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Thread: KMP Corsair


  1. #126
    Tisoy909's Avatar
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    RE: KMP Corsair

    Coming slow but coming along!
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    \" To thine own self be true \"

  2. #127

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    RE: KMP Corsair


    ORIGINAL: Tisoy909

    Just got the Brison 2.4 in, as i was saying before I dont believe 26 cc's would cut it for a 16-17 pound warbird. I've had that same power to weight range issue before with a well tuned Zenoah 26 in my H9 150 size p-47 @ 18 Lbs and it was a dog!!! Sure 39CC's are on the higher end but no such thing as a complaint for having bigger balls right, and don't want issues with such a nice ARF either. Anyhow here are the pics you make the judgement for yourself. I'm gonna cut out the lower part of the cowling for some air to head clearance spark plug and muffle tips of course, and then an opening in the lower rear of the cowling as well for some added air scavenge. All in all i believe this should come out pretty clean. I'm just waiting on a Bisson Pitts side muffler. I'm going to put hitec metal gear for the rudder and elevator and the Karbonite stuff for the other positions: ailerons flaps throttle and gear switch etc. Sorry for the overkill on pics of the same thing, its just that i'm lovin it so far thats why. BTW I have an Inverted Wraparound Bisson Pitts muffler that came with the motor. If anyones interested, would be happy to send it shipped for $50 for anyone who needs this, and its a brand new muffler btw!
    Louie
    I did a search on engine weights just recently and came across this info the standard Zenoah G-26[stock muffler] is 59oz, the Brison 2.4 with a Bisson side mount muffler is 55oz.
    Therefore weight wise your not at any disadvantage plus you can always run a 3 blade 18 x 10 prop which you couldn,t do with the Zenoah.
    Your engine choice is a good one even though the Zenoah should fly a 16-17lb warbird without any difficulty.
    As they say you can always throttle back.

    Dave

  3. #128
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    RE: KMP Corsair

    Drifter,
    Have you figured out how these flap wires go? You mentioned three wires per wing but even this i cant quite understand. The way i see it ,and understand from these fabulous instructions is that we have 3 flap sections per wing so there should only be two wires, one in between each flap section, now i'm also further confused because there are actually two sets of wire holes, for two wires on each sub flap section if thats what we can call it. I understand the concept, and see that these wires will slide in and out of the flap sections to accomodate the movement as the flaps will deploy but i didnt see anything suggesting to glue or support one end of the wire into these sub flaps, wouldnt it be better to do this to help prevent a jam during deployment in flight, the way i see it, if the wires aren't secured at one end, and just free to move left to right then jamming is a possibility. I have to admit, the arf is nice but the manual is something else. I like to stick with instructions but theyre becoming irritating as this arf progresses. Prior building experience tells me that some of the steps in this manual are kinda shady, I mean it is a 13 page manual for a seven hundred dollar kit, fascinating.
    Louie
    \" To thine own self be true \"

  4. #129

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    RE: KMP Corsair

    I did not start the plane yet but haveing been going over the flaps over and over . I am starting to think we need to email KMP and ask for some clarity on what they did on the test model
    LDM

  5. #130
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    RE: KMP Corsair

    ORIGINAL: Tisoy909

    Drifter,
    Have you figured out how these flap wires go? You mentioned three wires per wing but even this i cant quite understand. The way i see it ,and understand from these fabulous instructions is that we have 3 flap sections per wing so there should only be two wires, one in between each flap section, ...
    Louie
    Louie,
    Maybe my "explanation" added to your confusion. I said "you have to bend three wires". Not all three go into the flaps. The 155 degree bend is on the linkage to the flap servo. As you say the other two go into the flaps. I was only addressing the backward way KMP described the angles that have to be bent.

    I agree that KMP ought to clarify whether the wires need to be secured.

    There are other examples of the instructions being subpar. When assembling the elevator we are told to "apply CA to the aileron"!?

    Drifter
    Why do they call it "dead weight" if it keeps your airplane alive?

