RC Warbirds and Warplanes Discuss rc warbirds and warplanes in this forum.

Flite Metal or Aero Foil?

Reply

Old 06-01-2010, 07:39 PM
  #26  
ram3500-RCU
My Feedback: (221)
 
ram3500-RCU's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: n. canton, OH
Posts: 9,626
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default RE: Flite Metal or Aero Foil?


ORIGINAL: dvs1

I did actually by blades in the 100 pack but I use regular razor blades, prefer them for some reason.

I havent purchased a burnishing tool yet, i need to. Ive just been using other means for the time being.
It works great, and comes in different sizes. You'll like it.
ram3500-RCU is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 06-01-2010, 07:41 PM
  #27  
Chris Nicastro
 
Chris Nicastro's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Coeur d'Alene, ID
Posts: 2,539
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default RE: Flite Metal or Aero Foil?

Has anyone tried Simple Leaf from Mona Lisa art products? I found a package at Michaels and it includes 18 5.5inX5.5in sheets. You have to apply an adhesive and then stick the sheet to it then peel off the backing sheet. You can use their spray adhesive or I'm sure a Super 77 spray will work.

I'll post a pic of it, the package was about $10. I want to test it out and see if its worth it or not and if it takes some wear and tear.
Chris Nicastro is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 06-01-2010, 07:47 PM
  #28  
ram3500-RCU
My Feedback: (221)
 
ram3500-RCU's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: n. canton, OH
Posts: 9,626
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default RE: Flite Metal or Aero Foil?


ORIGINAL: VENOMOUS

Has anyone tried Simple Leaf from Mona Lisa art products? I found a package at Michaels and it includes 18 5.5inX5.5in sheets. You have to apply an adhesive and then stick the sheet to it then peel off the backing sheet. You can use their spray adhesive or I'm sure a Super 77 spray will work.

I'll post a pic of it, the package was about $10. I want to test it out and see if its worth it or not and if it takes some wear and tear.
This type material translates even the slightest blemish. IMO, it would be almost impossible to get a smooth enough layer of contact adhesive to get the surface smooth. It will almost certainly look all bumpy from the glue.
ram3500-RCU is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 03-02-2018, 11:01 AM
  #29  
downwind leg
 
Join Date: Dec 2015
Location: San Juan Island,Washington
Posts: 32
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default

I already have a roll of flite metal and in practice pieces noticing how long it takes to sand out the orange peel. Just wondering if that same orange peel effect happens with the Aero foil.
downwind leg is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 03-02-2018, 11:30 AM
  #30  
ram3500-RCU
My Feedback: (221)
 
ram3500-RCU's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: n. canton, OH
Posts: 9,626
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default

Originally Posted by downwind leg View Post
I already have a roll of flite metal and in practice pieces noticing how long it takes to sand out the orange peel. Just wondering if that same orange peel effect happens with the Aero foil.
The "orange peel" is due to the application of the adhesive on the back. All foil has it to some degree.
ram3500-RCU is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 03-02-2018, 12:04 PM
  #31  
downwind leg
 
Join Date: Dec 2015
Location: San Juan Island,Washington
Posts: 32
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default

Thanks for that. I knew it was from the spray on adhesive but wondered if the Aero foil had a different application that would not cause that. It takes a long time to sand out. I'm going for the Terry Nitch F-100 finish on my Yellow P-38 so it's kind of a shame to sand it to remove the orange peel and then turn around and have to go finer and finer on the sandpaper to get within polishing range. Thanks,Brad

Last edited by downwind leg; 03-02-2018 at 05:42 PM.
downwind leg is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 03-02-2018, 05:38 PM
  #32  
downwind leg
 
Join Date: Dec 2015
Location: San Juan Island,Washington
Posts: 32
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default

Hey Ram, can you discribe your process ie. sanding,buffing,grits,etc. for that beautiful P-47? I would appreciate the input.
Thanks,Brad
downwind leg is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 03-05-2018, 05:37 PM
  #33  
big fred
 
Join Date: Nov 2013
Posts: 73
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default

