cmreefer

Hi All,

Looking for some of the more experienced builder''s opinions....

I have a 100cc Twin that needs a home and I would really like to build a warbird this time around. My question is how big of a difference is it to build a kit cutters type kit with plans from something like a GS Top Flite kit? I realize the TF (or other mass produced kit) will have instructions as well as plans, but aside from that, if I already know how to build, how much more difficult is it to build a Jerry Bates or Don Smith or Ziroli kit with a laser cut full wood kit. Do they fit together as well as a mass produced kit?

Lastly, any recommendations for Warbirds for a 100cc twin engine? It obviously has to be a radial cowl to fit the engine...

I really like Sea Fury''s, P-47s, and Bearcats. the only ARFs or mass produced kits I know of are the ~ 80" P-47s from Hangar 9 and Top Flite. I assume these would be too small for my engine, so I need to build something in the 90 - 100 inch range, of which I only know of Kit Cutters type builds like the Ziroli''s etc.... I''ve never been accused of underpowering a plane and don''t want this to be the first!

Any and all advice or opinions are greatly appreciated!

-Danny

jeff naul

My Feedback: (16)

look at the meister p-47, they have instruction booklet that compliments the plans.
http://www.meister-scale.com/
it''s 102" and from what i''ve seen they fly awesome. also plenty of accesories to go with it.
also check out http://aero-accessories.com/ for more p-47 accessories.
i will be starting one this fall and powering with r.c.s. 150 radial. good luck, jeff

cmreefer

Thanks Jeff. That''s a beauty!

I also saw Century Jet has an 87" Sea Fury with fiberglass fuse... Anyone think that would be a good fit for a 100cc twin? Its about the same price as the Meister Scale P-47, but for that you get a fiberglass fuse and sheeted wings! Seems like a deal?

Thanks Again

Evil_Merlin

My Feedback: (13)

You get what you pay for. I''ve seen several complaints about the quality of CJM''s planes.

Rumor has it they have gotten better though.

bosssman

My Feedback: (35)

AMEN!! I have a CJM F-100 that I still don''t know what to do with. The quality of the glass work is terrible and the fuse is MUCH heavier than my Yellow F-4. Overall, I wouldn''t recommend ANY of the CJM kits (or their retracts) to ANYONE...

You may want to look at these guys http://www.flyrcmodels.com/. Although I haven''t personally seen one of their kits, their have been several guys here at RCU that have posted about their glasswork. One guy recently posted about making a very rare ME-109Z using two of the American Eagle glass ME109 fuselages. Do a search on American Eagle and you might be pleasantly surprised...

randy

carlbecker

My Feedback: (3)

I build from plans. I do so because of the different offerings. If you have lots of building experience then take your time and have some fun. I have used Bob Holman, Aeroplane works and PCK. In my experience the quality of fit is better than a packaged kit.

cmreefer

Thanks guys. I have a request into Kit Cutters to see about the Don Smith 88" Sea Fury and the Jerry Bates 100" Sea Fury. I think either of these models would fly very well with a BME 100?

If CJM retracts are no good, what retracts are recommended for giant warbirds like these? Siera, Robart?

Thanks

cmreefer

Bosssman,

Looks like the Flyrcmodels Sea Fury could be another winner... I would like to build a kit from a box of wood, but I have to admit that a quality fiberglass fuse with foam wing cores will probably turn out a lot better as i am not a master builder.... and even the American Eagle Sea Fury is about the same price as a deluxe wood kit.......

I appreciate everyone''s input...

jeff naul

My Feedback: (16)

also keep in mind that if you go with a foam wing set-up there is flite-skin, talk about save some time in sheeting,glassing and sanding!http://www.fliteskin.com/
sea fury''s are different! your going to need the nose weight so the 100 should be fine. i,ve seen alot of the american eagle planes fly (since i live in louisiana) and they seem to be nice birds. they generally come in light so swinging big props should be possible.
not to knock don smith''s plans but i''ve read alot of complaints about the way they build, meaning difficult to build. just do some more research if you lean that way. jeff

jeff naul

My Feedback: (16)

oh, i forgot, i''m partial to sierra but thats me. yes they cost more but what you get in looks is worth it. robart is good gear but lack in the scale looks that sierra has. jeff

carlbecker

My Feedback: (3)

If you are looking at http://www.kitcutters.com/ I suggest you look elsewhere. They do not seem to be able to deliver anything. Do a search here about them. Look at Precision Cut Kits. Robart make decent retracts and have parts available. Sierra Precision make great retracts but I have yet to build a plane for the two sets I have. Shindin may be worth looking at.

cmreefer

Thanks again guys, very much! I will try to find more feedback here on the American Eagle kits. I emailed them asking about which retracts they recommend and I also asked for some pictures of the kit contents to see if I can get a better idea of the quality of the fiberglass fuse and the wings.

I will also look at precision cut kits and see if they recommend Jerry Bates kits... There is also a few Vailly Aviation plans for the Sea Fury I believe... I''ve heard it''s currently difficult to get good quality sheeting material (Balsa)? Are any of you having trouble getting good quality wood?

Anyway, thanks again to you all. You are really helping me to narrow things down!

jeff naul

My Feedback: (16)

i totally forgot about the vailly, great stuff. if i were building the sea fury that would be my first choice. i have the vailly 1/4 scale L-5 stinson, its a blast to fly! he also gives great customer support.

cmreefer

Thanks Jeff. I was looking at their site and they appear to have the best stuff.

