TexasAirBoss

My Feedback: (22)

I think it isn't just the wing loading.

Warbirds are just a bit more complex to build. Anybody can slap a sport plan together and expect everything to work correctly. But warbirds have more issues. Cooling, back pressure, throttle response, idle, reliable gear........there are far more issues effecting the flyability of the airplane besides the fact they are heavy.

When the novice make thier move to a warbird, they could probably fly it, if the plane was perfect and they were given a chance to learn how to fly it. But that is rarely the case. Often scale ships will require many adjustments and test flights. The pie eyed novice just doesn't realize what is involved. And they often don't have adequate experience to save a crippled ship.

And maybe the landing speed is a step up for some people.

Prop Nut

My Feedback: (3)

Pilot, most of what you are saying goes back to my point. More scale detail ads more intricacy, more weight, etc. You took it a step further (and are very much correct). I agree. I have an old 92" D&R P40 warhawk. Foam fuse, foam wings ribbed (not sheeted) in balsa and at 18lb with a Quadra 50cc it floats like a trainer on landings. I would really like to add much more detail (like retracts!!!!) but do not want to add any more weight. Another plane that I have is the GSP P47 (the larger version), its a bit heavy and landings are fast. Tip stalls are easy, etc. The more details you have to contend with in flight, the easier it is to crash a plane.

wulf190

My Feedback: (19)

Here's the ranking for the reasons as I've seen them:

1. Tip stall due to lack of airspeed or CG too far back
2. Don't make it back to field after engine flameout.....lost airspeed & lack of ability to glide mean bad things.
3. Airframe problem....i.e. vibrated out component, flutter, etc.
4. Pilot error....i.e. lack of situational awareness, or misread distance resulting in ground strike (flying too low) or mid air with another plane.
5. Dead battery or radio interference.

There's just a whole lot more to go wrong than on a non-warbird. Add 'em all up, include the shakes and nerves due to expensive plane, and that's pretty sure to equal more planes in the ground rather than on the ground.

scottrc

I would like to conclude, due to all the great postings here, that a crash might result from the pilots attitude. Like we have all said, a warbird is a smaller version of the real thing. I fly them because I have been in love with them since a very small boy. Before flying a Mustang, Corsair, Warhawk, or whatever, I read all I can from pilots who fly the real thing. They all say you need experience and a frame of mind that will condition you to react to the characterisics of the design.

Many of the experienced hands here preach that over and over, and it is sound advice.

RC pilots need to do the same. Many do not. They spend a lot of time flying sport ships and 3D birds that have a high margin of recovery built into them. Then they take the controls of a warbird design and try to use the same techniques, such as high attitude take offs, high banking at low speeds, and short finals. All which do not give much leeway for a design that has a tight threshold for balance and loading.

And add all the details, like for instance the gear doors on the Corsair, which were designed to also act as a speed brake. Drop the gear on the model and without the proper elevator and throttle setup, and it stops, drops, and rolls.

Scott

Prop Nut

My Feedback: (3)

There are Warbirds (and this is arguable on this forum) that fly like trainers.........Most WWI planes come to mind
It does take a special set of skills to fly a warbird (not a better set, just a different set), there are so many factors, weight (wingloading), wing shape, GC, etc etc etc. The original question what "why do they crash so often and why would I want one if they do?", if you have been in love with Warbirds since childhood like most of us, the answer wouldnt matter......I love to see my giant P40 in a flyby, or my Fokker DVII hanging in the air like a kite. (Anyone notice how outnumbered my P40 is sitting there with all those German fighters?!)

seanychen

My Feedback: (4)

Why do so many warbirds pilots crash so often?

Well, warbirds were not designed to in mind to fly easy, at least the real ones. They were designed to do inflict damage (and vice versa getting damaged), and sometime self-annihilate. So crashing a warbird only rightfully recreates historic resemblence.

Having said that, I think RC warbirds don't have to be hard to fly like the real ones, if it is intelligently designed. Any wing & shape will be easy to fly if it is really light. As model technology progresses, we are seeing warbirds that weigh 2/3 what they used to weigh. There is even the Mustang P51 trainer by Hangar 9 now.

I fly both warbirds and *other* planes. I crash the *other* planes much more often because I fly them much lower, and in a different orientation. Also it helps my warbird is a H9 P40, which lands slower than my Cap.

BasinBum

My Feedback: (2)

You guys realize you are still giving advice to a guy that started this thread 1-1/2 years ago and has never posted about warbirds since? On post #40 avops, in his newbie excitment to add to the discussion, revived the thread a few days ago. Now if you are just enjoying the conversation carry on by all means but the original poster has moved on.

270win

My Feedback: (14)

I'm sure he's not the only one getting information from this thread.....

270

dubd

I have a H9 P-51 waiting to be maidened. This is my first taildragger warbird. I have a H9 T-34 with about 50 flights on it.

mirwin

My Feedback: (1)

Who cares? It's fun patting ourselves on our collective backs because we can get our warbirds up and then down in one piece.

I remember my 1st warbird, a GP .40 size Corsair with a Magnum .80 4-stroke. It took me all summer to figure out how to land that bent winged $@#@$ without nosing it over.


