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CMPro 71" Fw-190 kitbash

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Old 06-17-2007, 03:32 PM
  #26  
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Default RE: CMPro 71" Fw-190 kitbash

I see what you mean , that is much bigger then existing design
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Old 06-18-2007, 09:44 AM
  #27  
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Default RE: CMPro 71" Fw-190 kitbash

Dave,
Be careful of Aileron size. The 190 used a frieze type aileron. As such, the bottom side of the aileron was significantly larger than the top side. I noticed the enlargement you made was for the bottom side of the wing. The hinge line was place well back of the leading edge on the bottom. When up aileron was given, the leading edge on the underside of the wing depressed into the wind stream, acting like an airbreak and thus preventing adverse yaw during a turn. I attached a photo of a 190 wing without its aileron. You can clearly see the pocket in the wing for the aileron was much deeper for the lower side of the wing vs the upper side. You probably already know this, but just in case........
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Old 06-18-2007, 09:55 AM
  #28  
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Default RE: CMPro 71" Fw-190 kitbash

Dave,
I think this diagram makes it a little clearer.
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Old 06-19-2007, 06:55 AM
  #29  
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Default RE: CMPro 71" Fw-190 kitbash

Hey Jagdfleiger,

Thanks for the diagrams, they highlight the location of the hinge point very well.

Do you think you will get a chance to show us how you did your consealed aileron controls?

thanks

Dave
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Old 06-19-2007, 07:21 AM
  #30  
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Default RE: CMPro 71" Fw-190 kitbash

Dave,
I'll be glad to show you how I set mine up. In fact I was going to take some pics yesterday, but my camera batteries were dead. They are recharging now, so when I get out of work this evening, I'll post to this thread.
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Old 06-20-2007, 10:31 AM
  #31  
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Default RE: CMPro 71" Fw-190 kitbash

Dave,
Here are the pictures I promised. Just a little background on the plane I am rebuilding (bashing). Its a 1/6.5 scale Dora 9. Don't worry about the fact that its a Dora 9. Both the 190A and the 190D had identical wings. I picked up the plane in a swap meet. Its a Czech kit (I know this by the instructions that came with it) that employs a foam wing. The 'bashing' that I did can be used on either a foam or build up wing. In fact, I think it is likely easier on a built up wing. Anyway, the kit is a standoff scale that has lines that are close to scale so, I decided to really scale it up. I have a 1/5th Holman 190A that I plan on building later, so I wanted to see if I could develop the building techniques necessary to make it 100% scale. Although having stated that, if you can make the CMP 190 pretty close to scale, I might give that a shot next. BTW - I am pretty impressed with the mods you make so far to your fuse. If I can help you a little bit with the details, the that might be my next plane.

OK, For the wing, I decided to install flaps (which the kit didn't have) and remake the ailerons 100% scale. (I am not going to describe how I did the flaps, but I can later if you are interested). The model had ailerons whos spans were too long and they did not extend to the wing tip as they should. So, the first order of business was to layout the flap and aileron outline on the bottom of the wing. I had to add an inch or so to the flaps, reducing the aileron outline accordingly. I drew the outline on the bottom, then cut out the bottom skin and removed all the foam in the pertinent areas. I created a bay to house the aileron and flap servos at a somewhat scale location (the original wing had a large hatch for access to the outboard 20mm cannon). Rather than using robard hinge points, I decided to make my own hinges to better simulate the original. The portion that is fixed in the wing are a sandwich of 2 pieces of 1/8th inch balsa with a flight skin core. The ailerons portion is actually a tube that houses a thin piano wire rod that runs the length of the aileron. This permits me to take the ailerons off very, very easily. It also makes for a very precise fit and allows the ailerons to rotate with virtually no binding. I have been playing around with flightskin and used it to build the ailerons...kind of an experiment. You can just as easily use balsa. I decided not to cover the ailerons with fabric. I find it easier to make them out of hard material (flightskin) to better simulate the scale details later. Her are some overview pics (please excuse the poor quality of the pics. My camera didn't quite survive a house fire I had last year).
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Old 06-20-2007, 10:35 AM
  #32  
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Default RE: CMPro 71" Fw-190 kitbash

Here are the hinges. As I mentioned, they are make of a sandwich of 1/8th balsa - flight skin (or G10) - 1/8th balsa. They go a couple of inches into the wing and were glued in with epoxy. They have rounded ends for proper clearance of the aileron. A couple of things to note. First, I rough shaped the hinges, the drilled the holes for the piano wire. I inserted the hinges into the wing with the piano wire in them to test the fit and make sure the hinge line lined-up correctly. Some fine sanding was required. I then epoxied them in place.
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Old 06-20-2007, 10:55 AM
  #33  
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Default RE: CMPro 71" Fw-190 kitbash

