Columbia Model Works P-38
03-21-2011, 06:49 AM
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RE: Columbia Model Works P-38
Back to a couple of questions. Can anyone help me out with answers to the following
Finished flying weight?
Have there been any out wing panel attach failures?
Retract options?
Gear doors? hinging and operating sujestions would be welcome.
How effective are the flaps? Is it worth cutting into the wing to add them?
Rick
Finished flying weight?
Have there been any out wing panel attach failures?
Retract options?
Gear doors? hinging and operating sujestions would be welcome.
How effective are the flaps? Is it worth cutting into the wing to add them?
Rick
03-21-2011, 07:29 AM
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RE: Columbia Model Works P-38
Figure on 30 lbs depending on the engines you use. DO NOT worry about the wings coming off if the builder used our plug in wing brackets, find something else to worry about. Don't worry about how it flys either. If you can fly an advanced trainer you can fly this thing.
Do you have the instruction manual? Gear door hinging is spelled out there and its a mechanical pain in the arse. Simple quicky hinges don't work because the doors are curved in two directions and have to drop down before swinging out. The photos you provided show the cowlings which means he bought the accessory pack and fiberglass gear doors were included....he should have them.
Retracts shouldn't pose too large a problem being a simple tricycle setup. The Yellow P-38 may work. Back in the day we made the mechanisms and Robart made the gear legs which was nothing more than a little lengthing of some they already made. Lots of jet retract mechanisms out there should work and Robart should have gear legs that will get you by.
Neither the prototype nor the one I own have flaps so I can't guide you there but you can easily get by without them. If you read the whole thread one of the guys put flaps on his and they apparently worked out well.
Do you have the instruction manual? Gear door hinging is spelled out there and its a mechanical pain in the arse. Simple quicky hinges don't work because the doors are curved in two directions and have to drop down before swinging out. The photos you provided show the cowlings which means he bought the accessory pack and fiberglass gear doors were included....he should have them.
Retracts shouldn't pose too large a problem being a simple tricycle setup. The Yellow P-38 may work. Back in the day we made the mechanisms and Robart made the gear legs which was nothing more than a little lengthing of some they already made. Lots of jet retract mechanisms out there should work and Robart should have gear legs that will get you by.
Neither the prototype nor the one I own have flaps so I can't guide you there but you can easily get by without them. If you read the whole thread one of the guys put flaps on his and they apparently worked out well.
03-21-2011, 03:15 PM
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RE: Columbia Model Works P-38
John:
Hey thanks for the info. I e-mailed all the retract manufactures that I could think of.
Just got a reply from Century Jet. They have a 1/5 size set that looks like it will work.
They said just keep it under 35 lbs.
At this point I"m considering electric power.
Need to consider the options first.
Thanks for the info.
Rick
Hey thanks for the info. I e-mailed all the retract manufactures that I could think of.
Just got a reply from Century Jet. They have a 1/5 size set that looks like it will work.
They said just keep it under 35 lbs.
At this point I"m considering electric power.
Need to consider the options first.
Thanks for the info.
Rick
03-21-2011, 06:35 PM
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RE: Columbia Model Works P-38
Rick,
if you need any of the pages from the manual, let me know and I will scan them and email it to you.. I will look through it tomorrow and find the page John is talking about on the doors....
John,
are there any glass parts still floating around, or is anyone still making them on request? When we got the plans we figured on getting all that stuff when we got ready to build, didn't think it would be 25 years down the road...lol
With all the motor choices out there now, what do you feel would be your choice if you were building one? I like to have extra extra power, kind of a speed nut. So Scale flyby's at half throttle, with super chargers a simple slide of the thumb away....
I will build mine with flaps to tame the extra horse power under the hood, working doors and all the other scale detail, dad wouldn't have had it any other way...
Seeing yours in the pics you posted has really got the bug started again. I think I will start cutting parts late this summer and start the build in the fall. been putting this project on hold for to many years.......
if you need any of the pages from the manual, let me know and I will scan them and email it to you.. I will look through it tomorrow and find the page John is talking about on the doors....