  6. #131

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    RE: KMP Corsair

    one of our guys is doing a full build on the r/cflyers forum, if it helps anyone

  7. #132
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    RE: KMP Corsair


    ORIGINAL: alanc

    one of our guys is doing a full build on the r/cflyers forum, if it helps anyone
    Here is the address. The flaps are under discussion now.

    http://www.rcmf.co.uk/4um/index.php/...dseen.html#new
    Why do they call it "dead weight" if it keeps your airplane alive?

  8. #133

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    RE: KMP Corsair

    Thanks that is great
    LDM

  9. #134

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    RE: KMP Corsair


    Sierra Giant Scale Products makes a set of 100 degree rotating retracts for the KMP F4U.
    I Haven't even opened my F4U from Kondor yet but I puchased these retracts after talking
    to Darrel about their quality. I am posting a photo for anyone interested. They work extremely
    smoothly and are very strong. I think they will handle side loads extremely well without bending.
    They are far superior to any others I have seen. I appreciate the discussions in the forums about
    the flaps. Looks like it's going to be a job. I'll probably be calling Andrew a couple of times.
    He is always extremely helpful and patient.

    -Bob

  10. #135
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    RE: KMP Corsair

    Hey everyone,
    Just wanted to say, after fiddling with the silly contraption provided by kmp to make the flaps function to the very least, i've come to the conclusion that the whole mechanism is complete junk, and thats just being honest. Did the wire bending, and re-bending over and over again, and it simply wont work in any satisfactory way, and in fact i believe it could possibly be the loss of plane if the user would attempt to make do with it. Tried calling KMP no responses, just a nice lady to answer the phone and take a message, nobody gets back, thats unfortunate. I've read other posts on other threads mentioning that they will work, and i think theres some kind of bias there, go figure, but honestly after going with the silly manual that dedicates one tiny info box to the entire description of how the flaps will use the wires to align and deploy the flaps, and studying how these tubes which run in the flaps that are supposed to support and control the adjacent flaps, that there was probably next to no concern on the designers part to see that they will work. If i'm just an idiot, and couldnt figure this out properly i can say atleast that i read the total of two sentences illustrating how the flaps will work then ill still leave the comprehensive manual to blame. The design suggest that wires will slide in and out as the flaps deploy, but the geometry of the flaps in this corsair model, the straight through tubes in the flap sections and the use of the wire is physically not practical or realistic, it will bind and jam up in flight, and as the manual tends to state a lot, "If coming off during flights. You'll lose control of your airplane which leads to accidents". Going to another Corsair model, the Top-flite giant scale manual proves that in a segmented flap model, the wires must not only slide left and right but they must also slide fore and aft to accomodate the dynamic motion of flaps that are segmented and deploy at different angles simultaneously. the kmp model just has a flap with a plastic tube through it, and pretty much ask you to stuff a wire in it and go have fun, lol. I was contemplating the thought of using sullivan Gold N Rods when trying to make these mickey mouse flaps work, and after giving up i made some test model to see how it can work with the gold n rods, and the variable geometry of a corsair flap system. The results appear better than i had initially thought. So im working on it right now, i'll share some pics if anyone is interested. Welps thats just my .02 cents again.
    thanks for reading
    Louie
    \" To thine own self be true \"

  11. #136
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    RE: KMP Corsair

    oops double post cleaned it up.
    Louie
    \" To thine own self be true \"

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    RE: KMP Corsair

    in the real corsaid , is the flap held in place with an inner flap , that slides in and out covering the gap created by the flaps opening ?
    If so , is it possible to hollow the flaps, add an inner piece ...plastic that will slide in and out in the following manner .
    Picture the plastic as a rectangle , cut a line in the rectangle in the center the aprox distance that you need the flap to extend .
    You dremil out the gap in the flaps to hold the flat platic inner flap , make sure its even and a perfact fit .
    You then set the plastice inner piece in the flaps , counter sink a screw into the flap thru the line in the middle of the plastice thru the bottom of the flap(flush) or dremil is away . You do this on both side of the flap(outer -inner ) ,
    the screw should act as a guide for the inner flap to travle left and right as the flaps extends , you wont get perfact lateral movement but you shoudl get perfact movement left to right with a somewhat of a scale appearance ,
    what do you think ??? now be kind , I know it will take paint ect , but its worth a try
    LDM

