elmshoot

My Feedback: (6)

[h=1]Giora Epstein[/h]Sparky

Hydro Junkie

And what's ugly about the Prowler? I can say it was a very nice looking and actually very fast aircraft. In it's day, it was the fastest airplane in the Navy. The only way the F- series planes were faster is when they went into "flamethrower Mode"
You want an ugly plane, see below as IT WAS TOTALLY FUGLY!!!!!!!!!


I now return you to your regularly scheduled quiz

elmshoot

My Feedback: (6)

I'm not sure how much flight time you have in the Prowler and Intruder but with 1000+ in each one I can say the Prowler is faster than the Intruder but in basic engine the F planes will go faster.
But then we can get into the discussion of at what altitude or configuration."With out ordnance its just an unscheduled airline"
I have seen over 500kias on the deck with the Intruder and about 535 with the Prowler and we had to slow down because we were overspeeding the RAT on the Jammer Pods!
Beauty is in the eye of the beholder!
Sparky

Hydro Junkie

I was actually a comnavradar tech on the ICAP in the early 1980s. More than once, while on deployment, I heard "Cat" pilots complain about how they had to go to stage one to keep up when the Prowler pilot decided to "firewall" the throttles on the return leg of a mission. While I never heard that from a Corsair pilot, I did hear pilots from my squadron complain about having to throttle back just so the Corsairs could keep up. Just repeating what I was told and overheard

Ernie P.

My Feedback: (3)

Add in a few morning clues, and... Thanks; Ernie P.


What warbird pilot do I describe?

Clues:
1. He was an ace in two different conflicts.
2. And flew in three.
3. Despite that, his total score wasn’t all that high.
4. He was noted as being an excellent commander.
5. In his early years, he engaged in farming and the timber industry.
6. He graduated from university, became a teacher, and taught for nearly five years.
7. He entered his country’s military, to learn to fly, before the war.
8. But, oddly enough, he failed advanced flight training.

elmshoot

My Feedback: (6)

Vermont Garrison,
Garrison was born on a farm near the tiny hamlet of Mt. Victory, in Pulaski County, Kentucky, a part of Appalachia. He was a younger half-brother to his father's first child and the oldest of five sons and three daughters (one of which died in infancy) born to Mayhue H. Garrison and his second wife, Shelta Harriet Sears Garrison.[SUP][5][/SUP] While he grew up farming and timbering to help his family subsist,[SUP][6][/SUP] he also completed a basic education despite the Great Depression. He graduated from Pulaski County Public Schools in 1933, then went on to two years at Eastern Kentucky State Teachers College, and earned a teaching certificate after a term at Sue Bennett Junior College in nearby London. He taught elementary school in one-room schools between 1936 and 1941.[SUP][6][/SUP][SUP][7][/SUP]

Ernie P.

My Feedback: (3)

Vermont Garrison it is, elmshoot; and you are up. Good job! I encourage everyone to read the below information; as Garrison lead a truly remarkable life. And, he had some truly remarkable friends, who held him in high regard. Thanks; Ernie P.

What warbird pilot do I describe?

Clues:
1. He was an ace in two different conflicts.
2. And flew in three.
3. Despite that, his total score wasn’t all that high.
4. He was noted as being an excellent commander.
5. In his early years, he engaged in farming and the timber industry.
6. He graduated from university, became a teacher, and taught for nearly five years.
7. He entered his country’s military, to learn to fly, before the war.
8. But, oddly enough, he failed advanced flight training.
9. Whereupon, he quickly joined the air force of a friendly nation already engaged in war.
10. He completed flight training with his new military service.
11. And, oddly enough, in his home country.
12. He was then transferred to flying duties in the country of his new service.
13. Where, he received more training.
14. He wound up as a gunnery instructor.
15. As an instructor, he trained pilots flying aircraft produced by his own country.
16. After approximately 1-1/2 years, he rejoined his own country’s air service.
17. He spent a little over six months flying combat missions, during which he became an ace with six victories.
18. Then his unit switched to a different fighter.
19. The same fighter, though a later model, for which he had an instructor with the foreign air service.
20. Less than a week later, flying a combat mission, his engine developed problems and all but one of his guns jammed.
21. He still managed to shoot down one enemy fighter and damaged another.
22. While returning to his base, escorting a flight member with a damaged engine at low altitude, he was shot down by ground fire.

