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Top Flite '.60 size' P-51D Mustang ARF: Building & Modifications

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Old 01-05-2010, 10:17 PM
  #1326
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Default RE: Top Flite '.60 size' P-51D Mustang ARF: Building & Modifications


Quote:
ORIGINAL: RBean

Seems the consenses is that the gas engine is out. I've don't know much about the RCV engines except that they are geared. Have not really though about it, but why not. But which one is best. Does it really need the 1.20 or would the .91 be enough. Are they easy starting, dependable etc? I guess I'll have to research and see what I can find out. I've ordered Spring Air retracts and Robart struts. I only have the engine decision left to figure out.
If you're willing to pony up the bucks, you can always go with the Saito FG-20. Would fit the same as the Saito 125 and you'll get the best of both worlds - little cowl hacking and economy of gas.
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Old 01-05-2010, 11:14 PM
  #1327
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Default RE: Top Flite '.60 size' P-51D Mustang ARF: Building & Modifications

Last summer I purchased a TF P-51 and a Sato 115 (glow) which is just a bit smaller than the 125. This engine fits nicely in the cowl and produces plenty of power. Only the very top of the valve covers and the muffler (stock Saito muffler) are visible. You can check the height chart on the horizon hobby website to see how much taller the 125 is. It's late and my motivation has faded but I can take a picture and post it tomarrow if you are interested.
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Old 01-05-2010, 11:16 PM
  #1328
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Default RE: Top Flite '.60 size' P-51D Mustang ARF: Building & Modifications


Quote:
ORIGINAL: RBean

Flight 21,

and the rest have convinced me I need an RCV SP. Especially if they will turn a four blade prop. Next question is .90 or 1.20. The 1.20 at 34 oz is quite a bit heavier than the .90. I have a Thunder Tiger .91 FS on a VQ Hurricane and it is sufficient power but could be more. Since the Mustang is bigger, I'm not sure if the 90 will be enough. What do you think?
I would go with the RCV 90SP should be plenty. These engines produce lots of torque and use big props and large pitch!
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Old 01-06-2010, 12:54 AM
  #1329
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Default RE: Top Flite '.60 size' P-51D Mustang ARF: Building & Modifications

I agree with Rbean - the 90 should be more than enough. It all depends on your flying style, but he is right on about the large amount of torque and bigger props and pitch. If you have at least intermediate flying skills the SP 90 should be great.
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Old 01-06-2010, 06:23 AM
  #1330
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Default RE: Top Flite '.60 size' P-51D Mustang ARF: Building & Modifications

The reason I will go for the 120 sp is the following:

The sp engines have a 2:1 gear internally, so they will turn at half the rpm of 'normal' four strokes. Therefore they need the high pitch propellers to be able to pull them through the sky. But at the same time, they are less efficient during slow flight (=take-off and landing)

Therefore I will use a 3 or 4 blade prop, so the pitch goes down again, so I will have more thrust at the low speeds, needed for those hairy situations...
(the efficiency of the 4 blade prop at the higher speeds will be less, but the mustang will be fast enough anyway, so it's a trade off between thrust at low speeds, or thrust at high speed)

My mustang will be quite heavy as well: I have century jet retracts, on board glow, droptanks, 10 HVAR rockets, maybe smoke system,...
(I think the 90 sp will be enough if you just have the stock set-up, without any mods)

BUT IMAGINE THE LOOK OF THE BIG 4 BLADED PROP :-) quite scale...
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Old 01-06-2010, 04:22 PM
  #1331
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Default RE: Top Flite '.60 size' P-51D Mustang ARF: Building & Modifications

The 90SP will swing a 4 blade also.
And speaking of torque: I have noticed that this plane seems to want to maintain that left turn right after after takeoff more than any other warbird that I have flown. I'm holding right rudder, but it still yaws and rolls left every time it takes off. The condition was worse when I had the 4 blade prop installed (more torque), which is why I went back to the 2 blade props.

