Chad Veich

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My pleasure John, no problem.

A bit more progress to report. The fuse now has it's first coat of primer, what I like to call the "reveal" coat. And this one has revealed that though we are coming along well there is still work to do before it can be deemed ready for surface detail. I shot a couple of pics on the kitchen table while the wife was out, shhh!

tailskid

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Just might have to join this party Chad.....

Chad Veich

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Jump on board Jerry! We are trying to get some of the 1/8th Air Force guys interested so we can have a local group of guys building Hellcats. We will see what happens.

PS - I got your email about the Zero and I'll keep you informed.

JohnMcGowan

My Feedback: (15)

Chad, looks wonderful! I really think that you are going to have hit a home run on this plane.
You mean that you would let Jerry hang out with you? Well there goes the neighborhood, LOL .... (just ribbing you Jerry) Jerry is a top notch kind of fellow in my book!
Now Chad, about you putting planes on the kitchen table without the "boss" knowing... I will not tell her for a small fee! ROFL !
Nite guys, Im to bed,
John

valr

Chad,

I should make it official and say I'm joining in and ready to go. We'll see how many of the other One Eighth Air Force guys we can get in on it too!

Val

tailskid

My Feedback: (34)

Val, where do you live? I'm in the Tolleson area....

aerowoof

Chad,
what are you using for a high fill primer these days? Last time I painted super poxy primer on polyester resin over 3/4 oz cloth .

EJWash1

My Feedback: (3)

Chad,

Subscribed.

The Hellcat looks great!

I want to give raised panel lines and rivets (raised & flush) a go, so I'd be interested in joining the group build. Count me in.

EJWash

valr

tailskid,

I live in the north / central area, near Central Ave and Bell Rd. Usually fly out of the SVF field.

Val

Chad Veich

My Feedback: (60)

You gotta keep some of the riff raff around John, keeps things interesting.

Appreciate your support Val and looking forward to building with you.

I am using Bondo brand spot putty mixed with acetone for the first filler coat and then finishing with Bondo brand rattle can primer. I have found the Bondo primer to be nearly as good as the Dupli Color at about half the cost. Plus I can get it right down at the local Ace Hardware. Finish coats on the Hellcat will be with butyrate dope.

Thanks EJ, and welcome aboard. The Hellcat includes both raised and flush panel lines and rivets so we will get to do a little of everything.


I should have more progress pics tomorrow. I was hoping to have the Hellcat on its' gear but ran into some issues and have to order some new parts for my Robart retracts. Oh well, still plenty to do. Thanks for all the support gentlemen!

EJWash1

My Feedback: (3)

Chad,

Just ordered a copy of "[link=http://www.hobbylinc.com/cgi-bin/s7.cgi?cat_s=SAW&str=hellcat%20f6f]F6F Hellcat Walk Around[/link], by Squadron/Signal Publications from Hobbylinc.

Keeping my eyes open for retracts. The Robart 615s for the mains? Which tailwheel?

EJWash

Chad Veich

My Feedback: (60)

EJ,

I'm going to give the Robart 615's a shot although I know a lot of guys have had issues with the side arms bending on a rough landing or when you get too much side load on them. I think many of these guys are flying airplane that are heavier than the rated 10 pounds and are flying off of grass which is probably not helping either. That's not an issue around here! The airplane will also be set up to take the Sierra Precision rotaters which are light years ahead of the Robarts but are also about 2 1/2 times the price. If you like the peace of mind and can afford them I would recommend the Sierra gear. If you decide to go with the Robarts I will be able to provide both the mains and the tailwheel (#121), as well as most other items, at a pretty good discount through Ray & Robin's Hobby Center which is sponsoring the group build. A list of items with part numbers can be found at the link below.

http://www.hellcat.cwvmodels.com/order.html#components

EJWash1

My Feedback: (3)

Chad,

Tower lists the Robart #615s at $129.99. If one wants to go scale in appearance (and functionality) they can go with the #650 3/8� RoboStruts AT $39.99 X2 ($79.98). That brings the Robart main gear set-up to $209.97. Funny thing is that Robart lists the limit of the #615s at 10lbs., but the #650 RoboStruts at 14lbs.. I guess that the 3/16� wire struts holds the limitation. If one went with the plastic strut covers, there’s another $12.99, so you’ve got $142.98 in the main gear right up against the 10lbs. limit.

