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  1. #26
    mick15's Avatar
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    RE: MOKI RADIAL Care and Maintenence

    Hi David, thanks for your comment, all donations gratefully received lol!

    The Yak is the 3W 130inch wing span weighs 36lbs the prop is a Menz 34x12.

    m

  2. #27
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    RE: MOKI RADIAL Care and Maintenence

    Great post, Scott. BTW, looking forward to seeing you at Monster Planes in October. Speaking of Monster Planes, I am working hard to have my 3W-Bearcat ready for that event. She will be powered by the Moki 215. I bought the engine used a couple of years ago and only started her up about two months ago in anticipation of the Bearcat build. Started right up but would quickly fade out after only about a minute of run time. Without going through all the trial and errors of correcting the problem, this is what was the culprit: The pressure bolts going from the header pipes to the muffler ring would get very loose as the engine warmed up. One of the posts here talk about this issue. When I tightened them, the engine ran perfectly, but the nuts would eventually loosen again and drop rpm's and then shut off. No matter how tight I made them, they would loosen. I then checked the running temp of the engine immediately after shutting down and read temps of 240 or more degrees! Way too high. I then switched to the recommended Yamalube 2 stroke oil at a 30:1 mix. The engine temp dropped to under 220 and the nuts stayed snug longer. Nevertheless, I added red locktight to the nuts and they have not loosened at all. Engine runs reliably and strong now.

  3. #28

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    RE: MOKI RADIAL Care and Maintenence

    Mark,

    what oil (and ratio) were you using before you switched to 30:1 Yamalube?

    Noah

  4. #29

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    RE: MOKI RADIAL Care and Maintenence

    Hey Mark,

    Glad to hear you're going to make Monster Planes. Should be a great time! Can't wait to see the Cat in action.

    Pretty interesting about the header pipes and engine performance. I think this thread is going to be a great tool. I'm surprised that the red Loctite would hold up in the extreme heat. That's good to know. Thanks for letting us know about it!

    See you soon,
    Scott

  5. #30

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    RE: MOKI RADIAL Care and Maintenence

    Is everyone using regular gas (87 octane gas) in their Moki radial? Is there any negative or benefit to using higher octane fuel (91 octane) other than price? [8D]

  6. #31

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    RE: MOKI RADIAL Care and Maintenence

    David,

    I use regular unleaded as I believe that is what they recommend. I seem to recall that using the higher octane was not advised but I can remember why? It's a shame to be 46 and so forgetful. At least when I get older I won't remember how nice it was to be younger!

    Scott

  7. #32
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    RE: MOKI RADIAL Care and Maintenence

    Hey Guys, Subscribing here as I have a 250 radial I will be putting in a Comp Arf Corsair soon. Great thread Scott, lots of good info.
    Evan Q.
    http://www.evoshangar.com

  8. #33

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    RE: MOKI RADIAL Care and Maintenence

    Hey Evan,

    Good to hear from you. It was great to meet you in Georgia last month. Wish I was making it out to the "Rockies" this year. Maybe next year.
    Let the guys over there know about the thread and lets see what we can all teach ourselves about these engines. I've already heard some good stuff that's helped.

    Guys,

    Anybody have a preferred method of doing the "air dam" thing and can explain it here? What materials, clearance, and attachment procedure. Could help a lot of guys who aren't doing it because they think it's too difficult. Help out if you can....

    Thanks,
    Scott

  9. #34

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    RE: MOKI RADIAL Care and Maintenence

    Scott, regarding baffling, have you check out Ali's TigerCat build on RCSB? It's in the "other kits" forum. I think it's on or around page 40 of the thread. Ali's builder (can't remember his name right now) has been documenting the completion of a 3W Tigercat, and he posted some really nice photos of the baffling that he's done around the twin Moki 150's.

    It's worth a look, for sure.