John,
are there any glass parts still floating around, or is anyone still making them on request? When we got the plans we figured on getting all that stuff when we got ready to build, didn't think it would be 25 years down the road...lol
With all the motor choices out there now, what do you feel would be your choice if you were building one? I like to have extra extra power, kind of a speed nut. So Scale flyby's at half throttle, with super chargers a simple slide of the thumb away....
I will build mine with flaps to tame the extra horse power under the hood, working doors and all the other scale detail, dad wouldn't have had it any other way...
Seeing yours in the pics you posted has really got the bug started again. I think I will start cutting parts late this summer and start the build in the fall. been putting this project on hold for to many years.......
03-22-2011, 03:26 PM
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RE: Columbia Model Works P-38
Mustangman:
Let me check and see if the instrution manual that I've got is compleate. If it isn't I will take you up on the offer.
I've never done it before. But if you are really stuck for cowls and boom scoops, We could try to make a mould from my parts.
After all in this hobby there is always an up hill learning curve
Rick
Let me check and see if the instrution manual that I've got is compleate. If it isn't I will take you up on the offer.
I've never done it before. But if you are really stuck for cowls and boom scoops, We could try to make a mould from my parts.
After all in this hobby there is always an up hill learning curve
Rick
03-22-2011, 04:04 PM
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RE: Columbia Model Works P-38
ORIGINAL: R Bell
Mustangman:
Let me check and seeif the instrution manual that I've got is compleate. If it isn't I will take you up on the offer.
I've never done it before. But if you are really stuck for cowls and boom scoops, We could try to make a mould from my parts.
After all in this hobby there is always an up hill learning curve
Rick
Mustangman:
Let me check and seeif the instrution manual that I've got is compleate. If it isn't I will take you up on the offer.
I've never done it before. But if you are really stuck for cowls and boom scoops, We could try to make a mould from my parts.
After all in this hobby there is always an up hill learning curve
Rick
03-22-2011, 04:46 PM
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RE: Columbia Model Works P-38
Jim,
If anyone is making fiberglass parts for it it's news to me. We sold quite a few short kits around the world containing all that stuff and there's bound to be someone out there who, like yourself, bought it with the best of intentions but just never got around to starting or finishing. You know, if you really have your heart set on a balsa and ply 38 you'd be better off these days with a Ziroli....plenty of parts and support. Not trying to talk you out of this per se, as I'd like nothing more than to hear of another taking to the air or still being flown, but the problem is like the one a Vought Aircraft company spokesman once said when asked if they would ever consider running some new Corsairs down the assembly line to ensure that future generations could see and enjoy this unique and special aircraft. His reply was that although they weren't entirely against the idea, the problem was that the tooling was gone, and for the cost to replace it one who had the desire and money to afford one could pick up an existing one much cheaper. That's the same problem you two guys have.....the tooling is gone.
As far as engines, mine has 39cc gassers and it's plenty. Anything bigger and you won't need to worry about cowlings because you'll have to all but carve them away.
If anyone is making fiberglass parts for it it's news to me. We sold quite a few short kits around the world containing all that stuff and there's bound to be someone out there who, like yourself, bought it with the best of intentions but just never got around to starting or finishing. You know, if you really have your heart set on a balsa and ply 38 you'd be better off these days with a Ziroli....plenty of parts and support. Not trying to talk you out of this per se, as I'd like nothing more than to hear of another taking to the air or still being flown, but the problem is like the one a Vought Aircraft company spokesman once said when asked if they would ever consider running some new Corsairs down the assembly line to ensure that future generations could see and enjoy this unique and special aircraft. His reply was that although they weren't entirely against the idea, the problem was that the tooling was gone, and for the cost to replace it one who had the desire and money to afford one could pick up an existing one much cheaper. That's the same problem you two guys have.....the tooling is gone.
As far as engines, mine has 39cc gassers and it's plenty. Anything bigger and you won't need to worry about cowlings because you'll have to all but carve them away.