Never had the orange peel on any that I have done. I do sometimes get a few wrinkles if you do not peel off the liner just right. I have gone over bare balsa, glassed balsa, and glass fuse. I have found that I do not like the paper burnishing tool though, but I am sure it works for many. I have used a pop sickle stick for about 20 years now, even have the first one. It is very smooth by now, that is a must to not leave scratches in the foil. You talk about the foil tearing, 3M #425 aluminum foil tape is almost .005 thick. The thicker it is, the more you can stretch it without rips. I have also used some .012 thick for covering fillets and for hatches, this gives it a raised effect. I am including a link to some that I have had good luck with. It is also the thinnest, lightest, that I have found. A 60 yd roll that is 6" wide will cover a Yellow P-47 with all the scale panels.

https://www.findtape.com/JVCC-AF20-A...0Foil%2520Tape

Good luck.
Attached Thumbnails Click image for larger version

Name:	P47_3.jpg
Views:	40
Size:	734.9 KB
ID:	2257798   Click image for larger version

Name:	t-33.jpg
Views:	39
Size:	177.0 KB
ID:	2257799   Click image for larger version

Name:	IMG_0076.JPG
Views:	50
Size:	1.75 MB
ID:	2257800  
big fred is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 03-05-2018, 05:42 PM
  #34  
big fred
 
Join Date: Nov 2013
Posts: 73
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default

PS downwind, I thought the F-100 you are asking about was done in Presto covering. But do not quote me on that.
big fred is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 03-05-2018, 06:25 PM
  #35  
downwind leg
 
Join Date: Dec 2015
Location: San Juan Island,Washington
Posts: 32
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default

Hey big fred, thank you so much for the info. The only reason I'm going through all of these sanding processes,400grit, 600grit,wet sanded and lately using Brasso to get the finish I want is because I'm trying to get rid of this orange peel. From all reports for aerofoil and flite metal, the adhesive sprayed onto the back of the aluminum is what causes the orange peel when applied to the plane. For some reason I can't blow your pictures up on my computer but the small pictures of the Shootingstar and Thunderbolt look awesome. That is just about exactly the finish I am looking for as far as I can tell. This foil you speak of sounds like the ticket. I am less concerned with price than how much screwing around I have to do. I would like to know your techniques,ie. sanding,buffing, rubbing in 90 degree directions to acchieve the different looks on different panels. I've been experimenting with the flite metal on lexan for practice for days now and getting close to the finish I want but when I translate this 5" square to an entire Yellow P-38 its pretty daunting. I'll take any info I can get whether it's here or a PM.
Thanks Again, Brad

Last edited by downwind leg; 03-05-2018 at 08:00 PM.
downwind leg is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 03-05-2018, 08:19 PM
  #36  
big fred
 
Join Date: Nov 2013
Posts: 73
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default

Hey Brad, a couple more pics. Hope these will give you a better look. I just burnish the tape down, again with a pop sickle stick, that has been what has worked best over the years. If it is a flat panel, start at one end and go from there. A panel that has a convex or concave curve, I will start at the middle and work my way out to both ends. I try to use the straight edge of the tape to over lap the mating piece of tape, 1/64th overlap or so. Burnishing it down over an adjoining panel, you will be able to see it through the tape you just put down. This gives you the cut line. I use a clear plastic flexible ruler taped in place,score the tape with exacto blade lightly, I may go over the score 3 times if needed, peel off extra tape. By the way, I resharpen my blades every now and then on a diamond grit stone. Saves on blade usage. After tape is done on plane I will then do my rivets, I use a tool made out of brass tubing with a wooden handle. Lay down each one, one at a time. Again I use the plastic ruler, since it is clear, you can line up the next row of rivets with the last by looking through the ruler. I like to do the rivets before scuffing of the tape as I think they show up better.
By the way, a P-47D-23 has 63,728 rivets. To scuff the tape I use a maroon scotch brite pad. Tape off each panel one at a time, and scuff in the direction that you need. You must use perfectly straight strokes with the pad, otherwise you will see the scuff marks. Go to the next panel, tape off and scuff. Even if you scuff adjoining panels in the same direction, doing them one at a time will give the look of 2 different panels. Also make sure that you get right to the edge of the tape, otherwise you get a shiny edge line. You should be able to see in the pics the different directions that you will need to scuff. Most panels the grain will go lengthwise. Clean, paint and apply markings. I find that paint sticks very well as the tape has already been scuffed and cleaned. I weighed the T-33 a piece at a time and I think that the tape method weighs less than filling pin holes, primer, paint, and a flat clear coat.
Hope all this helps. Please feel free to ask any other questions that you may have.
big fred is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 03-05-2018, 08:21 PM
  #37  
big fred
 
