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Charlie Kellogg's TBM Avenger Build

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Old 12-05-2009, 05:32 PM
  #501  
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Default RE: Charlie Kellogg's TBM Avenger Build

lkahn4,

I have a friend who is starting the platt 1/5 T-28 also. I told him how useful RCU threads like this are in helping on a build project. Would you mind if I sent him (Maser) your way?

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Old 12-05-2009, 06:25 PM
  #502  
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Default RE: Charlie Kellogg's TBM Avenger Build

Warbird,
Anything for a friend of this thread, I can give him the info on a T-28 website that has all kinds of useful info. Not to mention the phrase "Misery loves company".. it would be nice to exchange ideas and progress... if he wants to contact me directly my email is lkahn98329@hotmail.com.


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Old 12-06-2009, 01:58 AM
  #503  
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Default RE: Charlie Kellogg's TBM Avenger Build

redtail,

Sound like a great project. I had a Dynaflight F-82 years ago. Stand-Off scale, but it sure flew great. I was thinking of taking two Top Flights and moding them, but the fuselage lengths and wing center section was to be an issue for me. If I had it figured correct I could have added an 18" section from centerline of each fuselage, left the Fuselages the orginal lengths and made it a 1/7 scale.
Only problem, not big enough!
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Old 12-06-2009, 07:36 PM
  #504  
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Default RE: Charlie Kellogg's TBM Avenger Build

So yesterday I got all the servos intalled and linkages made. Not too labor-intensive. I am using Robart control horns, Hangar9 titanium Pro-links (the rods) and DuBro 4-40 ball links on every servo arm for the ailerons and flap sections. For the rudder and the tail wheel steering, I'm using pull-pull with steel leader. For the elevator halves, I'm using the Robart horns and some rods that go all the way up to the wing centersection (where the servos are mounted). Each surface has it's own servo. Hitec 5955 TG on elevator halves and rudder, and just some standard Hitec 645 MG on the ailerons and the flap sections. I might swap out the servos in the outer flaps with the 5955 TG, because those are pretty large surfaces. We'll see.

The throttle and choke are JR digital servos (some ultra precision DS 8231). I ordiginally had some 645 MG on both throttle and choke, but I think the precision servos will be better.

Not a lot to show for this stuff, but here are a few shots from the weekend.
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Old 12-06-2009, 07:37 PM
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Default RE: Charlie Kellogg's TBM Avenger Build

And inspite of the cold weather, I went out and wet-sanded the control surfaces. The Inspection hatches came out pretty good.

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Old 12-06-2009, 07:44 PM
  #506  
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Default RE: Charlie Kellogg's TBM Avenger Build

I also did my best to get some more panel lines on the wings and fuse, but it was a mess. The wind was bad and it was too cold. The tape was not sticking well and the paint was not spraying well.

I'm just not sure I can do a good job on the panel lines in the winter.

The other major problem was that the primer was taking forever to dry. So between coats, as I was trying to build up the layers of primer along the tape, I had to drag the fuse or wings (quickly) inside the house and into to a little downstairs bathroom so I could use the heat and the exhaust fan to minimize the fumes.

Madness. And needless to say my wife was not impressed.



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Old 12-06-2009, 07:52 PM
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Default RE: Charlie Kellogg's TBM Avenger Build

So, until the weather turns, I think that I'm going to move onto the cat.

It's hand-layed fiberglass fuse/nacelles/cowls and foam-core wing and horizontal stab. Picures of the fuse and cores below. It's essentially a full kit less the hardware. The wood is in the house, as are the gear and the motors.

I'll start with the horizontal stab, fit it to the fuse and then onto the wings.

I plan to start a thread devoted to the kit, and WARBIRDRCER indicated that he wanted to build his Ziroli B-25 in parallel, so I guess we'll be doing a joint, giant scale twins thread sometime in the near future.

Be back soon!

