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GSP Spitfire ARF build

Old 07-05-2004, 09:38 AM
  #26  
butlern
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Default RE: GSP Spitfire ARF build

I flew mine for the first time yesterday...

Oh, brother! That planes screams with a YS120 up front!

Unfortunately, I was so thrilled with its performance that I ran it out of fuel on its maiden flight (way downwind), and I couldn't make the runway into the stiff wind we had yesterday afternoon. It came down in some tall grass about 10 meters short. I tried a little too hard to get it all the way home and it tip stalled about 0.5 m off the deck. Thankfully, there was no major damage. I did bend one of the oleos a bit, but I think that I can get it realigned. I was impressed by how slow it was moving before it stalled. I'm also impressed by the fact that the main spars and retract mechanism held in place. The plane is about 5kg, and that's a fair amount of force when dropped at an awkward angle, and from that height. So, while I can't yet comment on whether mine will nose over when landing on the mains, I think that it should 3-point pretty easily based on what I saw mine do yesterday.

Overall, I'm very happy. Next time I'll do a better job monitering my time in the air (that YS gulps the fuel more so than any other engine I use).

Have you guys tried to slow it down a little more?

When I get mine back in service, I'll let you know what I find.

Regards,

Noah
Old 07-05-2004, 09:52 AM
  #27  
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Default RE: GSP Spitfire ARF build

Congrats on the maiden!

maybe you should have kept the gear up and belly landed [8D]
Old 07-05-2004, 10:00 AM
  #28  
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Default RE: GSP Spitfire ARF build

Yeah, I guess I was a bit delusional about making the field.

There are a hundred things I should have done differently on that flight (I could have started by keeping it short).

I'll let you know how my future flights go.

By the way, Sonnich, have you flown your Zero yet?? I'm anxious to hear about your experiences.

Noah
Old 07-05-2004, 10:49 AM
  #29  
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Default RE: GSP Spitfire ARF build

Not yet..... Im installing some sulivan cables in it instead of those flower posts that come with the kit :-)
Old 07-05-2004, 01:16 PM
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Default RE: GSP Spitfire ARF build

My maiden was a bit hairy too!! The cheap plastic throttle connector broke. Had to buzz around at full chat for 15 mins while I ran the tank dry. Thankfully I made sure I had enough height as the engine cut. So my maiden was a dead-stick too. Not what you want with a new bird - it's hair raising enough as it is.

Hgiles, you said in the initial post that you were thinking of a .91 FS as the review had a .91. Well don't forget that the review plain had an RCV .91 which is a geared motor (2:1) I just think a standard .91 is not enough motor for this baby. I have an ASP1.20FS which has plenty of grunt but I would say it's only adequate for a 10.5lb Spit. Also you want to throw a reasonable size prop (15" or 16") I first flew mine with a 16x8 - flew great and looked good too. One of our members uses a 14x7 3-blader and it just looks too small.

Just my opinion - please feel free to "shoot me down"

Pete
Old 07-06-2004, 07:00 AM
  #31  
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Default RE: GSP Spitfire ARF build

Ran into some other projects around the house that required my attention. Haven't had time to do much to the Spitfire other than paint on some invasion stripes. I put a set on the tail end of the fuselage and I put a set on the bottom side only of each wing. I will probably paint some yellow on the leading edge of the wings too -- just to make it more distinctive.

The review of the plane here on RCU has a YS 91 FS in the plane I believe he says he wouldn't hesitate to use any .91 FS. My THunder TIger should be about as strong as a Saito 100, so I am hoping it is enough. It is what I have so, it is what I will use, unless something else falls into my lap. I have a Brison 2.4 and a Saito .56 sitting in boxes, and I thought the TT the better of my choices.

I have a set of Spring Air 103HD pneum retracts to go in it, but may opt for the fixed gear for now, until after the maiden... Going to replace the nylon clevises with some steel ones from GP. The control horns will hopefully be just fine.
Old 07-07-2004, 02:37 AM
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Default RE: GSP Spitfire ARF build

Hgiles,

My humble apologies, you are of course quite correct. The review plane did indeed have a YS91FS NOT an RCV. I was thinking of the GSP Corsair review, which is still in its box in my garage waiting for me to clear the building table (Flair Giles 202 3D).

Looking at the video clips of the review Spit, especially the take-off, it seems that the .91 had plenty of power. Although a 1.20 would give you some reserve. Mine will do big lazy loops, which I doubt would be possible with a .91 (somebody prove me wrong here)....