    Noah

  10. #35

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    RE: MOKI RADIAL Care and Maintenence

    I've made baffles out of formica and have not had any issues such as cracking or getting out of shape. They're wedge shaped of course and fit in front of the exhaust pipes. I attach them with stainless steel aircraft safety wire wrapped once around each cylinder at the top and bottom through drilled holes. Simple and effective although I speak shooting from the hip as I've not taken temp readings with and without. I figure it can't hurt though. My engine is mounted in a loosely cowled 30-% Waco and overheating has not been an issue for me.
    Heat can be a problem with these engines I've been told. I remember seeing Dino and the FW 190 that had a cooling fan in the cowl. It made more heat due to the energy required to turn it! Full scale planes almost always use baffles. Mitch

  11. #36

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    RE: MOKI RADIAL Care and Maintenence

    Scott,
    Very good forum. I have been runing the Moki 215 in my Stearman for 10 years now, my Waco for the past 5 years and my Yac with the 250 for 4 years. Just a couple of things that I have always done. First nothing but 32/1 oil mix. I use Klotz synthetic. I use 5 volt regulator and Duralite packs usually 3000 MA. I use Lithium(white grease) on the rockers and push rods. Get the water proof at the bait store, fisherman use it on their reals. It sticks on the metal and doesn't get flung on the onstde of the cowel. On the ignition use electrical tape to secure the nut that holds the plug together. It looks like it won't vibrate apart but it will. Cost me one flight at the Nats in 2007 thanks to Brian Omera we figured it out. Don't ever over rev the engine you will loose a push rod or two and probably break the head bolts. I have a few of these engines, they run great and are reliable as long as you maintain them.
    Mike Barbee

  12. #37

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    RE: MOKI RADIAL Care and Maintenence

    10 years! Wow...I didn't even know they've been around that long. So Mike, you got that 1st 215 when you were what.........28yrs old??? Ha ha ha. Good to hear from you Mike. Thanks for giving us your thoughts on it. I do the tape job on the ignition connection too. I think Dave McQ told me about that one. Thanks again and hope to see you soon.........Monster Planes maybe for you???

    Mitch,
    I was hoping you would give us your air dam set up. That sounds way to easy. Great idea. Some/any pictures of that would be nice. Any problems with them vibrating and or wearing and becoming loose?

    Scott

  13. #38
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    RE: MOKI RADIAL Care and Maintenence

    Hi fellow radial addicts, and thanks Scott for launching this.

    Here is what I have gleaned after 3 years running two 250's (one on a 3W Bearcat with a 30x18 Menz prop, one on a 1/3 scale B-USA Stearman with a 32x12 prop):

    1) Cooling. Stearman was easy .. hanging in the breeze. In the Bearcat, I put "pie-shaped" deflectors in between all the cylinders to force all airflow over the fins. The cowl on the B'Cat is tight enough on the outside dimension that no air block was needed there. I have posted pics of the install on other RCU threads, when I have some time, I'll repost here.

    2) Lubrication. Each day, light machine oil on the rockers. A few times a season, lubriplate on the pushrod ends.

    3) The air pump. Always use a clear 3mm festo tube to the carb so you can check for grease residue. That will stop the motor, as no pressure pulses reach the pump in the carb. I expect a little grease to be extruded from the breather hole in the back of the pump on each flight. When this stops, it means it is time to add some more grease. I use high-temp disk brake lube. The little pump simply unscrews with a good quality open-end wrench on the flats on its head, and the lube can be put in with a hypo. If you keep flying after the grease stops coming out, that's when you seem to get grease vapor plating out on the clear tube, which eventually will clog it. I keep 2-3 spare pre-cut tubes with me in my radial tool kit.

    4) Ignition battery. I have always run my two motors on 4.8V. I too hear about some that "like" 4.8 and some that "like" 6.0V. It is my belief that to run well the ignition needs a VERY low impedance voltage source. I had a lot of problems at first with ignition packs that were too small (e.g. 2400 mah .. and good Sanyo cells too). I ended up going to 4400 or 5000 mah NiCd or very good quality NiMh with 5 milliohms or less output impedance. The flights don't take too much total current (maybe 400-500 maH to recharge) so it's really the low impedance that is needed .. not the absolute capacity. My belief is that it is possible that the people using 6V are compensating for batts that are high impedance or too small... but that is only a guess.

    5) Oil. On Mike Dooley's recommendation, I mostly run the motors with Yamalube mixed 30:1. I also experimented with the 50:1 Amsoil mixed at 40:1. I found the engine ran smoother and cleaner on the leaner oil mix (that black gunk that comes out the exhaust with the Yamalube is some nasty stuff!).

