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MOKI RADIAL Care and Maintenence

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Old 06-20-2012, 02:40 PM
  #2051
mogman
 
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Default RE: MOKI RADIAL Care and Maintenence

Here you go......This is on a 400, I can't imagine the other mokis being different.

#1...lifter
#2...pin shows breather? or air intake for pulse piston?
#3...ign. sensor
#4...sensor removed, this is where I added oil.

Cheers,
Dave.
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Old 06-20-2012, 02:41 PM
  #2052
Scott Prossen
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Default RE: MOKI RADIAL Care and Maintenence

Thanks Dave. The pictures will help those who don't know the terminology.

Scott
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Old 06-20-2012, 03:26 PM
  #2053
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Default RE: MOKI RADIAL Care and Maintenence

Just thought of something...I've heard of people losing pushrods...nothing to prevent the lifter from departing the engine also...might be prudent to carry a couple of spares?
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Old 06-20-2012, 03:40 PM
  #2054
Scott Prossen
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Default RE: MOKI RADIAL Care and Maintenence

That's perfect Dave. Thank you. Now everybody will now what to do. Except the blind guy just called me and asked for it in braille. Can you do that next!?!? Ha!

All the best friend. See you in Fall.
Scott.
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Old 06-20-2012, 03:56 PM
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Default RE: MOKI RADIAL Care and Maintenence

I would be interested in hearing from Goetz Vogelsang on this issue. Being that he is a Moki service centre, he may have an opinion on grease vs oil in the front housings.

Dave.
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Old 06-21-2012, 01:37 PM
  #2056
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Default RE: MOKI RADIAL Care and Maintenence

I talked to Goetz about the lubrication in the front case of the 250 since ours is an earlier version with the smaller exhaust tubes. He ask me to tell everyone that on the early 215/250 the grease used during assembly will harden and migrate to the outer walls of the case as discussed in this forum. HOWEVER, he emphatically stated that the newer 215/250 are packed with a vastly superior SKS grease, which requires NO additional lubricant or needless dissasembly of the engine. He cites as an example a 250 used very hard by a major kit manufacturer and sent to him with over 400 flights on it. Goetz said the inside of the front case on the engine was perfect with absolutely no wear on the internal components. The early 250 my friend Phil is runing in his CARF Corsair has OVER 25 hours of run time on it with no issues other than a couple of pushrods we lost before we learned how to properly lubricate the valve train.

In a related note and on the subject of valve train lubrication, we talked to a Red Line oil engineer about the best lubrication to use on the valve train and more importantly to lubricate the exhaust valve stems. He said, whatever lubricant you use make sure it IS NOT silicone-based because even with PTFE (as many silicone spray lubes advertise) the silicone-based lubricant will NOT hold up under the engine heat. Red Line recommended a high grade compressor oil they sell in three viscosities. We chose not to go with their oil and instead have settled (again, for 25+ hours) on TRI-FLOW spray lube. TRI-FLOW has excellent pennetrating properties (for working the oil down the exhaust valve stems) and more importantly, it withstands up to 475 degrees F. Our valvetrain lubrication regimen is: Lube external valve train every flying day. Lube external valve train and exhaust valve stems every 6 flights (our flights are 20+ minutes each). We lube the exhaust valves by depressing the valve rocker, removing the pushrod then filling the pocket around the top of the exhaust valve with TRI-FLOW and depressing the valve spring to allow the lube to migrate down the valve stem. Obviously each cylinder needs to be vertically oriented with the valve pocket pointed up. This creates work with the Corsair because the wings have to be removed and the fuselage rotated around in the cradle. The truth data: after the pushrod losses at the 5-hour point in the engine's operational life we adopted the regimen I laid out and have not lost a pushrod since.

In summation:
-From Goetz, do not take these engines apart needlessly, crappy case grease only applies to early 215/250 (like ours).
-Stay away from silicone lube, get oil down into the exhaust valve stem because when the exhaust valves go dry and coke up they stick and you lose pushrods.

Phil's Corsair is the one posted in the youTube link by Patrick a page back or so.
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Old 06-21-2012, 02:57 PM
  #2057
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Default RE: MOKI RADIAL Care and Maintenence

Growler84, thanks for the info that will save me a lot of work, as I stated earlier, I remove the pushrods and lube the sockets and lube everything you stated but I also lube the lifters.
Now the big question, ..How do you tell the new 215/250 engines from the old 215/250 ones?
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Old 06-21-2012, 03:04 PM
  #2058
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Default RE: MOKI RADIAL Care and Maintenence

What about the 150's? What is the situation with those engines internal grease?

Thanks to all for all the info, makes you really wish a decent manual came with these engines!

Whit
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Old 06-21-2012, 04:05 PM
  #2059
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Default RE: MOKI RADIAL Care and Maintenence

Appropriate questions indeed.

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Old 06-23-2012, 04:10 PM
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Default RE: MOKI RADIAL Care and Maintenence

Hey fellas, I thought I should mention that gear oil with GL-5 rating which has EP additives is corrosive to yellow metals, such as bronze and brass.
It looks like the Moki has yellow metal bushings in it so be careful if you select a gear oil because you could be doing more harm than good.
Just thought I would pass this info along..........Ron

I hope someone will tell us how to tell the difference between the old 215/250's and the new 215/250's so we know which grease we have in the front housing.
Thanks for all the support on this subject.
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Old 06-23-2012, 10:27 PM
  #2061
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Default RE: MOKI RADIAL Care and Maintenence

Hello everyone.
This answer has been given to me by Moki factory, so this is the greese what they use.