People that are set on over-powering their warbirds will do so regardless of anyone else's opinion, so if your so sure you can handle the extra torque: go for it.
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Old 01-07-2010, 06:22 AM
  #1332
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Default RE: Top Flite '.60 size' P-51D Mustang ARF: Building & Modifications

Well, I still didn't buy the 120 sp, so I'm still able to switch to the 90 sp or cd...

CorsairJock, do you think the 1.20 will be overpowering the plane, with all the extra's I will put on the plane? (CJ retracts, on board glow, droptanks, accu monitoring, etc.)
I just want that extra oompff if I need the power... and thought that the .90 would be only 'just' enough...

I just want a nice flying bird, not one with bad habits due to the bigger engine...

any advice? (I now have the rcv 90 CD installed... maybe I don't need to switch to the bigger one? )
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Old 01-07-2010, 12:15 PM
  #1333
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Default RE: Top Flite '.60 size' P-51D Mustang ARF: Building & Modifications

I'm leaning towards the RCV 90SP. The airframe seems pretty light. The Spring Air retracts, Robart struts and wheels are on order and won't be too heavy. I'm concerned about the weight of the 1.20. At 34 oz it is almost as heavy as the gasser (38 oz). Do the RCV SPs need an on board glow driver? That would be more weight with the extra battery.
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Old 01-07-2010, 03:56 PM
  #1334
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Default RE: Top Flite '.60 size' P-51D Mustang ARF: Building & Modifications

I hate to make judgements concerning engines that I have no practical experience with. Altho I own an RCV 90SP (as well as a 60SP), I have never even 'fired it up' My intentions are to install it on a Thunder Tiger F8F Bearcat, but it is another one of my projects that has been put on the back burner. That Bearcat should weigh a little over 10 when completed (with 3 gear retracts, functional flaps), and I have every reason to believe that it will be a good engine for it (especially with a 4 blade prop).

I'm thinking you Mustang will end up in the 11 lb range with the 90SP, and again: I'm thinking it should be enough to fly it comfortably and scale. It won't be a skyrocket/ able to leap off the ground and go straight up vertical, but you should get a reasonable climb without too much torque issues. Just my opinion. And despite what some people say: warbirds DO fly better/ easier when they are lighter. Not only do they fly better, they impose less stress on the landing gear, and I have witnessed that even CenturyJets are not indestructable.
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Old 01-10-2010, 01:00 PM
  #1335
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Default RE: Top Flite '.60 size' P-51D Mustang ARF: Building & Modifications

My TF P51, YS 91 Slimline pitts and Century retracts. Flew today nose heavy despite lead in the tail...great flying plane!

Anyone fitted gear doors to CJ retracts?

Chris
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Old 01-11-2010, 04:08 PM
  #1336
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Default RE: Top Flite '.60 size' P-51D Mustang ARF: Building & Modifications

I've decided to go with a .91 FS to keep this thing light. I'm using 700 series Spring Air retracts. I have Spring Airs in a VQ Hurricane with Robo struts and 3.5" wheels. They work great. However, with the Mustang I want to use the off set struts, but the Spring
airs take 3/8" robo struts and the largest wheels these size robo struts take is 3.25 ". The 7/16 Robo Struts take 3.5" wheels, but won't fit the retracts. I'll be flying off a grass runway so the larger the wheels the better. Any one flow this plane off grass with 3.25" inch wheels or smaller? How does it do?
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Old 01-11-2010, 04:13 PM
  #1337
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Default RE: Top Flite '.60 size' P-51D Mustang ARF: Building & Modifications

110 OS, 125 SAITO OR 91 ONLY IF IS YS...

MY TWO CENTS.
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Old 01-11-2010, 07:33 PM
  #1338
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Default RE: Top Flite '.60 size' P-51D Mustang ARF: Building & Modifications

Quote:
ORIGINAL: RBean
I've decided to go with a .91 FS to keep this thing light. ............
Sounds like a wise choice.