    6) Spark plugs. They seem to get quite black and ugly in 10-20 flights. Not sure if this is an over-oil problem (see #5 above), or a too-rich mix, or perhaps that the engine runs cooler than most of the gas two strokes I have. This is based only on temp gun readings on the ground, where the 250s seems to be in the 215-225C range, where most of my other gassers run hotter than that. I would love to know more about this. I often change the plugs just because they look so awful, even though the motor still runs ok.

    7) Exhaust port nuts. Yep, they get loose. I lightly tighten them each flying session while I have the cowl off to do lubrication. Heard too many stories of stripping the threads so I tighten them very gently...

    That's what I can think of for now .. thanks to all for posting such great stuff here!

    Dave


    8)

  14. #39
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    RE: MOKI RADIAL Care and Maintenence

    Oh yes, the microphone plug on the ignition can vibrate loose. So tighten it up and wrap w/tape. I passed that gem along to Scott, but I got it from Mike Barbee! Hope Mike and Brian O'Meara join the fray, they may have more radial time than anyone out there ...

    Dave

  15. #40

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    RE: MOKI RADIAL Care and Maintenence

    Thanks a bunch Dave. Well said too. The teachers must of loved you in school. Outlined and straight to the point, how could you not like that!

    I think we're starting to get some real good content here. Very helpful stuff. This is already a great reference tool for any Moki newbies out there. If you guys know any please welcome them aboard.

    How about any special mounting tips? Linkage tips anyone?

    Scott

  16. #41

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    RE: MOKI RADIAL Care and Maintenence

    I wonder if we could get Mr. Mike Dooley himself to dive in here and share a few words of wisdom. I've got to believe he's worked on more of these babies than anyone else in this country. Anyone know how to get him involved???

  17. #42

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    RE: MOKI RADIAL Care and Maintenence

    I want to comment on oil and fuel. They recommend a minimum of 87 octane in the so called manual, premium fuels are not hotter they will actually run a cooler exhaust temperature. Premium fuel will have less impurities that flash off causing the higher exhaust temps that 87 octane produces. This is the big mis-conception of octane in fuel. Do yourselves a favor and run premium. Car manufacture's say run 87 because the engine is designed to run on low octane, they alter the fuel curve, compression ratio and timing to make it most efficient because we are all going to run the cheap gas.
    Oil, I have seen every 2 cycle oil that has been produced in the last 15 years, and i've only seen one bad one. Blue Marble, they didn't last long. All tcw3 rated oils are good but the name brand synthetics are in a league of their own. The synthetics clean way better than say "yamalube" not bashing yamalube. this engine is not designed around yamalube so don't go beating your head in trying to find it or run it consistantly. These are expensive engines so don't sell yourself short on cheap oil, run a name brand synthetic. also additive's like "ring free, carbon guard or quick clean" are a worth their weight in gold! One bottle will last years as it mixes 1 ounce to 10 gallon's. "Sea foam" at a parts house is the same thing. If you ever could see an engine that runs without it and one that does you will be amazed.
    One guy mentioned Klotz, it is awesome oil and thats what we have run in our boats for about the last 6 or so seasons. The only draw back is that it "WILL SEPERATE" from the fuel and settle to the bottom so be sure to keep it shook up. It takes a few weeks to do so so don't panic. loading it in the truck and driving to the field will shake it up enough. We have problems with it sticking floats after it sets 2 weeks in carbs. there again it settles in the carb and most of the gas evaporates out so it leaves gummy oil in the needles. When i use it in my planes i run the carb dry and have no problems.
    Ratio's, Klotz is forgiving so you can experiment running it thinner. Keep in mind that air cooled engines don't have the luxury of water and thermostats to keep the temp consistant so that why you need to run at the recommended 32:1. especially during the summer. 40:1with a synthetic will run better as stated earlier but i'm not telling anyone to do it.
    i have a few ideas on better tuning that we are going to try on my 150 but we just havent gotten around to it. Thank you guy's for getting this thread going.


  18. #43

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    RE: MOKI RADIAL Care and Maintenence

    Hi i dont have one of these engines but they fascinate me and sound fantastic in the air.
    If i can make a suggestion that someone makes a list of these maintenance and service points.If you go to the Gas engine section you will see a list that has been put up that posters add to now and again but its only for gas engines, so if someone organizes these tips and add to the list when someone comes up with a good idea it would make it a lot easer and quicker to read.
    Just an idea.