Next, the construction of the aileron. I started by cutting out the bottom part of the aileron from flightskin. It extends the full cord of the aileron, so I simply used my blown-up 3 view diagram as a guide. You could so this just as easy using balsa. I then glued a piece of 3/32 balsa on the forward edge of the aileron. In back of that I glued on a portion of the original aileron (its the green looking thing in the photos) so as to give me the exact angle of the aileron from trailing edge to the hinge line. I then glued the piano wire guide (Full length) to the onto the 3/32nd balsa piece where I wanted the hinge line to fall. Next, I marked the location of the hinges coming from the wing. I cut into both the aileron and the piano wire guide using a jig saw. If everything is done correctly, you can now check the fit of aileron by placing in the wing and inserting the piano wire. All of this is actually alot easier to do than to describe. Once that was done, I used balsa on top for the front portion of the aileron (for shaping) and flight skin for the back portion of the aileron. I also installed the pushrod attachment in the scale location and use hardware that looks pretty close to the original. This was a bit of work, but I like the end product.
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Old 06-20-2007, 11:13 AM
  #34  
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Default RE: CMPro 71" Fw-190 kitbash

Just a couple of notes about the servo bays. Each bay houses 2 servos; one for the aileron and one for the flap. I installed standard size servos for these. However, things were very tight and hard to work in. So, I changed my approach as follows. I built 1/8th ply frames that hold both servos. The frame is removable with 4 screws. This helps things alot. I am now planning on replacing the standard servos with mini's that have roughly the same torque. This should help greatly with the space problems. I wouldn't expect anyone to try and do all this....again, I wanted to see how far I could go in making everything scale.

Dave, here is what I would recommend. Build the ailerons in a similar fashion to the way I described. You can use robart hinge points - that will make it a bit easier, quicker. Use the aileron servo, linkage arrangement that comes with the model. That will allow you to do the job quickly and come out with a scale looking aileron.
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Old 06-25-2007, 12:48 PM
  #35  
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Default RE: CMPro 71" Fw-190 kitbash

Hey Jagdfleiger,

I was thinking of building the ailerons the same way as the Sist Fw-190 ones are done, but i think i might go a combination of both ( which is what you have in fact suggested).

I have been swamped with work and a whole lot of other stuff that is sucking up all my time but i will get back onto her soon...

thanks

dave
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Old 06-27-2007, 09:34 AM
  #36  
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Default RE: CMPro 71" Fw-190 kitbash

Hey guy's

well, had a couple of test pulls done on the canopy plug, and i have to say, what i ifference it makes to the model!!! I'm almost prepared to forgive the other shape inaccuracies Not.

We did 3 pulls of the canopy with the last one beaing the only really useable one. I'm thinking i might to some more slight modifications to it and then i'll call it done!. I have also included a pic of the original canopy for reference. and in the pic's the canopy look really blurry and quite bad, but it not that bad???

thanks

dave
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Old 06-27-2007, 09:51 AM
  #37  
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Default RE: CMPro 71" Fw-190 kitbash

Dave - Awesome work. I am very very impressed with what you have done. Really the epitome of the expression, '...turing a sow's ear into a purse...' vs '...puting lipstick on a pig...' Please keep going with your build. I am now seriously thinking of ordering one of these ARFs. One question, how did you make the mold for the canopy?
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Old 06-27-2007, 07:01 PM
  #38  
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Default RE: CMPro 71" Fw-190 kitbash

Hey Jagdfleiger,

Thanks mate. I wish i would hurry up and finish her too!!

THe canopy plug was made with blood, sweat, and tears, What i did was take a plaster of paris mold of the kits original, and then shaped it to the, well, "more correct" shape that it should be. you are kind of restricted in how much you can change it by the base of the canopy because it key's into the fuse. I will make some slight changes like the canopy frames are vertically up on the kit one, and they should have a foward slant (looking at the canopy side on.

The sweat and tears was because it took me 3 goes at getting a paster of paris copy that i was happy enough with. the trick was to keep the bottom of the canopy in it's natural shape as this is what i really wanted from the original. Each time i did it took about 2-2.5kg (4.5-5.5lb) of plaster to make it. Once i am happy with the final shape, i will spot fill and prime it, then i will have it sprayed in 2 pac paint, as that's the only paint i have found that really holds up to the heat of vac forming, and then i will have a super smooth and hopefully crystal clear canopies! all in all, it a fair bit of work! but it's a must in my eyes

thanks

dave
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Old 06-27-2007, 07:10 PM
  #39  
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Default RE: CMPro 71" Fw-190 kitbash

That's the ticket,
Good work mate, do I see a market opening up here???
Brad
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Old 06-28-2007, 11:26 AM
  #40  
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Default RE: CMPro 71" Fw-190 kitbash


ORIGINAL: Brad330l

That's the ticket,
Good work mate, do I see a market opening up here???
Brad

Lol

What till you see the goodies i hope to get done for her in the next few days.......

Thanks

Dave
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Old 07-01-2007, 03:08 AM
  #41  
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Default RE: CMPro 71" Fw-190 kitbash

Hey guy's

Well, after the dissapointment of the new ESM/YT Fw-190 release, i have been back onto the CMPro one..

I have now complete the plugs and have produced a set of vac formed gun blisters for the wing. Not sure who well the pic's show them, and it does help that they are in clear plastic, but that's all i had lying around, and it does make placement easier later on. the two i have made are the outboard late series blisters and the inboard cannon blister that are present on all Fw-190 models. They look pretty good, and i have to say i am pretty happy wth them as they will add the world of character to the model. i have to produce the outboard right hand side gun blister as these ones are different to one another... I am also thinking about making the underwing blister that is evident on some versions of the Fw, and the aileron pushrod cover on the top surface....

