Max1965

Ghost check out my freshly painted F-86.........Should be running the motor up next week.

http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showt...=646315&page=7

2M86

My Feedback: (1)

Any news???
Bye

The Ghost

No, had bad weather for a few weeks now, also thad other things that had to be done that has taken up my time, health reasons have slowed me down as well. Will be having my daughter for a couple of weeks so there will be no work going on over that time anyway. I was hoping to have it done by now but it is not to be. I will get it finished though.

Cheers

Max1965

Hi Ghost...Merry Christmas...may the New Year find you in better health.


I had a little setback on my build....paint problem(I hate painting).
By the way I ordered two of the Zippy 6s 5000Mah packs.......they are as you say....great! They actually perform better than my Flightpower 25s. Now if they will hold up this is the way to go.

The Ghost

Max, Merry Christmas (even though it is nearly over here) and the best for the New Year. I have been using the Zippy batteries for over 12 months and never had one fail yet. I have had Flightpower batteries fail in under 12 months and they did not have the use that the zippies have had. In photo is half of the batteries that I have at the moment.

Cheers

Max1965

Ghost ..Those are gold foiled batteries...my Zippys are blue....which ones are you using?

I did somemore test on the 6s Zippys by installing them in my Sport 90 and again...better performance than the Flightpower 25s. My Flightpowers are older but I never had this type of power as is in the Zippy. I had heard that the larger Zippy batteries did not work well although the smaller packs did......didn't really make sense. Now I know.

The Ghost

Max, I have had these for about 12 months and I know that they changed them a few months ago to the blue covered ones in the 6cell batteries. These are the replacement [link=http://www.hobbycity.com/hobbycity/store/uh_viewItem.asp?idProduct=6353&Product_Name=ZIPPY-H_5000mAh_6S1P_20-30C_Lipoly_Pack]ones[/link] that I will be getting. The 3cell ones have just been replaced with [link=http://www.hobbycity.com/hobbycity/store/uh_viewItem.asp?idProduct=7636&Product_Name=ZIPPY_Flightmax_2200mAh_3S1P_25C_]These.[/link]

Cheers

Max1965

Ghost would you believe both of my Zippy 6s 5000mah packs puffed and I have a cell out in each package.....DAMN! I have two of the 5000Mah 5s which are doing great in one of my other planes. I didn't get a run up on F-86 as the packs puffed before I could get good readings. I had balanced and run them in a few times before I did the test. Both batteries were charged and balanced on my Cellpro 10s @ the same time....voltage was right on. I will need to send the batteries back for an exchange ........have you returned any of your zippy to Hobby King?

I have two Flightpower(older packs) which seem to be o.k. so I will give them a trial on Monday....also I am going to try a 12s2p run up on A-123s. I found that if I left a few items out of the plane the A-123s would add only 6 oz more than the lipos. I have two canopy and interiors for the plane, one has the pilot and is fancied out....the other is just the bare setup. I can also save weight by not installing the rudder servo and use an UBEC instaed of an onbaord battery....then I believe the A-123s will work out.

The Ghost

Max, Never had problems with any of the Zippy's I have. I have given all of them quite a workout with my prop models. Have also worked them with all the testing that I done with the fan in the test rig.

Cheers

Max1965

I think the packs could not handle the large demand in series on the Byron fan....only thing I can figure. I had broken the packs in on my charger by charging and discharging and then balancing them again. At any rate I will send them back(bet that will be fun)for exchange. To tell the truth I was surprised as one of the packs worked at all.....as the package had taken a beating and one of the packs had the plastic wrap torn. I don't believe this treatment caused the failure however. I will use the exchanged ones in my prop planes and go to the tried and true Flightpower packs. The 5s Zippy packs are working great but I am not running a heavy in series demand on them. Oh well....I just wanted to see what this Hacker/Byron fan would do. As I said I have a good set of Flightpowers and some A-123s which I will run up monday.

Max1965

Ghost I just did the run up to tach the Turbo. I got 26,400 or about 16.24 lbs thrust @ 64 amps. I did the run up using 14s2p A-123s @ 50 volts. I believe I will get even closer to your 17lbs once I hook up my new 12s Flightpowers. Hell this plane would fly on 10s.

The Ghost

Thats great Max. I have tested on 9cells,(specks in thread somewhere), The reason I am using 12 cells is bacause I use 6 cell packs in my prop aircraft. Even 16lb thrust will fly the old byron jets better than they did orignally. I know in the day I was only getting 12lb on a very good day, with every thing working perfictly, and then hoping that it would hold the tune through the hole flight. A big positive with electric is that what you get with one run is what you get every run. I have never tached mine so I don't know what RPM I'm getting. I know a bloke with an old mech tach that you hold on the shaft but I have not seen him in a while to ask him about it. The Hacker ET motor is a monster as far as power goes, just a shame it does not fit easlley in the Byron fan shroud.