Noah

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Old 12-06-2009, 08:34 PM
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Default RE: Charlie Kellogg's TBM Avenger Build

lkahn4,

I forwarded your info to Maser and he likes the idea of the T-28 build thread. If you need any scale photos let me know. I have access to one in progress and one completed. The in progress I may be checked out in it to fly myself one day. Never thought that would ever happen, but the guys at the museum are great that way.

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Old 12-06-2009, 08:53 PM
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Default RE: Charlie Kellogg's TBM Avenger Build

Wow, I thought I had big projects!

Cool pictures, Steve.

Speak with you soon.

Noah
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Old 12-06-2009, 08:55 PM
  #510  
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Default RE: Charlie Kellogg's TBM Avenger Build

Looking good Noah, I agree, let the winter have its blast, no need pushing a beautiful construction job. Get the Kat started for now. That will give me a month or so to almost catch up to you guys. Smile Chic
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Old 12-06-2009, 08:58 PM
  #511  
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Default RE: Charlie Kellogg's TBM Avenger Build

Warbird, thanks for the offer, I certainly will take you up on it as I start and progress. I have downlaoded a ton of photos from the web and am now trying to get a list together of what I need to complete the buils, ie. servos engine etc. will keep you posted as I get nearer to starting.
On another note, Noah you are certainly making progress, and I olve how you dry the paint. Here's a hint about the smell, get the airwick plug ins, get the most aromatic insert you can get and leave it on in the little bathroom with the door closed, the wife will never know. That's how I manage to paint in my workroom, not 100% foolproof but it lessens the glares and comments get come my way.
Temp was around 40 today with winds between 15 and 20 so no flying, I helped the wife with the outside decorations, made a few points, now I'm only minus 1,498, I figure a few more Xmas's and I'll be at -1,490 if I don't do anything else to screw up. (Yeah like that's gonna happen..lol)

Thanks again Warbird

Larry
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Old 12-06-2009, 08:59 PM
  #512  
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Default RE: Charlie Kellogg's TBM Avenger Build

butlern,

Looks good. Say what is that aerobatic plane in the back, and is that a ziroli Zero?

Let me know when you want to start the Giant Scale Twins thread. My build buddy and I await, but we also have plenty of other building to do.

Thanks

Doolittle Raiders:
Crew No. 7, front row left to right: Lt. Ted W. Lawson, Lt. Dean Davenport; rear row left to right: Lt. Charles L. McClure, Lt. Robert S. Clever, and Sgt. David J. Thatcher
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Old 12-07-2009, 07:02 AM
  #513  
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Default RE: Charlie Kellogg's TBM Avenger Build

The aerobatic plane is a Great Planes Yak 54. It's powered by a Taurus 42cc engine. I don't do much aerobatic flying, but when I do, it certainly helps keep me out of the warbird rut (going full-throttle in circles around the field, high speed low passes, with an occasional barrel-roll, wing-over or split-S).

The Zero is a Yellow Aircraft kit. 27lbs with a G38 for "power." Actually it's a lot of fun flying a plane with marginal power. You have to actually fly the plane!

The Bf109 is Meister kit. ~36 lbs with a Taurus 62cc for power. Floater! No flaps required.

The P-47 razorback is an old Byron Originals kit. 27lbs with an equally-old Sachs/Dolmar 69cc. Far and away my favorite to fly among the warbirds I own. It's due for some attention. The glue/foam in the control surface hinges are getting worn and loose.

Clearing out the shop this morning before work so I can bring the F7F in out of the garage later this week.

Will start a thread devoted to the F7F and the B-25 later this week.

Larry, you need to keep the Avenger contruction pictures and reports coming!

