carlbecker

My Feedback: (3)

It very dangerous to surf the web looking for airplanes.

I had to knock a plane off my build list to make room for a HE-162. What an odd ball, I love it. I found some plans and books and a Revell model. Then I emailed Bruce at CJM several times with questions about his kit. I though about which to build plans or kit and decided to go with the kit because this is my first DF and I did not want to waste 150 hours doing it wrong. I thought the price was reasonable also. This is going to be more assembly then build. This kit builds in about 50 hours, I will take longer of course.

I have decided which plane to model. GetStencils will make all the artwork. I will use WarbirdColors primer and Nelson Hobby paint. I found a used BVM .91, pipe and fan for power.

So far what I really can not stand about this kit is the main landing gear. To me it just looks awful. Scale front wheel should be 3" and that is fine. The rear should be 5" but this kit recommends 3.5" wheels. I am going to try and modify the mains to be a bit closer to scale with 4.5 Williams Brothers smooth contour wheels and more scale angles. This will change the height in the rear so I will probably have to mess with the front. Looks like the front should be about a 100 degree rotation instead of 90 degree. I can live with that, just barely.

Carl

Oberfeldwebel

Carl,
I will be following your build carefully, as I have the same kit. I purchased mine from a fellow club member who started it but did not finish. He looked for but could not find the plans, so I am left to do it alone. I know I could probably get a set from CJM but I'm cheap and prefer to do it this way. Actually, the formers are in place, the tail assembly is on and the landing gear plates are on also. The wings are sheeted and spars in place. So, what do you ask is left to do? Basically all the rest haha...The main source of my concern is the mounting of the fan unit. Again I say I will be looking forward to any more post about this build.
Here's how mine looks today.

bosssman

My Feedback: (35)

I hope that CJM HE-162 is better then the POS F-100 I purchased some time back. The glass work is terrible - heavy and poorly formed. The "wood" in the kit is something you would expect to buy off the rack at Home Depot and the foam cores could have been cut MUCH MUCH better. Luckily for me, I got a "bargain" off the RCU marketplace from a guy that paid full CJM price and finally got disgusted with it and sold it to me fairly cheap. The one thing about a ducted fan/turbine model is WEIGHT - putting the CJM F-100 fuse on the scale next to my Yellow F-16 fuse is like placing a brick next to a block of foam. Fortunate for me, I have been building ducted fans since the early 1980s and I am fairly sure I can make a good sport flyer out of it, albeit with a lot of work.....

randy

BobH

My Feedback: (2)

Carl, a member of NVRC built one of those as a turbin trainer. He never flew it because of heat issues with the stab and sold it to another member. That member still has it and plans to retro fit a ducted fan into the plane.. When that'll be done I have no idea lol.
I watched a Video of it flying at toledo several years ago.. good luck with it..

Oberfeldwebel

I agree with bossman about the F-100, I was disappointed in the finish of the fuselage and while the wood was OK to me, the instruction sheets were very poor. This was my first DF and while I finally got it finished, it did not last long. On the first takeoff, it started to rise off the runway nicely, when it pitched straight up climbed to about 50-75 ft and nosed over and crashed nose first on the runway. Totalled, write-me off....I'm sure the Cg was right on and everything else checked out, battery, radio and the engine was running just fine, so I'm still not sure what happened. I think one of the flying stabs may have failed somehow, causing it to pitch up like it did and then I had no control over the pitch axis.

Carl, could you just tell me where the CG is supposed to be, thanks very much

carlbecker

My Feedback: (3)

So far this seems to be a decent kit. The plans list the CG from the leading edge as 2 7/8 - 3 7/16 all most 3.5 inches.

Currently I'm making new mounts for the mains to correct the angle. The Axles are angled for the plans angle so this will be off from scale.

Carl

Ram-bro

My Feedback: (101)

Carl, glad you are doing this kit. This is something unusual from the other jets out there. I didn't know you were ajet guy. Welcome to the 2% club.......I am assuming you are making this the DF version.

ho2zoo

My Feedback: (5)

Oh man. I got the HE fever now. I actually had the CJ kit a few years ago but sold it to help pay for my wedding. [:@] Sigh. Well, I'm going to get another one soon...

Carl, If this helps with your landing gear troubles. I'm pretty sure I read somewhere that the He-162 used the same landing gear as an ME-109, just mounted differently. They did it to save time at the end of the war. I may be wrong, but there you go...

lrb75

My Feedback: (12)

Bob I will finish the HE-162 when you finish your SE5a. I had to spend some time fixing the tail where the turbine had warped the fiberglass and melted the plastic tail cone. But mostly I just don't spend enough time building to make any progress. My biggest dilemma is the paint used is not fuel proof. I have tried using Nelson's flat clear but now I have to figure out how to get rid of a few drips and runs on the wings. I basically suck at paining anything. I also have no where to paint until spring. I also have to figure out how to remove the hardwood rails that the turbine was mounted on without destroying the fiberglass so I can put my fan unit in. Mine has the scale main wheels from Glennis they are at least 4" dia. The fan unit is mounted on about 1.5"x1.5" x 1/4" ply blocks epoxied into the sides of the nacelle. Cut off the mounting lugs of the fan housing and then use long screws through the ply blocks. These screws replace some of the original fan housing screws and go all the way through the fan housing. I bought the plans and instructions from CJM for about $30. Well worth it to see how some things are laid out. Good luck.

carlbecker

My Feedback: (3)

Well I am not a jet guy yet. This is a first and the only reason is because of this airplane, though I do like the Me-262, Mig-15 and F-86. I usually stick to late 1930's very early 1940's.