Answer: Vermont Garrison
Vermont Garrison (October 29, 1915 — February 14, 1994) was a career officer in the United States Air Force, and an ace with 17.33 credited victories in aerial combat.[SUP][1][/SUP] He was one of only seven Americans to achieve ace status during World War II, then again against jet fighter opposition during the Korean War.[SUP][n 1][/SUP] In 1966, Garrison participated in his third war, as vice commander of the 8th Tactical Fighter Wing, and flew a full tour of bombing and fighter missions over North Vietnam.[SUP][1][/SUP]
During all three of his combat tours, Garrison was consistently older than his peers, becoming an ace in World War II at the age of 28, in Korea at the age of 37, and flying Rolling Thunder missions at the age of 51. For this and his renown as a gunnery expert, Garrison was known in the service as "The Gray Eagle".[SUP][2][/SUP][SUP][n 2][/SUP]
U.S. Air Force historian and author Walter J. Boyne described Garrison as a "first-rate combat unit leader."[SUP][3][/SUP] Col. Robin Olds, commanding the 8th TFW in Thailand, said of his vice commander: "Of the many hundreds I've served with, Garry was one of the greatest—as pilot, as gentleman, as officer, and as friend.
Garrison was born on a farm near the tiny hamlet of Mt. Victory, in Pulaski County, Kentucky, a part of Appalachia. He was a younger half-brother to his father's first child and the oldest of five sons and three daughters (one of which died in infancy) born to Mayhue H. Garrison and his second wife, Shelta Harriet Sears Garrison.[SUP][5][/SUP] While he grew up farming and timbering to help his family subsist,[SUP][6][/SUP] he also completed a basic education despite the Great Depression. He graduated from Pulaski County Public Schools in 1933, then went on to two years at Eastern Kentucky State Teachers College, and earned a teaching certificate after a term at Sue Bennett Junior College in nearby London. He taught elementary school in one-room schools between 1936 and 1941.[SUP][6][/SUP][SUP][7][/SUP]
Following his return from World War II, Garrison was married to Reatha Mae Cuthbert (1928-1959) of London, Kentucky, until her death in July 1959. Garrison remarried in August 1961 at Mountain Home, Idaho, to Marie E. Lee (1920-1997). The couple resided in Idaho after his 1973 retirement and raised three daughters and a son. Garrison died of a heart attack on February 14, 1994, in Mountain Home.[SUP][8][/SUP] He is buried at Arlington National Cemetery with his wives.[SUP][9][/SUP]
On March 17, 1941,[SUP][1][/SUP] Garrison enlisted in the United States Army and became an aviation cadet in Class 41-C at Muskogee, Oklahoma, but washed out of advanced flight training at Brooks Field, Texas, in October. Garrison promptly enlisted in the Royal Air Force at Dallas, Texas and completed flight training at El Centro, California.[SUP][10][/SUP] After obtaining his RAF wings, Pilot Officer Garrison was shipped to England, where after further training he was promoted to Flying Officer and made a gunnery instructor, posted to RAF Hawarden to train pilots flying North American Mustangs.[SUP][7][/SUP]
On July 13, 1943,[SUP][1][/SUP] Garrison transferred from the RAF to the United States Army Air Forces, receiving a commission as a first lieutenant. On September 26, after transition training in the P-47 Thunderbolt at RAF Atcham, he was assigned to the 4th Fighter Group, based at RAF Debden, as a member of the 336th Fighter Squadron.[SUP][n 3][/SUP] Garrison's first combat mission came on October 4, 1943.[SUP][11][/SUP] The 4th Fighter Group was assigned to support a task force of 3rd Bomb Division B-17s on its withdrawal after bombing Frankfurt am Main, Germany. It proceeded to the rendezvous-point at Eupen, Belgium, but could find no bombers, remained in the vicinity for 16 minutes, and then withdrew.[SUP][12][/SUP]