Mike

Prop Nut

My Feedback: (3)

We are all a bunch of old farts. Quid pro quo (or however the heck you spell it) we like to sit around and argue a subject to death.

P-40LUVR

I think it's those damn Allison engines![sm=lol.gif]

flybug

Well I am a newcomer who stumbled accross this post and believe you me, I've gather a fountain of info on how not to fly my future warbird (the one I'm getting as soon as i learn to fly RC planes), so if you don't mind please do continue the transfer of knowledge I really appreciate it and I am sure tons more are also reading and learning.

Thanks and happy holidays and have a 2006 filled with succesful landings

Charles

mirwin

My Feedback: (1)

Flybug,

We like talking about this subject so ask any questions you want. If you're looking for advice, you'll find plenty of that.


Mike

SpitfireMKI

My Feedback: (2)

Charles 'Flybug',

What club do you intend to fly with in Maryland ?

As far as flying and crashing warbirds goes,

1) Patience - There is no hurry, from pit to flight line to landing
2) Education - Educate yourself and understand wingloading, angle of attack, airspeed vs groundspeed, model particulars, etc.
3) Practice - Get a good low wing sporty / trainer of similar size to your intended warbird and learn, become proficient with it.
4) Patience - Again, there is no rush to get in the air nor back to the ground, every thought and input should be thought out.

Someone in this thread said flying a warbird is like flying a fullscale airplane, I agree completely.

"Great pilots are made not born. . . . A man may possess good eyesight, sensitive hands, and perfect coordination, but the end result is only fashioned by steady coaching, much practice, and experience."
— Air Vice-Marshal J. E. 'Johnnie' Johnson, RAF

flybug

Hi and Merry Christmas all,

I plan to join DC-RC club, it has been around for a while and has a great/well kept field (2 strips one grass, one asphalt) membership is 200+ and I hope to find someone with warbird knowledge. Activities will start again in April (just can't wait to get started) So in the mean time I am building a trainer from plans (to learn the different parts of a plane and their function) and hopefully I will get that in the air soon.

Thanks for all the knowledge/advice shared here.

Merry Christmas and may your 2006 be filled with successful landings

Prop Nut

My Feedback: (3)

I recieved from Santa today Realflight G3. Its not perfect but if you are just starting out, it will give you plenty of stick time.

mirwin

My Feedback: (1)

I hope you have a very powerful processer and an even MORE POWERFUL video card.

Prop Nut

My Feedback: (3)

Actually, I am not home (inlaws for the weekend) so I loaded it on my wifes laptop. Its a 1.6mhz Athlon with a built in video card (ATI 64meg, using memory from main ram). When I loaded it the program said that it would not funtion with this video device. I tried anyway and have been playing with it all day. I am getting around 36fps, which is actually pretty smooth. I expect that with my desktop (P4 2.8, 512 Radeon 9550) that it will work very very well.

SpitfireMKI

My Feedback: (2)

Flybug,

You're welcome to stop by Freestate in Laurel. DC's got some real nice planes, their site is ok but those trees are really close.

At FSA, we are in the planning stages of our annual scale fly-in for June, last year's event was fantatstic with plenty of nice planes to see.

Here's a pic of my RAF birds at our show, myself with DCRC's Terry Lambs Giant 1/3 Waco that I had the honor of flying for the crowd and a shot of myself with my ARC MkIII and "Building Bill" Cunningham with his Topgun FW190. Bill is a DCRC member and one of the finest builders you will ever find. If you want to know about warbirds seek him out.

Mike

flybug

Wow nice pictures, I did not know there was another field near by in Laurel. Do you have a web site? I will love to visit with you all

SpitfireMKI

My Feedback: (2)

http://www.freestateaeromodelers.org/

Our club has one of the best flying sites in the State, though we are low on warbird drivers, only a couple of us flying giant scale warbirds and a few flying smaller ones. I'm always looking to get more of our "Kind" over to our club. The majority of the membership fly trainers, sporties and 3D aerobatics, but that seems to be the same in most clubs. Warbirds are kind of a rarity in that they take loads of time to build, tend to be high maintenance (especially giant), expensive and flying is generally limited to scale types of manuevers.

Personally, I do not think warbirds are "Difficult" to fly, I do find them challenging in that you must think two steps ahead of the plane, deal with "quirks" of the particular design and constantly draw upon your past experience with changing situations (Wind, temps, etc) I guess the best way to put warbird flying is:

"You must keep the aircraft within it's performance envelope and with a warbird, that envelope is quite narrow"

Meaning, they do fly quite easily as long as you stay within it's parameters, but get outside of that and they will bite.

I volunteer as a club instructor and would be glad to help you along your way to warbirds. We start official training in April though if it's a nice weekend we'll be out, especially Sunday mornings.

Mike

mirwin

My Feedback: (1)

Just remember this basic flying rule:

Try to stay in the middle of the air. Do not go near the edges of it. The edges of the air can be recognized by the appearance of ground, buildings, sea, trees and interstellar space. It is much more difficult to fly there.

SpitfireMKI

My Feedback: (2)

It's more fun on the edge though !

flybug

He, he, he will do!