I have documentation that discuss's the LG being Me-109. My issues with the kit are that the gear is splayed out far to much and the main wheels are 1.5 to small. That and the axle is designed for the greater angle. I assume its to help ground handling. For me it just ruins the look sitting on the ground. I have discovered that if scale angles are followed it would be possible to get a 5" wheel inside the fuse. That is something to consider if I build another from plans with Robinaire gear. I want to keep this fairly simple since DF is new for me.

The glass fuse seems very light but the tail section feels heavy. I don't know how all this will effect the CG but with long moments front and back I don't think I will be adding much if any lead. Since I have raised the center section by changing the LG angles and adding a bigger wheel I will be looking at making the nose gear taller. I think I can raise the front about 1/2 inch.

I think its a good idea to get the instructions and plans to finish this model. It helps considerably.

lrb75 I would love to see this other local He-162.

Carl

lrb75

My Feedback: (12)

Where do you fly? NVRC? The plane was orginally built by Brian Shipp I you know who he is. I will have it out and flying at some point. I need to get something flyable for Warbirds over Delaware. Now you made me mad. I measured the wheels and they are 3 1/2". And they do look small. I would have never even noticed but now it will bother me.

carlbecker

My Feedback: (3)

Currently I fly at CCRCC in Waldorf. I had flown down at the FARM and before at Pohick Pilots Assoc at Fort Belvoir which closed. I have not been to NVRC in years and now it looks like you are closed. I live near Fairfax Circle. If you would like to hook up send me a PM, I would love to see yours. I will be at WOD in July for the 3rd straight time.

Not sure if its good or bad but I looked over the plans VHM or something like that from ScaleRC in Maine pretty closely and I have 5 books on the HE-162 so I had a pretty good idea about major problems with the scaleness of the CJM. I don't plan this to be anything more than sport scale but I'm getting worse in what I can tolerate[:@].

I have managed to get 4.5 wheels to fit. If I had had Robinaire make scale gear I'm quite sure narrow 5 inch wheels would work. Currently the axle angle is off a bit and if corrected would allow the wheels to fit flatter in the fuse. I have managed to raise the nose about 3/4 of an inch. I was concerned about the wing incidence while on the ground. I measured the new wheel placements on the plans then drew a ground refference and leveled the plans at ground. The wing is positive in relation to the ground so I think I am OK.

There is a lot wrong with this kit for competion without getting the 3 view out to measure things. The aileron and flaps are hinged in sport style not recessed in the control surface. The rudders are one piece instead of top and bottom split. Thats a big no-no on the side view. I don't think the elevators are proper either. Of couse the hinges are not recessed. I had not planned to corret these things, but I may have to do something about the hinges. The Dave Platt Zero has really made an impression on me about items like this. With a fiberglass fuse and foam core wings the build will be quick so I might fix up the hinging.

I guess with what I have so far changed the warranty is gone and I'm on my own

Carl

lrb75

My Feedback: (12)

By the way I read that the HE-162 used the main wheels and brakes from the ME-109G. Looking at the pictures the struts don't look the same and really the wheels and tires don't look the same either.

GlennisAircraft

My Feedback: (1)

He may have meant FW-190 - which is all that I ever understood that were used (from the few distant photo's I've seen).

"German Aircraft Landing Gear" says the (main) gear and (all) wheels were from a BF-109K, and although they don't show the face of the wheel, it is definitely a fat tire like the 109G


[link]http://www.clubhyper.com/reference/he162ng_maingear.html[/link]

They are 109G's Though

Dennis

carlbecker

My Feedback: (3)

From the documentation I have the main wheel is just a tad more than 5" in dia. and about 1.3 in width. For the CJM kit narrow is better and light is going to be the major factor for DF power plant. My biggest concern is to get as close to 5" as possible and still get them inside the fuse. I have done this and I believe 5x1.3 will work just fine with the proper scale retracts.

That is a very nice site. Thanks Dennis.