Regards,

Noah
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Old 12-09-2009, 11:41 AM
  #514  
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Default RE: Charlie Kellogg's TBM Avenger Build

I intend to start on my T-28 this month. I bought the cockpit interior kit also. The plans are from Dave Plat, and I had a custom cutter cut the entire kit. I also had Dave Plat send me the canopy that can be opened. Not sure how to do this, never had attempted one before. The retracts are Robart. There are some modifactions I will have to make for the Robarts, but thats an easy fix. The hinges for the control surfaces will be tubing. The hinge pointisplaced in such a location that I could not find anything commercially available. Bill Holland here in OKC bought a Germanmade F-4U that has a hinging system which I intend to employ on the T-28. If you have any ideas on a sliding canopy or the hinging system let me know.Hopefully I will have it done by Warbirds 2010.
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Old 12-09-2009, 05:31 PM
  #515  
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Default RE: Charlie Kellogg's TBM Avenger Build

Ask this guy about the moveable canopy. Dan.
http://www.canopyrailsforwarbirds.com/
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Old 12-10-2009, 04:55 PM
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Default RE: Charlie Kellogg's TBM Avenger Build

Excellent. Thanks. This is just what I need.
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Old 12-10-2009, 06:59 PM
  #517  
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Default RE: Charlie Kellogg's TBM Avenger Build

Hi all,
Time for an Avenger update per Noahs request. Yesterday we finally got to prime the fuselage for the third time, not too bad, still a few issues to address which I hope to get taken care of tomorrow or Monday. We also started countersinking the holes in the hinges for the bomb bay doors and hope to get them set in the fuse on Wednesday. and make whatever adjustments that are needed. Noah pix are coming be patient, I can't see sending them when there looks like there is no progress being made. Noah speaking of progress, is there a drawing of the gun turret, I can't seem to find it on the plans and I was going to try and get the pieces rough cut on Sunday.

Maser, glad to hear you are starting your T-28 this mont, hopefully the wife comes across and I get mine for Xmas. I do have a couple of questions, what number Robart retracts did you get and what engine type are you going to use for power. I think Dave's website is www.t-28.com, if not email me at lkahn98329@hotmail.com and I'll fwd it to you.

The temps are going down to the low 20's with windchills between 10 and -15 this weekend so I'll be housebound, guess I'll change out the battery in the P-38

Talk soon, stay warm
Larry
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Old 12-10-2009, 07:11 PM
  #518  
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Default RE: Charlie Kellogg's TBM Avenger Build

HI, Larry.

Glad to hear that you're back at work (on the Avenger).

No drawings on the turret.

I was using photos from the collection on Charlie's build CD.

I'll upload some more pictures of mine later tonight after work, and I'll provide some written detail on how I built it.

Be back soon.

Noah
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Old 12-10-2009, 07:45 PM
  #519  
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Default RE: Charlie Kellogg's TBM Avenger Build

Noah,
Thanks for the halp as always, if I just wasn't so damn anal we could move on to other stuff put I'm trying to get the dorsal fin to blend nicely into the fuse

Larry
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Old 12-10-2009, 08:38 PM
  #520  
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Default RE: Charlie Kellogg's TBM Avenger Build

Not a problem, Larry. I'm happy to help when and where I can.

As I said, I just "eyeballed" my turret proportions, but used Charlie's
photos as a reference. I've attached some sketches and some
pictures to help you get an idea of the proportions of my turret.

To make the turret, I started with a light ply ring that fits the base of
the turret canopy. This ring is about 1/2 wide. I then cut some 0.040
styrene for the side supports (triangular shape). I cut those so that the
edges at the base of each triangle would make contact with the ring. I
rounded off the top and then wrapped the upper edge of the triangles
with 0.010 styrene. Do not glue the triangles to the ring yet!

Next I made the "tub" that holds the gunner. I just sketched the profile for
the tub sides based on the proportions (of the tub relative to the ring) as
depicted in one of Charlie's pictures. Once satisfied with the size and
shape, I traced these onto 0.040 styrene and cut them out. The bottom and
back of the tub are just cut from 0.040 styrene, and the curved front
portion is cut from 0.010 styrene (so that it more easily wraps and
conformed to the curved front of the tub). The bullet-proof screen was cut
from music CD case, again the size and shape was just eyeballed, and then
wrapped in a thin strip of 0.010 styrene.