Garrison recorded his first combat victory returning from a bomber withdrawal support mission to Bremen on December 16, 1943. In exceptionally bad winter weather conditions, he shared credit for shooting down a Junkers Ju 88 fighter over the German-Dutch border with Don Gentile and Louis Norley.[SUP][13][/SUP][SUP][n 4][/SUP] A month later, on January 14, 1944, he downed two Focke Wulf Fw 190s, although his claim report for the second kill credited half to Norley. A review of his gun camera film, however, resulted in the award to Garrison of both victories. By February 10 he had scored his fifth kill and made ace, followed by a sixth victory on February 25, during an escort mission supporting the Big Week bomber offensive.[SUP][14][/SUP]
The next day his squadron began conversion to the P-51B Mustang fighter. On March 3, 1944, the 4th Fighter Group flew a bomber support mission to Berlin for the first time, resulting in several large aerial engagements. Garrison was part of a flight of nine P-51s of the 4th engaging more than 60 Luftwaffe fighters attacking bombers at 24,000 feet near Wittenberg. Three of the flight, including Garrison, were shot down. Despite losing his aircraft's supercharger and having five of its six guns jam, Garrison shot down an Fw 190 and received a "probable" for downing a Messerschmitt Bf 110. Flying back to England at low level with two wingmen, one of whom had a damaged engine and could not maintain altitude, Garrison was shot down by antiaircraft fire near Boulogne-sur-Mer and bailed out. Captured almost immediately, he was subjected to two weeks of interrogations, then shipped to Stalag Luft I, the German Prisoner-of-war camp near Barth, Germany.[SUP][15[/SUP]
Liberated on May 1, 1945, by Soviet troops, Garrison elected to rejoin his squadron rather than return to the United States. He remained with the 336th FS until it was inactivated in September 1945, then transferred to the 406th Fighter Group on occupation duty in Germany. In 1946 he transferred to the 56th Fighter Group at Selfridge Field, Michigan, where he again flew P-47s. Garrison rejoined the 4th Fighter Group (now a component of the 4th Fighter Wing) at Andrews Air Force Base, Maryland, in April 1947, was promoted to captain, and became part of the U. S. Air Force when it became an independent service on September 18.[SUP][16][/SUP]
Garrison organized and led a jet aerial demonstration team for the 4th FW, flying P-80 Shooting Stars,[SUP][17][/SUP][SUP][18][/SUP][SUP][n 5][/SUP] and participated in the first official delivery of air mail by jet to celebrate the 30th anniversary of air mail on May 15, 1948. Using the same route as in 1918, Garrison delivered a packet from Washington, D.C. to New York City in a 28-minute flight.[SUP][19][/SUP][SUP][n 6][/SUP] In May, 1949, he led the team representing the 4th Fighter Wing at the first Air Force Worldwide Gunnery Competition at Las Vegas Air Force Base, Nevada, winning the jet portion of the competition.
Garrison's noted gunnery skills and prior instructor experience resulted in his transfer in May 1950 to Las Vegas, now Nellis Air Force Base, where the USAF converted its flying training establishment into the USAF Aircraft Gunnery School. After completing the gunnery course, he remained at Nellis as an instructor and R&D officer of the 3596th Advanced Applied Tactics (later "Combat Crew Training") Squadron, where one of the instructors was Captain Manuel J. Fernandez. Garrison formed another unit jet air demonstration team, the "Mach Riders", with Fernandez and future ace Capt. William H. Wescott on wing.[SUP][17][/SUP][SUP][20][/SUP][SUP][n 7][/SUP]
At the outbreak of the Korean War, while many experienced fighter pilots deployed to combat, Garrison continued in his combat crew training role at Nellis. He was promoted to major in 1951 and took command of the 3596th CCTS. The commander of the 4th Fighter-Interceptor Wing (successor to the 4th FG) requested Garrison by name to join the wing, and in November 1952 Garrison went to Kimpo Air Base, Korea, as operations officer of the 335th Fighter-Interceptor Squadron.[SUP][[/SUP]

