back, but radio and servos were junk. I actually put my AM radio in it ( late 80s), flushed out the engine with WD40 and flew it for a couple more months. Finally had to retired it as the soggy wings were flexing like a wet noddle, funniest thing.
Nothing worse that loosing everything. Happened to me once when the club flew in the Stratford marsh (Balsa Bugs). Wasn't really a crash, just landed in the water. Got it back, but radio and servos were junk. I actually put my AM radio in it ( late 80s), flushed out the engine with WD40 and flew it for a couple more months. Finally had to retired it as the soggy wings were flexing like a wet noddle, funniest thing.
Last edited by 70 ragtop; 10-21-2014 at 07:16 PM.
10-23-2014, 05:36 PM
#759
Calling all the Ziroli P-38 guys
Received the following PM from a fellow modeler with a few questions on a Ziroli P-38. Hoping you guys can help him out
I was wondering if your group could help me out with respect to my latest build. I've followed and a approached a number of builders of the airplane and thought that your group could also help me out.
Here is the zest of the message i sent out to the builders.
I have been following a number of your build threads for the last three months now on you Nick Ziroli P-38 Lightning. I have just started building my Ziroli P-38 and your builds have helped me considerably. Without the help you have provided, I would have been completely lost as to where to start, what to do in addition to the plans, the little work-arounds you have incorporated in your builds as well as some of the improvements you have all made. You fellows are undoubtedly the masters when it comes to giant scale planes. I really appreciate your efforts and the documentation and photographs you have placed in the forums for other builders to use and admire. A gracious effort!
Now having said all of this praise and my gratitude's, here is my dilemma, I'm in a position now to do some planking. But before I do, I need some advice on the servos. The last thing I want to do is to re-think the placement and undo what I have already done.
So here are some questions related completely to the servos you used in your builds..
That's it. hopefully you could give me some insight on this. Just so you know, I'm a Futaba fan and I'll be using my Futaba 8J transmitter and R2008SB receiver. I'm also looking into the S-Bus capabilities for my servos. Your honest thoughts on this would also be appreciated.
Received the following PM from a fellow modeler with a few questions on a Ziroli P-38. Hoping you guys can help him out
I was wondering if your group could help me out with respect to my latest build. I've followed and a approached a number of builders of the airplane and thought that your group could also help me out.
Here is the zest of the message i sent out to the builders.
I have been following a number of your build threads for the last three months now on you Nick Ziroli P-38 Lightning. I have just started building my Ziroli P-38 and your builds have helped me considerably. Without the help you have provided, I would have been completely lost as to where to start, what to do in addition to the plans, the little work-arounds you have incorporated in your builds as well as some of the improvements you have all made. You fellows are undoubtedly the masters when it comes to giant scale planes. I really appreciate your efforts and the documentation and photographs you have placed in the forums for other builders to use and admire. A gracious effort!
Now having said all of this praise and my gratitude's, here is my dilemma, I'm in a position now to do some planking. But before I do, I need some advice on the servos. The last thing I want to do is to re-think the placement and undo what I have already done.
So here are some questions related completely to the servos you used in your builds..
- What servos and how many did you in your build and for what function were they used for?
(a make/model/usage would suffice to help me find the right torque values.) - Could you provide me with pictures of the placement of the servos in your build. Where did you put them and what placement(internal/external).
- What did you use to synchronize the servos. Like for the throttles, flaps, rudder, elevator, ailerons (if any)? I plan to use at least 10 for my build.
- And, finally, because of the number of servos and other accessories like lights, what have you used to make sure that there are enough amps to satisfy the draw? Did you use multiple batteries, of what type, how they connected and where were they placed to help with the CG.
That's it. hopefully you could give me some insight on this. Just so you know, I'm a Futaba fan and I'll be using my Futaba 8J transmitter and R2008SB receiver. I'm also looking into the S-Bus capabilities for my servos. Your honest thoughts on this would also be appreciated.
10-23-2014, 05:48 PM
#760
Check out this listing that just went up for a Yellow P-38 for $600. Doubt it will be around long!
http://www.rcuniverse.com/market/ite...itemId=1003081
http://www.rcuniverse.com/market/ite...itemId=1003081
10-24-2014, 06:42 AM
#761
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Any servo with a torque of 90 in-oz or better will do-I'm using Futaba S9305's on the control surfaces and NG, you can use anything for the retracts and throttles. You're going to need a total of 14 servo's, I've got 18 for bomb drop and chokes.
The servo location's are on the plan. I always use 2 A123 batteries, it cheap insurance for a model this expensive and modern servo's can take the 6.6 Volts without adding a voltage regulator.
An 8 channel radio is going to be difficult to set up the P-38 with. If you're careful with your build you shouldn't need any adjustment as the servo's are all pretty close.
