Jerry Bates P-51B Build "Hell Yes Let's Go!!!"
10-17-2016, 01:49 PM
#51
Thread Starter
My Feedback: (13)
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: C/S CO
Posts: 730
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Sorry to here about your TF -51B Those are great flying planes. Building with the FG fuse it's a bit different. You are basically filling an empty space with parts unlike building from the plans. You can only use the plans and Vic's panel lines for reference to align parts as well as allot of second guessing yourself
10-17-2016, 02:58 PM
#52
At least, when you are building it yourself you can toss substandard parts or wood, ARFs, you have to take the crap wood they build with or stick patches where they might do some good. I have been doing ARF planes for about 20 years and have decided that you really don't save any time OR money going that route. The first warbirds I built in the early 70's were kits or fiberglass and foam, so I am familar with the methods used in construction. The fiberglass fuse planes I have built in the past never had panel lines for reference. My brother has scratch-built planes with large 10 foot foam wings before there were giant scale kits available. One, we used to kid him about, we called his wing a surfboard. He crashed it straight down into the woods and the wing was not damaged, just knocked off. He used to visit the small engine repair shop, buy weed-wacker motors that had been tossed into a bin for a few bucks, take them home and get them running to power his own-design giant scale planes. He did not have much horsepower to work with, but they flew.
It is always nice to open a box and in a few minutes have a plane that looks ready to go. Only they usually require extensive mods. to make them airworthy, and, tossing out the hardware supplied with the plane and buying all new stuff is like paying twice. You could argue that you should just use what comes with the plane and save money, but that has led to costly failures and loss of a lot more than the ARF.
It is always nice to open a box and in a few minutes have a plane that looks ready to go. Only they usually require extensive mods. to make them airworthy, and, tossing out the hardware supplied with the plane and buying all new stuff is like paying twice. You could argue that you should just use what comes with the plane and save money, but that has led to costly failures and loss of a lot more than the ARF.
10-17-2016, 02:58 PM
#53
The only ARF planes I have bought that you could truly just outfit and fly are competition sailplanes, very expensive, and they need expensive components to complete. But once balanced, programmed, and trimmed to your flying style can make you look really good at an event. They seldom need any mods. to improve performance, they are a reflection of the pilot's skill, and ability to read weather conditions to excel and win.
10-17-2016, 03:40 PM
#54
This will be the squadron colors my B model will fly with. Thats me sitting in the rear cockpit with the ground crewman checking my seat belts. The plane displays the markings that Col. C. M. McCorkle used in the Mediteranean theatre. He got 6 kills in Spitfires then 5 more in this plane. He was still flying it when the war ended, He assigned all of the new D model Mustangs to the new replacement pilots and kept this one as his exclusive fighter. The Col. was the 31st Fighter Group commander and led missions with as many as 60 Mustangs following. He stayed with the B model because, when the enemy was sighted, He had a 20 mph speed advantage over the D models and could get a first shot. He may have been the only veteran fighter pilot still flying a B model at the end of the war. Every time they are in our area, my pit crew guy, Bill, insists that we go see it. It is his favorite plane, and the markings are also easy for an old f**t like me to see from the ground.
On this flight the pilot demonstrated maneuvers, then let me fly them. He had me repeat some because I was a little too conservative. This was the fastest I have ever flown at low altitude (close to 300) and I don't remember if the airspeed indicator read Knots or Mph. I did turns around a point, wingovers, and several dives to high speed with a pullup to a military roll. At RC warbird events I like to do a long vertical climb, but I was advised by the "experts" that warbirds didn't do that. Then I witnessed this plane, "Betty Jane" at an airshow, come in low and fast, to the runway center, then pull vertical and go straight up for a mile before leveling off. I don't let the "experts" tell me how to fly my P-51 model any more.
Last edited by sjhanc; 10-17-2016 at 03:45 PM.