  13. #138
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    RE: KMP Corsair

    LDM,
    I believe you're correct, the original Corsair i recall having, just as you say, something of a shield which is revealed in between the flap sections when deployed, i believe they are to make the Corsairs' flap actually efficient. My opinion is yes, i think you would be able to fashion something as you describe that will not only be more scale than this model provides but also functional to allow the flaps to work properly. But yes, i think it would take more than a bit of time and TLC, and for me maybe a little too much effort but hey, if you can engineer it, i know it will be better than whats called for in the manual. I just want to get going to get this bird done, i mean i've had the kit almost a month now and still on the frigging wings lol. I don't mind doing lil corrections here and there, but if thats what kit bashing is then i dont know, all i do know is i probably spent nearly two grand now on the kit, motor, other misc. components etc. so to come across something as this mickey mouse flap design kinda ticks me off somewhat, i would imagine to others as well. Anyways, I like your idea on another kmp corsair flap solution.
    Louie
    \" To thine own self be true \"

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    RE: KMP Corsair

    Louie , thanks , by the way this is Lou , I know what you mean , I do have the plane and did not expect any bashing with the overall cost .
    On another note did you menthion the engine your useing ??? I am still in need of an engine
    LDM

  15. #140
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    RE: KMP Corsair

    Tisoy909 you might download the instructions to the TF Giant Corsair and see what was done there. They also had the same idea of a wire going from each flap to the next. I can say it also was a trick to get them all to work properly but it did in the end. On the TF a 4-40 wire was used sliding inside a brass tube. I had one end of the 4-40 wire glued into one flap sliding into a brass tube that was glued in the next flap. Also the hinges for the flaps were just as important to get it all to work. You had to get the angles correct but it was possible. Anyways maybe it will help at least the instructions I know are longer. The Corsair I am building now is using the same idea as the full scale which is a lot more linkage but easier in the long run I think and looks cool. Keep us posted would like to see what you come up with.
    Randy, Enjoying Warbirds

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    RE: KMP Corsair

    The plane looks nice but the wing radiators are backwards the round oil cooler should be to the outside or towards the tip

  17. #142

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    RE: KMP Corsair

    I have just finished hinging my wing, manged to get the wire method to work fine, however I have replaced the hinges with Robart type. For more info and photos please follow this link http://www.rcmf.co.uk/4um/index.php?....msg640113#new

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    RE: KMP Corsair

    Click for fullsize I dont know if this picture will show or not , but the inner flap does indeed have a thin internal flap that slides in and out of the larger flaps when retracted , working like a web .
    When I start my build I am going to try to copy this detail with a interal thick plastic sheet sliding on a simple track made as described earlier .
    I viewed the 1/5 top flight corsair and I did not find it helpful as it does not appear that the TF is scale
    LDM

  19. #144
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    RE: KMP Corsair

    Ldm,
    I kit-bashed a set of flaps with that inter-web-flap thingy on my H9 Corsair and they have worked very well for me. Here are a couple of short flicks of their actuation and a flight vid... http://www.rcuvideos.com/video/f4uflaps0002-wmv http://www.rcuvideos.com/video/f4uflaps1-wmv Only the last 20 seconds show flight with the flaps extended, but you'll get the idea. http://www.rcuvideos.com/video/corsairflapsfly-wmv

    I used the Topflight, straight pin method to link the flaps. This requires cutting a slot in the adjacent flap instead of just drilling a hole so that the pin doesn't bind. If you look closely at my pictures, you'll see the slot for the pin. This method should be easier than the curved wire method that KMP suggests because you don't need to bend the wire at an exact curvature. But with some trial and error, the KMP method should work just as well.