Pete
Old 07-07-2004, 08:36 AM
  #33  
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Default RE: GSP Spitfire ARF build

ORIGINAL: Pete850

Hgiles,

My humble apologies, you are of course quite correct. The review plane did indeed have a YS91FS NOT an RCV.
Looking at the video clips of the review Spit, especially the take-off, it seems that the .91 had plenty of power.
Please scroll back to Post #8 and view the two videos given at the bottom of that post, which show the Spit being flown with a YS 91FZ. Then check out the engine on Post #11. The YS 91 indeed had plenty of power.
Old 07-07-2004, 08:43 AM
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Default RE: GSP Spitfire ARF build

ORIGINAL: hgiles

My THunder TIger should be about as strong as a Saito 100, so I am hoping it is enough.
Your TT .91 will be underpowered with this plane. The supercharged YS .91 in the review puts out around 40% more power than the TT .91. This plane will end up around 11 lbs 9 oz with air retracts, so the TT .91 will fly it scale at best. The TT .91 is more suitable for planes weighing up to 10 lbs.
Old 07-07-2004, 09:32 AM
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Default RE: GSP Spitfire ARF build

The supercharged YS .91 in the review puts out around 40% more power than the TT .91.
No wonder it was so sprightly......I guess the supercharged YS .91 has a similar output to a standard 1.20 4-stroke. It's all starting to make sense now......

Pete
Old 07-07-2004, 09:33 AM
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Default RE: GSP Spitfire ARF build

How d'you think it would go with an 850 Commando engine?
Old 07-07-2004, 01:41 PM
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Default RE: GSP Spitfire ARF build

Looks like I am going to be in trouble with the TT .91 FS. Great! I will try it and see. I have no other engine even close right now. Maybe I will look for a G-26!
Old 07-11-2004, 11:07 AM
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Default RE: GSP Spitfire ARF build

Hey guys
I just finished building my CMpro spit with a Saito 120 but I installed a pair of World Model mechanical retracts instead of air to cut costs. Now the model is finished I'm worried the weight might be a little too much what do you think? I have already flown my CMPro P-51 with the same retracts and that went well but the spit is a little heavier.
Also this spit has such a beautiful paint job that I think its a shame to send it up in the air without some treatment to the finish, do you have any suggestions?
Kal
Old 07-11-2004, 03:16 PM
  #39  
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Default RE: GSP Spitfire ARF build

kqutob,
What model did your WM retracts come out of? I was considering doing the same thing, that is put a set of GS WM Zero mechanicals in the Spit and using my Spring Air 103 HDs in the Zero. Of course that would require me to buy that WM Zero that I have been staring down lately.

I worry every day about my TT 91 FS not being enough engine. It should turn a 14x6 @10.5k. The one in the review flew with a 13x8.5 prop. It's been said that the power of my TT 91 FS is comparable to a Saito 100 with some extra weight added in for good warbird-measure. If it doesn't do well, then I will just drop in my Brison 2.4!

As far as distinct appearances go-- you could paint some invasion stripes on it like I did. Once the decals are applied I expect there will be a worthwhile improvement in appearance. Also there is often seen a yellow stripe on the leading edge of some warbirds (spit included). I plan also to paint this on each wing. I guess I should post some pictures...
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Old 07-12-2004, 09:26 AM
  #40  
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Default RE: GSP Spitfire ARF build

Haywood,

I don't know anything about those TT engines, but I will say that my finished GSP spitfire weighs about 12.5 lbs, fueled on takeoff. The engine I have (YS120) makes easy work of flying it, but I shutter to think how disaterous this plane would fly if greatly underpowered. As Richard L. said, it might fly scale-like, but if you get into a bit of trouble taking off or landing, that engine will not be able to save you. Moreover, even with the YS120 I have on the front (which I believe is ~35 oz), and even though my plane balances on the recommended CG, it still flys tail-heavy. You would have to add a huge amount of dead weight on the nose to get it to fly properly, further compounding the issue if using a lighter, underpowered engine. Someone else (might have been Travis) said that they were having trouble with a sensitive elevator and porpoising when slowing for landing. To me this indicates the plane is too tail heavy. I can't remember what engine he had on it, or how much weight he had to add to the nose, but I do know it was larger than a 91.

Sorry to have to tell you this, but I think that this Spitfire would not do well with a TT91.

Noah
Old 07-12-2004, 11:02 AM
  #41  
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Default RE: GSP Spitfire ARF build

Haywood
Thanks for the tips.
I got the retracts from the Tai Ji. They seem to be the right size. Have'nt seen the Zero retacts but thats an 18lb model and maybe the retacts are a little too big and heavy for the Spit.
If you can really get 10500rpm with a 14/6 out of your tt.91 you should get some nice scale flying with a little extra power. My GSP p-51 seems overpowered with the 1.20 and the spit is supposed to be a slower plane. I have a couple of OS 91s on a GP Spacewalker and a WM chipmunk but I never could get more than 9800rpm
Old 07-12-2004, 11:54 AM
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Default RE: GSP Spitfire ARF build

Hello,

Noah, I have a Saito 100 in mine, which pulls this plane fine with an APC 14X8 prop. I think my max RPMs are around 9600 using Cool Power 15%. It does not have a lot of extra power on take off, but low passes at full throttle are spectacular! This engine is light (19.4 oz) and the slimline pitts muffler probably only adds a few ounces, so I am not surprised that I had to add a pound or so of lead to get it to balance while you didn't with your YS 120. I recently made some minor changes to remove weight from the tail, e.g., removing the antenna tube, etc., but added an on board glow driver. I was able to remove some lead from the nose, but given my last experience with the way it flew--with some tail heavy characteristics, want the cg more forward.