Ernie P.

My Feedback: (3)

More on Vermont Garrison. Thanks; Ernie P.

In January 1953, Garrison tookcommand of the 335th FIS. The "GunVal Project", seven F-86s and fiveveteran pilots, was attached to the squadron to test armament modifications incombat. NorthAmerican Aviation removedthe six M3.50-caliber machine gunsfrom four late-production F-86Es and six block-one F-86Fs, expanded the size ofthe gun bays, strengthened the surrounding frame assemblies, and mounted fournewly developed T-160 20mm cannon in their place. Having a similar rate offire, the cannons were expected to significantly increase the Sabre's lethalityover that of the machine guns, whose armor-piercing incendiary ammunition was usually ineffective against jetaircraft above 35,000 feet of altitude.[SUP][21][/SUP] However, the heavier weight and bulk ofthe cannons and ammunition, while providing greater effective range, flattertrajectory, and higher velocity, limited the F-86 to only 400 total rounds,which reduced its total firing time by nearly 75%, from 16 to 4.6 seconds.[SUP][22][/SUP]
Garrison worked closely with theproject after one of the test aircraft was lost in combat on January 25 becauseits engine experienced compressor stall from ingesting the cannons' propellentgases. He regularly flew GunVal Sabres on missions before the testing ended onMay 1, and despite firing limitations imposed by the stall risk, scored a MiGvictory in a cannon-equipped F-86F, near Sui-ho Reservoir on March 26.[SUP][23][/SUP][SUP][n 8][/SUP]
His first victory came onFebruary 21, 1953, during his 18th mission as 335th FIS commander. Engaging apair of MiGs in a "dogfight", Garrison was nearly shot down ashe became too focused on his quarry and failed to detect a MiG closing in frombehind, then became locked into a Lufbery circle. When the MiGs broke the circle and tried toescape, both he and his wingmen destroyed one.[SUP][17][/SUP] With just two MiG credits in his firstsix months of his tour, Garrison's tally increased dramatically in the finalthree months of combat before the Korean armistice. In the spring of 1953, thesize of the Fifth AirForce's F-86 forcedoubled, increasing competitiveness among its pilots for victories over largelyinexperienced communist pilots. Garrison achieved two kills in May.
On June 5, 1953, he led a fightersweep to the mouth of the Yalu River in the northwest corner of "MiG Alley"at 45,000 feet. Observing approximately 40 MiG's in the process of taking offfrom an airfield in Manchuria, he led his flight of four aircraft in an attackon the vulnerable fighters, diving at Mach 1 through a protective top cover of MiGs 20,000feet over the base. Almost immediately he shot down a MiG at low altitude,followed by a second soon after, as every member of the flight scored a kill, arare if not unique occurrence.[SUP][24][/SUP][SUP][25][/SUP][SUP][n 9][/SUP] In addition to recognition as the USAF's32d jet ace, Garrison was awarded the Distinguished Service Cross for the mission. He was promoted to lieutenantcolonel on June 25, 1953,and scored his final MiG victory on July 19, eight days before the armistice.[SUP][26][/SUP]
Garrison finished his tour onKorea on October 28, 1953. His next assignment was in the newly activated 4750thTraining Wing (AirDefense) at Yuma (later Vincent) Air Force Base, Arizona, an Air Defense Command organization developing tactics and trainingpilots to fly the F-86D rocket-firinginterceptor. There heworked in conjunction with wing commander Col. Glenn Eagleston and 4750th Training Squadron commander Lt. Col. James Jabara, both aces who also served in the 4th FIW inKorea.[SUP][27][/SUP][SUP][28][/SUP]
Garrison attended the MarineCorps Amphibious Warfare Senior Officers Course (now the Marine Corps Command and Staff College)at MarineCorps Base Quantico fromSeptember 1957 to June 1958, then served a tour at Headquarters USAF in the Pentagon. Later assigned to TyndallAir Force Base, Florida, he was promoted to colonel in March 1961. Assigned to the 25th Air Division at McChordAir Force Base, Washington, Garrison served on the command staff andas senior advisor to the Washington Air National Guard through the early 1960s.[SUP][[/SUP]
In August 1965, Garrison returnedto combat for the third time in his career, becoming deputy commander foroperations (DCO) of the 405th FighterWing at Clark Air Base in the Philippines. The 405th was a composite wing of F-100 Super Sabre and F-102Delta Dagger fighters,and B-57 Canberra bombers serving temporary duty (TDY)rotations in South Vietnam. Shortly after, Garrison moved up to vicecommander, and on January 5, 1966, advanced to his first wing command. Heremained in command of the 405th until August 4, 1966, when he was succeeded byCol. Charles Yeager.[SUP][27][/SUP]