  19. #44
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    RE: MOKI RADIAL Care and Maintenence

    This will probably start a whole new debate; I have done away with the pulse generator some two years ago.

    I use a Flightworks 100 fuel pump (converted to petrol by the factory) driven from a separate channel mixed to the throttle, this enables in-flight mixture fine tuning.

    The pump is fed from the 4.8 ignition battery. The fuel is fed to the carb by a 4mm tube which has a 3mm branch spilling back to the tank.

    This system has been 100% reliable and requires no maintenance.

    m

  20. #45
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    RE: MOKI RADIAL Care and Maintenence

    Yo Scott,

    Thanks for starting this thread! Great idea. There has been a lot of suggestions about adjusting certain screws and bolts. It would be great if you could add digital pictures with these locations you mention for the really "special" people like me to follow along so I have some idea what the h@ll I am tightening. Its not hard to confuse me when it comes to engines especially on this radial monster. I am proud owner of a 150 that is going in a ziroli corsair.

    Hey Evan,
    When are you updating that little website of yours its getting to be outdated.....

    All the best,
    Peter
    \"To Gen. Jimmy Doolittle, you would have enjoyed this airplane and it would have enjoyed you -\"
    Chuck Yeager

  21. #46

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    RE: MOKI RADIAL Care and Maintenence

    Jeff, WOW! That's a bunch of really good information. Thanks for taking the time to put that down on paper for us. I feel a lot better about my choices now and you cleared a few things up for me.

    Dubs, can you find that organized list and link that page here. Sounds like a great idea for sure. I'll be looking for it!

    Mick15, you're just way too advanced for me. That sounds like an interesting thing to do. Thanks to routine maintenence, I haven't had a problem or too big a concern with mine so far. It's more than I'd want to bite off but.....you never know. Thanks for the idea.

    Doolittlereaider. You need a shorter name. How about "Doo"? Ha, just kidding. I think I'm like you in that sense that engine mechanics are not natural to me. I can learn them well enough and this thread has already helped a lot. I hope it does the same for you!

    He brings up a good point about pictures. If you guys can, post some helpful pictures where applicable. Kind of hard to do if the egine is in an airplane

    Thanks guys, this is really helpful[8D]

  22. #47

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    RE: MOKI RADIAL Care and Maintenence

    Hello Scott,

    Great thread!!!! I'm the proud owner of a 250, which will be going into my Scale Wings LA-7. I hoping to show off the new power plant at Monster Planes in October…

    Pete and I would like to setup a date to get together and review all this wonderful information covered on this thread. This will allow us to understand and show us what to look for, as we get deeper into the Radial Engine World!!! After class we can go to lunch Pete’s treat…. LOL I can’t wait to fire my 250 up….

    Greg

  23. #48

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    RE: MOKI RADIAL Care and Maintenence

    Hi guys-
    How about a three blade prop recomendation for the 1.50 ? Got a T-28 refurb project that's going to need a nice three blade. THanks-Mike O

  24. #49

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    RE: MOKI RADIAL Care and Maintenence

    Mike O,

    Good to hear from you too. Glad to hear that bird is getting closer. I know a few guys flying the Beila (sp?) 26x12 and 28x12 with good results. One has to watch the RPM's more than the other. Don't want to let it go over 5400 in a dive. I limit my throttle travel so that on the ground I don't get more than 4900. I only estimate that the unloaded RPM is no more than the 5400 limit. So far so good.

    I think that's aperfect application for one of Wayne's SOLO PROPS. Scale and adjustable. Almost like it was made for the 150 Moki.

    How about some pictures of that bad boy and the engine installation??

    Take care,
    Scott

  25. #50
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    RE: MOKI RADIAL Care and Maintenence


    ORIGINAL: Doolittleraider


    Hey Evan,
    When are you updating that little website of yours its getting to be outdated.....


    Peter, Been doing maintenence on the fleet of 8 birds for Wabirds over the Rockies. Had to build a new canopy for the D9 as it was lost over the Georgia forest.
    Also hit a snag on the D13 build. The belly area came out wrong and Im having to redo alot of the lower fuselage/wing join. I will post pics on the website soon.
    Hopefully starting a new build with pics soon for the Corsair/Moki radial build.
    Evan Q.
    http://www.evoshangar.com


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