Sierra lists their 60-size 100-degree rotating retracts (model 60 F6F Mains) at 14lbs. model weight, and man does this gear look more stout over the RoboStruts. The Sierras list for $270.00. So, if the builder wants scale gear (and functionality) the difference between these two is $60.03. Personally, I want the scale appearance, functionality, and the BEEF, so I’ll be opting for the Sierras for the mains.

I see from the link that your website is coming together. Things are getting interesting...

EJWash

Chad Veich

My Feedback: (60)

EJ,

I had not factored the cost of the struts into the equation. The 650 struts you mention are not long enough for the Hellcat so you have to go with the 7/16" diameter which are $53.50 each, $107 for the pair. I may have a source for the struts for substantially less than the cost of the Robarts. If all goes as planned I should be able to offer the Robart 615's and a pair of 7/16" diameter struts for around $180 or so. That's a substantial savings versus the Sierra gear. Having said that, I just picked up a set of the Sierra gear myself and they are VERY nice and will be going in my next Hellcat. I am definitely interested in testing the Robart gear for myself to see if they are up to the job. I will be more than happy to share my "real world" results with the group. This is one of many reasons I do not want to start the group build until the airplane has been tested to my satisfaction.

Craig-RCU

Neat Hellcat project, Chad. For the extreme budget conscious builder, Hanger 9 Hellcat or Corsair gear should work. I have these gear on my H9 Corsair. I also added some 3/8" struts that I bought at VQ Models. They seem to be very close copies of Robostruts and are/were about half the price of Robostruts. They don't appear to be available right now. I don't know if they will be available again.

http://www.horizonhobby.com/Products...ProdID=HAN4084
http://www.vqwarbirds.com/access.html

From the pictures of your unsheeted Hellcat wing on the first page of this thread, it looks like gear mount rails could be moved to the top of the wing fairly easily to accommodate the H9 gear. The H9 gear (1-3/8" wide) is about 3/8" narrower than the Robart 615s (1-3/4" wide), so wider gear rails would be needed along with moving them to the top of the wing. The H9 gear with a $30 HS-75 retract servo and bell-cranks would be about $60 dollars all together, plus $7 for H9 Hellcat/Corsair wheels.

EJWash1

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That is a killer price! Have you laid the two (Robart/Sierra) side-by-side?

EJWash

tailskid

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Chad, do you need any assistance? If so, give me a call...

Jerry

fw190d9

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Awesome work as usual Chad! The cat is a little small for me, but Im subscribing anyway just to watch. Keep up the great work.
Evan Q.

Chad Veich

My Feedback: (60)

Thanks for the info Craig. That may be an option for someone willing to make the necessary changes. How have your gear held up in the H9 Corsair? I flew a H9 P-40 some years back and the gear seemed to work alright though they were definitely a bit "wobbly". I would probably only recommend the use of the H9 gear for folks who plan to keep their Hellcats very light.


Here they are side-by-side. Both are advertised as 100 degree retracts but the Robarts actually appear to be more like 95 degrees. Obviously the Sierra strut is a bit too short. I need to speak with Darrell and see if he has, or can make, the right length strut. I would recommend holding off on purchasing the Sierra gear until I can figure out just exactly which ones are the best option.



I'm doing OK for now Jerry, thanks for the offer. I'll let you know when test fly day is going to be if you are interested.

Thanks a bunch Evan! The 'cat is a bit small for me too! This whole project was initiated at the request of a flying buddy and this is the size he wanted. I would have preferred to go 1/7 scale which would have been ~73" span. I'm still considering blowing it up and building another at that scale. Any bigger than 1/7 scale and Lein, Bates, Smith, and Ziroli pretty much have you covered.


A few updated pics. Not much looks different although a substantial amount of progress has been made. I now have my belly pan completed and fitted. My belly pan is removeable because I plan to put my air system in there. Plus, this allows for the wing bolts to be hidden. It does create a lot more work for the builder though and is not entirely necessary. This will be one of those options that each builder will have to decide on. I am also working on the enginer/muffler installation and you can see how the 61FX fits in the cowl. My Dad will be fabricating a custom muffler to get the exhaust out of the scale locations on the bottom of the cowl. This should be a relatively simple thing to build and I will cover its' construction in the build thread for those that would like to fabricate one of their own.