From Clark AB, Garrison wasassigned as vice commander of the 8th Tactical Fighter Wing at Ubon Royal Thai Air Force Base, Thailand, in August 1966.[SUP][1][/SUP] The following month Col. Robin Olds wasmade commander of the 8th TFW to invigorate its combat spirit,[SUP][29][/SUP] and together with deputy commander ofoperations Col. Daniel"Chappie" James and Garrison, provided one of the strongest and most experienced commandtriumvirates in Southeast Asia. Garrison flew the F-4C Phantom II on 97 missions over North Vietnam and Laos,although Olds noted that Garrison never formally "checked out"(qualified) in the type, as a result of which he always flew with an instructorpilot in the rear seat.[SUP][30][/SUP] In describing Garrison's combatexperience, Olds observed that Garrison flew his "52nd combat mission onhis 52nd birthday" while at Ubon.[SUP][31][/SUP][SUP][n 10][/SUP] Olds also noted that by 1967 Garrisonwas:
...so nearsighted he carriedabout four different pairs of glasses with him...but by God, if you wanted atarget bombed, he would hit it. He would hit it when everybody else missed....He got furious with me because I wouldn't let him get up there among theMiGs. I told him, 'Pappy, every fighter pilot in the Air Force knows and lovesyou, and I am not going to be the guy that sends you up there to get your buttscragged.' He just could not see anymore.[SUP][30][/SUP]
He finished his tour on June 5,1967, turning over his vice commander's slot to James.[SUP][32][/SUP]
Between the end of his combattour and his retirement on March 1, 1973, Garrison served in a number ofcommand slots: commanding officer of the F-101 Voodoo-equipped 408thFighter Group at Kingsley Field, Oregon, from July 1967 to August 1968; vice commander of the 26th Air Division at Adair Air Force Station, Oregon, to June 1969; commander of the 4780thAir Defense Wing at PerrinAir Force Base, Texas, to July 1971; and commanding officer of the 4661st Air Base Group at HamiltonAir Force Base, California, to his retirement.[SUP][4][/SUP]
None of Garrison's assignedaircraft was named or featured nose art. He scored all but the last of his 7.33World War II victories in P-47 Thunderbolts 41-6573, marked VF: S, and42-74663, marked VF: H. His final kill was also the plane in which hewas shot down, P-51B 43-6871, with the VF:H markings. His Korean War MiG-15kills were made in F-86F 51-12959, an unrecorded GunVal Project F-86F-2, andF-86F's 51-12944 and 51-12953.[SUP][33][/SUP][SUP][34][/SUP]
The President of the UnitedStates of America, under the provisions of the Act of Congress approved July 9,1918, takes pleasure in presenting the Distinguished Service Cross toLieutenant Colonel Vermont Garrison, United States Air Force, for extraordinaryheroism in connection with military operations against an armed enemy of theUnited Nations while serving as a Pilot with the 335th Fighter-InterceptorSquadron, 4th Fighter-Interceptor Wing, FIFTH Air Force, in action againstenemy forces in the Republic of Korea on June 5, 1953. On that date, whileleading a flight of four F-86 aircraft near the Yalu River, Colonel Garrisonsighted a formation of ten MIG-15s far below. Diving down, Colonel Garrisonpressed dangerously close behind the lead MIG in order that the remainder ofhis formation could assume attacking positions. With one long burst of hisguns, Colonel Garrison caused the MIG to explode and disintegrate. Then, atgreat risk to his life, Colonel Garrison flew directly through the debris fromthe explosion, in order to attack another enemy MIG and fully exploit thetactical advantage already gained. Courageously disregarding a hail of enemyfire from behind him, and in the face of heavy odds, Colonel Garrison, afterviolent maneuvering, closed on the second MIG, scoring hits which caused it toexplode and crash. As a result of Colonel Garrison's intrepidity and keenflying skill, his flight was able to engage other MIGs in the forefront of theenemy formation, successfully destroying three of them. The enemy, having lostone-half of his force in less than two minutes, and thoroughly demoralized bythe heroic and telling attack of Colonel Garrison and his formation, turned andwithdrew from the scene of action in defeat. Through Colonel Garrison'sselfless courage and inspiring leadership, the tide of battle was turned andhis flight was credited with the destruction of five MIGs, two of which weredestroyed by Colonel Garrison.