Cheers

Max1965

I would like to tach the motor using an auto tach, but I don't know anyone who has one. I think the run up today was pretty damned close as it came within one pound of your run.

As for fitting the Hacker to the shroud....took me about fifteen minutes to rout out the shroud using my Dremel tool....then mixed up some JB Weld epoxy and was done. 16 lbs is quite a big deal considering it is about a 30% gain in thrust. I am going to run the motor up again tomorrow using different setting on my tach and also check out teh Amps with my watt meter. I think the Amp draw will be low.

The Ghost

You will have to watch the JB Weld epoxy as it may soffen with heat. If the motor heats up enough it may soften enough to allow the motor to pull out. I know how far the fan flys if it comes off at full power, hate to have that happen in the model, would not be much left. Just something to watch out for.

Cheers

ticketec

My Feedback: (2)

They are definately pretty nice figures.

I'll have to look into selling my A50 Hacker, and buying one of the turbos now!

I staill have not re flown the F-16 due to the continually high winds, and lack of time. but i have bought the R/x and have fitted the larger mains.

Thanks

Dave

The Ghost

Dave, same here, with my daughter staying here now for the holidays and the same windy weather as well as other work and not being in the best health. Hope to fly her within the next couple of months.

Cheers

Peter_OZ

My Feedback: (1)

Gday ghost and Dave, happy new year fellas!

Dave let me know how that tail unit for the SF is coming along, be nice to get that bird back in the air - provided the winds stay down!

cheers
Peter

Max1965

Ghost, I ran up the motor to full speed for some length of time when I used the A-123s and the motor didn't get hot. If it were to run hot it should have done so then....but I will watch the JB Weld. I don't believe it will soften as this expoxy has been used on full sized car motors to replace threads in metal engine block. If this motor /fan works well maybe someone will come out with a new shroud to fit it. I have informed Iron Bay about the test maybe it will perk their interest.

I still want to do the tach again but with different prop settting for the tach menu. I wish I had an auto tach but that would be hard to tach anyways as the motor is back in the fuselage ....guess I could beam it throught the wheel wells as I haven't installed the wheel well covers yet. I guess I was surprised @ the results from my tach test yesterday and want to be sure my numbers are close. I do believe they are because they fall in line with your 17 lbs.

Ghost hope your health improves.

The Ghost

Max, how did you use the tach, did you use the fan blades or did you paint two white stripes on the fan hub. My tach won't measure 5 blades and I have not got around to paniting the hub. Also all my thrust tests were done out of the model in a test stand setup(Photo old motor setup). I have not tested it in the model yet as I am waiting for a new Hyperion speed controller to turn up.

Cheers

Max1965

I will need to do the run up again Ghost. It would be misleading if I posted any other numbers. First of all I am waiting on my Flightpower packs...should be in this week. I just do not have any good packs right now to do the test right. Second, I will paint the white strips and tach the motor that way as it is more accurate.

I had read how you ran up your motor and maybe that is why your got better numbers....damned if I know as I have never did tests for thrust before. Once you know the rpm of the byron fan you can use the Byron formula to calculate the thrust and really don't need a scale. First you find out the rpm and then divide the rpm by 1,625...this will give you the thrust. Byron figured out this formula years ago. You may know this already but maybe others could use the info.

The Ghost

Max, No I did not know that Byron had a formula for thrust calculation, every one that I know that was involved with them in the days of Byron, they all measured the thrust as every one was different (only slightly but still different). I have seen the same setup (engine, pipe, fuel and shroud) run up to the same RPM on different Byron fans in the same shroud and they had different Thrust. I beleve that I will have slightly less thrust in the model from what I have read and been told. It will only be slightly less but I will have to wait untill I get the new ESC.

Cheers

Max1965

I had no idea the formular exsisted either as I was using a scale (which didn't work well). Someone told me about the formular on one of the threads. I guess the thrust was close enough in each plane to use the formular. Of course if the formular depended on rpm then it would not matter which power unit you used. At any rate I will use the formular once I figure I have the correct rpm. I'm not going to post any more results until I am sure they are right.

The Ghost

Max, using the formula backwards, I get 27,625rpm for 17lb thrust so it must work as it compares with what you got. Also at 12lb you get 19,500 which is what as obtainable with the 90 sized glow motors.

Cheers

Max1965

Much easier than using a scale huh? I think Skyhawk told me about the formula. I had taken a hiateous from flying about the time the Byron , Miller and Cook planes were flying( had gotten into racing and sales of r/c cars at the time).

I meant to ask you if you knew your rpm reading so you could check out the formula compared to your digital scale readings. Sure does make it easier to calibrate thrust in the Byron fans.

I will be installing my retracts today as well as doing a couple odds and ends on the plane. I still need to hook up the pushrods to the flying surfaces . Won't be too long before the maiden.

Max1965

Skyhawk is the one who told me about the formula....read here:
http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showt...646315&page=10