10-17-2016, 07:31 PM
#55
Thread Starter
My Feedback: (13)
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: C/S CO
Posts: 730
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
That must have been to best experience ever! I was fortunate enough to do a similar flight however it was in a NAVY SNJ (AT-6). I was able to take over the stick and put it through the maneuvers as well, loops and rolls.
But a Mustang??? That would be the best!
My buddy Big Rob just ordered the TOP RC P-51D. I looked at these up close and for an ARF they are very nice!. would be a great platform to detail out and skip the big build.
But a Mustang??? That would be the best!
My buddy Big Rob just ordered the TOP RC P-51D. I looked at these up close and for an ARF they are very nice!. would be a great platform to detail out and skip the big build.
Last edited by propwashed; 10-17-2016 at 07:59 PM.
10-17-2016, 07:51 PM
#56
Thread Starter
My Feedback: (13)
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: C/S CO
Posts: 730
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Okay back to the build.. Remember when I epoxied in that first former for the wing dowels into the bottom of the fuse? Wrong! I jumped the gun and assumed it was to rest tight against the face of the the bottom radiator opening and it is actually suppose to sit back about 1/2". Pay close attention to this as the plans are for the wood build and do not show the extension that's molded into the fuse which allows the belly scoop to attach. I only noticed this from some pictures of Vic's build.
Fortunately, I have a CNC and was able to re-cut the former relatively quickly after cutting and sanding out the freshly installed one. Dam!!! I did however go ahead and cut it out of CF plate that I had
and then glued the 1/4" doubler to the back of it. I hate hacking back apart but I feel better now. Always something........
WRONG!
CORRECT
Fortunately, I have a CNC and was able to re-cut the former relatively quickly after cutting and sanding out the freshly installed one. Dam!!! I did however go ahead and cut it out of CF plate that I had
and then glued the 1/4" doubler to the back of it. I hate hacking back apart but I feel better now. Always something........
10-17-2016, 08:15 PM
#57
Yeah, the only thing left on my bucket list is a ride in an F-16. I am afraid they will retire them before I get a chance though. The military is going to start shooting them down soon as QF-16 target drones. What a waste. The turn out on to the active runway, then running up to over 1000 hp (the noise!) and releasing the brakes was awesome. It set me back in the seat for the whole length of the runway, I felt the rotation, heard him hit a switch and he was climbing at a steep angle and rolling left into a turn as the gear thumped into the wells. I stop-watched the retraction in the video at 3 seconds to doors closed. The sky was overcast so he went around the airport and headed Sw (I think) accelerating all the way, under the clouds until he found a gap in the clouds with blue sky at the top, pulled it into a steep climb and we were on top in seconds at 4,500 feet. we stayed between 5,000 and 6,500 for the maneuvers, lasting about 45 minutes, then he throttled back, put the nose down and we lost altitude rapidly until he spotted a lake below, dove on down to 1,200 and steered for the runway still doing 300. when we got close we were still going too fast so he called for a flyby at 500 feet and we coasted down the runway, turned left to the downwind and it finally slowed to 150 about a mile out, he dropped the gear, added flaps, it started slowing quickly as we turned on final and he set the throttle, prop pitch, and more flaps. It settled into a smooth flat approach down to about 15 feet and around 110-120 mph. He cut the power and it seemed to float so he lowered the left wing tip as he flared, feeling for the touch down. The left wheel touched gently, he leveled the wings to get the right wheel down and it suddenly seemed to be eating runway fast, with the Merlin popping from the left front cylinder and the rest rumbling. It took me a couple of weeks to get my feet to touch the ground.
10-17-2016, 08:39 PM
#59
propwashed, good advice on the bulkhead, I probably would have missed that detail also. On the wing plans, what kind of airfoil is used for the wing? full, or semisymetrical?
I recently watched a Top RC Mustang fly at an event recently. It did pretty good. My brother got to look at it up close, he says it is a good looking plane.