03-22-2011, 05:30 PM
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RE: Columbia Model Works P-38
ORIGINAL: jfangohr
Jim,
If anyone is making fiberglass parts for it it's news to me. We sold quite a few short kits around the world containing all that stuff and there's bound to be someone out there who, like yourself, bought it with the best of intentions but just never got around to starting or finishing. You know, if you really have your heart set on a balsa and ply 38 you'd be better off these days with a Ziroli....plenty of parts and support. Not trying to talk you out of this per se, as I'd like nothing more than to hear of another taking to the air or still being flown, but the problem is like the one a Vought Aircraft company spokesman once said when asked if they would ever consider running some new Corsairs down the assembly line to ensure that future generations could see and enjoy this unique and special aircraft. His reply was that although they weren't entirely against the idea, the problem was that the tooling was gone, and for the cost to replace it one who had the desire and money to afford one could pick up an existing one much cheaper. That's the same problem you two guys have.....the tooling is gone.
As far as engines, mine has 39cc gassers and it's plenty. Anything bigger and you won't need to worry about cowlings because you'll have to all but carve them away.
Jim,
If anyone is making fiberglass parts for it it's news to me. We sold quite a few short kits around the world containing all that stuff and there's bound to be someone out there who, like yourself, bought it with the best of intentions but just never got around to starting or finishing. You know, if you really have your heart set on a balsa and ply 38 you'd be better off these days with a Ziroli....plenty of parts and support. Not trying to talk you out of this per se, as I'd like nothing more than to hear of another taking to the air or still being flown, but the problem is like the one a Vought Aircraft company spokesman once said when asked if they would ever consider running some new Corsairs down the assembly line to ensure that future generations could see and enjoy this unique and special aircraft. His reply was that although they weren't entirely against the idea, the problem was that the tooling was gone, and for the cost to replace it one who had the desire and money to afford one could pick up an existing one much cheaper. That's the same problem you two guys have.....the tooling is gone.
As far as engines, mine has 39cc gassers and it's plenty. Anything bigger and you won't need to worry about cowlings because you'll have to all but carve them away.
thank you for the honest advise, I see what your talking about with the Zaroli and all the parts being available... I think I will need to do some thinking on this one......
03-22-2011, 06:56 PM
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RE: Columbia Model Works P-38
Rick,
I know your concerned about the structural integrity of these things, so I thought I'd tell you a story and show you a few pictures to ease your mind a little.
I didn't build the '38 that I have. I bought it ready to fly with about 15 or so flights on it. At the time it had Supertigre 3000's on it with a Zinger 3 blade prop system consisting of a hub system and individually replaceable wooden blades. Shortly after buying it I took it to the field to test run the engines. During one of the full throttle run ups one of the blades decided to part company with the hub.
It was at roughly 8000 RPM when it happened and the vibration that went through this thing before I cut the throttle was phenomenal. But the only damage it sustained is what you see in the photos below. I have yet to repair it cosmetically but the structural repairs have been done and it has flown since. I want you to think about how well designed a balsa and ply structure would have to be to withstand something like this without being ripped to pieces.
As far as the outboard wing panels are concerned....no, there were no reported failures. The prototype was put through every imaginable high G maneuver that we had the skill to put it through and there were never any structural failures. Did you know that on a P-38 a large percentage of its lift is generated with the inner wing section between the booms? Don't believe it....try this.....pull the outboard wing panels off and do some long full throttle runs down the runway. Don't be surprised if you suddenly find it 15 or more feet in the air (good luck getting it back down in one piece).
I know your concerned about the structural integrity of these things, so I thought I'd tell you a story and show you a few pictures to ease your mind a little.
I didn't build the '38 that I have. I bought it ready to fly with about 15 or so flights on it. At the time it had Supertigre 3000's on it with a Zinger 3 blade prop system consisting of a hub system and individually replaceable wooden blades. Shortly after buying it I took it to the field to test run the engines. During one of the full throttle run ups one of the blades decided to part company with the hub.