Quote:
ORIGINAL: RBean
................... I want to use the off set struts, but the Spring airs take 3/8'' robo struts and the largest wheels these size robo struts take is 3.25 ''. The 7/16 Robo Struts take 3.5'' wheels, but won't fit the retracts. I'll be flying off a grass runway so the larger the wheels the better. Any one flow this plane off grass with 3.25'' inch wheels or smaller? How does it do?
If you would take the time to read some of the early posts, you will find that I am using 3 1/2" Dave Brown wheels on 3/8" dia. offset RoboStruts. It took a slight modification to the struts, but I pulled it off. Otherwise, I;m sure that there are plenty who are using the stock (3/14" wheels) and having good success on grass runways.
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Old 01-12-2010, 08:11 PM
  #1339
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Default RE: Top Flite '.60 size' P-51D Mustang ARF: Building & Modifications

CoursairJock,

Thanks for the the info. I have read the entire thread but its been some time ago. I've ordered the 3/8" Robart Struts. I have 3.5" Robart tires so I'll find your prior post re the strut modification. I have a OS .91 Surpas II so I hope it will be enough power for at least scale like flying. I thought about the RCV .91 SP but I think I'll just go with the engine I have.
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Old 01-13-2010, 12:11 AM
  #1340
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Default RE: Top Flite '.60 size' P-51D Mustang ARF: Building & Modifications


Quote:
ORIGINAL: RBean

I've decided to go with a .91 FS to keep this thing light. I'm using 700 series Spring Air retracts. I have Spring Airs in a VQ Hurricane with Robo struts and 3.5'' wheels. They work great. However, with the Mustang I want to use the off set struts, but the Spring
airs take 3/8'' robo struts and the largest wheels these size robo struts take is 3.25 ''. The 7/16 Robo Struts take 3.5'' wheels, but won't fit the retracts. I'll be flying off a grass runway so the larger the wheels the better. Any one flow this plane off grass with 3.25'' inch wheels or smaller? How does it do?
RBean - if you call Spring Air they will make you adaptors so you can mount 7/16 oleos to their 700 series retracts. Hope this helps.

Ed
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Old 01-13-2010, 04:48 PM
  #1341
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Default RE: Top Flite '.60 size' P-51D Mustang ARF: Building & Modifications

I called. Their adapters as I understand it use a wire between the retract and strut. So then, why use Robo strut ready retracts. I'll go with the 3/8" struts. As I have already found with my Hurricane, the robo strut ready retracts and robo struts solve a lot of problems. Also the 3/8" struts weight slightly less than the 7/16" ones. I like the spring airs because you don't have to worry about having enough air pressure to get the gear down, wether from a leak or multiple operation of the gear in one flight.
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Old 01-13-2010, 07:24 PM
  #1342
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Default RE: Top Flite '.60 size' P-51D Mustang ARF: Building & Modifications

Who did you talk with there? When I called I asked the lady who answered that I wanted to talk to the guy who makes the retracts (I think its her husband). I told him I didn't want the adaptor you are describing and he said they would make one from aluminum rod with one end sized to insert into the hole in the 700 retract and the other end of the same piece of aluminum would be sized to fit into the hole in the 7/16 oleo strut. He said to use adhesive (super glue) to keep the adaptor in place in the oleo (I figured I woul use something a little more positive than the super glue).

Sorry I didn't explain this in my first message.

Ed
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Old 01-13-2010, 08:20 PM
  #1343
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Default RE: Top Flite '.60 size' P-51D Mustang ARF: Building & Modifications

Man man man... quite a bit of work when you want more 'scale' retracts and covers...

Here is what I have so far.... now just a bit more tweeking, paint and filler...

Oh yes, you guys all convinced me that I would keep the .90 engine in it... the more scale flying, the better!