We also got to see a larger Mustang fly with an inline DA 100 twin cylinder. The sound that motor makes is very different from the gas singles. I think it sounds better than if it was a four stroke. It seems to be a very smooth running engine, no powerpulse. I think it has a 180 degree crankshaft because it does not sound like any of the flat twins used in 3d planes. The pilot mentioned it took him 50 flights to get the cooling right. It got me thinking that if the firewall is moved back to the scale location it would fit in the H 9 Mustang. It will certainly turn a 4 blade prop. The DA 100 is a custom, made-to-order engine. With an exhaust system it will cost around $2,000.
I recently watched a Top RC Mustang fly at an event recently. It did pretty good. My brother got to look at it up close, he says it is a good looking plane.
We also got to see a larger Mustang fly with an inline DA 100 twin cylinder. The sound that motor makes is very different from the gas singles. I think it sounds better than if it was a four stroke. It seems to be a very smooth running engine, no powerpulse. I think it has a 180 degree crankshaft because it does not sound like any of the flat twins used in 3d planes. The pilot mentioned it took him 50 flights to get the cooling right. It got me thinking that if the firewall is moved back to the scale location it would fit in the H 9 Mustang. It will certainly turn a 4 blade prop. The DA 100 is a custom, made-to-order engine. With an exhaust system it will cost around $2,000.
10-17-2016, 09:10 PM
#60
Once I get theTop RC, I'll share some photos on here. As long as Tripp doesn't mind me hacking his thread. Glad you caught that bulkhead, would of sucked if you got further along. Big Rob out <3
10-18-2016, 04:42 PM
#66
Thread Starter
My Feedback: (13)
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: C/S CO
Posts: 730
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
All my additional balsa and ply showed up today from National Balsa. Have not looked at all of it yet but the quality looks good so far.
I ordered all 48" long stock and 2'x12" sheets of diff thickness/grade ply. I believe my take off was on the fat side so hopefully have some extra for misc. The wing plan calls for 1/2"x1/4" balsa top and bottom stringers. I ordered some basswood strips of equal size to most likely replace with. We'll see.
I ordered all 48" long stock and 2'x12" sheets of diff thickness/grade ply. I believe my take off was on the fat side so hopefully have some extra for misc. The wing plan calls for 1/2"x1/4" balsa top and bottom stringers. I ordered some basswood strips of equal size to most likely replace with. We'll see.
10-18-2016, 07:37 PM
#67
Thread Starter
My Feedback: (13)
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: C/S CO
Posts: 730
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Not a whole lot of progress tonight. I did manage to do some motor mock up. I cut a 5.5" CF sheet to act as the spinner backplate (waiting on spinner) as well as some prop shaft shims (4pcs = 8mm).
Inserting the motor then mounting the shaft shims, back plate and an old prop hub I was able to easily center the backplate on the nose of the fuse and tape it in position. This is how I will determine the firewall location. The backplate will be advanced away approx 1/32 -1/16" off the face of the nose. I will then basically slide the firewall up to the motor stand offs and tack it in place so I can mark the hole locations. I may slide the firewall back and use longer standoffs or spacers for in the event I choose to go with a larger motor.
With the mock up in place I was able to determine that the head, plug cap and exhaust of the DLE 55RA will completely clear the chin cowl. Awesome! However without the shaft shims the plug cap would require a very small hole.
Inserting the motor then mounting the shaft shims, back plate and an old prop hub I was able to easily center the backplate on the nose of the fuse and tape it in position. This is how I will determine the firewall location. The backplate will be advanced away approx 1/32 -1/16" off the face of the nose. I will then basically slide the firewall up to the motor stand offs and tack it in place so I can mark the hole locations. I may slide the firewall back and use longer standoffs or spacers for in the event I choose to go with a larger motor.
With the mock up in place I was able to determine that the head, plug cap and exhaust of the DLE 55RA will completely clear the chin cowl. Awesome! However without the shaft shims the plug cap would require a very small hole.