Join Date: Nov 2013
Posts: 73
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default

More pics
Attached Thumbnails Click image for larger version

Name:	IMG_0074.JPG
Views:	47
Size:	927.4 KB
ID:	2257815   Click image for larger version

Name:	IMG_0073.JPG
Views:	42
Size:	696.6 KB
ID:	2257816   Click image for larger version

Name:	IMG_0065.JPG
Views:	43
Size:	599.9 KB
ID:	2257817   Click image for larger version

Name:	IMG_0077.JPG
Views:	40
Size:	571.4 KB
ID:	2257818   Click image for larger version

Name:	IMG_0056.JPG
Views:	47
Size:	894.7 KB
ID:	2257819  
big fred is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 03-05-2018, 08:33 PM
  #38  
big fred
 
Join Date: Nov 2013
Posts: 73
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default

Tool used
Attached Thumbnails Click image for larger version

Name:	P-47 tools 001.JPG
Views:	49
Size:	3.32 MB
ID:	2257822   Click image for larger version

Name:	P-47 tools 003.JPG
Views:	50
Size:	2.67 MB
ID:	2257823   Click image for larger version

Name:	P-47 tools 004.JPG
Views:	54
Size:	3.13 MB
ID:	2257824   Click image for larger version

Name:	P-47 tools 005.JPG
Views:	57
Size:	3.20 MB
ID:	2257825   Click image for larger version

Name:	P-47 tools 006.JPG
Views:	47
Size:	3.28 MB
ID:	2257826   Click image for larger version

Name:	P-47 tools 007.JPG
Views:	41
Size:	3.36 MB
ID:	2257827   Click image for larger version

Name:	P-47 tools 008.JPG
Views:	38
Size:	2.45 MB
ID:	2257828  
big fred is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 03-05-2018, 08:36 PM
  #39  
big fred
 
Join Date: Nov 2013
Posts: 73
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default

Try that last one again
Attached Thumbnails Click image for larger version

Name:	P-47 tools 009.JPG
Views:	37
Size:	3.30 MB
ID:	2257829   Click image for larger version

Name:	P-47 tools 010.JPG
Views:	40
Size:	3.15 MB
ID:	2257830   Click image for larger version

Name:	P-47 tools 011.JPG
Views:	42
Size:	3.23 MB
ID:	2257831  
big fred is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 03-05-2018, 09:55 PM
  #40  
downwind leg
 
Join Date: Dec 2015
Location: San Juan Island,Washington
Posts: 32
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default

Thanks so much Fred. In the closeups I can see a little bit of what I call the orange peel but much less pronounced than the flite metal. I think I could just get away with just the scuffing with the finer pad as you did and not have to spend all the time wet sanding the orange peel flat. Do you have a small scrap I could experiment with like 5" square? I would gladly pay for it before buying a large quanity from the manufacterer. If so, let me know and I will PM you my mailing address. I will try to post a picture tomorrow of my latest experiments with the flite metal. I really appreciate you sharing your knowledge and expertise.
Brad
downwind leg is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 03-06-2018, 06:45 AM
  #41  
big fred
 
Join Date: Nov 2013
Posts: 73
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default

I can send you out some. But just so that you know, the link that I posted a whole roll is 25 bucks for 6" wide and 50 yards long. I have to go to PO today, pm me address and I can send it out. Fred.