EJWash1

My Feedback: (3)

Not planning to buy any components until things gel a little more.

I see you're contemplating a 75" version. Wouldn't this mean back to the drawing board on the vacuum formed parts and canopy? How much more work would this be, and how much more do you think it would weigh, and will this knock it out of the .60 range?

Question, I like the idea of the engine being totally concealed and mounted upright. If one were to toy with the idea of mounting an inverted 4-stroke, what is the measurement from the center of the thrust line to the bottom of the firewall?

Thanks Chad!

Chad Veich

My Feedback: (60)

Yes, new tooling would have to be made for all the formed parts. However, ESM make a Hellcat this scale so their canopy and cowl would work if they are readily available replacement parts. I could make them myself if necessary, although at this size I would seek to have the cowl made in fiberglass. (I know a guy ) It would definitely be out of the .60 size range and would probably end up somewhere around 14-18 pounds depending on the level of detail and finish. Just right for a 1.08-1.60 size two stroke, 1.50-2.20 four stroke, or 26-38cc gasser.


Roughly 4 and 3/4 inches at the approximate location of the engine head as seen below.

Craig-RCU

My gear have been holding up well on my 8.5 lb Corsair. I have an early version Corsair and the wire gear had two loops in them which made them pretty wobbly. Maybe the P-40 that you flew had two loop wire gear? Replacing that two loop wire gear with struts greatly reduced issues with my gear. You can see a picture of the original two loop wire gear on the Horizon website. http://www.horizonhobby.com/Products...ProdID=HAN2575
Additionally my gear had a bit of slop in the hole in the mechanism for the wire. That was easily fixed by drilling out the hole to accept a bushing made out of brass tubing. I maidened a friend's H9 Corsair that was an updated version with the one loop wire gear, and I found the gear to be much improved. So, maybe the brass bushing wouldn't be needed on the updated gear. Another thing I did to improve my gear was to carve out the heel of the ball-cup. The angle between the two ball-posts is too extreme for the cups when the gear is in the retracted position. Carving out the heel alleviated binding that occurred. Bending the cup's threaded rod a bit can help with that too. I don't know if the updated gear require this mod either. My estimate is that the updated gear can handle a plane of up to 10 lbs, maybe a bit more if struts are used.

What will your dad be fabricating your muffler out of? I'll be interested to see his techniques.

Craig-RCU

FWIW, the single HS-75 retract servo that I use on my H9 Corsair offers 92 oz of torque for the pair of gear, or 46 oz for each gear at a cost of $30. Standard servos can be had for under $8 a piece and offer 42-47oz torque http://www3.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin...?&I=LXTJJ7&P=7 So, that would be a cost savings of $14 over the single retract servo with a weight penalty of about 1.5 oz. Additionally, with two standard servos, no bell-cranks would be needed (reducing the overall mechanical resistance in the system, thus needing less torque to operate) and the servos can be slowed for scale retract speeds. I have been using two standard servos for the retracts on my World Models Zero 60 with no problems.

EJWash1

My Feedback: (3)

And a pretty good increase economically.

The cowling would conceal an inverted .91 4-stroke...

EJWash

Chad Veich

My Feedback: (60)

Thanks for the gear information Craig. I'm pretty sure I'll end up under 10 pounds so the H9 gear may be an option for those willing to make the necessary changes. With less detail and an iron on finish the airplane could probably be built to 8 1/2 or 9 pounds. I did a preliminary check of the CG today and I'm pretty certain the airplane will balance without adding any dead weight. Hope I'm not sticking my foot in my mouth here!

EJ, the step up to 1/7 scale would definitely result in an increase in cost. If I were to build the larger version I would strive to give it the potential to be a contest level airplane as the increased size would allow for a bit more weight / wing loading. I'm sure it would have a somewhat different target audience than the smaller version but I think there is a definite gap in currently available kits/plans for the 70-75 inch fighter types. The moderate increase in size also results in a substantially better flying airplane in my opinion.