As you can see in the pic's the top side of the aileron is almost 1" shorter than the lower surface as Jagdflieger pointed out with it's frieze ailerons. haven't decided how far in going to go with the ailerons.....

I did also get round to sanding the flow resin coat on the hori stab extensions and the fuse gun blisters. once i get the glassing of the vertical stab completed, i will prime the whole fuse and have a look to see if i will mold the fuse vents that sit in the extaust stream.

I'm really keen to get her flying now...

thanks

Dave
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Old 07-01-2007, 09:59 AM
  #42  
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Default RE: CMPro 71" Fw-190 kitbash

Dave,
You are really doing an awesome job. I am impressed. Keep up the good work.
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Old 07-11-2007, 06:44 PM
  #43  
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Default RE: CMPro 71" Fw-190 kitbash

Thanks mate,

Well, i removed the original vertical stab post, which, buy the way had cracked down the entire centerline, on its own. Good thing i was planning to replace it anyway as this would have caused the loss of the rudder in flight.

I also have made the cutout for the tail wheel. i had layed up 2 layers of 3oz cloth around a tin of thinners when i glassed the top of the hori stab, so i used that and some soft balsa square stock in the corners to supply a little more purchase area. I'm not doing a retractable tail wheel with this one so i will epoxy a ply plate into the area and drill a hole for the tail wheel to mount onto.

THe tail wheel is almost ready to be installed, and is more of a functional item rather than a perfectly scale one and i would really like to finish up at the tail end of theis bird so i can move on.

thanks

Dave
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Old 07-13-2007, 01:59 AM
  #44  
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Default RE: CMPro 71" Fw-190 kitbash

have got the tail wheel installed...

thanks
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Old 07-13-2007, 08:23 AM
  #45  
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Default RE: CMPro 71" Fw-190 kitbash

finished the rudder post and have installed it, then i drilled the robart hinge points...
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Old 07-13-2007, 08:50 AM
  #46  
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Default RE: CMPro 71" Fw-190 kitbash

You're making my kitbash of this plane look like child's-play !
Good work, and keep it up!
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Old 07-19-2007, 08:24 AM
  #47  
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Default RE: CMPro 71" Fw-190 kitbash

Sorry noflaps

Installed the rudder post and hinged the rudder. I used yellow solartex to cover the rudder and elevators and i have to say how nice it is to work with. Especially when you compare solartex to solarfilm. i switched to monokote covering film ages ago because it was heaps better to work with than solarfilm and so i was a little aprehensive when it came time to use the solartex, but i got it for free so i had nothing to lose. the techinque is a little different but i found it real easy. and the "weave" looks real nice.

Depending on how close the yellow is to the RLM 04 gelb (yellow) i don't intend to paint the rudder. the elevators will be painted with the rest of the fuse.

Pretty much finished sanding the glass on the hori stab and i will do the flow coat and let it set for a few days... then final sand before i can prime the whole area and the truth will be seen!!

The last pic is a mate's T-28 trojan that he just finished and will be at my house all of next week getting some weathering done...... guess the Fw-190 will be on the back burner for another week[]

thanks

dave
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Old 07-30-2007, 03:38 AM
  #48  
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Default RE: CMPro 71" Fw-190 kitbash

Wow, haven't posted for a week and i couldn't even find the thread, this froum sure moves along!!

The T-28 is finished, it took 4 days of 6-10h a day (and still working a "normal" job), which was pretty hard yakka, but she came out pretty good i thought.

Also squeezed in a charity airshow and Mustang engine runs and taxi trials, but i'm back onto the Fw-190 for a little more work.

I have made the gun trough's at the front of the fuse after sanding down the hori stab flow coat. I used brass tube to give me the shape and had i of had evergreen plastic tube i would have used that instead cos the brass was harder to work with. I cut out the fuse to recess the tubes into the forward section and then i glassed under them to restore the strength in that area. the trough's in the cowl are fibreglass and that was just 2 layers of 6oz cloth draped over a rod that was a smaller diameter than the brass installed in the fuse. the cowl now has like keyways it slides onto...

The cooling vent on the side of the fuse were vac formed and then cut out so that i got 2 vents per vac form. i added a little balsa to the inside to increase the purchase area and make sure then don't get viabrated off.

The last thing i put on the fuse was the extra little bumps on top of the cannon bilsters. this was done using the Platt technique but i just used sticky tape instead of monokote, the need a little more sanding to blend them in. and i have high fill/primered the fuse which has shown me were i need to do a little more work.

thanks
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Old 07-30-2007, 03:45 AM
  #49  
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Default RE: CMPro 71" Fw-190 kitbash

great job , I have found an old artical on foam wing/retracts install upgarde if your interested let me know .
Great stuff that may cure this planes history of weak retracts installation .
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Old 07-30-2007, 03:46 AM
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ticketec
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Default RE: CMPro 71" Fw-190 kitbash

and the rest of the pic's
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