Last edited by propwashed; 10-18-2016 at 07:43 PM.
10-18-2016, 07:58 PM
#68
Thread Starter
My Feedback: (13)
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: C/S CO
Posts: 730
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
[QUOTE=sjhanc;12268418]propwashed, good advice on the bulkhead, I probably would have missed that detail also. On the wing plans, what kind of airfoil is used for the wing? full, or semisymetrical?
Semi Symmetrical. Looking at the rib details you can clearly see the upper half of the ribs are raised more than the bottom. Also it is clear that some washout has been designed in nearing the final rib W-14.
Semi Symmetrical. Looking at the rib details you can clearly see the upper half of the ribs are raised more than the bottom. Also it is clear that some washout has been designed in nearing the final rib W-14.
Last edited by propwashed; 10-19-2016 at 05:06 AM.
10-19-2016, 12:31 AM
#69
At RC warbird events I like to do a long vertical climb, but I was advised by the "experts" that warbirds didn't do that. Then I witnessed this plane, "Betty Jane" at an airshow, come in low and fast, to the runway center, then pull vertical and go straight up for a mile before leveling off. I don't let the "experts" tell me how to fly my P-51 model any more.
Last edited by Hydro Junkie; 10-19-2016 at 12:36 AM.
10-19-2016, 05:42 AM
#71
Thread Starter
My Feedback: (13)
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: C/S CO
Posts: 730
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Still working on the firewall. Made a 3/64" plywood shim ring to glue to the back of the temp spinner back plate to set the proper clearance. then was able to finalize the firewall location. Also made some 3/8" thick CF shims to install between the stand offs and the firewall to allow more room/distance in the event I go with a larger motor and to make linkage connections a bit easier. Once the motor was re secured I installed the firewall shims to the standoffs and secured them with the bolts. Next I installed small round earth magnets on each bolt heads and slid the firewall tight against the magnets. Using a small stack of the same magnets I was able to located the exact location for the bolt holes. Worked out pretty good. after drilling the holes the firewall get re mounted to the motor for initial epoxy to the fuse. I plan on using a combination of CF and FG to epoxy glass it to the fuse. I will also be cutting a skeleton-ized doubler for the back of the firewall
to give more strength to the bonding surface.
to give more strength to the bonding surface.
Last edited by propwashed; 10-19-2016 at 09:23 PM.
10-19-2016, 09:16 PM
#75
Thread Starter
My Feedback: (13)
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: C/S CO
Posts: 730
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Well the firewall is mounted. The wood kit comes with two 1/4" ply cut formers to glue together to create a 1/2" thick firewall. I opted to go ahead and custom cut a piece of 2mm CF and a piece of 1/8" ply to create a lighter version. The CF plate is laminated in between the 1/4 and 1/8" pieces of ply. I used CF strands to epoxy to the fuse. Once fully set up I will remove the motor and do the forward side. I don't think this will be going anywhere but I may throw some glass cloth at it as well. Installed the rear Servo tray former as well as getting a coat of paint to the interior radio area, cockpit sides and interior canopy framework. I used my small automotive detail gun. There is no paint on the outside yet it's just visible through the fuse.
Note: Behr indoor/outdoor Latex house paint (Flat) thinned 1:1 with windshield wiper fluid is without a doubt one of the best systems I have used for scale rc aircraft and will be using this method on this build exclusively. Drys super quick, it's fuel proof and will save you tons in the wallet. Shoot it with automotive HVLP guns or airbrushes for detail work.
Note: Behr indoor/outdoor Latex house paint (Flat) thinned 1:1 with windshield wiper fluid is without a doubt one of the best systems I have used for scale rc aircraft and will be using this method on this build exclusively. Drys super quick, it's fuel proof and will save you tons in the wallet. Shoot it with automotive HVLP guns or airbrushes for detail work.