"The grease type what we use: SKF LGHP 2/1 High Performance
polyurea -40 to +150 º C "


Lelle
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Old 06-24-2012, 02:44 AM
  #2062
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Default RE: MOKI RADIAL Care and Maintenence

growler84,

Is this the product that you are using?

http://www.triflowlubricants.com/Tri...Lubricant.html
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Old 06-24-2012, 02:50 AM
  #2063
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Default RE: MOKI RADIAL Care and Maintenence

In spite of all that has been said and written, grease is still not the best lubricant for a gearbox!
The best you can hope for is a very small amount lubricating each component over and over again, 99% of the grease in the housing is doing nothing.
I will stick with oil.

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Old 06-24-2012, 03:38 AM
  #2064
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Default RE: MOKI RADIAL Care and Maintenence

Mick, I totally agree with you, and I understand that you have the older Moki engines that had the grease problem, you have the correct solution.
I am wondering if the so called new grease will flow at low temperature to migrate to the required areas, the reason I am wondering is because the stuff seems to get by the carb pump piston into the festo tube, so I'm assuming the grease must be liquifying to some extent.......Maybe not!
The only way to know is to get some of the LGHP 2/1 grease and warm it up, if it doesn't flow then I will add oil......Ron

I am not disagreeing with anyone, I am trying to bring up things we need to consider and possibly find an answer to before we change anything.
These are wonderful engines and quite an investment so I think we need to investigate completely before reacting.
I am sure everyone will agree our main problem is the lack of instructions and information from the factory!!!!!!
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Old 06-24-2012, 03:48 AM
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Default RE: MOKI RADIAL Care and Maintenence

You raise an interesting point, if the grease heats to oil why not use oil in the first place. I’m not trying to influence anyone just saying the way I treat my engines.

One of my 250s is new but that doesn’t change the way I treat it.

m


Incedentally I don't believe the grease does melt as it seems to stay all around the inside of the cam housing.
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Old 06-24-2012, 05:44 AM
  #2066
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Default RE: MOKI RADIAL Care and Maintenence

http://www.mapro.skf.com/products/lub_lghp2.htm
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Old 06-24-2012, 07:05 AM
  #2067
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Default RE: MOKI RADIAL Care and Maintenence

Thanks Mick and Jaketab, I just got an idea to solve this whole dilema,... drill a small hole in top of the forward housing, then install a zerk fitting in the lower front housing, then before every day of flying just give it a couple of pumps of grease or until it comes out the hole in the top.........Problem solved. Ha!Ha!
I will go away now.....Ron
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Old 06-24-2012, 07:16 AM
  #2068
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Default RE: MOKI RADIAL Care and Maintenence

Bye bye!! lol.

m
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Old 06-24-2012, 03:59 PM
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Default RE: MOKI RADIAL Care and Maintenence

Ok Guys, I have a moki 215 6-7 years old bought from RCS. only finish the plane last year . I have 80 minutes of run time. Friday I was flying, great first fligh. Second flight not so great. Grinding noise throttled back engine quit. Went to turn it over by hand one place felt grinding. Removed front cover found brass gears. Three of the teeth stripped off dont know why. Engine came out of time valve damage and lifting rods damage on two cylinders. have not taken it apart any futher. First does anyone have a parts list, best place to buy parts? Anyone know how to time this motor. There is a timing mark on the steel primary gear what do you line this up with. Any info helpful thanks Bill
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Old 06-24-2012, 06:00 PM
  #2070
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Default RE: MOKI RADIAL Care and Maintenence

www.vogelsang-aeroscale.com

They sell the Moki and are a service center.
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Old 06-25-2012, 10:18 AM
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Default RE: MOKI RADIAL Care and Maintenence

Sorry for the delay in replying guys. I was in Chino over the weekend flying the big Corsair against an equally big Zero at the Southern California Scale Squadron fly in, which was outstanding by-the-way.

Yes, that is the TRI-FLOW we use.

How to tell any early 215/250 from a late one? Call Goetz Volgelsang for the real truth data but I will tell you Phil's "early" 250 has smaller diameter exhaust tubes leading from the head to the collector ring (I understand these are the same as the 215 tubes). The newer 250s use a larger diameter exhaust tube. By-the-way, Goetz said the 250s with the larger exhaust tubes will make about 300 more RPM and sound a bit throatier/louder.

I do not know what the grease story is on the 150, one can only assume its the same as for the other radials Moki produces. Again, call Goetz for the 100% answer.
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Old 06-25-2012, 08:23 PM
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Default RE: MOKI RADIAL Care and Maintenence

Any word on the new ignition?
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Old 06-25-2012, 09:22 PM
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Default RE: MOKI RADIAL Care and Maintenence


Quote:
ORIGINAL: MANFRED

Any word on the new ignition?

The new igniton is here in my hands; I have a prototype version installed on a Moki 215.
it is running as fine as can be, but the company that makes the ignition is still working on some development for serial production.

I guess it wont´t take long until it is officially availableon the market.

BTW it is the same company that has developped the ignition for my V-4 engine, so we are in very good hands with that

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Old 06-26-2012, 04:34 AM
  #2074
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Default RE: MOKI RADIAL Care and Maintenence

Who's Zero is that? And what kit is it? Wow sor a second i thought it was my plane lol it looks exactly like mine lol
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Old 06-26-2012, 10:54 AM
  #2075
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Default RE: MOKI RADIAL Care and Maintenence

Brian's Zero is a 50 lb Meister Scale with a DA-100. Speed wise it was no match for the Moki-motivated Corsair. The Zero turned like a bat however, true to scale all around!
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