A question: does anyone has a good solution for mounting the droptanks? the system with the screws is bound to fail on the first flights, I do not intend to make them functional, only detachable on the ground...

And what about weathering ? is it possible on this type of covering? or will it just drip off?


Happy flying!

Jens
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Old 01-14-2010, 08:34 PM
  #1344
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Default RE: Top Flite '.60 size' P-51D Mustang ARF: Building & Modifications

great job on the custom full length doors. I was thinking about doing the same thing as I never liked how the original was so tough to properly fit to robart struts.

The attachment to look scale. As a friendly suggestion, don't forget to add some flat blk paint to the airscoop for authentic looks.

:0

Enjoy!
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Old 01-14-2010, 10:53 PM
  #1345
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Default RE: Top Flite '.60 size' P-51D Mustang ARF: Building & Modifications

Ok,, Flight Report... My -51 was one of the first batch with great covering and the mod. needed on the retract bays. I just got her in flying condition in Dec. and maidened it on the 31st of Dec.

What can I say, the bird is perfect, better than I could have imagened when I started. The take-off roll was managable with input of rt. rudder ,it started to nose over but was more a function of it being out of trim. The climb out was positive if not spirited. Tucked up the gear and after a few clicks of trim the game was on.
With the Saito 1.00 it is no racer but the performance is better than scale. With the stock set up on the controls the loops can be nice and big and the rolls nice and crisp. Knife edges well ( pulls to the belly somewhat) I have not seen that annoying tail wiggle that some warbirds have.
Deploying the flaps does not require any trim change and slows the plane down very nicely. The landings were almost non events (except for the knee nocking) the Mustang setteled down at a nice speed and I was not uncomfortable with it at all.
After 6 flights on this plane I can say I like it alot! I met all of my goals on the build and it turned out well. I know it's just an ARF but I still like it .

Eng... Saito 1.00 , APC 14X8 prop ,Mc Daniel on board glow , Keleo inverted pitts muffler
Raido..JR 9303 2.4 , Hitec servos
Retracts... Lado 90*, Robart Robostruts/ 3 1/4" wheels
C.G. 5 1/4" from wing /fuse join
Weight... 10.8 lbs.
Mods ... Scratch cockpit sunshield ,instrument pnl. , gunsight , airbrushed pnl lines/ weathering, Slimline pilot
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Old 01-14-2010, 11:03 PM
  #1346
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Default RE: Top Flite '.60 size' P-51D Mustang ARF: Building & Modifications

A couple of in progress shots. I desided to do the curent warbird and make the mods on the scheme rather than take off the fin fillit to make it the WWII bird. The stars& bars and the tail nos. are Major Decals, the invasion stripes are Monokote. The guns are alum tubing.
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Old 01-14-2010, 11:07 PM
  #1347
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Default RE: Top Flite '.60 size' P-51D Mustang ARF: Building & Modifications

Couple more
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Old 01-14-2010, 11:12 PM
  #1348
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Old 01-14-2010, 11:50 PM
  #1349
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Default RE: Top Flite '.60 size' P-51D Mustang ARF: Building & Modifications

Lemme be the first to say.......... AWESOME!! Love the airbrushing and the cockpit details! Glad your flights were heartpounding.
I see a hint of gapseals in the control surfaces.. a great added touch to detail and aerodynamics. I did the same and it covers up the robart hinges nicely.
I can't wait to get mine back in the air as soon as it warms up. A -51 on skis doesnt cut it! LOL I need to learn how to airbrush and I will do the same to mine one day. How did you do the panel lines- taped off or pen?

Congrats!
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Old 01-15-2010, 12:38 AM
  #1350
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Default RE: Top Flite '.60 size' P-51D Mustang ARF: Building & Modifications

Most excellent! Bravo! I like your choice to do the current bird - looks just like it. So did you clearcoat the plane after the weathering, panel lines and paint? Or did you use fuel proof paint on the details?

Very nice additional details. Very impressive...
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