You don't have enough channels to plug each individual servo into it's own channel but don't use a Y cord, the current available to each servo is cut in half. I'm not familiar with Futaba, I've always used JR and just switched to Jetti, but you can use a JR matchbox that will allow you to adjust end points on up to four servo's per "channel" and there's no current loss. Not sure if Futaba has something similar.
Use heavy duty extension cords, 22 ga minimum to minimize voltage drop. I use cord with 20 ga but 22 should be OK.
Plan on mounting the batteries as far forward in the nose as you can to minimize additional lead to balance it.
Check your Rx specs to make sure that it can handle the current draw of the 10 controls servo's, especially during landing when the flaps are down, flap servo's can draw a lot of current and on the P-38 there are four of them.
Jon
PS, not sure if everyone knows, but Yellow Aircraft is no longer making or selling kits.
Last edited by F106A; 10-24-2014 at 06:55 AM.
10-24-2014, 03:46 PM
#762
F106
I PM'd Ben and told him to check the thread....thanks
Yeah, it's a shame about Yellow, spoke with Charles last week and he was pretty sure no one was going to pickup the line and continue to offer them....which is a real shame.
Hope one of the guys who have been looking for a Yellow P-38 for a while, were able to snag that one yesterday. That was pretty cheap!
I PM'd Ben and told him to check the thread....thanks
Yeah, it's a shame about Yellow, spoke with Charles last week and he was pretty sure no one was going to pickup the line and continue to offer them....which is a real shame.
Hope one of the guys who have been looking for a Yellow P-38 for a while, were able to snag that one yesterday. That was pretty cheap!
10-25-2014, 07:28 AM
#765
I was going to PM you, but I don't get email notices for PMs anymore, so it really wouldn't have helped?? There seems to be a huge delay with email notifications going out in general
TLH101
Looking good
Don't realize the Wing MFG kit came with glass cowls. Is that a glass faring above the wing?
Looking good!
TLH101
Looking good
Don't realize the Wing MFG kit came with glass cowls. Is that a glass faring above the wing?
Looking good!
10-25-2014, 09:45 AM
#766
10-31-2014, 04:59 PM
#767
Ok so here is the concept for the current P38 project.
1. Easy to Build
2. Doesn't fall out of the sky unintentionally
I have experimented with electrics because it is a fair certainty that if one fan is turning both fans will keep turning. It does make the fear of spontaneous snap rolls less a factor when flying but there are other drawbacks, not the least of which for me is the satisfaction endorphin secreted when I hear two sync'd engines running.
Sooo I want to see if I can duplicate a success I had with modifying a Sig Kadet into a twin. The modified Kadet twin is easily flown on one engine, well maybe not easily but successfully!! (I have intentionally taken off with one as well as shut one down while in flight) That plane has well over 100 successful flights to date. (most of the time with both engines running)
The easily built goal will come from the box style construction of the Kadet for the booms and pod and the semi-symmetrical low wing loading hershey-bar type wing of an old Great Planes model I'm familiar with called "GLA". The "Great Little Airplane" wing had a slight swept back design that I think will aid in the flight characteristics and I think I can do some things to enhance the outline of the wing that could keep the results at least a kind of stand-off appearance as true as possible to the full scale. Then we will just have to hope the paint guy can make me look good!!
It will have retracts, about a 56 inch one piece wing with 0 dihedral, I have not decided on power plants yet but leaning toward 40 size although 25's are a real possibility, I know a way to easily incorporate Fowler style flaps between the booms and the rest of the wingspan will have ailerons, 0 incidence on both wing and stab with the thrust line going straight through the wing.
So having sufficiently bored everyone I'll stop for now. There will be pictures along the way and I genuinely appreciate suggestions and/or experience.
Looking forward to getting to know some of you
1. Easy to Build
2. Doesn't fall out of the sky unintentionally
I have experimented with electrics because it is a fair certainty that if one fan is turning both fans will keep turning. It does make the fear of spontaneous snap rolls less a factor when flying but there are other drawbacks, not the least of which for me is the satisfaction endorphin secreted when I hear two sync'd engines running.
Sooo I want to see if I can duplicate a success I had with modifying a Sig Kadet into a twin. The modified Kadet twin is easily flown on one engine, well maybe not easily but successfully!! (I have intentionally taken off with one as well as shut one down while in flight) That plane has well over 100 successful flights to date. (most of the time with both engines running)
The easily built goal will come from the box style construction of the Kadet for the booms and pod and the semi-symmetrical low wing loading hershey-bar type wing of an old Great Planes model I'm familiar with called "GLA". The "Great Little Airplane" wing had a slight swept back design that I think will aid in the flight characteristics and I think I can do some things to enhance the outline of the wing that could keep the results at least a kind of stand-off appearance as true as possible to the full scale. Then we will just have to hope the paint guy can make me look good!!