Carl

DocYates

My Feedback: (102)

You are right about keeping the weight down on this model. My other concern on the HE is the fuel tank location. The DF engines are thirsty and temperatmental when it comes to fuel tank placement. A lean engine will seize in a heartbeat. I owned a Salamander once myself, but not the CJM version and the plumbing was real pain. I always said if I built another one it would be this larger model with a 12 pound thrust turbine. I could certainly deal with the heat issues on the tail easier than the plumbing. Either way you are going to have a beautiful and unique aircraft. Good luck with it, and I commend the effort you are taking to make the scale appearance even better.
Tommy

Baldeagle

My Feedback: (7)

Caral interesting project. I've never tried a DF. at this altitude you really have to be light.
I thought you would like these pic of a PZL P23 Karas. That belongs to a friend of mine. IHe drew up his own plans to fit the Sidel. It is deffently different. We hope to test fly it tomorrow or Saturday. He wants to get a few flights before he finishes the detail and paint.
He brought it over to run the motor and check the CG. I made the LG for him and will make an exaust collector ring after he test flies it. Rich

carlbecker

My Feedback: (3)

Rich,
That is certainly going to be sweet!! Wish you'all the best on the maiden. Looks like it should be a good flier.

I have finished modifing the mains and managed to get Dubro wheels to fit. They are still 4.5 but much thicker and one ounce lighter. I made new axles that have a slight bend to get the bottom of the wheels out a little. Its close enough for me on the plane. I just finished mounting the front gear into the fuse. Box 7 checked off. A little more around the nose gear to mount then on to the front of the engine.
I have measurements to give to Gary at Getstencils and will have him start that. Ordered a 3" front wheel and some rlm76 and rlm 82 from Nelson's. I am just going with green on top and grey/blue on the bottom.

Carl

carlbecker

My Feedback: (3)

Update,
I have the front wheel installed with servo plates. The intake is in and rough formed. I put the fan/motor in to see if it fit. Looks like I will have to shave the forward edge of the mounts as its a bit wide, no big deal. I'm more concerned about the pipe fitting. I gave Gary at GetStencils all the size info for markings, about 16 pieces.

I have been studying the rudders and will try to make them scale with scale actuation to a belcrank then pull pull to the servo. I believe the tail will be heavy as the plans show the battery all the way forward in the nose. At a glance the elevators look pretty close to scale so I will leave that alone except try to hide the horns/rods inside. Maybe a torque rod and flange similiar to the Platt Zero flap design.

Carl

carlbecker

My Feedback: (3)

Last night I cut out the mains doors with a dremel and saw blade and sanded the inside of the fuse where the mains go and used epoxy and fiberglass to mount the formers. Then I mixed some microballoons to fill in some gaps. I checked the retraction and it just tucks into the fuse with little to spare. Then I added some more filler at the intake. Next I need to work on the motor and duct cover mount. If using a Ramtec fan I would have to mount a piece of ply inside and remove the fan mount flanges. The BVM flange needs just a bit of material removed to not spread the cowl sides. I will make up a plate and use the flanges.

Carl

Countryboy

My Feedback: (25)

Carl,

I hate to be an doubting Thomas, but based on the gear stance, thrust line and the root airfoil incidence, I believe you are going to have a runway sled...in other words, I don't think it will rotate. I may be totally wrong in that logic, but it is my thought as I see it.

Nice work though.

carlbecker

My Feedback: (3)

That is a concern. I did plot the wing incidence on the plan sheet and have positive (I think positive is leading edge up). I probably lost a bit hopefully not much, SWAG changed less than 1/4 dropping the nose. If it doesn't work then my only fix will be a longer nose wheel. I am sure Robinaire would make a 100 degree nose retract quickly for me, I have the perfect model for him if needed. There is plenty of room to add up to 1/2 and then I could have proper rake on the nose gear. That is a bit more than I want to put into this kit but the proof will be in the pudding. I had a Ziroli Ercoupe once and had to much down thrust. It taxied well but I had to yank it off the ground[:@]

Thanks Carl

carlbecker

My Feedback: (3)

I have the motor mount installed. I made two carrier beams which will hold the motor and lower duct mounted with epoxy and fiberglass reinforced. Since the instruction manual mentions tail heavy and lead I decided to mount the elev and rudder servos forward of the plan position. I also do not like mounting servos sideways so I will place them inline above the retracts. I had hoped to place them right behind the spar mount from the top but they would be inacessible because of the lower duct so I will figure out mounts from the bottom through the LG doors. I lightened the aft former 12 grams and moving 4 ounces of servos forward will help some.

Carl

lrb75

My Feedback: (12)

Be careful opening up that rear former. Alot of grass will accumulate back there and be a pain to get out. Put some monocote or something over the opening.

carlbecker

My Feedback: (3)

So I went and made a grass bagger. I will take care of that issue. I measued incidence on the table without the tail or wings on (I think that would load the main gear a bit more) and the leading edge is 3/4" higher than the trailing edge so maybe I will not have a sled. I plumbed the air for the retracts and front door, cycled them a bunch to set speeds. Making plans for attaching the main doors to the struts for a lighter simpler[:@] setup. This should be fun. I will mount the main fuel tank back a bit closer to the CG but still forward. After the wing spar is placed in the fuse I want to use that former to rest the rear of the tank on and just put a beam across the front instead of using a big plate of light ply. Hope to lose a few grams here. Looks like I will be making several changes form the basic kit. Just can not seem to leave well enough alone. I think that is why built planes have a soul and ARF's don't. I just can not seem to get a care about my ARF's even though the fly well.

Carl