If I go that route, Vailly has a 90" and a 101" Sea Fury. Which do you think will be a better match for my BME100? My first inclination would be the 90"...

lrb75

My Feedback: (12)

For a 100cc engine you are looking at the 100" Seafury. 100cc=6.1 cuin. Vailly calls for a 4.2-5.8 cuin for the 100". Meister Scale makes nice easy to build ~100" Corsair, P-47 and a Zero that should work fine. Not 100% scale but easy to build and fly.

cmreefer

How do the Vailly compare in terms of ease of build. Getting a lot of positive feedback about the Meister Scale flight characteristics and buildability which are the two most important factors to me.

I have built a few wood kits and I have done almost all the wood work in my house, by I am by no means a master builder.

Thanks Again

jcflysrc

My Feedback: (50)

Don''t forget Ziroli either. I am building my first giant scale P51 from plans, and a short kit. It has been very straight forward. I am buiding a set of foam wings for it, but that is the only major deviation from the plans. Meister I hear too has a good flying airplane.

Evil_Merlin

My Feedback: (13)

Vailly kits are more scale than the Meister stuff, slightly smaller and a bit more complex to build. You are building off of the plans with the Meister, Vailly, Ziroli, Bates and what not.

The Meister plans are the easiest and give you a bunch of info, both on the plans and when you buy the plans you can get some detailed build notes for most of the plans as well.

if this is your first real big bird, you may be better off going with the Meister as it is harder to build incorrectly and will fly as good, if not better, than anything else out there.

larry@coyotenet

My Feedback: (21)

Considering the motor you are wanting to use I think the choices narrow down to a Jerry Bates or Don Smith radial engined plane like a Seafury or Helldiver or something in that vein. From personal experience that engine will stick out of the cowl on a 96" Ziroli 47 or the same size FW 190 from Vailly. You will be surprised at how big a plane you will have to build to get a cowl that the cylinders won''t stick out of! The Vailly 100+ inch Seafury cowl is not big enough. The warbird guys around here who have the DA100''s from their IMAC planes have had a hard time finding a plane that is big enough for the engine to be completely encowled and yet will fly with the 100!
As to building from a kit cutters kit, I have found that it is somewhat harder to build from kit cutters than from, say a TF kit because the kit cutters parts tend to require quite a bit of work to fit correctly, tend to be uneven in quality of the wood and are uneven in the faithfulness to the plan outline. Nothing off a lot but not much right on, maybe 1/32nd up to as much as 1/8 on the kits I have built. A lot of hand fitting required. Also the big companies like TF engineer their kits much better since they know the average builder will not be as good as someone who can scratch build. Its a shame that there isn''t a kit from TF that matches that engine you have.

Larry

Evil_Merlin

My Feedback: (13)

I have to disagree with Larry on at least one point. TF wood is total and utter crap. The stuff I get from PKK and other kit cutters is much much higher quality.

larry@coyotenet

My Feedback: (21)

I just got done building two TF giant Corsairs and a PKK Vailly FW 190. The TF kit wood was much superior to the wood supplied with the PKK kit.
Probably depends on what is on hand when the kit was cut.

Larry

cmreefer

The size (width) of the cowl was one of my concerns as well... Part of the reason I figured the sea fury would have a larger cowl than a 47 because the 47's cowl is more oblong and maybe narrower. But if my BME100 fit inside the cowl of a 95" Yak I figured it should fit inside a 100" radial warbird cowl.... I will ask the different plan designers what the width of their cowls are....

It's definitely good to know that the Meister's build a little easier.

Thanks Again

NCIS

I am building a 120" 1/4 scale Don Smith F4U-1D Corsair from Don's blown up plans. BEWARE of blown up plans. The lazer cutter cuts the parts per the plan and supplies the wood also according to the plans. Well thats where the problem comes in. None of the wood wil work. The parts fit together nicely but you have to make all the wood from what they provided by laminating or doubling in some instances. I will not ever by a blown up set of plans again unless I just get the short kit and buy all the wood that will work the first time. Nobody ever seems to give Laser Cut USA a chance and thats a shame because Pat works with Dino and all of Meister's kits are cut by him. Yes Laser Cut USA. Plus he is a great guy to deal with. He treats every customer like you are his only one. You have to wait your turn but if you mess up a part he will replace it and not even charge you for the part or shipping. Beat that!!!!!!!!!

Gibbs

cmreefer

Gibbs,

Thank you for your input! I have to admit this decision is getting tougher, not easier, even though I have gotten a lot of good advice here. I emailed Vailly and Ron actually recommended the 90" Sea Fury for my 100cc twin... Interesting.

Looking on the Meister Scale sight several of the FW-190's "Customer Projects" have 100cc twins in them with no apparent fit issues so I think the cowls on these 90" - 100" birds will be big enough.

Because I am not a master builder, I'm intrigued by the flyrcmodels.com Sea Fury. I just feel a lot more confident about building a straight airplane when I'm starting with a fiberglass fuse and fowm wing cores... I have sent them an email requesting more info as their website is very limited information.... I'll give them a call in a day or two if I don't hear back on the email.

P.S. Gibbs, I like your show, my wife and I watch every week.

butlern

My Feedback: (15)

Anyone tried to contact Larry at PCK lately? I've sent emails, but I never get a reply.

Is it better to call, or are they just notorious for not answering email inquiries in a timely manner?

Thanks.

Noah