It will have retracts, about a 56 inch one piece wing with 0 dihedral, I have not decided on power plants yet but leaning toward 40 size although 25's are a real possibility, I know a way to easily incorporate Fowler style flaps between the booms and the rest of the wingspan will have ailerons, 0 incidence on both wing and stab with the thrust line going straight through the wing.
So having sufficiently bored everyone I'll stop for now. There will be pictures along the way and I genuinely appreciate suggestions and/or experience.
Looking forward to getting to know some of you
It does feel good when you get it up on the wheels the first time so here is a pic to share.
11-01-2014, 03:10 AM
#768
Hey Terry,
Nice work... what a shame about Yellow, I missed out on a Trojan from Byron before they became Iron Bay... I'm thinking with the dwindling number of builders it would be tough to keep a decent customer base. With all the ARF's and ARC's out there not to mention the foamies out there.
I contacted the guy I got my P-38 from and will purchase another one when I get to Arizona, wife thinks I will taking up too much room in the moving truck when we make the move next year.
Here's the website for the P-38, manageable size fiberglass booms and pod. rcairplane.net G&P sales
Happy Flying as winds here this weekend will be in the 20 - 40 MPH category
Larry
Nice work... what a shame about Yellow, I missed out on a Trojan from Byron before they became Iron Bay... I'm thinking with the dwindling number of builders it would be tough to keep a decent customer base. With all the ARF's and ARC's out there not to mention the foamies out there.
I contacted the guy I got my P-38 from and will purchase another one when I get to Arizona, wife thinks I will taking up too much room in the moving truck when we make the move next year.
Here's the website for the P-38, manageable size fiberglass booms and pod. rcairplane.net G&P sales
Happy Flying as winds here this weekend will be in the 20 - 40 MPH category
Larry
11-01-2014, 06:58 PM
#770
Tony
Looking good, whats the wingspan
Larry
If you scroll through this thread, someone had a G&P-38 they're not happy with...can't remember who.. Boom was warped from sitting, thin layup I think. Easy enough to straighten most of *** out with a heat gun, and add some carbon for strength
With the end of the Yellow Aircraft line
, I started a rebuild thread on the Yellow-38. Figured I would share what I learned, and a bunch of pictures. I think there may be a few banged up planes sitting around out there, hopefully this thread will help motivate some more rebuilds!
http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2274813
Looking good, whats the wingspan
Larry
If you scroll through this thread, someone had a G&P-38 they're not happy with...can't remember who.. Boom was warped from sitting, thin layup I think. Easy enough to straighten most of *** out with a heat gun, and add some carbon for strength
With the end of the Yellow Aircraft line
, I started a rebuild thread on the Yellow-38. Figured I would share what I learned, and a bunch of pictures. I think there may be a few banged up planes sitting around out there, hopefully this thread will help motivate some more rebuilds! http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2274813
11-02-2014, 03:11 AM
#771
Ragtop
You're correct the glass was thin forward of the wings but once the ply formers were added it wasn't terrible. The first deliver had a cracked boom and Bill had no problem replacing it.
After the first crash I added servos for the outboard flaps since I was never happy with his setup with the square brass tube and spade setup to drive them.
For the price it was a good plane, and since I know all the changes that need to be made it will be easier to build another one.
I will look back through the thread and see if I can find the portion with his kit.
Larry
You're correct the glass was thin forward of the wings but once the ply formers were added it wasn't terrible. The first deliver had a cracked boom and Bill had no problem replacing it.
After the first crash I added servos for the outboard flaps since I was never happy with his setup with the square brass tube and spade setup to drive them.
For the price it was a good plane, and since I know all the changes that need to be made it will be easier to build another one.
I will look back through the thread and see if I can find the portion with his kit.
Larry
11-02-2014, 03:15 PM
#772
Thanks for asking!!
I've been struggling with the retracts but I think I have it figured out and I got it squared up and the booms mounted today. It's obvious there are no firewalls yet cause I am leaning toward a pair of LA 40's but all I have in the spare parts bin are a matched pair of 25"s. If I find another LA 40 I'll mount those up instead of the 25's and close the front of the booms. Then all I have left are the tail feathers which should be a quick build.
11-02-2014, 03:37 PM
#773
For this one I have different goals in mind. I have personally seen more engine out scenarios than I would like cause they all unfortunately ended up the same way. I spouted off one day and said I thought I could come up with a design that wouldn't do that and they said "do it". So that's how this started. The Kadet influence is to try and make this a relatively easy build and hopefully save a few ounces as well. I want to end up with something pleasing to the eye but if all goes well the ultimate goal is flying it around on one engine.
Still needs a little filler and finish on the gun ports.