Once the tub was glued together, I made a support system (the tub is
floating between the triangular sides and above the lower ply ring). The support
tubing is made from 1/4 plastic tubes. This tubing simulates the tubular steel
framework that connects the tub to the side supports (triangles). Holes were
drilled in the triangles to accommodate the tubing. The tubing is heated gently
with flame so that you can get it to bend. Otherwise shorter
lengths of tubing can just be glued together at the turns and bends.

The tubing was then glued to the tub, and then the ends of the tubing were
inserted into the holes in the triangles. Once I was satisfied, I glued the
triangles to the ply ring and added details and further support where
appropriate (I also ended up using some styrene I-beam material to support
the front of the floating tub).

The seat and seat-back were also just made from styrere.

Hope some of this helps.

Just remember there are no hard and fast rules or dimensions
for the making the turret. Just do your best to make it look how YOU think it should look.
In the photos I've posted below, you can easily tell that my turret is a "bit out of whack,"
but no one will ever know once it's installed in the plane.

If you want some more specific details (or better pictures) or if you cannot view
the .pdf drawing I uploaded, just let me know!

Regards,

Noah
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Old 12-10-2009, 10:09 PM
  #521  
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Default RE: Charlie Kellogg's TBM Avenger Build

Hi Noah,
Thanks for the info, pix and drawing, it helps a great deal. Now at least while I'm stuck in the house this weekend I can start to work on that and be a bit further ahead than I would normally be. Stay warm and your build is coming out awesome. BTW, we are going to use 1/16" chartpak tape for the panel lines, and then use rosie rivets on top of that, we'll see how it turns out. We're getting really good at removing everything to start over

Thanks again
Larry
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Old 12-10-2009, 10:14 PM
  #522  
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Default RE: Charlie Kellogg's TBM Avenger Build

I certainly give thanks Noah, for a great explanation of how to build the turrent. I have a 4 inch three ring notebook on this build that is practically filled up. Keep it coming my friend.
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Old 12-10-2009, 11:03 PM
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Default RE: Charlie Kellogg's TBM Avenger Build

Larry,

The nose gear is the 95 degree DGHD #642 HDRS. The strut is the right hand offset for 3 1/2" - 4" wheels #671R (Not sure if it should have been a left hand)

The mains are the 85 degree HD 1/2" low profile #636RSLP. The strut is the 3/8" straight strut #650. You need to get the modifications for the strut in order for it to fit the retract mechanism.

The engine is s FUJI BT-50 EI with EIS (46.5cc)

After looking at Steve Keesey's photo of the real T-28 the struts I bought seem to be bigger than scale. The reason I bought these was because I took the demensions for the struts off the Dave Plat plans.

Since this model has such a short nose moment I hope I won't have to add nose weight. Any suggestion on how to compensate for this.

Steve Keesey is going to help me build a thread for this project.

Dave Plat's web site can be obtained by going to "Google" or whatever one you use and type in Dave Plat. The site will come up

Hope this helps.

Boyd.
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Old 12-11-2009, 07:50 AM
  #524  
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Default RE: Charlie Kellogg's TBM Avenger Build

I just got online at work and clicked on the .pdf attachment I uploaded and only parts of the drawings showed up. Weird.

So, for those of you interested, if you don't see 4 complete sketches on the drawing (ring bottom view, triangle side view, tub side view and tub front view), let me know and I can email the attachment to you directly.

Noah

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Old 12-11-2009, 01:30 PM
  #525  
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Default RE: Charlie Kellogg's TBM Avenger Build

Larry
Since you are asking for some details on the turret, I had printed some photos from Cal Cochran to help me with the details. Try these web sites
www.clubhyper.com/reference/tbm3cc_1.htm#3. Turret
http://www.aircraftresourcecenter.co...an/walk592.htm

We look forward to your photos
Charlie


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