Noah, when you say yours balanced on the recommended cg, where was it? Are you planning on moving your cg? The manual states a range of 120-130mm from the leading edge and I now plan to balance mine towards the front end of that range, probably around 122mm. I recall that Richard L said his balanced in the middle of the range, presumably around 125mm, and that it flew fine there.

Travis
Old 07-12-2004, 12:58 PM
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Default RE: GSP Spitfire ARF build

Travis,

I don't have a balancing assist stand, I just make crude checks with my fingers supporting the inverted plane, positioned on the wing adjacent to the fuselage.

With this plane, I made two pencil lines on the wing at the root, one at 120 mm and one at 130 mm. I placed my fingers in between the lines and held up the plane (gear up). It balanced very, very slightly nose down. There's no way that this method can accurately discern between 122, 125, or 129 mm. All I really know is that the balance is within the recommended range. And as I mentioned earlier, it flys a little tail heavy. Based on how mine flys, I would recommend 120 mm, or maybe even a little farther forward.

I rather like the way mine flys at the moment. If I didn't have the ability to use an exponential function on the elevator, I would probably not like it so much and I would have moved it a long time ago. Nonetheless, I think that I will definitely experiment with battery placement in order to find out where it flys best. You never know until you try!

Where is your's balanced?

Noah
Old 07-12-2004, 01:32 PM
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Default RE: GSP Spitfire ARF build

RETRACTS: The stock location for the retract servo is for mechanical retracts only correct? I think I will put in the Spring Airs (pneumatic), but have never set up pneumatic retracts before.

Can someone advise me on how to go about this procedure with the Spitfire?

Thanks!
Old 07-12-2004, 02:15 PM
  #45  
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Default RE: GSP Spitfire ARF build

Yes, that location is for a servo driving mechanical retracts. DO NOT CUT THE COVERING!! (cause it'll look bad... and even though it won't show when the plane is assembled, you'll know about it and it'll haunt you).

The pneumatic retracts will have a nipple on the mechanism (at the end of the cylinder on Spring Air retracts). Attach the airline tubing (which should have been supplied with your retracts if you purchased Spring Air) to the nipple and feed it through and out of the top of the wing (just like your aileron servo wires). One tube will come from each of the two retract mechanisms. Where they come out of the top of the wing, you'll need to attach "quick connectors." You can use either Robart or Spring Air quick connectors. You'll have to buy these separately. Now, in the fuselage, you'll install an additional servo (maybe even a miniservo) that will operate the valve. I can attach a picture of my set-up when I get to my home computer. It's a bit hard to explain in this format.

I'll attach some more pictures of my Spring Air installation when I get home tonight.

Until then,

Noah
Old 07-12-2004, 02:46 PM
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Default RE: GSP Spitfire ARF build

Haywood,

I just looked back through the old posts, in #17 you can (sort of) begin to see how I arranged the servo, valve, and canister for the retracts.

I'll get better shots posted tonight.
Old 07-12-2004, 03:57 PM
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Default RE: GSP Spitfire ARF build

Noah,

I don't recall where my initial cg was set. After thinking about this and reading your post, I think I will now set the cg at 120mm. Hopefully this will make the plane more stable and easier to land. In the past, I found it difficult to land on a small paved strip.

I will post back after I fly it again.

Thanks,

Travis
Old 07-12-2004, 08:53 PM
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Default RE: GSP Spitfire ARF build

Here are a few picture of the wheel well build-up:
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Old 07-12-2004, 08:59 PM
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Default RE: GSP Spitfire ARF build

Here are a few of the formers I made and epoxied in place to accommodate the air canister, as well as the bracket I made to hold the additional servo and the retract actuator valve.

(and I know, I know.... the metallic silver paint in the wheel well is nasty. I'm going to paint them flat grey soon).
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Old 07-12-2004, 09:02 PM
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Default RE: GSP Spitfire ARF build

I have this Spitfire. I`m using a ASP 1.08 2-stroke.
Flys very well. My CG is set at 123mm using a great planes CG machine and is perfect in the air.
Post your pics when there done.[sm=lol.gif]

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