It was at roughly 8000 RPM when it happened and the vibration that went through this thing before I cut the throttle was phenomenal. But the only damage it sustained is what you see in the photos below. I have yet to repair it cosmetically but the structural repairs have been done and it has flown since. I want you to think about how well designed a balsa and ply structure would have to be to withstand something like this without being ripped to pieces.
As far as the outboard wing panels are concerned....no, there were no reported failures. The prototype was put through every imaginable high G maneuver that we had the skill to put it through and there were never any structural failures. Did you know that on a P-38 a large percentage of its lift is generated with the inner wing section between the booms? Don't believe it....try this.....pull the outboard wing panels off and do some long full throttle runs down the runway. Don't be surprised if you suddenly find it 15 or more feet in the air (good luck getting it back down in one piece).
03-23-2011, 02:38 PM
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RE: Columbia Model Works P-38
ORIGINAL: Mustangman40
John,
thank you for the honest advise, I see what your talking about with the Zaroli and all the parts being available... I think I will need to do some thinking on this one......
John,
thank you for the honest advise, I see what your talking about with the Zaroli and all the parts being available... I think I will need to do some thinking on this one......
I recently checked out what it would take to electric power a Ziroli with with scale dia 3 blade props. $$$$$$$$$$.
Then checking out the Yellow aircraft P-38 the differance in power costs were huge.
I got to thinking. Purchase the Yellow aircraft cowls and canopy reduce the Ziroli plans 87.5% and use the Yellow gear.
Then this came along The builder contacted a couple of flying clubs in my area. through his friend.
The builder wished to donate the unfinished project to someone. As he wouldn't be able to finish it due to health issues.
(80 years old and has Parkinsons)
His only request was to get a chance to see it fly. Needless to say the model building que is shuffled yet again and the P-38 will be on the bench just as soon as the Lancaster gets finished.
03-23-2011, 02:52 PM
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RE: Columbia Model Works P-38
ORIGINAL: jfangohr
Did you know that on a P-38 a large percentage of its lift is generated with the inner wing section between the booms? Don't believe it....try this.....pull the outboard wing panels off and do some long full throttle runs down the runway. Don't be surprised if you suddenly find it 15 or more feet in the air (good luck getting it back down in one piece).
Did you know that on a P-38 a large percentage of its lift is generated with the inner wing section between the booms? Don't believe it....try this.....pull the outboard wing panels off and do some long full throttle runs down the runway. Don't be surprised if you suddenly find it 15 or more feet in the air (good luck getting it back down in one piece).
With the outer wing panels I'm just used to seeing tube wing joiners, and had to ask, since ther is still a fair bit of work and cost to finish it.
It's looking like I'll be going with Century Jet retracts as they list a P/N for the Columbia Models P-38. And I did get a reply. The other places went with a bit of mix and match some parts or it's a custom job.
Iexcited to get this P-38 in the air.
Rick
09-11-2011, 05:44 PM
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RE: Columbia Model Works P-38
John,
I just picked up one of your P-38 kits this past week on ebay and am pretty excited about receiving it. I've thought the Lightning was cool ever since elementary school!
A couple of questions, if you don't mind:
Was there ever an interior made for this kit? If so by who?
Are there any notes that you could share about this kit over and above what is in the manual or on the plans?
Thanks in advance.
I just picked up one of your P-38 kits this past week on ebay and am pretty excited about receiving it. I've thought the Lightning was cool ever since elementary school!
A couple of questions, if you don't mind:
Was there ever an interior made for this kit? If so by who?
Are there any notes that you could share about this kit over and above what is in the manual or on the plans?
Thanks in advance.
09-12-2011, 03:26 PM
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RE: Columbia Model Works P-38
To my knowledge there is no cockpit kit available for it specifically. I know that we never made one.
Tips? Let's see:
1. The booms tend to develop hair line stress cracks where the boom meets the upper rear 90 at the rear of the gear doors, especially if you bounce the tail off the ground a time or two on rough landings. A little half oz. carbon fiber cloth in that area wouldn't hurt.