    It turns out that the inter-web-flap is as easy to set up as the Topflight straight pin link. I made a paper pattern for the web by deflecting the installed flaps to their maximum, then I traced the angle between the flaps. Next, I added 1/2" tabs to either side of the tracing and applied it to some aluminum roof flashing. I used aluminum roof flashing that I found at the hardware store , but you could also make the web out of fiberglass. I took a close look at full-scale Corsair pictures and noticed that the web was set up close to the bottom surfaces of the wing. This requires that the web be curved the same as the bottom of the gull wing at the flap joint. Aluminum stays where you bend it. To achieve the proper curvature with fiberglass, you'll have to lay the fiberglass up on the bottom of the flaps over some wax paper.

    The web (up to the 1/2" tab line) is then glued into one of the adjacent slots cut in the flaps edges and you are done unless, there is an internal rib in the way that doesn't allow the web to be fully inserted into the other flap. You may have to open up one of the flap edges to gain access and remove obstructions that prevent full insertion. Trimming the 1/2" excess down a bit might be another option here. Paint or monokote the finished web. If the web is stiff enough, you may even be able to fore go the wire linkage between these two flap sections.
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  20. #145

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    RE: KMP Corsair

    great info Craig , I need to study this and possibly ask you a question , thanks again and great job
    LDM

  21. #146
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    RE: KMP Corsair

    Thank LDM, feel free to ask questions. I think that I just thought of a simple way to figure out the exact curvature that you need for the KMP wire link method. After you get the flaps mounted (I don't know if KMP provides a way to keep the flap wire holes lined up while mounting them. A short bit of wire temporarily inserted in the holes should do the trick), measure the distance between the hinge pin and the hole for the wire in the flap. Transfer this measurement to some paper and use a compass to draw a segment of a circle of this radius. The circle segment only needs to be as long as the distance between the flap-wire-holes of adjacent flaps when the flaps are fully extended. Bend the wire to the radius that you drew with the compass. Disclaimer: I don't own this plane and I can't find the KMP instructions online so I may be way off here.

  22. #147

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    RE: KMP Corsair

    Thanks Craig , I am going to start on this baby in December , I am printing your info .
    I will be in Minnesota this Thursday hopeing that Jeremy(sky-hobbies) is up and running in his new shop , I need an engine for this plane , dont know what to get yet and a new radio !!!
    LDM

  23. #148
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    RE: KMP Corsair

    LDM,
    Did you hear that the old location of Sky's the Limit Hobbies (formerly Hobby Warehouse) at 71st and Chicago Av. in Richfield has been closed for some months due to professional disagreements? Jeremy is going to open a new place in Egan and his dad, Tom, is reopening the old place. I don't know the time schedules of all of this, but if you were unaware of these happenings you might give a call ahead to be sure that the places are open. Maybe you know more about this than I do since, I have incomplete information. I don't know the name or address or opening date of Jeremy's new place in Egan, nor do I know when Tom is reopening the old place. If you know more fill me in. If you know less, I could do some asking around for you.

    Later, Craig

  24. #149
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    RE: KMP Corsair

    Graig, That is a very sweet job you did on the flaps. I recently assembled my H9 F-4U and was trying to figure out how to cut flaps into it. I've done it on the H9 P-51 but this seems to be a little more challenging. Do you happen to have any documentation on how you did it? I would appreciate it greatly.

    Thanks
    Shane
    Colorado-rc.com

  25. #150
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    RE: KMP Corsair

    Unfortunately, I don't have anything comprehensive. I was flying by the seat of my pants when I built the flaps, made mistakes and was too wound up in "figurin' and a fumin'" to think about documenting what I was doing. So, I only took one picture of the process which was just after I had cut the flaps from the wing. If you look at all the pictures that I posted of the finished product in this thread, that might help. http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/m_50..._1/key_/tm.htm I tried to help a couple of others in that thread but they started with a different process than mine so don't confuse their pictures with my finished product or you will get really confused. If you want to give it a go I'll try to help out.


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