elmshoot

My Feedback: (6)

OK here is a Photo quiz. If I figure it out.

proptop

My Feedback: (8)

That's the most effective Winter camoflage that I've ever (not) seen!

Ernie P.

My Feedback: (3)

I wasn't sure if I was looking at a stealth plane on a bad radar screen, or maybe a really good jammer at work. Or maybe this is what a 10 G negative loop looks like. Thanks; Ernie P.

elmshoot

My Feedback: (6)

Some one send me their email address and I send you the picture to post I cant figure it out.
Sparky

Ernie P.

My Feedback: (3)

Sparky; I'd be happy to help, except I can't get it to work either. Thanks; Ernie P.

elmshoot

My Feedback: (6)

Not the guys in front.

pd1

L-29 Delfin ?

Paul

elmshoot

My Feedback: (6)

Yep, I expected it to last a little longer. Based in Georgetown, TX along with a SNJ in the same hangar.
Here is one as a bonus and you have to post your results here.

https://www.zoo.com/quiz/99-people-c...QfeYrIwo2sMj9A

I was 41-49

The obscure European planes were my downfall.
In an effort of true disclosure I had several that were a 50-50 guess and you cant use the hints and yes there are a couple planes that didn't see combat but are refered to as WW ll fighters.
Sparky

proptop

My Feedback: (8)

I was thinking of maybe the Magister...but something about it (the pic) nagged at me...not quite...

Got 49 out of 49 on the linked quiz...

pd1

48 out of 49 and I dispute two of the pictures. First is not a Mitsubishi airplane. It is a Boeing P26. Second is not a P-43 Lancer it is a North American airplane of the NA 50 class.

MJD

My Feedback: (1)

LOL. I love quizzes where you have to check the answers afterwards to find out if you are crazy or not. I got those two wrong.

Here are images of each for comparison:

proptop

My Feedback: (8)

I just did those 2 by process of elimination...picked the one closest to the pic...and mentally crossed off the ones it wasn't...
The P-26 / Claude was obviously a boo boo, (typo?) but...whatareyagonnado???

There are a lot of people who, when they see a Hinomaru on an airplane, it automatically becomes a "Zero"...confusion abounds...
A few years ago I bought a Kyosho Ki-61 ARF and the guy in the LHS called it a Zero...

To a casual observer the P-26 does sorta look like the Claude...

Ernie P.

My Feedback: (3)

Elmshoot; so PD1 is up, correct? Thanks; Ernie P.

elmshoot

My Feedback: (6)

Paul you are up.
Sparky

pd1

I'll try to get something together later today.

Paul

pd1

Here goes.
1. The plane was so ugly it had to be named twice.

MJD

My Feedback: (1)

Sounds like something from ATL - they did some fugly birds.

But I'll start with the F-22.