Last edited by big fred; 03-06-2018 at 06:48 AM. Reason: abc
big fred is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 03-06-2018, 08:50 AM
  #42  
downwind leg
 
Join Date: Dec 2015
Location: San Juan Island,Washington
Posts: 32
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default

Hi Fred, just wondering in the picture of your various tools what the orange rectangular tool is. Great workmanship by the way on your planes.
​​​​​​​Brad
downwind leg is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 03-06-2018, 09:01 AM
  #43  
big fred
 
Join Date: Nov 2013
Posts: 73
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default

Diamond grit stone for sharpening the blades. A couple passes on it and they are better than new
big fred is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 03-06-2018, 11:47 AM
  #44  
big fred
 
Join Date: Nov 2013
Posts: 73
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default

Hi Brad, PO says it will be there Thursday.
big fred is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 03-06-2018, 12:01 PM
  #45  
big fred
 
Join Date: Nov 2013
Posts: 73
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default

Brad this T-33 is an EDF version of the BVM one in previous post. It is one of them Chinese ARF's. I went right over the plastic covering on this one, you could see the markings through the tape so I just cut them out and peeled the aluminum tape off to expose the USAF and such.
Attached Thumbnails Click image for larger version

Name:	T-33 on gear 013.JPG
Views:	43
Size:	957.1 KB
ID:	2257892   Click image for larger version

Name:	T-33 on gear 017.JPG
Views:	35
Size:	1,017.3 KB
ID:	2257893   Click image for larger version

Name:	Easy T-33 002.JPG
Views:	41
Size:	3.49 MB
ID:	2257894  
big fred is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 03-06-2018, 01:22 PM
  #46  
downwind leg
 
Join Date: Dec 2015
Location: San Juan Island,Washington
Posts: 32
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default

Fantastic job Fred. Never would have guessed from the pictures that was a Chinese ARF. Thanks for mailing that sample of the tape. Anything special you do to make the tape more maleable prior to putting each piece on? Also, it seemed in your pictures of the P-47 that the scuffing had at least three different looks. How did you accomplish that?
Brad
downwind leg is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 03-06-2018, 04:42 PM
  #47  
big fred
 
Join Date: Nov 2013
Posts: 73
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default

Thanks for the good words. Some of the panels are scuffed vertical, some are horizontal, some are left un scuffed, such as the fillet around the tail. I think kind that of adds to the over all look of things. Also, the gun bay panels are of different material, they are not tape. I have some aluminum litho plate, very stiff, but good for flat panels. It is still scuffed the same, but has a different look when done. I use double sided carpet tape on the back to hold it in place. Also has many mini screws around the edge. I also sent you some of the thicker tape that I use to make hatches, still scuff it, but before it is put in place. I also use a tool to make the 1/4 turn fasteners. I took a small pocket phillips screw driver, flatned the tip, and then put piece of brass tubing around it. Use it the same as the rivet tool, but on a hard surface and not on the plane. It takes more pressure to indent the thick tape and I do want to poke a hole in the plane.
big fred is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 03-06-2018, 04:45 PM
  #48  
big fred
 
Join Date: Nov 2013
Posts: 73
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default

I don't do anything to make it more maleable, but the thicker it is the more it will stretch.
big fred is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 03-07-2018, 08:01 PM
  #49  
Aros
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Maple Valley, WA
Posts: 76
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default

Gorgeous work big fred! Wow.
Aros is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 03-08-2018, 04:19 AM
  #50  
big fred
 
Join Date: Nov 2013
Posts: 73
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default

Hi Guys, thank you very much.
I'm old, done a couple. If I remember correctly the first Yellow P-47 I did back in "95" for the scale masters. Did not mean to hijack this thread, but glad if I can help out. Downwind, your pkg should be there today, let me know what you think of the stuff, how does it compare to what you have. In all the years I have never used the Flite Metal brand.
big fred is offline  
Reply With Quote

Thread Tools
Search this Thread

Contact Us Archive Advertising Cookie Policy