2. Take an aspirin before you start on the gear doors if you rig them as indicated in the plans. They're a mechanical PITA.
3. The prototype had non-removable fuel tanks and I think it was kitted the same way. Re-engineer that....I did on mine.
4. I would not recommend the ST2500's as suggested. Mine has 39cc gassers that weigh the same as the ST's.
Tips? Let's see:
1. The booms tend to develop hair line stress cracks where the boom meets the upper rear 90 at the rear of the gear doors, especially if you bounce the tail off the ground a time or two on rough landings. A little half oz. carbon fiber cloth in that area wouldn't hurt.
2. Take an aspirin before you start on the gear doors if you rig them as indicated in the plans. They're a mechanical PITA.
3. The prototype had non-removable fuel tanks and I think it was kitted the same way. Re-engineer that....I did on mine.
4. I would not recommend the ST2500's as suggested. Mine has 39cc gassers that weigh the same as the ST's.
09-12-2011, 05:11 PM
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RE: Columbia Model Works P-38
I'm super close to having all my projects that were in the cue ahead of the P-38 compleated.
This means that the P-38 will be on the bench very soon. I really want flaps and as such I've picked up a set of the Robart fowler flap hinges.
I've got 2 Hacker A60 motors and I'm thinking about doing it as an electric. Haven't fully desided on that one yet
Rick
This means that the P-38 will be on the bench very soon. I really want flaps and as such I've picked up a set of the Robart fowler flap hinges.
I've got 2 Hacker A60 motors and I'm thinking about doing it as an electric. Haven't fully desided on that one yet
Rick
09-12-2011, 06:37 PM
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RE: Columbia Model Works P-38
I have been lurking to get myself nice P-38, being it Yellow P38 or this one, anyone has leads to one being available currently, ur model looks stunningly beautiful model.
At 90" wingspan, what scale this model is?
Does fibreglass cowls come with this kit?
At 90" wingspan, what scale this model is?
Does fibreglass cowls come with this kit?
01-28-2012, 06:51 PM
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RE: Columbia Model Works P-38
I recently acquired a Columbia Model Works p38. It is pretty much ready to fly but I plan to go through the plane before flight to make sure it is good to go. It came with pages 1 and 5 of the plans and no other information. I am curious to know what the CG measurement is and how to locate it on the wing and what the control throws are. Also it has a 113" wingspan which seems a little long but the part formers and layout match up with the plans so I am certain that the plane is a CMW P38. It also has Supertiger 3000s should I consider changing the engines? Please share any tips you have for me prior to flight. Thanks.
05-09-2016, 08:29 PM
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I'm having a terrible time trying to respond here. Internet explorer keeps quitting on me on this site. I have a copy of the plans and he instructions. e-mail or message me I can copy them and send you a copy. All I ask is you cover the coping and mailing cost. The manual looks like i's abut 20 or so pages.
Rick
Rick
05-10-2016, 02:59 AM
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Rick happy to pay the copy and postage, I actually just need the manual as I already have the plan set...
Chuck Cabaniss
546 Webber Pond Road
Vassalboro, Maine 04989
207.462.8697
Feel free to just scan the manual and email if that is easier for you and I can print it off here saving you time and effort.
[email protected] is a good email for me...
Any idea on retracts for that and how do you feel about Quadra 35's for power plants?
Thanks!
Chuck
Chuck Cabaniss
546 Webber Pond Road
Vassalboro, Maine 04989
207.462.8697
Feel free to just scan the manual and email if that is easier for you and I can print it off here saving you time and effort.
[email protected] is a good email for me...
Any idea on retracts for that and how do you feel about Quadra 35's for power plants?
Thanks!
Chuck
07-24-2019, 06:30 AM
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I have a great set of scanned plans (tif and pdf) contact me for information.
I was lucky enough to come across a complete short kit with a good set of plans. I had the plans scanned, so contact me if you want a set. I was not able to upload the files.
Steve
Steve
